Individual mandate in trouble?

[Avatar4321]

Or....we could remove the profit motive from anything having to do with the health and wellness of our fellow humans........your god's children..........and place the burden for the health of our brothers and sisters on all of our shoulders.

While we're at it. maybe we should force carpenters and farmers to forgo their profit motives as well? What else do you think citizens should get free from the government? Cable? Internet? IPods? Condoms?

Dumb argument.

I'm amazed that you've summed your arguments up so much that you just tell us that it's dumb without actually boring us with actually reading it. Makes our discussions so much quicker and more efficient. Thank you

 

[initforme]

"Our alternative has always been the same: GET THE HELL OUT OF OUR HEALTH CARE"

Thats fine...But there had better be more than this. The WHOLE SYSTEM needs a complete overahaul. It is totally hypocritical to say "I'm PRO life" yet I'm for denying pre-existing conditions. Once those jerks get sick then their tune changes. HYPOCRITES.

 

[LoneLaugher]

While we're at it. maybe we should force carpenters and farmers to forgo their profit motives as well? What else do you think citizens should get free from the government? Cable? Internet? IPods? Condoms?

Dumb argument.

I'm amazed that you've summed your arguments up so much that you just tell us that it's dumb without actually boring us with actually reading it. Makes our discussions so much quicker and more efficient. Thank you

Dumb is dumb. Why waste time on it.

Would you like to support that dumb argument? Please........have at it.

 

[The T]

While we're at it. maybe we should force carpenters and farmers to forgo their profit motives as well? What else do you think citizens should get free from the government? Cable? Internet? IPods? Condoms?

Dumb argument.

Yeah, it is. But, the government could very well force you to do it.
They would have the authority.

And then where does it stop? The government can force the individual to do ANYTHING once the precident is set.

Liberty loses. People lose.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Yo T,

have you changed your sig yet?

 

[Ropey]

Dumb argument.

Yeah, it is. But, the government could very well force you to do it.
They would have the authority.

And then where does it stop? The government can force the individual to do ANYTHING once the precident is set.

Liberty loses. People lose.

It won't need much precedent with such a hard wired open door to commerce.

 

[Ernie S.]

"While we're at it. maybe we should force carpenters and farmers to forgo their profit motives as well? What else do you think citizens should get free from the government? Cable? Internet? IPods? Condoms? "

All people want is affordable health care. Right now it aint affordable to those who work hard just to maintain. That says alot about our country. ALOT OF BAD.

And a lot of people can't afford Cadillacs, Porter House steaks and 24 room mansions either.
Maybe we should just pile all of out money in the Capitol Rotunda and let the government hand us the keys to a Chevy Volt, 5 pounds of ground chuck and a lease on a section 8 apartment?
What happened to paying your own way in this country?

 

[Mac1958]

.

If indeed this thing is knocked down, the GOP (once it finishes its happy dance) damn well better have an alternative. Something better than "we'll see what we can do, but you're still on your own."

.

Our alternative has always been the same: GET THE HELL OUT OF OUR HEALTH CARE

Agreed. "You're on your own". But how about a few specifics?

What is a person with pre-existing conditions supposed to do when he is declined by an insurance company? Even if he can afford the policy?

What is a person supposed to do if they can't afford $800 a month for a family policy?

What about their kids?

Should a person be turned away from the emergency room if they don't have insurance?

And on what date would you suggest ending Medicare and Medicaid health coverage? Because if you're consistent, you'll want government out of those, too.

Details, please.

 

[M14 Shooter]

"Indeed. it's an attack on the private sector. On individuals."
Insurance companies charging me exhorbitant prices is an attack on me.

Your relationship with the insurance companies is completely voluntary.
Or, it was - but then The Obama forced you into having that relationship.

But I should have access to affrodable health care.

Why? Who are you and why are you special?

 

[candycorn]

I hate to quibble on points, but I think it looks excellent for Uncle Sam. Our nation wont be strapped with this Administrations unconstitutional laws.

At least, assuming these questions mean that they will throw out the mandate. Which isn't necessarily true.

Personally, I dont know how you can use the government to compel someone into a contract. One of the first things you learn in law school about contracts is that coercion is a ground for invalidating any contract. If the law stands, I would argue that we have a significant flaw in our current legal system that can completely undermine the laws by which our economy is governed.

Can't say I disagree with you; if they find it unconstitutional, it therefore is an unconstitutional law.

Let me ask you this though: Do you think it then becomes a political football for Obama? I can see where some would think it becomes an albatross and I'm not sure that it doesn't. Losing it though, may help him and the democrats politically since they had to go into such contortions to get it passed, I can see them arguing, "If we had more democrats in congress, we would have passed a better-suited bill." Or some argument like that.

They could argue that. I think they'd be freaking stupid to since the people overwhelmingly opposed it to begin with. But hey, if they want to guarantee a GOP victory this year then please feel free.

I don't see the overwhelming dissent out there. Working in healthcare, I hardly see any dissent at all at the program itself.

I'll tell you what I hear from our administrators who are dealing with the situation--these are your classic middle aged men and women--Pool and Patio types; they love it; they love that the government made a law that moves the needle one way or the other because the alternative for our hospital system is that the number of occupied beds is decreasing most months. Fewer patients means fewer dollars to put it bluntly. As defacto traffic manager for the system, I see the numbers. Our census is way down over the last five years. Meanwhile the public sector hospitals are skyrocketing; this is what you and I are paying for.

So if the poor who are apparently going to be served by it are for it, and at least one sector of the extremely affluent are on board, if the socially conscious liberals and moderates are for it, if the ideological left is for it, I don't think there are "overwhelmingly" large numbers that would be against it.

Thanks for your input.

 

[Liability]

Since when does anyone trust the analysis of conservatives further than they can throw them?

You CONZ are just whistling past the graveyard on this one.


Tell me...what will you do if the court finds this constitutional?

Bitch about the LIBERAL BIAS on the Supreme Court?

Tell me...what will you do if the court finds this unconstitutional?

He will cry and moan and groan and whine and cry some more. Cry like a bitch. Cry like the bitch he is.

Oh, and he will also cry and bitch and moan and groan and do some crying.

Then he'll cry a bit more.

 

[initforme]

"Then dont buy insurance. Or start your own insurance company. That's the beauty of America. We can do things differently. "

Sure. I'll just start my own insurance company. Whatever. Like I could do that. The beauty of america. What a joke.

 

[candycorn]

"Indeed. it's an attack on the private sector. On individuals."

Insurance companies charging me exhorbitant prices is an attack on me. But I should have access to affrodable health care. Without insurance I dont. They should have to cover everything I need if I am paying their ridiculous premiums.

This is America where you don't have to do anything for anybody at anytime; ever. It says so in our 200+ year old constitution.

God Bless.

 

[The T]

Can't say I disagree with you; if they find it unconstitutional, it therefore is an unconstitutional law.

Let me ask you this though: Do you think it then becomes a political football for Obama? I can see where some would think it becomes an albatross and I'm not sure that it doesn't. Losing it though, may help him and the democrats politically since they had to go into such contortions to get it passed, I can see them arguing, "If we had more democrats in congress, we would have passed a better-suited bill." Or some argument like that.

They could argue that. I think they'd be freaking stupid to since the people overwhelmingly opposed it to begin with. But hey, if they want to guarantee a GOP victory this year then please feel free.

I don't see the overwhelming dissent out there. Working in healthcare, I hardly see any dissent at all at the program itself.

I'll tell you what I hear from our administrators who are dealing with the situation--these are your classic middle aged men and women--Pool and Patio types; they love it; they love that the government made a law that moves the needle one way or the other because the alternative for our hospital system is that the number of occupied beds is decreasing most months. Fewer patients means fewer dollars to put it bluntly. As defacto traffic manager for the system, I see the numbers. Our census is way down over the last five years. Meanwhile the public sector hospitals are skyrocketing; this is what you and I are paying for.

So if the poor who are apparently going to be served by it are for it, and at least one sector of the extremely affluent are on board, if the socially conscious liberals and moderates are for it, if the ideological left is for it, I don't think there are "overwhelmingly" large numbers that would be against it.

Thanks for your input.

As long as your paycheck is secure and you have Obama making it happen, right?

 

[Avatar4321]

"Then dont buy insurance. Or start your own insurance company. That's the beauty of America. We can do things differently. "

Sure. I'll just start my own insurance company. Whatever. Like I could do that. The beauty of america. What a joke.

Why couldn't you do that?

 

[Valerie]

"Indeed. it's an attack on the private sector. On individuals."

Insurance companies charging me exhorbitant prices is an attack on me. But I should have access to affrodable health care. Without insurance I dont. They should have to cover everything I need if I am paying their ridiculous premiums.

This is America where you don't have to do anything for anybody at anytime; ever. It says so in our 200+ year old constitution.

God Bless.

I detect a little sarcasm there...........

 

[Ernie S.]

"Do you want your auto insurance to pay for preexisting dents too? "

Idiotic argument. You miss the point. MAKE IT AFFORDABLE. Trouble with reading?

No, it's not, son. We're talking about insurance here

 

[initforme]

"Why? Who are you and why are you special? "

There it is. So health care should be expensive and unaffordable. Why should people get health care right? What an incredibly stupid thought that is. Health care.

 

[Conservative]

the mandate is definitely in trouble...
Excerpts From Supreme Court Hearing On ObamaCare | Fox News

 

[IHBF]

This Act needs to be scrapped so it can go back to Congress and they can create a good one that addresses the COST of health care so that the COST can be affordable even without insurance.

Both liberals and conservatives should have a problem with the individual mandate.

First, there is no limiting principle. That means government could then require us to buy anything (cars, food, whatever) and it wouldn't be challenged because of this case.

Second (liberals should object to this), the government is requiring you to support a CORPORATION. An organization with the sole purpose of making a profit. Why isn't the Occupy crowd up in arms about that?