Little Sympathy for California Fire Victims

[bodecea]

With that much water in the pool, and a $200.00 water pump, both of those homes could have been saved.

A pump could DRENCH the home with pool water, and the water at the base of the house could be diverted back into the pool to be used again. After the fire danger is over, filter the pool water and set the house runoff diverter valve back to the street disposal as normal.

You have no idea, do you?

 

[bodecea]

The homeowners can't do anything. The envirowackos won't let them. I had a friend that owned a cabin at Crestline. She got a notice from the Fire Marshal to clear away the dead brush around her cabin. She did. She was fined by the Environmental protection agency and ordered to restore the natural habitat. She produced the notice from the Fire Marshal. It did no good. The dead brush was restored by volunteers and my friend fined and the fine filed as a lien on the property.

Then came the Crestline fire a few years ago.the cabin burned to the ground. She collected the insurance money and abandoned the land.

Cool story, Poe.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

It is clear that the OP has no idea about fire fighting. We all took fire training in the Navy.......and that Macho man I'd have used a 200 buck pump to stop it is laughable.

It IS laughable, when you misquote me. I did not say a $200 pump would stop the fire. I said it could prevent ONE HOME from burning to the ground. It could keep ONE HOME sufficiently wet down while the raging fire burns past it. A home swimming pool is what ... 25,000 gallons? Larger?

You CANNOT intelligently argue that the fire is BOTH moving so fast that you cannot stay ahead of it, but when the fire line reaches a home, it stops and burns there for hours until the home is consumed.

A fire line BURNS PAST a house. The home is ignited at the moment that fire is the hottest. There is a very brief period of time when the heat of a brush fire is intense enough to IGNITE a home on fire. If you keep the structure's exterior soaked during that brief period of time, your chances of saving the home are exponentially increased.

The speed that the fire moves is determined by the available fuel it can consume in its path. Minimizing the fuel around one's home, combined with SOME EFFORT to keep the home's exterior DRENCHED for the brief period of time that it is actually an ignition risk is a far better idea than anything YOU have offered thus far, Macho Navy fire expert.

With Tropical Force Winds driving an inferno............you'd be burned alive in seconds with that stupid 200 buck pump.

Ummm .... the PUMP would be there pumping the water out of the pool. The water would drench the home and then return to the pool via channeling designed into the foundation. I would not be standing there next to it working a lever and braving the heat while sipping a Slurpee. Don't be so damned ignorant.

The whole idea is to set the pump to drench the home's roof and walls AND THEN LEAVE for a period of time WHILE the fire line is burning past the water drenched home and moving on. It requires no human presence for such a system to work.

The policies of California over the decades have contributed greatly to this problem. As have the Federal Policies of the Roadless Acts passed by the Greens in Congress. The thinning of forests are now a higher priority in California as they are finally realizing that forest thinning, controlled burns, and building fire breaks are essential to minimizing fires.

But now that have Newsom to $%^& things up for them again.

In regards to PG & E............the requirements for right of way are ONLY 4 FOOT in California.......In 60 to 70 mph winds this is USELESS.............They are now proposing a 30 foot Right of Way to clear trees and limbs from hitting the lines in Santa Anna Winds. But low and behold they are being fought in court over it yet again. As an electrician..............NO GRID can NOT BE DAMAGED with limbs hitting it constantly in high winds.

Agreed. Why aren't the power lines UNDERGROUND in the Socialist Utopia of CommieFornia?

Forest Management ...............and thinning is necessary...........the neglect of this for decades is exactly why we are having infernos today. Learn or burn California. And vote out the Greens who are fighting the fire prevention measures to protect the State.

Agreed.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

With that much water in the pool, and a $200.00 water pump, both of those homes could have been saved.

A pump could DRENCH the home with pool water, and the water at the base of the house could be diverted back into the pool to be used again. After the fire danger is over, filter the pool water and set the house runoff diverter valve back to the street disposal as normal.

You have no idea, do you?

I know exactly what I am talking about. YOU have no vision. A pump that moves 1500 gallons of water a minute through plumbing specifically designed to keep all exterior surfaces of the home DRENCHED would prevent that home from burning down. 1500 GPM not enough? Then run TWO of them, or FIVE of them. WTF? It that too big of an expense for a multi-million dollar home to invest?!?

 

[EvilCat Breath]

It is clear that the OP has no idea about fire fighting. We all took fire training in the Navy.......and that Macho man I'd have used a 200 buck pump to stop it is laughable.

It IS laughable, when you misquote me. I did not say a $200 pump would stop the fire. I said it could prevent ONE HOME from burning to the ground. It could keep ONE HOME sufficiently wet down while the raging fire burns past it. A home swimming pool is what ... 25,000 gallons? Larger?

You CANNOT intelligently argue that the fire is BOTH moving so fast that you cannot stay ahead of it, but when the fire line reaches a home, it stops and burns there for hours until the home is consumed.

A fire line BURNS PAST a house. The home is ignited at the moment that fire is the hottest. There is a very brief period of time when the heat of a brush fire is intense enough to IGNITE a home on fire. If you keep the structure's exterior soaked during that brief period of time, your chances of saving the home are exponentially increased.

The speed that the fire moves is determined by the available fuel it can consume in its path. Minimizing the fuel around one's home, combined with SOME EFFORT to keep the home's exterior DRENCHED for the brief period of time that it is actually an ignition risk is a far better idea than anything YOU have offered thus far, Macho Navy fire expert.

With Tropical Force Winds driving an inferno............you'd be burned alive in seconds with that stupid 200 buck pump.

Ummm .... the PUMP would be there pumping the water out of the pool. The water would drench the home and then return to the pool via channeling designed into the foundation. I would not be standing there next to it working a lever and braving the heat while sipping a Slurpee. Don't be so damned ignorant.

The whole idea is to set the pump to drench the home's roof and walls AND THEN LEAVE for a period of time WHILE the fire line is burning past the water drenched home and moving on. It requires no human presence for such a system to work.

The policies of California over the decades have contributed greatly to this problem. As have the Federal Policies of the Roadless Acts passed by the Greens in Congress. The thinning of forests are now a higher priority in California as they are finally realizing that forest thinning, controlled burns, and building fire breaks are essential to minimizing fires.

But now that have Newsom to $%^& things up for them again.

In regards to PG & E............the requirements for right of way are ONLY 4 FOOT in California.......In 60 to 70 mph winds this is USELESS.............They are now proposing a 30 foot Right of Way to clear trees and limbs from hitting the lines in Santa Anna Winds. But low and behold they are being fought in court over it yet again. As an electrician..............NO GRID can NOT BE DAMAGED with limbs hitting it constantly in high winds.

Agreed. Why aren't the power lines UNDERGROUND in the Socialist Utopia of CommieFornia?

Forest Management ...............and thinning is necessary...........the neglect of this for decades is exactly why we are having infernos today. Learn or burn California. And vote out the Greens who are fighting the fire prevention measures to protect the State.

Agreed.

Fast moving fires certainly do leave homes and structures that burn for hours. The fire doesn't go out as it passes buildings. The wind driven flames and embers are fast moving but what they burn burns for hours.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

In this kind of fire there is no run off back to the pool if anything there would be steam. An inflatable home might work.

WRONG. Your steam would come from a garden hose being sprayed onto a hot surface. I am talking about a flow of WATER, that runs over the roof and down the walls, to a well-designed foundation that would return most (not all) of the water to the pool, be poured through a rough filter to remove most of the crud, and then return to the pool's water supply for reapplication.

Do not confuse a spray from a garden hose with a supply of water rated at 1500 or 3000 gallons per minute. Do you realize how much water that is? At 1500 gallons per minute, that is one oil drum of water EVERY TWO SECONDS. A silly garden hose cannot create that level of water flow, but a good PUMP can.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

Thinning these forests would take a lot of manpower. Who has money to employ a hundred thousand brush thinners at the very least? Ridiculous.

Use prisoners.

 

[Mac-7]

I'm sorry, but if I was ever going to build a ($x??) million dollar home in the hills of California, I THINK I would spend another ten or twenty thousand or so on preventative measures against brush fires.

These fires are an annual event, and not at all surprising. What IS surprising, is how little the homeowners have done to prevent their homes from burning to the ground.

I see these lots along the sculpted streets of SoCal, and all of the homes are burned to the ground. In the back yards of these homes are reflection pools, HUGE swimming pools full of water, that reain after the fires burn out. They build the expensive homes, and the beautiful reflection pools, but they NEVER think ahead, to plumb in a sprinkler system that can DRENCH the home with pool water at the moment the fire wall approaches and burns past the house.

It boggles my mind, to think that any architect would design a home with a 50,000 gallon pool in the yard, and NOT have some way to use that water to fight a fire. We are only talking about a $500.00 Honda gas powered water pump and some steel piping, after all.

Does this make ANY sense?

Lib tree huggers will not allow controlled burns that help reduce mass fires

 

[HenryBHough]

Slowly but surely Mother Nature is reclaiming California.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

That's actually a pretty good idea, I wonder why no one has done it?

Wow! ANOTHER person with a BRAIN on this forum! Nice to meet you!

 

[bodecea]

The value is in the land. Postcard views everywhere. The polar opposite of Kensucky

Kentucky is actually a beautiful state, a tremendous place.

I'd rather be in the Blue Grass state with guys like Colonel Sanders than in California, no doubt about it.

Of course you would.

 

[bodecea]

I'm sorry, but if I was ever going to build a ($x??) million dollar home in the hills of California, I THINK I would spend another ten or twenty thousand or so on preventative measures against brush fires.

These fires are an annual event, and not at all surprising. What IS surprising, is how little the homeowners have done to prevent their homes from burning to the ground.

I see these lots along the sculpted streets of SoCal, and all of the homes are burned to the ground. In the back yards of these homes are reflection pools, HUGE swimming pools full of water, that reain after the fires burn out. They build the expensive homes, and the beautiful reflection pools, but they NEVER think ahead, to plumb in a sprinkler system that can DRENCH the home with pool water at the moment the fire wall approaches and burns past the house.

It boggles my mind, to think that any architect would design a home with a 50,000 gallon pool in the yard, and NOT have some way to use that water to fight a fire. We are only talking about a $500.00 Honda gas powered water pump and some steel piping, after all.

Does this make ANY sense?

The fucking Cal. authorities forbid anyone from clearing any brush/undergrowth on Gov. lands. After all there might be the famous five peckered salamander somewhere in the undergrowth. In many cases the million dollar homes are built right on the edge of Gov. land.

Not true.

 

[bodecea]

All homes built in California have sprinkler systems. In this kind of fire they are useless.

I am not talking about an interior sprinkler system. I am talking about a pump that sucks the water out of the pool at 1500 gallons per minute, DRENCHES the home's exterior, and returns the water to the pool via a channel system for reapplication.

To make the home even MORE fire resistant, a home could have a large tank (or two, or three) of liquid CO2 and a pipe system that runs through the home. When the fire reaches the actual home, a valve can be opened to INFLATE the home with CO2, thereby displacing oxygen. The home will not burn is there is no oxygen to feed the fire. The fire will burn past the home and leave it relatively unscathed.

Neither was she talking about an interior sprinkler system....she was talking exterior. I love it when people who have NO CLUE about life in California try to "explain" it to us.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

Fast moving fires certainly do leave homes and structures that burn for hours.

That is ONLY because some component of the home's exterior was ignited WHILE the fire passed.

The fire doesn't go out as it passes buildings. The wind driven flames and embers are fast moving but what they burn burns for hours.

What the embers successfully IGNITE will burn for hours. The embers themselves have a short life.

If no part of the actual home ignites while the fire line passes, the chances are GREATLY improved that the home will not burn down. Continued wetting of the exterior, perhaps at a reduced per-gallon rate will deal with any flying embers.

 

[HenryBHough]

Once upon a time I was forced to live in California for the work I was doing. Notably, in recent years, that company has fled to Canada. In any case I had a typical California House with a cedar-shingle roof. I kept the brush around it well trimmed. Bought 200-feet of light plastic drip irrigation tubing and spread it out on the roof. Punched about 500 holes in it with an ice pick. Connected it to my generator-powered well pump. When the evacuation order came I fueled up the generator, cranked it up and left. When I got back the house was in fine shape though a little soggy. Two neighbors came home to crispy remains. Then I had to face the critics cries over my having "wasted ground water".

They didn't bitch long. Their insurance settlements took months and the commute from the motel where they living was too long for them to picket much.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

All homes built in California have sprinkler systems. In this kind of fire they are useless.

I am not talking about an interior sprinkler system. I am talking about a pump that sucks the water out of the pool at 1500 gallons per minute, DRENCHES the home's exterior, and returns the water to the pool via a channel system for reapplication.

To make the home even MORE fire resistant, a home could have a large tank (or two, or three) of liquid CO2 and a pipe system that runs through the home. When the fire reaches the actual home, a valve can be opened to INFLATE the home with CO2, thereby displacing oxygen. The home will not burn is there is no oxygen to feed the fire. The fire will burn past the home and leave it relatively unscathed.

Neither was she talking about an interior sprinkler system....she was talking exterior. I love it when people who have NO CLUE about life in California try to "explain" it to us.

I lived in SoCal for 40 years. Quit talking out of your ass.

She certainly WAS talking about an interior sprinkler system. California does NOT require homes to install an exterior lawn sprinkler system. I am talking about a REAL flow of water through a series of REAL spray nozzles applied to the home's EXTERIOR. Think 'Fire Hose'

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

The homeowners can't do anything. The envirowackos won't let them. I had a friend that owned a cabin at Crestline. She got a notice from the Fire Marshal to clear away the dead brush around her cabin. She did. She was fined by the Environmental protection agency and ordered to restore the natural habitat. She produced the notice from the Fire Marshal. It did no good. The dead brush was restored by volunteers and my friend fined and the fine filed as a lien on the property.

Then came the Crestline fire a few years ago.the cabin burned to the ground. She collected the insurance money and abandoned the land.

Uh-huh.... sure.......

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

"KC! You're so STUPID! You CAN'T have water drench a home's roof and walls, and then return to the pool!"

Really? Have you ever basted a turkey on Thanksgiving?

 

[HenryBHough]

"KC! You're so STUPID! You CAN'T have water drench a home's roof and walls, and then return to the pool!"

Really? Have you ever basted a turkey on Thanksgiving?

What a radically different view of the proper usage of a turkey baster in the mind of any liberal!

 

[bodecea]

Once upon a time I was forced to live in California for the work I was doing. Notably, in recent years, that company has fled to Canada. In any case I had a typical California House with a cedar-shingle roof. I kept the brush around it well trimmed. Bought 200-feet of light plastic drip irrigation tubing and spread it out on the roof. Punched about 500 holes in it with an ice pick. Connected it to my generator-powered well pump. When the evacuation order came I fueled up the generator, cranked it up and left. When I got back the house was in fine shape though a little soggy. Two neighbors came home to crispy remains. Then I had to face the critics cries over my having "wasted ground water".

They didn't bitch long. Their insurance settlements took months and the commute from the motel where they living was too long for them to picket much.

You know that cedar roofs are a no no now?