Mitt Romney pays a lower tax rate than you do.

[Cecilie1200]

True Story.

Romney Says His Effective Tax Rate Is ‘Probably’ 15%

Well fuck dude. Fifty percent of All Americans pay less Federal Income tax than I do so what's yer fucking point? AT least Romney pays Federal Income Tax.

Does he? I didn't know he currently had a job. Well, I suppose he would pay income tax on fees from speaking engagements, wouldn't he?

 

[Vast LWC]

Capital Gains Taxes: The Concise Encyclopedia of Economics | Library of Economics and Liberty

Take, for example, the capital gains tax paid on a pharmaceutical stock. The value of that stock equals the discounted present value of all of the company’s future proceeds. If the company is expected to earn $100,000 a year for the next twenty years, the sales price of the stock will reflect those returns. The “gain” the seller realizes from the sale of the stock will reflect those future returns, and thus the seller will pay capital gains tax on the future stream of income. But the company’s future $100,000 annual returns will also be taxed when they are earned. So the $100,000 in profits is taxed twice—when the owners sell their shares of stock and when the company actually earns the income. That is why many tax analysts argue that the most equitable rate of tax on capital gains is zero.

But I'm sure you know more about it than they do.

Since employee are paid from the same revenue pool, one could apply that to all payrolls.

If the company was not making as much money, they would not be able to afford to pay their workers as much.

Therefore, the "Taxed Twice" argument could be applied to anyone who works for a company that is taxed. Which would pretty much cover a vast majority of employees in the USA.

 

[Vast LWC]

Does he? I didn't know he currently had a job. Well, I suppose he would pay income tax on fees from speaking engagements, wouldn't he?

When did profits from capital gains stop being income?

 

[Cecilie1200]

How is he "gaming the system"? Where is it written that one is REQUIRED to have THIS sort of income rather than THAT sort of income, because THIS sort is "morally superior" in some arcane fashion?

He's rich. He invests his money. He pays the legal tax rate on investment income. What was he supposed to do with his money? Stuff it in his mattress? Give it all away to charity and get some 9-to-5 wanker job just so you'll feel better about YOUR lousy life?

You're absolutely right.

The point is that Romney is running for president, and is working on a platform that includes lowering tax rates for the rich.

Which makes him part of the problem.

No, to be part of the problem, he'd have to be a lazy, brainwashed loser sitting around on his dead ass, waiting for Mommy Government to come along and make his existence happy and worthwhile.

Of course, if that were the case, he wouldn't be running for President. He'd be sitting on an Internet chat board, being treated to my special brand of contempt and disdain, the way you . . . oops. Sorry.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Except that capital gains are taxed TWICE

False.

If you buy 100k worth of a stock and sell the stock for 120k you only pay capital gains tax on the 20k profit i.e. the new income.

I didn't say YOU were necessarily taxed twice. I said the money was. Sort of the way an inheritance is taxed twice: first when the dead person earned it, and then again when it was passed to his beneficiaries.

Learn to speak English. Sheesh.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Except that capital gains are taxed TWICE

False.

If you buy 100k worth of a stock and sell the stock for 120k you only pay capital gains tax on the 20k profit i.e. the new income.

I think what cecilie is thinking is that initial 100k you invested was already taxed and that the money you make of that money is "double taxed"

But like you said you only pay on the gains and you can write off losses so you are, in effect, not double taxed.

Actually, I'm saying that the government taxes the money when the company actually earns it, and then taxes it again when you sell the stock. I posted a link and a quote from the Library of Economics and Liberty.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Add in he made over 375K in speaking engagments alone in 2011 and counts that as "not much money". That's APART from his income from other sources.

Median income in the US is around 50K. So his "not much money" is many times the median.

It's NOT much money to him. So what? God forbid we elect a President who's a financial success in his personal life. After all, the left didn't.

What do you mean? P-BO's wife, FL-MO, had a 400k/year IIRC no show job at a hospital. He married smart.

Gamblers and con men manage to get a lot of money, too, but I just don't classify that as "financial success in life", at least not in the context of wanting to be President.

 

[Article 15]

Except that capital gains are taxed TWICE

False.

If you buy 100k worth of a stock and sell the stock for 120k you only pay capital gains tax on the 20k profit i.e. the new income.

I didn't say YOU were necessarily taxed twice. I said the money was. Sort of the way an inheritance is taxed twice: first when the dead person earned it, and then again when it was passed to his beneficiaries.

Learn to speak English. Sheesh.

No, it's not sorta like an inheritance at all.

If you earn a 100k, invest it, and make a capital gain of 20k off that investment when only the 20k gains is taxed there is no double taxation. Only the new income is taxed and it's once.

 

[Article 15]

False.

If you buy 100k worth of a stock and sell the stock for 120k you only pay capital gains tax on the 20k profit i.e. the new income.

I think what cecilie is thinking is that initial 100k you invested was already taxed and that the money you make of that money is "double taxed"

But like you said you only pay on the gains and you can write off losses so you are, in effect, not double taxed.

Actually, I'm saying that the government taxes the money when the company actually earns it, and then taxes it again when you sell the stock. I posted a link and a quote from the Library of Economics and Liberty.

Funny, I don't get a tax bill when my stocks go up. I get a tax bill when I sell and realize a gain.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Capital Gains Taxes: The Concise Encyclopedia of Economics | Library of Economics and Liberty

Take, for example, the capital gains tax paid on a pharmaceutical stock. The value of that stock equals the discounted present value of all of the company’s future proceeds. If the company is expected to earn $100,000 a year for the next twenty years, the sales price of the stock will reflect those returns. The “gain” the seller realizes from the sale of the stock will reflect those future returns, and thus the seller will pay capital gains tax on the future stream of income. But the company’s future $100,000 annual returns will also be taxed when they are earned. So the $100,000 in profits is taxed twice—when the owners sell their shares of stock and when the company actually earns the income. That is why many tax analysts argue that the most equitable rate of tax on capital gains is zero.

But I'm sure you know more about it than they do.

Since employee are paid from the same revenue pool, one could apply that to all payrolls.

If the company was not making as much money, they would not be able to afford to pay their workers as much.

Therefore, the "Taxed Twice" argument could be applied to anyone who works for a company that is taxed. Which would pretty much cover a vast majority of employees in the USA.

Just goes to show how little you really know about economics and investments. Of course, all of your posts do that.

 

[Article 15]

Corporations get taxed on their reported taxable income, not what the price of their stock is.

 

[Big Fitz]

No shit it's income. The same way paying for it out of pocket OR having it paid for by your employer. This is a cute little union game they play to try and pretend that insurance isn't income. Fine, if it's not income, it may as well be cut. How's your income doing then, smartass?

Psst:

"OR having it paid for by your employer"...

A factor that is not taken into account in your linked comparison.

Duh.

I'll take the cash please and find my own CHEAPER health care insurance. 17k extra a year? I have many better things to do with that than waste it only on health care coverage I can get cheaper elsewhere.

 

[Vast LWC]

No, to be part of the problem, he'd have to be a lazy, brainwashed loser sitting around on his dead ass, waiting for Mommy Government to come along and make his existence happy and worthwhile.

Of course, if that were the case, he wouldn't be running for President. He'd be sitting on an Internet chat board, being treated to my special brand of contempt and disdain, the way you . . . oops. Sorry.

Oh god, you got me. Yep you sure got me.

I'm not a highly-paid, highly-skilled professional at all. I'm really a lazy welfare recipient living on the dole, who happens to be able to access the computer at the local library just to harrass you.

Yep, I guess I'm caught.

 

[Big Fitz]

Uh huh. not even 12 months ago and you're quibbling. Yeah, figures. I dunno about you but 10 months economically wasn't that long ago, AND there's no evidence things have changed that much since then.

March 2010 was actually 2 years ago...

Meh. Keep forgetting it's 2012 now. Still, I see tables used from 2006 on occasion as reasoning why the taxes should be raised. So what?

 

[Vast LWC]

Just goes to show how little you really know about economics and investments. Of course, all of your posts do that.

OR, it just goes to show that my worldview, where workers are an essential and contributing part of a company, and the economy, is different from your worldview, where rich investors are the only contributors to a company, and workers are just leeches that need to be paid so that they can survive to the next day to make more money for the investors.

Oh, and you know what all your posts show? That you're an enormous prick that likes to be condescending, but can't quite figure out the situations where it's appropriate to be so.

 

[Vast LWC]

I'll take the cash please and find my own CHEAPER health care insurance. 17k extra a year? I have many better things to do with that than waste it only on health care coverage I can get cheaper elsewhere.

I'm sure the poor folks would rather take the cash too.

Either way, if it's not figured into the chart, then the chart isn't accurate.

 

[Big Fitz]

I'll take the cash please and find my own CHEAPER health care insurance. 17k extra a year? I have many better things to do with that than waste it only on health care coverage I can get cheaper elsewhere.

I'm sure the poor folks would rather take the cash too.

Either way, if it's not figured into the chart, then the chart isn't accurate.

Them goalposts heavy? Lift with your legs, not your back.

 

[Vast LWC]

Them goalposts heavy? Lift with your legs, not your back.

That was my argument to begin with, so, I"m not sure what you mean...

 

[Ava]

True Story.

Romney Says His Effective Tax Rate Is ‘Probably’ 15%

Good! The more money he has, the more money he has to put into the economy. JOBS! Purchases! He has worked hard and he has worked smart and most of all, he has worked within the laws, to acheive his goals. Why some of our family may be working for what he has created, as we speak....

 

[Cecilie1200]

No, to be part of the problem, he'd have to be a lazy, brainwashed loser sitting around on his dead ass, waiting for Mommy Government to come along and make his existence happy and worthwhile.

Of course, if that were the case, he wouldn't be running for President. He'd be sitting on an Internet chat board, being treated to my special brand of contempt and disdain, the way you . . . oops. Sorry.

Oh god, you got me. Yep you sure got me.

I'm not a highly-paid, highly-skilled professional at all. I'm really a lazy welfare recipient living on the dole, who happens to be able to access the computer at the local library just to harrass you.

Yep, I guess I'm caught.

I can only go by what you say, and given how much you snivel about needing more and more government micromanaging people's lives . . .

Don't blame me because you present yourself as a lazy, whining leech.