Moses was a Despot

[PainefulTruth]

Moses took the Ten Commandments (which he wrote, and 5 of which don't really deal with true morality at all), and expanded them to a massive quantity of theocratic dicta that regulate the minutia of everyday life including divine retribution for spilling one's seed on the ground, and being executed for gathering sticks on the sabbath or blasphemy. And then there's the genocidal invasion of Canaan with God on their side as justification. BTW, many modern scholars don't believe that was the way it happened anyway, that it was a gradual incursion.

Fascist/communist socialism and theocracy are just two different sides of the same autocratic coin. Freedom of religion means freedom from religion, though ironically, universal rational morality must be the only basis for any rule of law--morality determined by rational means, not theocratic or socialist hegemony. We just throw way to many non-moral issues into the pile labeled morality.

And just to clarify, I don't hold modern Jews responsible for any of that whatsoever (other than maybe for not refuting the obvious crap I just pointed out, today) any more than I hold modern US whites responsible for slavery (other than not admitting that it was indeed the de facto cause of the Civil War).

 

[Chuckt]

Moses took the Ten Commandments (which he wrote, and 5 of which don't really deal with true morality at all), and expanded them to a massive quantity of theocratic dicta that regulate the minutia of everyday life including divine retribution for spilling one's seed on the ground, and being executed for gathering sticks on the sabbath or blasphemy. And then there's the genocidal invasion of Canaan with God on their side as justification. BTW, many modern scholars don't believe that was the way it happened anyway, that it was a gradual incursion.

People don't like to make rules but what happens when someone is injured?

What do you think Congress does? They make laws every day.

 

[PainefulTruth]

Moses took the Ten Commandments (which he wrote, and 5 of which don't really deal with true morality at all), and expanded them to a massive quantity of theocratic dicta that regulate the minutia of everyday life including divine retribution for spilling one's seed on the ground, and being executed for gathering sticks on the sabbath or blasphemy. And then there's the genocidal invasion of Canaan with God on their side as justification. BTW, many modern scholars don't believe that was the way it happened anyway, that it was a gradual incursion.

People don't like to make rules but what happens when someone is injured?

What do you think Congress does? They make laws every day.

Precisely, and they should only legislate morality. That doesn't mean they do, and I'm not going to oppose certain aid programs even though they have no moral compulsion. I do think they all need major reform, however, and a decentralization of power.

But none of those non-moral commandments, or any theocratic "laws", should be legislated or otherwise mandated. Social pressure is still fair game however.

 

[Chuckt]

Moses took the Ten Commandments (which he wrote, and 5 of which don't really deal with true morality at all), and expanded them to a massive quantity of theocratic dicta that regulate the minutia of everyday life including divine retribution for spilling one's seed on the ground, and being executed for gathering sticks on the sabbath or blasphemy. And then there's the genocidal invasion of Canaan with God on their side as justification. BTW, many modern scholars don't believe that was the way it happened anyway, that it was a gradual incursion.

People don't like to make rules but what happens when someone is injured?

What do you think Congress does? They make laws every day.

Precisely, and they should only legislate morality. That doesn't mean they do, and I'm not going to oppose certain aid programs even though they have no moral compulsion. I do think they all need major reform, however, and a decentralization of power.

But none of those non-moral commandments, or any theocratic "laws", should be legislated or otherwise mandated. Social pressure is still fair game however.

They are supposed to represent us and not the rich or powerful who have PACs. They have to represent the will of the people.

How do you legislate morality when they saw the Iraq war as a theater to test weapon systems? What other reason did they go in there except that and for the oil?

They're not very moral so like I said. If morality can't be taught, who's morality will be taught? The morality of the rich? The morality of the defense companies? The morality of the needs of the people for making oil and other resources available?

Is there a day in the world where there isn't war or conflict? No. Who's morality is being taught? Not God's.

 

[Chuckt]

People don't like to make rules but what happens when someone is injured?

What do you think Congress does? They make laws every day.

Precisely, and they should only legislate morality. That doesn't mean they do, and I'm not going to oppose certain aid programs even though they have no moral compulsion. I do think they all need major reform, however, and a decentralization of power.

But none of those non-moral commandments, or any theocratic "laws", should be legislated or otherwise mandated. Social pressure is still fair game however.

They are supposed to represent us and not the rich or powerful who have PACs. They have to represent the will of the people.

How do you legislate morality when they saw the Iraq war as a theater to test weapon systems? What other reason did they go in there except that and for the oil?

They're not very moral so like I said. If morality can't be taught, who's morality will be taught? The morality of the rich? The morality of the defense companies? The morality of the needs of the people for making oil and other resources available?

Is there a day in the world where there isn't war or conflict? No. Who's morality is being taught? Not God's.

When will we have peace?

Make sure you read about the morality being taught:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/current-events/320119-drone-war-crimes-will-i-be-next.html

 

[peach174]

God wrote the Ten Commandments not Moses.

Exodus 24:12 And the LORD said unto Moses, Come up to me into the mount, and be there: and I will give thee tables of stone, and a law, and commandments which I have written ; that thou mayest teach them. (This is the first time.)
Exodus 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God . (This is the first time.)
Exodus 34:1 And the LORD said unto Moses, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first: and I will write upon these tables the words that were in the first tables, which thou brakest. (This is the second time.)

 

[JakeStarkey]

All theocracies are despotic.

 

[Moonglow]

Moses took drugs also. A bark that made you hallucinate, thus a burning bush that was not consumed.

 

[Chuckt]

All theocracies are despotic.

What do you think democracies do? Do we dictate our will to other countries or do we have congress for them and an address of grievances?

I was talking to an American Muslim that I knew and I got a vitriolic response that our democracy is a dictatorship and we should other countries alone. So I didn't know what to say other than, "Okaaaaayyy" to appease the wrath.

 

[peach174]

Moses took drugs also. A bark that made you hallucinate, thus a burning bush that was not consumed.

The Burning bush is real and it grows wild in Israel.
It's called Dictamnus Albus.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUyuanV6P4Q]The Worlds Most Burning Bush Plant "Dictamnus" - YouTube[/ame]

 

[theword]

Moses took the Ten Commandments (which he wrote, and 5 of which don't really deal with true morality at all), and expanded them to a massive quantity of theocratic dicta that regulate the minutia of everyday life including divine retribution for spilling one's seed on the ground, and being executed for gathering sticks on the sabbath or blasphemy. And then there's the genocidal invasion of Canaan with God on their side as justification. BTW, many modern scholars don't believe that was the way it happened anyway, that it was a gradual incursion.

Fascist/communist socialism and theocracy are just two different sides of the same autocratic coin. Freedom of religion means freedom from religion, though ironically, universal rational morality must be the only basis for any rule of law--morality determined by rational means, not theocratic or socialist hegemony. We just throw way to many non-moral issues into the pile labeled morality.

And just to clarify, I don't hold modern Jews responsible for any of that whatsoever (other than maybe for not refuting the obvious crap I just pointed out, today) any more than I hold modern US whites responsible for slavery (other than not admitting that it was indeed the de facto cause of the Civil War).

God's planned "beast" worked exactly as planned. Religion came from the "beast" and was used to teach men how to build things, not to spread the Truth around the world.

 

[JakeStarkey]

All theocracies are despotic.

What do you think democracies do? Do we dictate our will to other countries or do we have congress for them and an address of grievances?

I was talking to an American Muslim that I knew and I got a vitriolic response that our democracy is a dictatorship and we should other countries alone. So I didn't know what to say other than, "Okaaaaayyy" to appease the wrath.

Depends on whether democracies guarantee by low and force the rights of minorities.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Consider the democratic procedures, without minority rights, in Puritan New England or Mormon 19th century communities.

 

[Chuckt]

Consider the democratic procedures, without minority rights, in Puritan New England or Mormon 19th century communities.

I think back then, people got away with a lot. There were less rules and no one cared unless you stepped on their property. There weren't a lot of police and when you live on a farm, no one comes to bother you because you are farther apart.

 

[PainefulTruth]

They are supposed to represent us and not the rich or powerful who have PACs. They have to represent the will of the people.

But the people still have the ultimate power, which all too often they sell to the politician who's the highest bidder.

How do you legislate morality when they saw the Iraq war as a theater to test weapon systems? What other reason did they go in there except that and for the oil?

I thought I was cynical.

If morality can't be taught, who's morality will be taught? The morality of the rich? The morality of the defense companies?

But a simple universal morality can be determined and taught, instead of the plethora of self-serving dicta.

Is there a day in the world where there isn't war or conflict? No. Who's morality is being taught? Not God's.

That's easy to say. Everyone and every group has the right of self-defense if they honor the rights of others.

When will we have peace?

Probably never. This is our testing ground to see how we react to temptation, and to others who give into that temptation at our expense.

Make sure you read about the morality being taught:

Chuck 'em all and start over with the basics, and stay there. Basically it's the Golden Rule, however it's worded: Morality is honoring the equal rights of all to their life, liberty, property and self defense to be free from violation through force or fraud. All else is individual virtue.

God wrote the Ten Commandments not Moses.

Exodus 24:12 And the LORD said unto Moses, Come up to me into the mount, and be there: and I will give thee tables of stone, and a law, and commandments which I have written ; that thou mayest teach them. (This is the first time.)
Exodus 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God . (This is the first time.)
Exodus 34:1 And the LORD said unto Moses, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first: and I will write upon these tables the words that were in the first tables, which thou brakest. (This is the second time.)

Yeah, and Moses wrote Exodus. Enforcing these and other religious rules with execution is a prime indication of someone with a God complex.

All theocracies are despotic.

Amen.

I was talking to an American Muslim that I knew and I got a vitriolic response that our democracy is a dictatorship and we should other countries alone. So I didn't know what to say other than, "Okaaaaayyy" to appease the wrath.

They want to impose their religion on others as well, and they're compelled to do it by the Koran. For them it's called Sharia Law.

 

[GreatestIam]

I have to wonder if Moses actually believed in God. If he did, I cannot see him breaking the commandment to kill but that is exactly what he did to something like 3,000 of his own people right after he came down from the mountain with the big ten.

He could not have respected the commandments much as one of the first things he did was change God's no divorce law to a new law where the Jews could divorce for damned near any reason.

Hillel and Shammai - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"but the House of Hillel allowed divorce for even trivial offenses, such as burning a meal."


No respect I tell ya.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FPv2toi5og]ClassicTelevisionBlog - Comedian Rodney Dangerfield - YouTube[/ame]

Regards
DL