‘Mr. Wonderful’ slams Trump ruling: ‘You might as well find guilty every real estate developer on Earth’

[DBA]

Everybody does it has never been a valid legal defense.

All of a sudden Democrats act as if they care about the laws. Ok, so let’s run with this and use the Trump case as precedent. Every business and every individual who has ever taken out a loan shound be investigated, wheher or not that loan was paid in full and on time or not. Anyone found to have inflated the value of their personal assets, based on the judgement of state appointed appraisers, will be be forced to pay a fine equivalent to the extra interest the banks could have presumably charged over the course of the loan plus accrued interest since the closing of the “fraudulent” loan and the time the judgement is paid. You first.

Boneheads.

 

[Marener]

All of a sudden Democrats act as if they care about the laws. Ok, so let’s run with this and use the Trump case as precedent. Every business and every individual who has ever taken out a loan shound be investigated, wheher or not that loan was paid in full and on time or not. Anyone found to have inflated the value of their personal assets, based on the judgement of state appointed appraisers, will be be forced to pay a fine equivalent to the extra interest the banks could have presumably charged over the course of the loan plus accrued interest since the closing of the “fraudulent” loan and the time the judgement is paid. You first.

Boneheads.

Investigations require some evidence a crime has occurred.

Have you lied to a bank when applying for a loan?

 

[DBA]

Investigations require some evidence a crime has occurred.

Have you lied to a bank when applying for a loan?

Has anyone? Is it a lie if you appraiser appraises your property for more than what some other appraiser might? Why hasn’t NY gone after anyone else for the same reason?

What about those that under-valued their assets? Would they have potentially gotten lower interest rates if they had valued their assets higher? Are they owned an interest refund from the bank?

This is an uttterly ridiculous ruling based on property values, which are nothing more than opinions. A property is worth what someone will pay for it.

 

[Marener]

Has anyone? Is it a lie if you appraiser appraises your property for more than what some other appraiser might? Why hasn’t NY gone after anyone else for the same reason?

What about those that under-valued their assets? Would they have potentially gotten lower interest rates if they had valued their assets higher? Are they owned an interest refund from the bank?

This is an uttterly ridiculous ruling based on property values, which are nothing more than opinions. A property is worth what someone will pay for it.

If people undervalue their assets on a loan application, then its not fraud since the deception is not in pursuit of an advantage. That’s on them.

There are rules for valuation of assets and you can’t just make shit up. Surely you wouldn’t do that since you’re not a bonehead.

Why would you be okay with other people doing it?

 

[DBA]

If people undervalue their assets on a loan application, then its not fraud since the deception is not in pursuit of an advantage. That’s on them.

There are rules for valuation of assets and you can’t just make shit up. Surely you wouldn’t do that since you’re not a bonehead.

Why would you be okay with other people doing it?

Why do you think he just made it up? Appraisals are all over the map, particualrly in NY And particularly with properties of historical significance.

This law is untenable if applied to all. The value of your assets is your opiniion. It is up to the banks to determine the true value. Lying would be saying you own properties that you don’t.

 

[Marener]

Why do you think he just made it up? Appraisals are all over the map, particualrly in NY And particularly with properties of historical significance.

This law is untenable if applied to all. The value of your assets is your opiniion. It is up to the banks to determine the true value. Lying would be saying you own properties that you don’t.

On one of his properties, he had an independent commercial appraisal of less than $10 million. He listed the value as $161 million.

If you had your house valued at $1 million, would you feel comfortable writing down $16 million on a loan application?

 

[DBA]

On one of his properties, he had an independent commercial appraisal of less than $10 million. He listed the value as $161 million.

If you had your house valued at $1 million, would you feel comfortable writing down $16 million on a loan application?

If I did, would the bank call me out on it? I guess I depends on how much they want to give my my loan and if my net worth clearly exceeds my loan amount. If I valued the property at 16 million when they thought it was only worth 1 million, they likely wouldn’t care if I was borrowing 500k. That is the way it works in the real world because banks are all about risk/reward.

 

[JoeB131]

All of a sudden Democrats act as if they care about the laws. Ok, so let’s run with this and use the Trump case as precedent. Every business and every individual who has ever taken out a loan shound be investigated, wheher or not that loan was paid in full and on time or not. Anyone found to have inflated the value of their personal assets, based on the judgement of state appointed appraisers, will be be forced to pay a fine equivalent to the extra interest the banks could have presumably charged over the course of the loan plus accrued interest since the closing of the “fraudulent” loan and the time the judgement is paid. You first.

Every other developer is smart enough not to commit the kind of outright fraud Trump tried to. They usually have whole compliance departments making sure all the t's are crossed and the i's are dotted.

 

[Marener]

If I did, would the bank call me out on it? I guess I depends on how much they want to give my my loan and if my net worth clearly exceeds my loan amount. If I valued the property at 16 million when they thought it was only worth 1 million, they likely wouldn’t care if I was borrowing 500k. That is the way it works in the real world.

Way to avoid the question, and it seems pretty obvious why.

The obvious answer is that any rational person who thinks the rules apply to them, would never in a million years inflate your house value by a multiple of 16.

I didn’t ask if it mattered to the bank or not. I asked if you would inflate your home value on a loan application from $1 million to $16 million.

You act as though it’s difficult to be honest. It’s really not. At least it’s not for normal people. Trump doesn’t seem to be that normal.

 

[martybegan]

So you agree with me.
Trump is a rapist.

No, I don't you soi boi cuck-sucker.

 

[DBA]

Way to avoid the question, and it seems pretty obvious why.

The obvious answer is that any rational person who thinks the rules apply to them, would never in a million years inflate your house value by a multiple of 16.

I didn’t ask if it mattered to the bank or not. I asked if you would inflate your home value on a loan application from $1 million to $16 million.

You act as though it’s difficult to be honest. It’s really not. At least it’s not for normal people. Trump doesn’t seem to be that normal.

The point is that banks take your self-professed property evaluations with a huge grain of salt.

I would like to know more about the property in question. There is likely much more to it than you let on.

 

[martybegan]

Federal law "trumps" state law............ shit for brains.

State courts can't try someone over federal law, dipshit.

Why havent' the feds charged Trump under that law?

 

[Marener]

The point is that banks take your self-professed property evaluations with a huge grain of salt.

I would like to know more about the property in question. There is likely much more to it than you let on.

Your point is irrelevant. This is not a question as to what the bank did. It's a question about what Trump did.

You do know that you have to be honest on your loan applications, right?

Oh, there is more to the property I mentioned, but it's worse for Trump than you think.

It's called Seven Springs. It's a piece of land. Trump valued the property as though it had 7 mansions built on it ready to sell. In fact, not only did it not have mansions on it, but it wasn't even legal for him to build those mansions on it because he had sought a tax advantage by promising not to develop it (previous attempts to develop the land had resulted in protracted legal battles and he had given up).

That's why the commercial property appraiser valued it at less than $10 million. Trump's valuation was based on lies.

Again, Trump had an independent commercial appraisal put the value at about $10 million. Trump claimed $161 million.

If you had an appraisal on your house that valued it at $1 million, would you feel comfortable writing down $16 million? It's a pretty simple question and the only reason you aren't answering it is because the obvious answer is "no".

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

State courts can't try someone over federal law, dipshit.

ANOTHER fine graduate of the Trump U. "law" school correspondence course.

Introduction to the Court System​

State and federal courts each play a different role in our legal system and you need to know the difference so your case is filed in the proper jurisdiction.
Both courts can hear criminal cases based on the governing laws of the crime, but only the federal courts can hear cases involving antitrust, bankruptcy, constitutional issues, patent, copyright, cases against the United States, cases involving parties from different states and if the amount in controversy exceeds $75,000. In the rare occasions that both federal and state courts have jurisdiction, the parties can choose whether to go to state court or to federal court.

State Court Jurisdiction to Enforce Federal Law | US Law​

LII / Legal Information Institute
https://www.law.cornell.edu › ... › Federal and State Courts
Unless the federal courts possess exclusive jurisdiction over a matter, state courts may hear cases over which federal courts would have also had jurisdiction.

Why havent' the feds charged Trump under that law?

Trump civil fraud trial: Why the New York case stands apart​

AP News
https://apnews.com › article › trump-fraud-business-law-...
Jan 29, 2024 — Notably, New York's anti-fraud statute, known as Executive Law 63(12), is clear that a finding of fraud does not require intent to deceive or ...

 

[pknopp]

50 pages and Trump is still guilty.

 

[Nostra]

If people undervalue their assets on a loan application, then its not fraud since the deception is not in pursuit of an advantage. That’s on them.

There are rules for valuation of assets and you can’t just make shit up. Surely you wouldn’t do that since you’re not a bonehead.

Why would you be okay with other people doing it?

Wouldn't undervalueing still be a lie, Stupid?

You aren't very smart.

 

[martybegan]

ANOTHER fine graduate of the Trump U. "law" school correspondence course.

Introduction to the Court System​

State and federal courts each play a different role in our legal system and you need to know the difference so your case is filed in the proper jurisdiction.
Both courts can hear criminal cases based on the governing laws of the crime, but only the federal courts can hear cases involving antitrust, bankruptcy, constitutional issues, patent, copyright, cases against the United States, cases involving parties from different states and if the amount in controversy exceeds $75,000. In the rare occasions that both federal and state courts have jurisdiction, the parties can choose whether to go to state court or to federal court.

State Court Jurisdiction to Enforce Federal Law | US Law​

View attachment 906480
LII / Legal Information Institute
https://www.law.cornell.edu › ... › Federal and State Courts
Unless the federal courts possess exclusive jurisdiction over a matter, state courts may hear cases over which federal courts would have also had jurisdiction.

Trump civil fraud trial: Why the New York case stands apart​

View attachment 906482
AP News
https://apnews.com › article › trump-fraud-business-law-...
Jan 29, 2024 — Notably, New York's anti-fraud statute, known as Executive Law 63(12), is clear that a finding of fraud does not require intent to deceive or ...

Jurisdiction, but not the actual written laws. State courts have to use State laws. There would have to be similar laws by both sovereigns to apply your point, and even then each sovereign has to use their own law on the books.

You referenced a federal law and thought it could be applied to a State case.


Dumbass.

 

[Marener]

Wouldn't undervalueing still be a lie, Stupid?

You aren't very smart.

You could say it's a lie, but it's not fraud.

You don't seem to know the definition of fraud. That's because you have a hard time thinking for yourself and seeking out new information.

 

[Marener]

I just want one of these Trump supporters to come out and say that it’s perfectly okay to write whatever the hell you want on a loan application.

That’s what they’re saying in so many words but they’ll never admit it.

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

Jurisdiction, but not the actual written laws. State courts have to use State laws.

No shit.

There would have to be similar laws by both sovereigns to apply your point, and even then each sovereign has to use their own law on the books.

You referenced a federal law and thought it could be applied to a State case.

No, I didn't.
Federal law trumps state law, I used that as an example of how all encompassing fraud laws are, meaning the entire US.

You stated it wasn't illegal at all.

What fraud laws were broken?

The process was risky and stupid, but not illegal.

814. False Statements (18 U.S.C. § 1014)​

Department of Justice (.gov)
https://www.justice.gov › archives › criminal-resource-m...
Generally, the making of a number of false statements to a lending institution in a single document constitutes only one criminal violation under section 1014.

Dumbass.

IDIOT.