Muslims are our friends but Islam is the enemy of Western Civilization?

[Kalam]

"Several letters have been received by me, asking me to declare my views
about the Arab-Jew question in Palestine and the persecution of the Jews in
Germany. It is not without hesitation that I venture to offer my views on
this very difficult question.

My sympathies are all with the Jews. I have known them intimately in South
Africa. Some of them became lifelong companions. Through these friends I
came to learn much of their age long persecution. They have been the
untouchables of Christianity. The parallel between their treatment by
Christians and the treatment of untouchables by Hindus is very close.

Religious sanction has been invoked in both cases for the justification of
the inhuman treatment meted out to them. Apart from the friendships,
therefore, there is the more common universal reason for my sympathy for
the Jews. But my sympathy does not blind me to the requirements of justice.

The cry for the national home for the Jews does not make much appeal to me.
The sanction for it is sought in the Bible and the tenacity with which the Jews
have hankered after return to Palestine.

Why should they not, like other peoples of the earth, make that country
their home where they are born and where they earn their livelihood?
Palestine belongs to the Arabs in the same sense that England belongs to the English or France to the French. It is wrong and inhuman to impose the Jews on the Arabs. What is going on in Palestine today cannot be justified by any moral code of conduct. The mandates have no sanction but that of the last war. Surely it would be a crime against humanity to reduce the proud Arabs so that Palestine can be restored to the Jews partly or wholly as their national home. The nobler course would be to insist on a just treatment of the Jews wherever they are born and bred. The Jews born in France are French in precisely the same sense that Christians born in France are French.

If the Jews have no home but Palestine, will they relish the idea of being
forced to leave the other parts of the world in which they are settled?
Or do they want a double home where they can remain at will? This cry for the
national home affords a colorable justification for the German expulsion of
the Jews. But the German persecution of the Jews seems to have no parallel
in history. The tyrants of old never went so mad as Hitler seems to have
gone. And he is doing it with religious zeal. For, he is propounding a new
religion of exclusive and militant nationalism in the name of which any
inhumanity becomes an act of humanity to be rewarded here and hereafter."

- Mohandas K. Gandhi, Harijan, Nov. 26 1938

 

[Jroc]

When the Arab population in East Jerusalem was polled as to whether they would choose to be Palestinian citizens or Israeli citizens should an agreement be reached to establish a separate nation of Palestine, only 30% chose to be Palestinian citizens. The fact that an Islamic mosque still sits on the Dome of the Rock speaks to Israeli tolerance for Islam.

Most of the so called muslims who responded that they wanted to stay Israeli citizens are "Druze".

Druze are muslims in name only.

And are Not accepted as muslims by either Shia or Sunni muslims.

They have always sided with Israel in exchange for protection.

Druze are the "sell outs" and "Uncle Toms" of the Middle East.

So to use them in any poll about Muslims is totally misleading and disingenuous.

Are Druze considered Arabs?

In new survey, 35% say they are willing to relocate if their neighborhoods become part of a future Palestinian state; only 30% say they would prefer Palestinian citizenship over Israeli.

Arab residents of East Jerusalem are divided on whether they would want Israeli or Palestinian citizenship should a future Palestinian state be created, suggests a new poll released on Wednesday in Washington.

East Jerusalem neighborhood Issawiya



The survey, conducted by Pechter Middle East Polls in partnership with the Council on Foreign Relations, asked a simple question that the leaders both in Israel and the Palestinian authority seem to ignore all too often: What do the people themselves want? And the people seem confused.

When asked if they preferred to become a citizen of Palestine, with all of the rights and privileges of other citizens of Palestine, or a citizen of Israel, only 30 percent chose Palestinian citizenship – as compared to 35 percent that chose Israeli citizenship. Another 35 percent either had no answer or declined to provide it.

A follow up question asked respondents if “most people in your neighborhood” would prefer to become citizens of Palestine or of Israel: 31percent thought that most people prefer Palestinian citizenship; 39 percent - Israeli citizenship; and 30 percent, once again, declined to answer or said they didn’t know.

Would East Jerusalem Arabs rather be citizens of Israel or Palestine? - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News

 

[Jroc]

"Several letters have been received by me, asking me to declare my views
about the Arab-Jew question in Palestine and the persecution of the Jews in
Germany.

- Mohandas K. Gandhi, Harijan, Nov. 26 1938

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuq3GnOXXjg"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuq3GnOXXjg[/ame]

 

[Foxfyre]

Of the 22 Arab countries, not a single one has a Jew in its government or in any position of power.

You are the one spewing the misinformation and hate Foxfyre.


"Tehran has 11 functioning synagogues, many of them with Hebrew schools. It has two kosher restaurants, and a Jewish hospital, an old-age home and a cemetery. There is a Jewish representative in the Iranian parliament. There is a Jewish library with 20,000 titles, its reading room decorated with a photograph of the Ayatolltah

Iran remains home to Jewish enclave

There has been a seat reserved for a Jew on the Iranian parliament since 1906 and, until the Constitution is amended, Jews are protected by the Iranian Constitution. However, Jews do not fare all that well in Iran since 1948 and most especially since the Shah was overthrown and radical clerics have been in control. I have acquaintances here in Albuquerque who were formerly Iranian Jews and they do not relate a good condition for Jews in Iran.

Evenso, even you should know that the Iranians are not Arab, Sunni Man.

 

[Kalam]

(@JRoc) Is there something you want to say?

 

[High_Gravity]

So basically everyone has to pack their bags and move back to the land of their ancestors? what if my father is black and my mother is white, do I keep a home in Africa and another in Ireland?

 

[Kalam]

So basically everyone has to pack their bags and move back to the land of their ancestors?

Who said that?

 

[Sunni Man]

King Hamad of Bahrain on Thursday (25 Nov) appointed
a Jew and a Christian among four women to the 40-member upper chamber,
following a parliamentary election last month, state media reported.

Excerpts: Bahrains king appoints a Jew and a Christian to parliament. Lebanese - TRCB

 

[Sunni Man]

So basically everyone has to pack their bags and move back to the land of their ancestors? what if my father is black and my mother is white, do I keep a home in Africa and another in Ireland?

You would have to go back to Africa.

Because you are considered black.

Just the same as Obama.

 

[High_Gravity]

So basically everyone has to pack their bags and move back to the land of their ancestors?

Who said that?

Well people are saying the Jews have no right to be there and should go back where they came from, correct?

 

[High_Gravity]

So basically everyone has to pack their bags and move back to the land of their ancestors? what if my father is black and my mother is white, do I keep a home in Africa and another in Ireland?

You would have to go back to Africa.

Because you are considered black.

Just the same as Obama.

So my Irish ancestry means nothing?

 

[Kalam]

So basically everyone has to pack their bags and move back to the land of their ancestors?

Who said that?

Well people are saying the Jews have no right to be there and should go back where they came from, correct?

Not at this point, but shouldn't have "imposed themselves" on Palestine in the manner that they did in the first place. They are non-Muslim inhabitants of a Muslim territory and, as such, have no right to impose their system of government on Muslims.

At the time Gandhi wrote the piece, Israel hadn't been formed and Jewish immigration to the territory was an ongoing issue. These were people whose ancestors had lived in Europe for hundreds of years or more.

 

[High_Gravity]

Who said that?

Well people are saying the Jews have no right to be there and should go back where they came from, correct?

Not at this point, but shouldn't have "imposed themselves" on Palestine in the manner that they did in the first place. They are non-Muslim inhabitants of a Muslim territory and, as such, have no right to impose their system of government on Muslims.

Well alot of countries are composed mainly of people who were not the original inhabitants, North America, South America and Australia come to mind. Where should the Israelis go now?

 

[High_Gravity]

Plus I thought the Palestinians were ok with sharing the land with Jews and Christians, but your telling me this land is just for Muslims?

 

[Kalam]

Well people are saying the Jews have no right to be there and should go back where they came from, correct?

Not at this point, but shouldn't have "imposed themselves" on Palestine in the manner that they did in the first place. They are non-Muslim inhabitants of a Muslim territory and, as such, have no right to impose their system of government on Muslims.

Well alot of countries are composed mainly of people who were not the original inhabitants, North America, South America and Australia come to mind. Where should the Israelis go now?

Wherever they want, or nowhere. Their state is another story.

 

[Ropey]

And as yet nobody has given me ANY justification for continued hatred of Israel and the Jews. The Jews bother nobody who is willing to leave them alone.

By saying this, you imply that they aren't squatting on stolen land. What I find funny is that many of the same Americans who complain about the "failure" of Muslim immigrants to "assimilate" to life in various European countries also support Israel, an entity created by immigrants who refused to assimilate to the culture of their destination to such an extent that they violently imposed their own way of life on the non-Jews living there. I can't help but suspect that these people would be less supportive of a revived Andalusian caliphate.

The fact remains that The UN partition of Palestine (the second one after they got Jordan, aka "Palestine I")

Had the Arabs won- there would have been no Jews TO 'Return'.

As a Palestinian, I ask the world to please stop exploiting our issue. If you want a do a good deed, find your own. To the singers romanticizing Palestinian suffering, it is not romantic. There is nothing dreamy about it. Where is the heroism in a small child throwing rocks at a tank? Either warn the child to stay away or just shut up! How dare you do this to our children? Does our suffering give you such good video footage and high ratings?

Stolen Land?

Much of the world buys the line – peddled by the Palestinians and the Arab Muslim world and, indeed, many Western countries – that paints Israel as the bad "Goliath" that "stole" the land from the "Palestinians."

Israel gave Gaza self-rule in 1994, unilaterally withdrawing the last of its citizens and soldiers from Gaza in 2005. Hamas, voted into power via free elections in 2006, fought and defeated their political and military rival, Fatah, to seize de facto control of Gaza in 2007. In the past eight years, Hamas has fired more than 10,000 rockets and mortars into Israel – 7,000 of them after Israel's 2005 withdrawal. With improved technology – reportedly assisted by Iran – Hamas' rockets can now fly 24 miles before impact and explosion, thereby threatening, injuring and killing more and more Israelis living in southern Israel.

But why the "disproportionate" response by Israel? Reportedly, more than 600 Palestinians have been killed, some civilians. Set aside for the moment that Hamas' charter specifically calls for the "obliteration" of the state of Israel. And set aside the fact that the Palestinian "militants" fight in heavily populated areas, assuring, indeed encouraging (for PR purposes) civilian casualties.

We turn our attention to the "stolen" allegation.

The truth about Israel's 'stolen' land

fter four centuries of Ottoman rule, Britain took the land in 1917 and pledged in the Balfour Declaration to support a Jewish national homeland there. In 1920, the British Palestine Mandate was recognized. A declaration passed by the League of Nations in 1922 effectively divided the mandated territory into two parts. The eastern portion, called Transjordan, would later become the Arab Kingdom of Jordan in 1946. The other portion, comprising the territory west of the Jordan River, was administered as Palestine under provisions that called for the establishment of a Jewish homeland.

The United Nations, in 1947, partitioned the area into separate Jewish and Arab states along meandering and indefensible boundaries. The Arab world, insisting that any Jewish claim to Palestine was invalid, staunchly refused to compromise or even discuss the subject.

When Israel's independence was declared in 1948, Arab forces from Egypt, Transjordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq combined to crush the one-day-old country. They lost. Still, Egypt occupied most of the Gaza Strip, and Transjordan (calling itself "Jordan") held most of the West Bank and half of Jerusalem. Neither Arab country gave the "Palestinians" a state.

The word "Palestinian," as employed today, is a relatively recent term. Until the end of the British mandate over Palestine, in 1948, all inhabitants of the area west of the Jordan River were known as "Palestinians." A Jewish person living in what is now Israel was a "Palestinian Jew." An Arab living in the area was a "Palestinian Arab." Likewise, a Christian was known as a "Palestinian Christian."

Israel won more land after a series of Arab initiated wars with almost all the land taken when Israel handed the Arabians their back sides in every war that the Arabians started and since has returned or offered for return in exchange for peace.

The Jews "stole" nothing.

 

[Sunni Man]

So my Irish ancestry means nothing?

Not in the American system of race/status hierarchy.

 

[Jroc]

(@JRoc) Is there something you want to say?

"

Several letters have been received by me, asking me to declare my views
about the Arab-Jew question in Palestine and the persecution of the Jews in
Germany. It is not without hesitation that I venture to offer my views on
this very difficult question.

I pointed out that there were over a million Jews driven out of Arab countries, they are not only from Europe. It seem to me that you think there should be no Jew living in any Arab or muslim land. Well... the so called "Palestinians think so" when areas are turned over to them all the Jews must be removed so why is that?

 

[Ropey]

your telling me this land is just for Muslims?

Yes, that is what he is telling you.

 

[Kalam]

Plus I thought the Palestinians were ok with sharing the land with Jews and Christians, but your telling me this land is just for Muslims?

The only territory that should be restricted to Muslim residents is the Hijaz in Saudi Arabia. Jews and Christians and members of other religious groups are welcome to live as citizens in an Islamic society if they recognize that they are living in an Islamic society.