New York City going to let illegals vote

[Rogue AI]

Since they use computers to do this it seems a simple matter of creating a subfolder. I'm not a computer expert but even I'm capable of creating a map within a map.

It's called a lawsuit.

'Seems' is not good enough.

A lawsuit is not going to ensure accountability. A guarantee of prosecution for voter fraud might. Sadly this hair brained scheme is lacking in every conceivable way.

 

[forkup]

'Seems' is not good enough.

A lawsuit is not going to ensure accountability. A guarantee of prosecution for voter fraud might. Sadly this hair brained scheme is lacking in every conceivable way.

How do you guarantee prosecution? Or for that matter is there such a thing as an airtight way to prevent fraud? If that's your only consideration why allow voting at all since fraud is always possible? What other remedy do you suggest besides proving your grievance in a court of law? Storming city hall?

It's been tried at a federal level. Not exactly a good idea in my honest opinion

 

[Care4all]

Who provides the oversight on the 'separate' rolls and what guarantee is there they remain separate? What remedy is available in case of 'mistakes'?

Good questions! There are localities already allowing this, that we could research to find out their procedures for it.... I just haven't had the time to do it yet....

 

[Rogue AI]

How do you guarantee prosecution? Or for that matter is there such a thing as an airtight way to prevent fraud? If that's your only consideration why allow voting at all since fraud is always possible? What other remedy do you suggest besides proving your grievance in a court of law? Storming city hall?

It's been tried at a federal level. Not exactly a good idea in my honest opinion

Pretty simple really. For the first five years after implementation, full and complete audits of every polling station. Prosecutions for any discrepancy.

 

[forkup]

Pretty simple really. For the first five years after implementation, full and complete audits of every polling station. Prosecutions for any discrepancy.

Really so let me get this straight? A poll worker misreads a single vote. He is now criminally liable?
A poll worker tells a poll watcher to "get out of her face" because he's been harassing her all day is now criminally liable
Someone has been sent the wrong ballot sending her to the wrong precinct because she changed her address 2 days before the election. Voila, the person who was responsible for sending the ballot is now criminally liable.

If you prosecute on your standards those are the things that will happen. You will have none left who's willing to count your vote.

 

[Rogue AI]

Really so let me get this straight? A poll worker misreads a single vote. He is now criminally liable?
A poll worker tells a poll watcher to "get out of her face" because he's been harassing her all day is now criminally liable
Someone has been sent the wrong ballot sending her to the wrong precinct because she changed her address 2 days before the election. Voila, the person who was responsible for sending the ballot is now criminally liable.

If you prosecute on your standards those are the things that will happen. You will have none left who's willing to count your vote.

The integrity of elections is at stake. If it really was a mistake, expect a not guilty verdict. Only through harsh initial accountability can you ensure continued diligence over time.

 

[forkup]

The integrity of elections is at stake. If it really was a mistake, expect a not guilty verdict. Only through harsh initial accountability can you ensure continued diligence over time.

Can you point to any actually proven example that the integrity of an election has been damaged on a scale capable of actually changing a vote?

You know what I'll help. Voter Fraud Map: Election Fraud Database | The Heritage Foundation

The most right-wing site imaginable. In a single year, the actual cases of voter fraud is counted in the dozens NATIONALLY. How much danger do you feel voter integrity is at? Yet you are proposing MASSIVE penalties both financially, physiologically, and societally for those willing to volunteer to do a tedious job for a problem that I can't establish actually exists.

 

[Rogue AI]

Can you point to any actually proven example that the integrity of an election has been damaged on a scale capable of actually changing a vote?

You know what I'll help. Voter Fraud Map: Election Fraud Database | The Heritage Foundation

The most right-wing site imaginable. In a single year, the actual cases of voter fraud is counted in the dozens NATIONALLY. How much danger do you feel voter integrity is at? Yet you are proposing MASSIVE penalties both financially, physiologically, and societally for those willing to volunteer to do a tedious job for a problem that I can't establish actually exists.

Try actual history. Check into New York City under Tammney Hall rule. You folks are asking to repeat history on a grander scale.

 

[forkup]

Try actual history. Check into New York City under Tammney Hall rule. You folks are asking to repeat history on a grander scale.

So you are claiming that letting legal residents vote will somehow lead to the practices of 19th century NY. An age right after the civil war? An age without computers, poll watchers, lawyers ready to sue, or any of the safeguards that constitute the current day election cycles?

I offered you a tool. Put up by people you agree with ideologically, in order to actually access the magnitude of a problem. And the best you can do is " but in the 19th century?"

Forgive me when I don't consider your argument as one that is made in good faith.

 

[Rogue AI]

So you are claiming that letting legal residents vote will somehow lead to the practices of 19th century NY. An age right after the civil war? An age without computers, poll watchers, lawyers ready to sue, or any of the safeguards that constitute the current day election cycles?

I offered you a tool. Put up by people you agree with ideologically, in order to actually access the magnitude of a problem. And the best you can do is " but in the 19th century?"

Forgive me when I don't consider your argument as one that is made in good faith.

Without strict accountability, most certainly.

 

[forkup]

Without strict accountability, most certainly.

If you honestly believe that, I can only say that your political affiliation has turned you into an idiot.

 

[wamose]

NY and California are in a race to insanity

 

[toobfreak]

Yup baby steps that's how these liberals operate. Make something not normal to normal.

WHAT COULD GO WRONG?

1. Let droves of foreigners move in and establish a residence.
2. Since they live in the community, give them a voice in elections equal to actual citizens.
3. The foreigners all start voting for other foreigners and people promoting their interests as foreigners.
4. Soon, the foreigners are running the city, protecting their own interests, making the region more like home and boosting their power base taking over the country.

Don't you know that if you move to China, Korea, Russia, Canada, Europe or the Middle East, the first thing they do is vote to give you an equal voice in their government as they have?

Wake up now, no, this is not a bad nightmare, it is just your foreign-influenced and run DNC party working for a stronger America (for foreigners). You? You're screwed.

 

[Rogue AI]

If you honestly believe that, I can only say that your political affiliation has turned you into an idiot.

You have absolutely no answers as to accountability, you are the one who appears to be an idiot. Blindly following your silly feelings without taking even a moment for rational thought and potential abuses.

 

[g5000]

Yup baby steps that's how these liberals operate. Make something not normal to normal.

New York City Gives 800,000 Noncitizens Right to Vote in Local Elections (Published 2021)

The legislation approved by the City Council will set up a system for legal residents to vote in municipal elections.

www.google.com

They are not letting illegals vote. Your topic title is a lie.

As for your claim of "not normal", from our country's founding until the mid 1920s, the majority of states allowed immigrants to vote in elections. Some even allowed them to vote in federal elections.

It wasn't until the wave of anti-immigrant fever of the 1920s that that practice stopped.

 

[rightwinger]

Who is conducting the oversight? Would it not require proof? If so, voter ID shouldn't be an issue moving forward, correct?

Maybe something called a Green Card?

 

[forkup]

You have absolutely no answers as to accountability, you are the one who appears to be an idiot. Blindly following your silly feelings without taking even a moment for rational thought and potential abuses.

My answer to accountability is lawyers and poll watchers from opposing parties having the ability to monitor and sue people who they feel are abusing the system. Or for that matter by the DOJ's ability to prosecute those that commit fraud.

As for potential abuses. Just because something maybe be a problem doesn't mean it is a problem or for that matter does it mean it needs to be eliminated.

Any vote can potentially be fraudulent. I assume you recognize that doesn't mean you should forbid voting. A rational person recognizes that the possibility of fraud has to be weighed against the actual instances of fraud. More people who commit fraud mean more safeguards to prevent fraud. The only fraud-free election is one you don't have.

You are suggesting safeguarding against the possibility of fraud regardless of the actual instances. To the point of denying certain groups to vote altogether. That is not rational.

 

[g5000]

Legal immigrants are being taxed. They should have representation.

Taxation without representation is tyranny.

 

[Independent thinker]

Yup baby steps that's how these liberals operate. Make something not normal to normal.

New York City Gives 800,000 Noncitizens Right to Vote in Local Elections (Published 2021)

The legislation approved by the City Council will set up a system for legal residents to vote in municipal elections.

www.google.com

Many in both California and New York are beginning to see the light. Some localities in California have already been letting illegals vote and now Newsome wants to cover illegals with free state run healthcare. This is great ammunition for upcoming elections. Off the top of my head, and I may be mistaken, but, I believe when you look at these two states county by county, there are more red counties than there are blue counties.

 

[MinTrut]

That rationale can be extended to federal election, making citizenship an abstraction. That's why.

The Democrats would NEVER try this!

They're quite upstanding.