Nikki Haley alleged she was set up by Democratic 'plant' after being asked what caused the Civil War

[Wobbly]

Tariffs are taxes applied to both imports and exports. Tariffs applied to southern produced goods made them cost prohibitive. This is mainly why the south seceded. Rerun of the revolutionary war. Precursor to Animal Farm.

There was no tariff on cotton exports. There was no tariff on "southern produced goods." Tariffs were on British manufactured goods to protect new American industries. that could not compete, otherwise..

And, as I pointed out earlier, the South had been bitching about those tariffs for decades. They never did anything more than bitch. Hell, the very first tariff passed in America was on foreign cotton and wool, protecting southern cotton.

From the SC declaration of secession and reasons given.
[A]n increasing hostility on the part of the non-slaveholding States to the institution of slavery, has led to a disregard of their obligations, and the laws of the General Government have ceased to effect the objects of the Constitution.

South Carolina Declaration of Secession (1860) | Constitution Center

National Constitution Center Historic Documents Library record for South Carolina Declaration of Secession (1860)

constitutioncenter.org

"A" as in First.

"Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery – the greatest material interest of the world…and a blow at slavery is a blow at commerce and civilization, ...

A Declaration of the Immediate Causes which Induce and Justify the Secession of the State of Mississippi from the Federal Union (1861) | Constitution Center

National Constitution Center Historic Documents Library record for A Declaration of the Immediate Causes which Induce and Justify the Secession of the State of Mississippi from the Federal Union (1861)

constitutioncenter.org

Slavery is the first and dominant cause of secession listed in the Texas declaration.

DECLARATION OF CAUSES: February 2, 1861 A declaration of the causes which impel the State of Texas to secede from the Federal Union. | TSLAC

DECLARATION OF CAUSES: February 2, 1861 A declaration of the causes which impel the State of Texas to secede from the Federal Union. Related Links Narrative history of Secession and Readmission | Narrative history of Annexation

www.tsl.texas.gov

And, beyond all of the words of the southerners themselves, we have the facts of what happened. The South seceded upon Lincoln's election. They weren't upset over Lincoln's policies on tariffs. They didn't object to the funny hat he wore. The South had bitched and bitched, but they only decided to fight, because Lincoln had a policy to limit the spread of slavery.

 

[bodecea]

Abraham Lincoln started the war. How the hell can modern day posters still not understand he is who started the war. The guy diverted and that was her complaint. She asked for the next question.

You guys still think the shots at Sumter started the war do not understand the shots hit the fort walls. None of the troops in the fort were hit by the fire by the South. They might as well have been firing into the ocean.

Lincoln didn't start the war...that was South Carolina, firing on a federal military base.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The treasonous insurrection of 1861 was about keeping human beings enslaved.



‘A geographical line has been drawn across the Union, and all the States north of that line have united in the election of a man to the high office of President of the United States, whose opinions and purposes are hostile to slavery. He is to be entrusted with the administration of the common Government, because he has declared that that “Government cannot endure permanently half slave, half free,” and that the public mind must rest in the belief that slavery is in the course of ultimate extinction. . . .

On the 4th day of March next, this party will take possession of the Government. It has announced that the South shall be excluded from the common territory, that the judicial tribunals shall be made sectional, and that a war must be waged against slavery until it shall cease throughout the United States. The guaranties of the Constitution will then no longer exist; the equal rights of the States will be lost. The slaveholding States will no longer have the power of self-government, or self-protection, and the Federal Government will have become their enemy. . .’

South Carolina Declaration of Secession (1860)

Stop dry humping the RINO you silly fuck

 

[Wobbly]

Abraham Lincoln started the war. How the hell can modern day posters still not understand he is who started the war. The guy diverted and that was her complaint. She asked for the next question.

You guys still think the shots at Sumter started the war do not understand the shots hit the fort walls. None of the troops in the fort were hit by the fire by the South. They might as well have been firing into the ocean.

Interesting. Your excuse is the South didn't start it, because they were incompetent.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Stop dry humping the RINO you silly fuck

Again, it was a perfectly legitimate question – Haley should have answered truthfully that the treasonous insurrection of 1861 was about preserving slavery, keeping human beings in bondage; Haley failed to acknowledge that fact, fearful of retribution from the racist right, as demonstrated by conservatives responding to this thread.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Again, it was a perfectly legitimate question – Haley should have answered truthfully that the treasonous insurrection of 1861 was about preserving slavery, keeping human beings in bondage; Haley failed to acknowledge that fact, fearful of retribution from the racist right, as demonstrated by conservatives responding to this thread.

And again stop dry humping the RINO

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

There was no tariff on cotton exports. There was no tariff on "southern produced goods." Tariffs were on British manufactured goods to protect new American industries. that could not compete, otherwise..

And, as I pointed out earlier, the South had been bitching about those tariffs for decades. They never did anything more than bitch. Hell, the very first tariff passed in America was on foreign cotton and wool, protecting southern cotton.

From the SC declaration of secession and reasons given.
[A]n increasing hostility on the part of the non-slaveholding States to the institution of slavery, has led to a disregard of their obligations, and the laws of the General Government have ceased to effect the objects of the Constitution.

South Carolina Declaration of Secession (1860) | Constitution Center

National Constitution Center Historic Documents Library record for South Carolina Declaration of Secession (1860)

constitutioncenter.org

"A" as in First.

"Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery – the greatest material interest of the world…and a blow at slavery is a blow at commerce and civilization, ...

A Declaration of the Immediate Causes which Induce and Justify the Secession of the State of Mississippi from the Federal Union (1861) | Constitution Center

National Constitution Center Historic Documents Library record for A Declaration of the Immediate Causes which Induce and Justify the Secession of the State of Mississippi from the Federal Union (1861)

constitutioncenter.org

Slavery is the first and dominant cause of secession listed in the Texas declaration.

DECLARATION OF CAUSES: February 2, 1861 A declaration of the causes which impel the State of Texas to secede from the Federal Union. | TSLAC

DECLARATION OF CAUSES: February 2, 1861 A declaration of the causes which impel the State of Texas to secede from the Federal Union. Related Links Narrative history of Secession and Readmission | Narrative history of Annexation

www.tsl.texas.gov

And, beyond all of the words of the southerners themselves, we have the facts of what happened. The South seceded upon Lincoln's election. They weren't upset over Lincoln's policies on tariffs. They didn't object to the funny hat he wore. The South had bitched and bitched, but they only decided to fight, because Lincoln had a policy to limit the spread of slavery.

You keep harping on slavery like a good shill. Slavery was a way of life and a necessary means to industry in those days.
The north used slavery as a wedge issue. They had no desire to help Africans. They did not want them in the north as witnessed by the segregated slums they generated after migration.
Cutting off slavery was tantamount to cutting off fossil fuels today. It undermines the economy. The south wanted no part of that.
Tariffs additionally hurt the Southern states’ economies and that’s why they seceded. The war was a war of aggression by the feds.
You keep on parroting your propaganda, though.

 

[irosie91]

It tells us a great deal, demonstrated by conservatives responding to this thread.

It tells us that Republicans continue to push the lie that the treasonous insurrection of 1861 wasn’t about slavery – when in fact it very much was about preserving slavery; knowing this, Haley dodged telling the truth to not alienate Republican primary voters.

not the point----more like it's not an issue in the CURRENT POLITICAL SITUATION. "treasonous insurrection" ??? oh gee---AGAIN

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Abraham Lincoln started the war. How the hell can modern day posters still not understand he is who started the war. The guy diverted and that was her complaint. She asked for the next question.

You guys still think the shots at Sumter started the war do not understand the shots hit the fort walls. None of the troops in the fort were hit by the fire by the South. They might as well have been firing into the ocean.

Wrong.

Lincoln desperately wanted to avoid war, as we see from Lincoln's cowardly, craven first inaugural address:

“I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so.”

The treasonous insurrection of 1861 was started by Southern states engaged in lawless rebellion seeking to preserve and maintain slavery.

 

[Wobbly]

You keep harping on slavery like a good shill. Slavery was a way of life and a necessary means to industry in those days.

Slaves were not used in industry, and a slavery economy hurt everybody except the oligarchs who suckered the southern rubes.

The north used slavery as a wedge issue. They had no desire to help Africans. They did not want them in the north as witnessed by the segregated slums they generated after migration.

I had no idea you were so well armed with empty assertions. And the growth of northern bigotry years after the civil war had nothing to do with the cause of the war.

Cutting off slavery was tantamount to cutting off fossil fuels today.

For the wealthy elite. Most southerners did not own or benefit from slavery. Existence of free slave labor meant there was little work for southerners who did not farm, and the same slaves meant much less need for entrepreneurs to produce goods slaves could craft.

It undermines the economy. The south wanted no part of that.

Disproven above, but a poor excuse anyway. If your economy cannot exist without slavery, too damn bad, Do your own work, sissies.

Tariffs additionally hurt the Southern states’ economies and that’s why they seceded.

Disproven above. South bitched about tariffs for decades. When Calhoun made secession noises over them, Jackson threatened to hang "Nullifiers" and the threat of revolt fizzled like MAGAt insurrectionists confronted by more than a couple of cops.

The war was a war of aggression by the feds.
You keep on parroting your propaganda, though.

Why did the South secede only after Lincoln's election? The funny hat?

A diploma from Google High School does not compensate for failing the GED.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Slaves were not used in industry, and a slavery economy hurt everybody except the oligarchs who suckered the southern rubes.

I had no idea you were so well armed with empty assertions. And the growth of northern bigotry years after the civil war had nothing to do with the cause of the war.

For the wealthy elite. Most southerners did not own or benefit from slavery. Existence of free slave labor meant there was little work for southerners who did not farm, and the same slaves meant much less need for entrepreneurs to produce goods slaves could craft.

Disproven above, but a poor excuse anyway. If your economy cannot exist without slavery, too damn bad, Do your own work, sissies.

Disproven above. South bitched about tariffs for decades. When Calhoun made secession noises over them, Jackson threatened to hang "Nullifiers" and the threat of revolt fizzled like MAGAt insurrectionists confronted by more than a couple of cops.

Why did the South secede only after Lincoln's election? The funny hat?

A diploma from Google High School does not compensate for failing the GED.

Anything that keeps overhead down enhances profit and that improves the economy. The opposite applies, too.
The north abused the productivity of the south and the south seceded as a result. Bitching about tariffs came to a head.
Your hero Lincoln referred to Africans as an inferior race. It’s referenced in Huckleberry Finn. That was the common sentiment of the time.
Slavery was an issue of opportunity. The war was not fought over slavery and it was instigated by the fed. Deal with it instead of being a communist history revisionist.

 

[Wobbly]

Anything that keeps overhead down enhances profit and that improves the economy. The opposite applies, too.
The north abused the productivity of the south and the south seceded as a result

Gibberish. Profit for the oligarchs is a poor excuse for treason

. Bitching about tariffs came to a head.

Really? What was new about Lincoln's tariffs that caused that to "come to a head"?

Your hero Lincoln referred to Africans as an inferior race.

Clumsy deflection you hope will distract from the failure of your other bluffs.

It’s referenced in Huckleberry Finn. That was the common sentiment of the time.

And, completely irrelevant to slavery as the cause of the civil war.

Slavery was an issue of opportunity. The war was not fought over slavery and it was instigated by the fed. Deal with it instead of being a communist history revisionist.

I've provided facts with citations. You've squawked empty assertions, weak bluffs, and clumsy deflections. Deal with that.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Gibberish. Profit for the oligarchs is a poor excuse for treason

Really? What was new about Lincoln's tariffs that caused that to "come to a head"?

Clumsy deflection you hope will distract from the failure of your other bluffs.

And, completely irrelevant to slavery as the cause of the civil war.

I've provided facts with citations. You've squawked empty assertions, weak bluffs, and clumsy deflections. Deal with that.

You insist on applying current standards to other eras. Dishonest. That was the significance in the Twain citation.
Oligarchs were the same as corporations today. If the top does well, it trickles down. That’s why slavery was important to the entire state and not just the slave owners. That’s how tariffs impacted the entire state.
And an FYI… slaves in America had longer life spans than their free counterparts not taken into slavery.
The civil war was an act of aggression by the fed in order to maintain the money supply the south produced for the fed oligarchs.

 

[Robert W]

Wrong.

Lincoln desperately wanted to avoid war, as we see from Lincoln's cowardly, craven first inaugural address:

“I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so.”

The treasonous insurrection of 1861 was started by Southern states engaged in lawless rebellion seeking to preserve and maintain slavery.

There was 2 things going on.
Leaving the union.
The damned war. This came last. The excuse was not the war was over slavery. It was over the states bailing out. And this was then legal.

We are not a free nation if the states are clamped in tight. They are fully functioning governments. Matter of fact, most the feds get blamed for happen due to acts by your state, your county and your city.
Teachers fucked up teaching it is about slavery.

 

[Mac-7]

You insist on applying current standards to other eras. Dishonest. That was the significance in the Twain citation.
Oligarchs were the same as corporations today. If the top does well, it trickles down. That’s why slavery was important to the entire state and not just the slave owners. That’s how tariffs impacted the entire state.
And an FYI… slaves in America had longer life spans than their free counterparts not taken into slavery.
The civil war was an act of aggression by the fed in order to maintain the money supply the south produced for the fed oligarchs.

I doubt if white farmers who couldnt read or write ever heard of trickle down economic theory

Nor were northern plowboys willing to die to free black slaves in the south

 

[Robert W]

Interesting. Your excuse is the South didn't start it, because they were incompetent.

Geezus crist. Your teacher really fucked you badly for you to talk that way.
I did not mention incompetency.

What is war? Is it cannon balls hitting a fort the the union should not have occupied?

If the South had modern artillery, the fort could be demolished. But that shit they used then had poor powder, were not very accurate, and had low firing ranges.

The war commenced in a huge way when Abe invaded VA. I suggest if you are near to Manassas VA go visit the battle site and pick up some history.

 

[Robert W]

I doubt if white farmers who couldnt read or write ever heard of trickle down economic theory

Nor were northern plowboys willing to die to free black slaves in the south

You are right to say that.

 

[Robert W]

Lincoln didn't start the war...that was South Carolina, firing on a federal military base.

A fort is inanimate. Study the union losses due to the cannon fire. ZERO

 

[Wobbly]

You insist on applying current standards to other eras. Dishonest. That was the significance in the Twain citation.

Mention Huck Finn is not a citation. It is further evidence of your poor education. And the commonality of racial bigotry is not an excuse for treason to preserve slavery. Well, it's an excuse, but it is MAGAt wimpy.

Oligarchs were the same as corporations today

Damn, those folks really live a long time!

. If the top does well, it trickles down.

Ah, the Trickle-on, free lunch scam that has seen middle and lower class wealth stagnate, while wealth of the richest has exploded. That it suckers you still explains the rest of your bloviations.

That’s why slavery was important to the entire state and not just the slave owners. That’s how tariffs impacted the entire state.
And an FYI… slaves in America had longer life spans than their free counterparts not taken into slavery.
The civil war was an act of aggression by the fed in order to maintain the money supply the south produced for the fed oligarchs.

Since you are so practiced in excusing southern treason, do you have an excuse for why you keep dodging questions like what was it about Lincoln's election that provoked secession that did not happen before then?
Look, you can't compensate for sleeping through that History class you took before dropping out of high school by googling confirmation bias now. It leads to you squawking about "commie" boogey men, when you panic over your inability to defend your ignorance.

 

[Seymour Flops]

‘Republican presidential candidate Nikki Haley, who is facing backlash over her response to a question about the Civil War at a New Hampshire campaign event, alleged without evidence Thursday that that the questioner was potentially a Democratic "plant."’

Nikki Haley alleged she was set up by Democratic 'plant' after being asked what caused the Civil War

The former governor alleged the question that landed her in hot water this week regarding the cause of the Civil War was the work of Democrats.

www.usatoday.com

It was a perfectly legitimate question to ask Haley, regardless of the politics of the person asking the question.

Well, of course they were a plant, and of course it was not a legitimate question. It has nothing to do with any issues in thje 2024 election, such as Bidenomics, Bidenborder, Bidinflation, Bidencession, Bidenunemp, and Bidenrruption.

I can understand why Democrats would love having headlines about the Civil War, instead of the fact that the Mexican drug gangs now have operational control over our southern border.

It’s also telling that Haley would perceive acknowledging the fact that the South started the war to preserve slavery as a political ‘gotcha.’

Her answer was not as smooth as those of Democrat politicians who are typically fed the quesions in advance.

As a Texan, and an actual reader of history, rather than a media-blinded consumer of sound bites vaguely related to history, I know that the Civil War was about keeping the country together. I know this because the Commander in Chief of the U.S. forces who started and continued the war said so.

But, I also know that the successions that prompted the United invasion were driven mainly, and primarily, by the fear that slavery was going to be banned. That's a distinction that will never make a dent in the propaganda thickened skulls of Democratic voters, but the plan fact is that few, if any, on the U.S. side saw the war as a crusade to end slavery. That idea was revised into history by the winners.

But who gives a shit, now? Just as with the Arabs in Palestine, that war was lost a long time ago, and any intellegent person accepts that reality and thrives in it. Certainly, the southerners who lost the Civil War did that. Many joined the U.S. Army, Navy, and Marines, fighting the numerous and ongoing Indian wars, the 1871 war in Korea (yes), and the coup in Hawaii. Their sons fought in wars from the Spanish-American War to WWII.

My East Texas grandfather, hated that the South had lost. His successful grandfather became a pauper, having invested/speculated money from his lumber business in slaves. But, like most Democrats, he believed wholeheartedly in Wilson's plan to make the world safe for Democracy and enlisted to serve in the trenches at the age of 31.

We can be loyal Americans, even if we don't take the polyanna view of the Civil War as Good vs. Evil.