Нiring labor in the Right society

[rupol2000]

This should not be, because it means the lack of rights of the quasi-slave proletarian, who has no rights to the means of production.

I think that instead, the concept of lease and sublease should be introduced, and any hiring should be formalized only on the basis of the rights of leasing the means of production.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

This is you, 5 minutes before all of your posts:



Keep fighting bro...don't give in

 

[JGalt]

This thread is way above my pay scale.

 

[initforme]

When there is a massive labor surplus as we have now, things get tougher for people.

 

[JGalt]

When there is a massive labor surplus as we have now, things get tougher for people.

Doesn't help that we also inherited almost 4 million illegals over the last year and a half either.

 

[rupol2000]

When there is a massive labor surplus as we have now, things get tougher for people.

It's an artificial surplus orchestrated by the feds

 

[rupol2000]

Doesn't help that we also inherited almost 4 million illegals over the last year and a half either.

Illegals don't matter. There will be work for every working hand, if there is a desire. Tell them to pay you more, to have your wife replaced by migrants, and she stayed at home, and listen to how they will piss in your ears.

 

[initforme]

Working hard will only get one so far. A great work ethic is no guarantee of success and a happy life.

 

[WinterBorn]

Illegals don't matter. There will be work for every working hand, if there is a desire. Tell them to pay you more, to have your wife replaced by migrants, and she stayed at home, and listen to how they will piss in your ears.

Work for every working hand? Doing what?

Many areas that once hired numerous working hands are now automated.

There are not an unlimited number of unskilled labor jobs.

 

[rupol2000]

Work for every working hand? Doing what?

Many areas that once hired numerous working hands are now automated.

There are not an unlimited number of unskilled labor jobs.

Talk about how there are too many people in China to provide them with work. According to your logic, there should be 2 billion unemployed

 

[WinterBorn]

Talk about how there are too many people in China to provide them with work. According to your logic, there should be 2 billion unemployed

I am not talking about China. Which, by the way, has an unemployment rate twice that of the US.

I am talking about the fact that there is not an unlimited number of unskilled labor jobs available.

 

[Red Front]

This should not be, because it means the lack of rights of the quasi-slave proletarian, who has no rights to the means of production.

I think that instead, the concept of lease and sublease should be introduced, and any hiring should be formalized only on the basis of the rights of leasing the means of production.

You're leasing human beings and reducing them to the machinery of production? You have no problem with a dictatorship in the workplace, only in government or politics. Why? People spend most of their waking hours in the workplace. We need democracy not just in politics but in the workplace as well. Production should become socialized and democratized ASAP. At the very least we should have labor unions and the government should protect labor against capitalist attempts to bust them up. Workers have the right to unionize, just like the capitalists do, with their chamber of commerce, super PACs, trade organizations, associations, and country clubs. We the working class also have the right to unionize, not just employers. The rich aren't the only ones with financial interests, we workers also have our own set of unique financial interests. We have common interests with other working-class people hence it behooves us to unionize and not negotiate our terms of employment with powerful, wealthy capitalists, on our own. We don't have much leverage alone, but we have more when we form a group or union. There's strength in numbers.

Hey I'm always hearing from you capitalists and the defenders of capitalism, how human nature and Darwinian evolution supposedly justify the capitalist exploitation of labor and class privilege, yet you fail to realize that in nature, social animals that learn to work together to accomplish their objectives always beat the solitary, lone rangers. The working class doesn't need the capitalist class at all. We don't need these dictatorial, authoritarian employers, we can organize production without them. Let's democratize production and get rid of the capitalist exploiters from owning the means of production, as little tyrants. Does "getting rid" of them imply violence? No no no, that's not necessary until they resort to violence and start killing people. Then we have the right to defend ourselves. Until then, we can carry out this revolution peacefully. A revolution doesn't have to be bloody.

 

[rupol2000]

You're leasing human beings and reducing them to the machinery of production? You have no problem with a dictatorship in the workplace, only in government or politics. Why? People spend most of their waking hours in the workplace. We need democracy not just in politics but in the workplace as well. Production should become socialized and democratized ASAP. At the very least we should have labor unions and the government should protect labor against capitalist attempts to bust them up. Workers have the right to unionize, just like the capitalists do, with their chamber of commerce, super PACs, trade organizations, associations, and country clubs. We the working class also have the right to unionize, not just employers. The rich aren't the only ones with financial interests, we workers also have our own set of unique financial interests. We have common interests with other working-class people hence it behooves us to unionize and not negotiate our terms of employment with powerful, wealthy capitalists, on our own. We don't have much leverage alone, but we have more when we form a group or union. There's strength in numbers.

Hey I'm always hearing from you capitalists and the defenders of capitalism, how human nature and Darwinian evolution supposedly justify the capitalist exploitation of labor and class privilege, yet you fail to realize that in nature, social animals that learn to work together to accomplish their objectives always beat the solitary, lone rangers. The working class doesn't need the capitalist class at all. We don't need these dictatorial, authoritarian employers, we can organize production without them. Let's democratize production and get rid of the capitalist exploiters from owning the means of production, as little tyrants. Does "getting rid" of them imply violence? No no no, that's not necessary until they resort to violence and start killing people. Then we have the right to defend ourselves. Until then, we can carry out this revolution peacefully. A revolution doesn't have to be bloody.

All the socialist shit you want turns people into slaves to the owners of machines and land that do not belong to proletariat.

 

[rupol2000]

Slavery is reduced to lack of rights, and the possession of slaves - to the usurpation of rights. The proletariat in any form is a people deprived of the right to property.

 

[Red Front]

Go ahead TN Harley, debunk me. Let's see what you got.

All the socialist shit you want turns people into slaves to the owners of machines and land that do not belong to proletariat.

All of the lands belong to the people. There's no reason why citizens of the socialist state can't own homes and even lands, provided they're not exploiting anyone. Farmers can form farm cooperatives, and run them democratically.

 

[rupol2000]

Go ahead TN Harley, debunk me. Let's see what you got.


All of the lands belong to the people. There's no reason why citizens of the socialist state can't own homes and even lands, provided they're not exploiting anyone. Farmers can form farm cooperatives, and run them democratically.

De facto they don't. All rights de facto belong to the Bolsheviks, and the proletarians only declare that they own something. It's just a scam

 

[rupol2000]

Go ahead TN Harley, debunk me. Let's see what you got.


All of the lands belong to the people. There's no reason why citizens of the socialist state can't own homes and even lands, provided they're not exploiting anyone. Farmers can form farm cooperatives, and run them democratically.

Publicize your wife and then you will say that she belongs to you even if you never fucked her. This is left uderstanding of "property rights"

 

[BlackSand]

Go ahead TN Harley, debunk me. Let's see what you got.


All of the lands belong to the people. There's no reason why citizens of the socialist state can't own homes and even lands, provided they're not exploiting anyone. Farmers can form farm cooperatives, and run them democratically.

.

If someone owns a rice field in Northern Arkansas and lets a farmer plant, tend, harvest and sell the rice at whatever he can manage in cost and profit ...
Then charges duck hunters $500 a day (each gun), for guided hunts over the harvested rice field during duck season ...

Does that count as a cooperative ...

.​

 

[Red Front]

A worker cooperative or a farm cooperative is when people work together to produce products and they collectively own what they produce. They might decide to consume what they produce or trade it for other goods or sell it on the market. Cooperatives are run democratically, every manager or production team leader is elected into that position and is accountable to everyone. There's mutual accountability, between management and their subordinates.

 

[rupol2000]

A worker cooperative or a farm cooperative is when people work together to produce products and they collectively own what they produce. They might decide to consume what they produce or trade it for other goods or sell it on the market. Cooperatives are run democratically, every manager or production team leader is elected into that position and is accountable to everyone. There's mutual accountability, between management and their subordinates.

How should disputes be resolved in the cooperative?