NY activist judges allow same sex marriage

[musicman]

I'm not sticking my head in the sand...you are trying to add 1 + 1 and make it equal 5. Homosexuals don't molest children pedophiles do. It doesn't get any more simple to understand than that.

Whether I have kids is immaterial to the fact your argument is based on a false premise, but I have a daughter and 3 grandchildren if you must know.

First of all, Missle Man, allow me to thank you for having the grace and fortitude to address your remarks to me DIRECTLY - just as if we were two men, exchanging ideas. Apparently, some of our posters are so frightened at the prospect of having their brains slapped around by an "idiot" or a "dunce" that they engage in the cowardly process of ad hominem attacks from the shadows, or through a "proxy".

I disagree with you, but you have my respect.

 

[musicman]

These kind of responses do not forward your argument at all. The name calling makes you look like an idiot, not the person you are trying to insult.

Well said, sir.

 

[Avatar4321]

Why is it so hard for you to comprehend that 100% of child molestations are committed by PEDOPHILES?

What is so hard to comprehend that the problem is that a majority of those pedophiles are homosexuals?

 

[CivilLiberty]

What is so hard to comprehend that the problem is that a majority of those pedophiles are homosexuals?

They aren't. the VAST majority (70 to 75%) are HETEROSEXUALS.


A

 

[Johnney]

There you go again with the "propagation of the species argument". That argument is worthless...It marginalizes the marriage of conventional couples who cannot have, or choose not to have, children. It is a thouroughly fallacious argumnet and has no real bearing on the issue.

As to shipping anyone anywhere, perhaps you should be one of the first to go...Your views would be right at home in North Korea where good little sheep...er...conformists are desired.

arguing with you bully is like trying to herd cats. just aint happening. you refuse to listen to what anyone has to say, unless they are dangling off your jock. you have the mannerisms of a shit house lawyer, much like civil liberty. i still say you guys are gay lovers. thats why your so high and mighty on and about fag rights for marriage. if i had my way... both of you would be on the first boat to north korea. your the one that seems to have the same ideaology as the north koreans. anti-American all the way. if your for the US, im against you.
fuck off fat boy, and take that red headed step child CL with you

 

[Johnney]

They aren't. the VAST majority (70 to 75%) are HETEROSEXUALS.


A

and if anyone would know the difference between a hetro and a homo, it would be civilliberty

 

[musicman]

They aren't. the VAST majority (70 to 75%) are HETEROSEXUALS.


A

You're still here??!!! Wow - you have no shame at ALL, do you?

I know I'm asking a lot here, Andy, but I'm going to proceed from the assumption that you have the intestinal fortitude to talk to me, man to man.

It doesn't matter what kind of games you play with numbers or language. Homosexuals are responsible for a percentage of child molestations that is wildly out of whack with their population numbers. They comprise 2-3% - I repeat, 2-3% of the population, yet commit 25-40% of the offenses. Explain that, please.

 

[Bullypulpit]

arguing with you bully is like trying to herd cats. just aint happening. you refuse to listen to what anyone has to say, unless they are dangling off your jock. you have the mannerisms of a shit house lawyer, much like civil liberty. i still say you guys are gay lovers. thats why your so high and mighty on and about fag rights for marriage. if i had my way... both of you would be on the first boat to north korea. your the one that seems to have the same ideaology as the north koreans. anti-American all the way. if your for the US, im against you.
fuck off fat boy, and take that red headed step child CL with you

Ahhh...At last. You've revealed the breadth and depth of you intellect, rather like a shallow and rapidly evaporating puddle of water on hot asphalt. Your insults are callow and shallow. Your comments show how little you understand about what being a true American and patriot really entails. So go back home to mommy and come back when you're no longer wet behind the ears. And while you're at it, have some one read the Constitution and Bill of Rights to you. Make sure they explain it in one or two syllable words...something you can understand. Dismissed.

 

[Johnney]

Ahhh...At last. You've revealed the breadth and depth of you intellect, rather like a shallow and rapidly evaporating puddle of water on hot asphalt. Your insults are callow and shallow. Your comments show how little you understand about what being a true American and patriot really entails. So go back home to mommy and come back when you're no longer wet behind the ears. And while you're at it, have some one read the Constitution and Bill of Rights to you. Make sure they explain it in one or two syllable words...something you can understand. Dismissed.

well damn bully, did yo uuse some thought in that one? i didnt think so. same crap you always use, just different day. bully some day when you want to discuss something with your head up your ass, please come back. ive seen you put up some nice debates. they were all over bullshit, but they were decent. like this thread here. thats why ive deduced that your a flaming homo (not to hurt your feelings or anything, but ive got some tissue here for you if you feel the need to shed a tear or two. kind of used cause i have the flu though). so you dont like the facts i have. which arent fact, but my opinion. i know opinions are like asshole, we got them and they stink. but this is America, and your entitled to hear about my opinion. so thats what you get. i dont bother provding proof on crap like this because, well, its an crappy subject, but gets alot of thread time. and i dont feel the need to provide you with a link on anything because you seem to have al lthe answers in your anti-American sites you visit.

 

[nakedemperor]

You're still here??!!! Wow - you have no shame at ALL, do you?

I know I'm asking a lot here, Andy, but I'm going to proceed from the assumption that you have the intestinal fortitude to talk to me, man to man.

It doesn't matter what kind of games you play with numbers or language. Homosexuals are responsible for a percentage of child molestations that is wildly out of whack with their population numbers. They comprise 2-3% - I repeat, 2-3% of the population, yet commit 25-40% of the offenses. Explain that, please.

Preface: child molesters are criminals and deserve what they get.

It is entirely likely that the 25-40% of child molestation that is man-molesting-boy doesn't necessarily mean that the molestor is a homosexual; if someone is screwed up in the head enough to justify sexually attacking children, I'm not sure the the gender of the victim is entirely based on the sexuality of the perpetrator.

Secondly, I think homosexuals are very very much more likely to have severe psychological problems than heterosexuals; as many homosexuals grow up in communities where homosexuality is looked down upon, considered a sin, and a GRAVE social taboo, this might account for some of the disproportionate % of gay child molestors.

These suggestions are not excuses, they are *possible* explanations.

 

[musicman]

Preface: child molesters are criminals and deserve what they get.

It is entirely likely that the 25-40% of child molestation that is man-molesting-boy doesn't necessarily mean that the molestor is a homosexual; if someone is screwed up in the head enough to justify sexually attacking children, I'm not sure the the gender of the victim is entirely based on the sexuality of the perpetrator.

Secondly, I think homosexuals are very very much more likely to have severe psychological problems than heterosexuals; as many homosexuals grow up in communities where homosexuality is looked down upon, considered a sin, and a GRAVE social taboo, this might account for some of the disproportionate % of gay child molestors.

These suggestions are not excuses, they are *possible* explanations.

Fair enough, NE. But, of course, that brings us right back to the "chicken or the egg" question. Are a disproportianite number of homosexuals dangerous because society frowns on homosexuality, or does society frown upon homosexuality because a disproportionate number of homosexuals present a clear and present danger to society?

Will you concede, though, that society must defend itself - and can only do so based on what it sees and knows?

Thanks for discussing this intelligently and rationally, NE. I often disagree with you, but I always find you to be an intelligent, fair-minded cat.

 

[nakedemperor]

Fair enough, NE. But, of course, that brings us right back to the "chicken or the egg" question. Are a disproportianite number of homosexuals dangerous because society frowns on homosexuality, or does society frown upon homosexuality because a disproportionate number of homosexuals present a clear and present danger to society?

Will you concede, though, that society must defend itself - and can only do so based on what it sees and knows?

Thanks for discussing this intelligently and rationally, NE. I often disagree with you, but I always find you to be an intelligent, fair-minded cat.

Well, I can only speak from personal experience. Of the gays that I know who have grown up in supportive communities, most are very well-adjusted, normal, caring human beings who just want a fair shakes.

This may seem off-topic, but since blacks account for such a disproportionate % of violent crimes, do we a) blame something about the physiology of "blackness" or b) blame a self-defeating societal outlook stemming from many external cultural factors, tracing their roots back to slavery, segregation, and anti-miscygenation?

I would argue something similar re: gays and man-on-boy child molestation.

In terms of gays representing a "clear and present danger" to society...well, I simply don't agree with this. The numbers you offered, 25-40% of child molestation cases are man-on-boy-- which is not necessarily gay-on-boy-- also doesn't tell me what percentage of the gay community has commited molestation. The small, small percentage of gays who have commited molestation crimes should not be taken as representative of the gay community, even if society at the moment might precipitate a higher percentage of child molestors among gays than among straights.

 

[CivilLiberty]

You're still here??!!! Wow - you have no shame at ALL, do you?

I know I'm asking a lot here, Andy, but I'm going to proceed from the assumption that you have the intestinal fortitude to talk to me, man to man.

It doesn't matter what kind of games you play with numbers or language. Homosexuals are responsible for a percentage of child molestations that is wildly out of whack with their population numbers. They comprise 2-3% - I repeat, 2-3% of the population, yet commit 25-40% of the offenses. Explain that, please.

Normally I wouldn't as I have you on ignore, however, I saw this comment quoted by NakedEmpreror, so I will respond directly.

#1: The stats you are quoting are a complete misrepresentation, and out of context to the actual number of crimes committed.

#2: The 1993 Janus Report, the first broad-scale scientific national survey on sexual behavior since Kinsey, concluded that 9% of males and 5% of females had had homosexual experiences more than just "occasionally."

Binson et al (1995) showed 5.3% of men reporting sexual activity with a same-gender partner since age 18. and 6.5% of men reporting sex with men during the previous five years. The highest prevalence was found* the 12 largest cities (14.4% since age 18) and among "highly educated" White males (10.8%).

Sells et al (1995) reported 6.2% of* males and 3.6% of* females with "sexual contact with someone of the same sex only or with both sexes in the previous five years," and 20.8% of U.S. males and 17.8% of U.S. females with some homosexual behavior or some homosexual attraction since age 15.*


Three separate studies, all showing substantially more than 2%. One showing that as many as 20% of males had some homosexual contact Since 15.


#3: The Boston Advocates for Human Rights conducted a study which illustrated that "the vast majority of child molestation - over 90% - is performed by heterosexual males. The man who is sexually interested in children is rarely homosexual."

The University of Colorado Health Sciences Center, Denver, studied 269 sexual abused children examined during one year at Denver Children's Hospital. Investigation shows:

80% of girls were molested by a man who was or had been in a heterosexual relationship with the child s mother or another
relative.

75% of boys were abused by males in heterosexual relationships with female relatives.

Only 1 of 219 girls was molested by a lesbian; 1 out of 50 boys by a gay male. I.e. 2%. TWO PERCENT. (this study was only of the Denver Children).


#4: This "commit 25%-40%" of the offenses is pure bull. Even the ardent gay bashers at AFA only claim 21%, and you know what that means:

79% of molesters are STRAIGHT by AFA's stats. But even they are overstating.



Now, instead of the crap that these intolerant groups bash around, let's look at some REAL peer review studies, like:
<i>
Carole Jenny, et al.,*Are Children at Risk for Sexual Abuse by Homosexuals?,*Pediatrics, Vol. 94, No. 1 (1994); see also David Newton,*Homosexual Behavior and Child Molestation: A Review of the Evidence,*Adolescence, Vol. XIII, No. 49 at 40 (1978) ("A review of the available research on pedophilia provides no basis for associating child molestation with homosexual behavior.")*</i>

Which found that a child was 100 times more likely to be abused by the heterosexual partner of a relative.


The fact is, you're parroting lies and misrepresentations which are baseless froth from the mouths of intolerant hate groups. If you want to believe them, I suppose that's your prerogative. But you are believing and fostering a lie.


Kindest Regards,


Andy Somers

 

[musicman]

Well, I can only speak from personal experience. Of the gays that I know who have grown up in supportive communities, most are very well-adjusted, normal, caring human beings who just want a fair shakes.

This may seem off-topic, but since blacks account for such a disproportionate % of violent crimes, do we a) blame something about the physiology of "blackness" or b) blame a self-defeating societal outlook stemming from many external cultural factors, tracing their roots back to slavery, segregation, and anti-miscygenation?

I would argue something similar re: gays and man-on-boy child molestation.

In terms of gays representing a "clear and present danger" to society...well, I simply don't agree with this. The numbers you offered, 25-40% of child molestation cases are man-on-boy-- which is not necessarily gay-on-boy-- also doesn't tell me what percentage of the gay community has commited molestation. The small, small percentage of gays who have commited molestation crimes should not be taken as representative of the gay community, even if society at the moment might precipitate a higher percentage of child molestors among gays than among straights.

Well, first of all, I try to treat people decently no matter what. I have several homosexual friends, and it's just not a "thing" at all. Moreover, I have a close family member who is homosexual, and anyone having something mean or uncharitable to say about her is going to hate like HELL what happens if I hear it. I'm a classic "live and let live" kind of guy.

But this whole thing has become politicized, and to the homosexual activists, "live and let live" just doesn't get it. I'm not allowed to have my own personal feelings about it, and live my life and raise my children accordingly. I find it wrong and dangerous on many levels - from religious to societal to just plain common sense. However, the agenda being forced on Americans against their wishes dictates that , unless my heart says it's a lifestyle, no better or worse than any other, I'm a hateful, ignorant bigot. That is madness, and worse, it's tyranny. I won't sit still for it.

As far as the question regarding African-Americans, my answer would land solidly on B - at least the first half of B. Without a doubt, external cultural factors are to blame. However, I don't think that bygone injustices are as much the driving forces as are the institutionalized racism and hopelessness of the welfare state. And, a self-perpetuating liberal popular culture that brands as a "Tom" or "race traitor" any African-American who tries to grab his rightful piece of the American Dream is simply unconscionable.

But, comparing the black struggle for equality to the push for homosexual rights is a good way to make blacks tune you out forever. I daresay you never gave your sexuality a thought for the first eleven or so years of your life. Black people don't have that luxury, NE. They can tell RIGHT AWAY they're black. They have endured hardship in this country because of that one, single fact, and they don't like seeing their struggle trivialized. I don't blame them. And so, in that sense, I state unequivocally that your sexuality is not who you are - it's what you do.

Lastly, I would say that society has neither the time nor the duty to slice definitions as thinly as you'd like. If it's male-on-male, it's homosexual - period, paragraph. I would not say that because A) homosexuals are a small minority, and B) they account for a percentage of child molestations that is wildly out of proportion to their numbers, it naturally follows that C) all homosexuals are child molesters. However, I think it would be perfectly reasonable to conclude that C) these statistics are too consistent and dramatic to ignore out of hand. They cast homosexuality itself in a troubling light, and society would be less than prudent to turn a blind eye to them.

 

[musicman]

Civil Liberty:

"Study after nationwide study has yielded estimates of male homosexuality that range between 1% and 3%. Yet they account for between 20% and 40% of all molestations of children."

Dr. Paul Cameron, Ph.D., of the Family Research Institute

What a hack. What an intolerant hate group.

 

[Bullypulpit]

well damn bully, did yo uuse some thought in that one? i didnt think so. same crap you always use, just different day. bully some day when you want to discuss something with your head up your ass, please come back. ive seen you put up some nice debates. they were all over bullshit, but they were decent. like this thread here. thats why ive deduced that your a flaming homo (not to hurt your feelings or anything, but ive got some tissue here for you if you feel the need to shed a tear or two. kind of used cause i have the flu though). so you dont like the facts i have. which arent fact, but my opinion. i know opinions are like asshole, we got them and they stink. but this is America, and your entitled to hear about my opinion. so thats what you get. i dont bother provding proof on crap like this because, well, its an crappy subject, but gets alot of thread time. and i dont feel the need to provide you with a link on anything because you seem to have al lthe answers in your anti-American sites you visit.

Your deduction as to my sexual orientation is, like the rest of your assumptions, wrong. You have no "facts", only opinions, and you are indeed free to express your opinions. However, opinion does not provide solid ground upon which to build public policy.

Your failure to provide links, OCA are you paying attention?, is simply a matter of laziness and, likely, an inability to find solid resources to link to. Your labeling of anything which fails to agree with you ideological position as anti-American represents nothing more than your own moral bankruptcy.

As for heads up rectums, why don't you give your ears a good tug and pop your head out of yours. Of course, as full of excrement as you are, the result could be disasterously messy. Have a nice day.

 

[MissileMan]

What is so hard to comprehend that the problem is that a majority of those pedophiles are homosexuals?

That statement is utterly false and you know it. Rethink your response and try again.

 

[Avatar4321]

It is entirely likely that the 25-40% of child molestation that is man-molesting-boy doesn't necessarily mean that the molestor is a homosexual; if someone is screwed up in the head enough to justify sexually attacking children, I'm not sure the the gender of the victim is entirely based on the sexuality of the perpetrator.

Um NE. Please dont insult our intelligence. if a man is sexually attracted to another man regardless of whether that male is still a boy, he is by definition homosexual. It's not really that difficult a concept to grasp. Heterosexual males will not be molesting boys.

Secondly, I think homosexuals are very very much more likely to have severe psychological problems than heterosexuals; as many homosexuals grow up in communities where homosexuality is looked down upon, considered a sin, and a GRAVE social taboo, this might account for some of the disproportionate % of gay child molestors.

Thanks for proving our point that homosexuality is not beneficial to society. We shouldnt be continually promoting activities that cause severe psychological problems in people. We should be getting them help. You dont help people with psychological problems by coddling them and justifying their problems you help them by helping them get over their problems.

Oh and btw anyone who is claiming that we are making up the stats, NE has just conceded that the stats are correct. quite denying whats in front of you.

 

[Johnney]

Your deduction as to my sexual orientation is, like the rest of your assumptions, wrong. You have no "facts", only opinions, and you are indeed free to express your opinions. However, opinion does not provide solid ground upon which to build public policy.
<b>
Your failure to provide links, OCA are you paying attention?</b>, is simply a matter of laziness and, likely, an inability to find solid resources to link to. Your labeling of anything which fails to agree with you ideological position as anti-American represents nothing more than your own moral bankruptcy.

As for heads up rectums, why don't you give your ears a good tug and pop your head out of yours. Of course, as full of excrement as you are, the reults could be disasterously messy. Have a nice day.

i said i dont provide links becasue they are my opinions fucktard. dont be crying to OCA because you got nailed for that. you try to pass everything you post as the gospel. i dont.
yes i am free to express my opinion. but i see you post "facts". well what you would like to think as facts anyway. not exactly sure where you get your info, or how you formulate your opinions, but you need to check both of them for sure.

 

[Bullypulpit]

i said i dont provide links becasue they are my opinions fucktard. dont be crying to OCA because you got nailed for that. you try to pass everything you post as the gospel. i dont.
yes i am free to express my opinion. but i see you post "facts". well what you would like to think as facts anyway. not exactly sure where you get your info, or how you formulate your opinions, but you need to check both of them for sure.

Grasp ears firmly...pull sharply...Everyone duck and cover.