Oakland Votes To Remove Police From Schools

[mgh80]

Why go to the police at all? There was no crime here, why would it be "obvious" that they should? It was a non-event in a controlled space where only its employees go

So you don't think leaving a noose (even a poorly constructed one) in the room of a black person is a threat?

It wasn't anyone's "room" it was a garage. And it wasn't being used by a black person at the time it was placed there.

So no, it wasn't a "threat".

Well they only know it wasn't used by a black person at the time because they had the police investigate the scene...which brings us back to the reason why the police should have been notified.

They could have investigated the "incident" themselves. Involving the police- and especially involving the hostile media- was a bad mistake.

Why go to the police at all? There was no crime here, why would it be "obvious" that they should? It was a non-event in a controlled space where only its employees go

So you don't think leaving a noose (even a poorly constructed one) in the room of a black person is a threat?

It wasn't left in the room of a black person.

They only know that because they had the police investigate, which supports my statement that the police should have been notified.

Right.

I won't say the police should or should not have been notified but I will say that NASCAR could have determined for themselves when the rope was put up.

At the very least, the media should not have been involved until any determination was made. Now the entire country is up in arms over a non-incident and what's more, despite having been determined a non-incident, because of media involvement and hype, some are still up in arms.

"Okay, so it wasn't directed at Wallace and in fact, was not directed at anybody. BUT IT'S STILL A NOOSE!!".

Even though they know it's not about race, they still have to make it about race.

You're assuming that NASCAR has the capabilities of conducting a criminal investigation (first poster).

It's only a criminal investigation if a crime has been committed, which was not known at the time. Also, who did the police talk to to get their information? NASCAR. If NASCAR had the information to give to the police then they could have used that same information to determine that the looped pull-down rope was put there before Wallace was assigned that particular garage bay.

Serious question to both of you though let's say NASCAR conducts an investigation and they figure out the answers-let's give them the benefit of the doubt of being able to put together a proper criminal investigation in a short period of time. What do you think the media would say next? It would be MUCH worse than what they're saying now.

Then that would be on the media, wouldn't it?

I'm not defending the media, I'm just saying that if NASCAR chose to have an in-house investigation it would look like they were hiding something and that never goes down well for your brand. It was a business decision, not a personal one. Business is business and personal is personal.

So everybody expects the police to police their own but in any other case, they should call the police first?

If it had been me in charge, I would have suggested to Wallace that we do an internal investigation so as to avoid (what would turn out to be) a media circus over nothing. In other words, keep Wallace in the loop and informed of all steps being taken and all involved. Complete transparency. That way, he can't go to the media later and say they did nothing or tried to hide anything. In fact, if he is sincere and honorable, he can head off criticism of NASCAR himself if the media goes in that direction.

As it is, Wallace is now being criticized and because of the hype, is still pushing the noose narrative. In fact, this very thread is a pitiful attempt by tigerred to turn a looped garage door pull-down rope into a hangman's noose meant to swing a black man even though no black man was involved or targeted at the time it was put up. It's fucking ridiculous.

I'm not arguing that they shouldn't have called the police but what I am saying is that NASCAR would have been criticized in any case because everyone needs a bad guy, even if one doesn't exist.

Wonderful.
Why were there police in schools in the first place? We will find out.

How did it stop what happened in Parkland?

Didn't the cop run like a coward? The Oakland schools are like juvenile prisons where the inmates go home. There were beatings, robberies and open drug use. Every day. That's why the schools have police. Not because of the one day there might be a nut with a gun
.

Is that why the police were at Parkland and schools all over the country?

A very, very small percentage of schools.

In my district every school has one. At least every high school and middle, not sure about elementary. They have an important role at the schools as well. I've only worked at schools with 3 and have never heard a single complaint from a single student, family, or faculty member about any of the 3.

 

[justoffal]

What sort of society is so careless of its citizens' needs that police are needed in its schools? Not a society that I can imagine.

Good then you send your kids to that school dipshit. I won't.

Jo

 

[justoffal]

Why go to the police at all? There was no crime here, why would it be "obvious" that they should? It was a non-event in a controlled space where only its employees go

So you don't think leaving a noose (even a poorly constructed one) in the room of a black person is a threat?

It wasn't anyone's "room" it was a garage. And it wasn't being used by a black person at the time it was placed there.

So no, it wasn't a "threat".

Well they only know it wasn't used by a black person at the time because they had the police investigate the scene...which brings us back to the reason why the police should have been notified.

They could have investigated the "incident" themselves. Involving the police- and especially involving the hostile media- was a bad mistake.

Why go to the police at all? There was no crime here, why would it be "obvious" that they should? It was a non-event in a controlled space where only its employees go

So you don't think leaving a noose (even a poorly constructed one) in the room of a black person is a threat?

It wasn't left in the room of a black person.

They only know that because they had the police investigate, which supports my statement that the police should have been notified.

Right.

I won't say the police should or should not have been notified but I will say that NASCAR could have determined for themselves when the rope was put up.

At the very least, the media should not have been involved until any determination was made. Now the entire country is up in arms over a non-incident and what's more, despite having been determined a non-incident, because of media involvement and hype, some are still up in arms.

"Okay, so it wasn't directed at Wallace and in fact, was not directed at anybody. BUT IT'S STILL A NOOSE!!".

Even though they know it's not about race, they still have to make it about race.

You're assuming that NASCAR has the capabilities of conducting a criminal investigation (first poster).

It's only a criminal investigation if a crime has been committed, which was not known at the time. Also, who did the police talk to to get their information? NASCAR. If NASCAR had the information to give to the police then they could have used that same information to determine that the looped pull-down rope was put there before Wallace was assigned that particular garage bay.

Serious question to both of you though let's say NASCAR conducts an investigation and they figure out the answers-let's give them the benefit of the doubt of being able to put together a proper criminal investigation in a short period of time. What do you think the media would say next? It would be MUCH worse than what they're saying now.

Then that would be on the media, wouldn't it?

I'm not defending the media, I'm just saying that if NASCAR chose to have an in-house investigation it would look like they were hiding something and that never goes down well for your brand. It was a business decision, not a personal one. Business is business and personal is personal.

So everybody expects the police to police their own but in any other case, they should call the police first?

If it had been me in charge, I would have suggested to Wallace that we do an internal investigation so as to avoid (what would turn out to be) a media circus over nothing. In other words, keep Wallace in the loop and informed of all steps being taken and all involved. Complete transparency. That way, he can't go to the media later and say they did nothing or tried to hide anything. In fact, if he is sincere and honorable, he can head off criticism of NASCAR himself if the media goes in that direction.

As it is, Wallace is now being criticized and because of the hype, is still pushing the noose narrative. In fact, this very thread is a pitiful attempt by tigerred to turn a looped garage door pull-down rope into a hangman's noose meant to swing a black man even though no black man was involved or targeted at the time it was put up. It's fucking ridiculous.

I'm not arguing that they shouldn't have called the police but what I am saying is that NASCAR would have been criticized in any case because everyone needs a bad guy, even if one doesn't exist.

Wonderful.
Why were there police in schools in the first place? We will find out.

How did it stop what happened in Parkland?

Didn't the cop run like a coward? The Oakland schools are like juvenile prisons where the inmates go home. There were beatings, robberies and open drug use. Every day. That's why the schools have police. Not because of the one day there might be a nut with a gun
.

Is that why the police were at Parkland and schools all over the country?

A very, very small percentage of schools.

In my district every school has one. At least every high school and middle, not sure about elementary. They have an important role at the schools as well. I've only worked at schools with 3 and have never heard a single complaint from a single student, family, or faculty member about any of the 3.

It's the criminals that want the police gone.

Jo

 

[justoffal]

Wonderful.
Why were there police in schools in the first place? We will find out.

How did it stop what happened in Parkland?

You clearly have no experience in education. the SRO's have a lot more to do than just simply stop a potential mass shooter.

Ever seen a gang jump a kid and paralyze them at a school? Ever had a teenager attempt to intimidate you and fight you in a classroom before (granted my students threatened to intervene but still). Ever have underage kids bring guns to your work place? Ever had a kid leave your classroom so they can "go sell molly"? Ever have a girl prostituting herself out in the girls' bathroom to make money from boys? I have to all of the above and clearly you haven't because you have no experience education. Ever have a male student throw an unopened (but unused) condom at a female student? Ever have a student grab a female's student's ass-unwanted mind you? By the way half of what I'm saying here occurred at my current school which is one of the best in the state. I've worked at inner city schools and your affluent suburbs schools and the only difference in the drugs they do is that the suburban kids do more expensive drugs. The inner city schools tend to actually have more resources and programs for the kids (at least in my district). Teachers get paid more to work those schools...and most still pack up and move from them. You want to know why? I'll give you a hint: has nothing to do with the SRO and everything to do with the lack of accountability we have for students all across the country in regards to their behavior and academics.

Stop playing politics and listen to myself and some of my peers who actually do my job, maybe you'll learn a thing or two. I work in a high school and I'd guess that the political ratio is 70/30 Democrat/Republican and I can tell you that NOBODY wants the SRO gone. NOBODY. I understand that most Democrats think that they're on the sides of teachers and education and sometimes they are, sometimes they aren't.

You don't speak for teachers. Stop pretending like you know what it's like teaching at a public school. Just stop.

You have ignored what I wrote. This happens often. You don't read what I wrote, you read what you want what I wrote to say.

You wrote that you don't want SRO's in schools. I'm responding to that. You're ignorant on what's like being in a school today. Your opinion holds zero weight to it.

I'm far from an expert on many things but one thing I DO know about is being a highly effective (my rating my from district) public school teacher today with years of experience, the test scores, the awards, and respect among my co-workers and students alike to say that my opinion holds a hell of a lot more weight than yours.

Anytime you want to discuss what should go on with schools I'm down for the conversation, but it's apparent you have zero ethos.

You support a police state. I do not. Sadly we will likely continue with the police state.

I don't support a police state. I support safe schools, something which you have no clue about because you probably haven't stepped into a high school classroom since you were a teenager. Get some experience on the topic and then come back and we'll discuss.

Don't waste your breath. He is not here to reason he is here to overturn.

Jo

 

[justoffal]

I have never been a fan of police officers in schools, so this is fine by me. Schools need to be handling their own disciplinary issues, not pawning them off on law enforcement.

Yeah great. So you hate kids too.

No, I hate police states. The question is why conservatards love them so much. You guys scream about small government and wave your Gadsden flags around while worshiping the authoritarian state out of the other side of your mouth.

Effective enforcement keeps epolice state away you moron. You'll have a police state run by criminal brown shirts otherwise.... With no court system to protect you.

Jo

 

[Weatherman2020]

I have never been a fan of police officers in schools, so this is fine by me. Schools need to be handling their own disciplinary issues, not pawning them off on law enforcement.

Yeah great. So you hate kids too.

No, I hate police states. The question is why conservatards love them so much. You guys scream about small government and wave your Gadsden flags around while worshiping the authoritarian state out of the other side of your mouth.

A cop sitting in an office or walking by you is a threat to you?
You’re mentally ill.

My brother is a cop, you imbecile. It's not his job to be a babysitter.

Of course you think Oakland schools just have harmless children running around. You’re an ignoramus.