Obama math: under new Common Core, 3 x 4 = 11

[peach174]

This is the samples of the questions for grade 3 in N.Y.
http://www.engageny.org/sites/default/files/resource/attachments/grade_3_math_released_questions.pdf
Holy Mackerel !
It's a bunch of usless stupid.
The Impact of Common Core on Math will ensure failureSave America Foundation

 

[testarosa]

Arrive at the correct answer the Common Core way or it's incorrect.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

No it doesn't, you can have a fundamental understanding of a process but still get a wrong answer through a simple error.
Did you always get your quadratic equations dead right at school...even though you understood basically how to work them out?

Besides, that's what education's for - to learn how to get these things right.

If you understand the process, and get the wrong answer, it won't help the wall you are building fit. That is why carpenters always make sure they get the right answer, not the right process.

If you don't understand the process, how can you work out the right answer?

If you actually understood math, you wouldn't ask that question.

Can you work the differential equations necessary to predict where a thrown ball will land using only the information available from a 2 second video showing the ball after its release?

Does that stop you from catching the ball?

 

[testarosa]

I'll scan you some common core 2nd 3rd 4th and 5th.

That'll shut this thread down in less time than it takes me to scan.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Writing l=3, w=4, and A = l x w = 3 x 4 = 11, proves that despite the arithmetic error for which the student would be docked credit, the student knows how to compute the area of a square, for which they should receive credit. That's pretty straightforward.

In my experience, long computations are frequently wrong the first time they are carried out. The ability to go back in the computation and spot your error is very important, and long computations need to be checked and re-checked many times to ensure accuracy.

This from a guy that claims to be an astrophysicist.

Tell me something, if you get the wrong answer when you are figuring out where to point the telescope, will the universe give you partial credit? Will the observatory let you have extra time because you got wrote the right equation, but put down the wrong answer?

If the answer to any of those is no, why the fuck should a teacher give a kid partial credit for the wrong answer?

What are you talking about?
Getting the correct result is the consequence of understanding the process.

No it isn't, getting a correct result is a result of doing the math right.

 

[daveman]

If you don't understand the process, how can you work out the right answer?

Memorize it.

That would be great if all problems were limited to a multiplication of single digit numbers now wouldn't it?
What do you do when the problem is bigger than that?

What do you do when the problem is "3 X 4 = ___"?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

If you don't understand the process, how can you work out the right answer?

Memorize it.

That would be great if all problems were limited to a multiplication of single digit numbers now wouldn't it?
What do you do when the problem is bigger than that?

There are all sorts of tricks that you can learn to multiply large numbers.

On the other hand, we could skip teaching kids how to multiply at all, and simply let them add 4+4+4.

 

[idb]

If you understand the process, and get the wrong answer, it won't help the wall you are building fit. That is why carpenters always make sure they get the right answer, not the right process.

If you don't understand the process, how can you work out the right answer?

If you actually understood math, you wouldn't ask that question.

Can you work the differential equations necessary to predict where a thrown ball will land using only the information available from a 2 second video showing the ball after its release?

Does that stop you from catching the ball?

No it doesn't.

What if the object is to catch the ball in a bucket sitting on the floor?
You have to place the bucket where you calculate the ball is going to land.
How do you work it out...rote learning...instinct...?

 

[dilloduck]

So what?
I thought the discussion was about whether kids should be taught to think and understand or simply rote-learn?

I thought the discussion was if they should get credit for getting the answer wrong.

You say potato....

If it's all the same then there's no point in defended it. It's simply another piece of political junk aimed at making people feel good.

 

[testarosa]

This from a guy that claims to be an astrophysicist.

Tell me something, if you get the wrong answer when you are figuring out where to point the telescope, will the universe give you partial credit? Will the observatory let you have extra time because you got wrote the right equation, but put down the wrong answer?

If the answer to any of those is no, why the fuck should a teacher give a kid partial credit for the wrong answer?

What are you talking about?
Getting the correct result is the consequence of understanding the process.

No it isn't, getting a correct result is a result of doing the math right.

Bingo.

Math is as easy and black and white as 1, 2, 3.

 

[testarosa]

Or you could completely and utterly reinvent math.

 

[testarosa]

Memorize it.

That would be great if all problems were limited to a multiplication of single digit numbers now wouldn't it?
What do you do when the problem is bigger than that?

There are all sorts of tricks that you can learn to multiply large numbers.

On the other hand, we could skip teaching kids how to multiply at all, and simply let them add 4+4+4.

On a hundreds chart.

Remember the Rules.

 

[dilloduck]

If you don't understand the process, how can you work out the right answer?

If you actually understood math, you wouldn't ask that question.

Can you work the differential equations necessary to predict where a thrown ball will land using only the information available from a 2 second video showing the ball after its release?

Does that stop you from catching the ball?

No it doesn't.

What if the object is to catch the ball in a bucket sitting on the floor?
You have to place the bucket where you calculate the ball is going to land.
How do you work it out...rote learning...instinct...?

You need know basic tools to process. You don't write without knowing your alphabet first.

 

[Mr. H.]

When my nephew was in middle school, he got into trouble for not showing his written work to the math test problems. He just wrote the answers.

The teacher gave him shit, so he just handed her his calculator. She's like "what's this".

He had programmed his calculator to solve all the test answers.

Teachers for the most part are lazy bitches.

 

[idb]

Memorize it.

That would be great if all problems were limited to a multiplication of single digit numbers now wouldn't it?
What do you do when the problem is bigger than that?

There are all sorts of tricks that you can learn to multiply large numbers.

On the other hand, we could skip teaching kids how to multiply at all, and simply let them add 4+4+4.

So what you're saying is that you have methods for calculating the right answer?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

If you don't understand the process, how can you work out the right answer?

If you actually understood math, you wouldn't ask that question.

Can you work the differential equations necessary to predict where a thrown ball will land using only the information available from a 2 second video showing the ball after its release?

Does that stop you from catching the ball?

No it doesn't.

What if the object is to catch the ball in a bucket sitting on the floor?
You have to place the bucket where you calculate the ball is going to land.
How do you work it out...rote learning...instinct...?

Experience, something you seem to lack.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

That would be great if all problems were limited to a multiplication of single digit numbers now wouldn't it?
What do you do when the problem is bigger than that?

There are all sorts of tricks that you can learn to multiply large numbers.

On the other hand, we could skip teaching kids how to multiply at all, and simply let them add 4+4+4.

On a hundreds chart.

Remember the Rules.

I don't even know what a hundreds chart is.

 

[testarosa]

There are all sorts of tricks that you can learn to multiply large numbers.

On the other hand, we could skip teaching kids how to multiply at all, and simply let them add 4+4+4.

On a hundreds chart.

Remember the Rules.

I don't even know what a hundreds chart is.

Five pages back I explained what elementary Common Core is.

That's how you learn double/ triple adding with CC

 

[Quantum Windbag]

That would be great if all problems were limited to a multiplication of single digit numbers now wouldn't it?
What do you do when the problem is bigger than that?

There are all sorts of tricks that you can learn to multiply large numbers.

On the other hand, we could skip teaching kids how to multiply at all, and simply let them add 4+4+4.

So what you're saying is that you have methods for calculating the right answer?

No, what I am saying is there is more than one way to get the right answer. Calculus was invented to make getting the right answer easier, if we did it your way we would be stuck using an abacus and Roman Numerals.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

On a hundreds chart.

Remember the Rules.

I don't even know what a hundreds chart is.

Five pages back I explained what elementary Common Core is.

That's how you learn double/ triple adding with CC

I ignored it because I know how to do math without charts.