saveliberty
Diamond Member
- Oct 12, 2009
- 58,705
- 10,768
- 2,030
It isn't the thunder that kills you. Its the lightning. Roll that around for a moment.
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Ocean acidification
- Thread starter Old Rocks
- Start date
Big Fitz
User Quit *****
- Nov 23, 2009
- 16,917
- 2,522
- 48
They say if you're going to get hit by lightning, you should stick your ass in the air. It's the safest orifice to be hit. I guess The Chicken Little Crew has taken to grounding out by their face though.It isn't the thunder that kills you. Its the lightning. Roll that around for a moment.
gslack
Senior Member
- Mar 26, 2010
- 4,527
- 356
- 48
Lee Trevino sez to grab your one iron, hold it over your head and run for cover...Because not even God can hit a one iron.
RollingThunder
Gold Member
- Mar 22, 2010
- 4,818
- 525
- 155
Here's the latest warning from scientists on the dangers we're facing due to the still growing ocean acidification problem.
EUROPE: Scientists urge action on ocean acidity
30 May 2010
University World News
Issue: 126
The European Science Foundation has highlighted the need for more effort to monitor and attempt to reduce ocean acidity. Oceans have absorbed almost a third of the carbon dioxide emitted from human use of fossil fuels; but the gas turns into carbonic acid, raising the acidity of seawater.
That has negative effects on marine life. For example, shellfish and corals find it more difficult to form their shells and external skeletons because the concentration of calcium carbonate in seawater drops as it becomes more acidic.
Earlier this month, the European Science Foundation delivered an overview of the impact of ocean acidification for European Maritime Day.
Prepared by leading scientists from Europe and the US, it highlights the need for a concerted, integrated effort internationally to research and monitor the effects of ocean acidification on marine environments and human communities.
"Ocean acidification is already occurring and will get worse. And it's happening on top of global warming so we are in double trouble," said Professor Jelle Bijma, lead author of the report and a bio-geochemist at the Alfred Wegener Institute in Germany.
"The combination of the two may be the most critical environmental and economic challenge of the century," he said.
"Under a business-as-usual scenario, predictions for the end of the century are that the surface oceans will become 150% more acidic - and this is a hell of a lot."
But integrated research on the impacts of ocean acidification is still a very new field - the full implications of rising acidity is unclear for marine ecosystems and fisheries resources, including fish stocks, shellfish and coral reefs.
Current European and national research programmes are relatively small compared to the combined challenges posed by ocean acidification and global warming. Existing research has mainly been initiated by individual researchers or teams, with limited overall coordination.
Two years ago, the European Project on Ocean Acidification was funded by the EU and within the last year Germany and the UK have funded national ocean acidification programmes - Bioacid and the UK Ocean Acidification Research Programme respectively.
The European Science Foundation says that as others emerge they need to be brought together through a large-scale research initiative taking full advantage of the combined scientific expertise across the European countries and internationally. One of the first steps toward integration is to develop a specific database building on the national research activities in ocean acidification.
Copyright University World News 2007-2010
(In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes.)
EUROPE: Scientists urge action on ocean acidity
30 May 2010
University World News
Issue: 126
The European Science Foundation has highlighted the need for more effort to monitor and attempt to reduce ocean acidity. Oceans have absorbed almost a third of the carbon dioxide emitted from human use of fossil fuels; but the gas turns into carbonic acid, raising the acidity of seawater.
That has negative effects on marine life. For example, shellfish and corals find it more difficult to form their shells and external skeletons because the concentration of calcium carbonate in seawater drops as it becomes more acidic.
Earlier this month, the European Science Foundation delivered an overview of the impact of ocean acidification for European Maritime Day.
Prepared by leading scientists from Europe and the US, it highlights the need for a concerted, integrated effort internationally to research and monitor the effects of ocean acidification on marine environments and human communities.
"Ocean acidification is already occurring and will get worse. And it's happening on top of global warming so we are in double trouble," said Professor Jelle Bijma, lead author of the report and a bio-geochemist at the Alfred Wegener Institute in Germany.
"The combination of the two may be the most critical environmental and economic challenge of the century," he said.
"Under a business-as-usual scenario, predictions for the end of the century are that the surface oceans will become 150% more acidic - and this is a hell of a lot."
But integrated research on the impacts of ocean acidification is still a very new field - the full implications of rising acidity is unclear for marine ecosystems and fisheries resources, including fish stocks, shellfish and coral reefs.
Current European and national research programmes are relatively small compared to the combined challenges posed by ocean acidification and global warming. Existing research has mainly been initiated by individual researchers or teams, with limited overall coordination.
Two years ago, the European Project on Ocean Acidification was funded by the EU and within the last year Germany and the UK have funded national ocean acidification programmes - Bioacid and the UK Ocean Acidification Research Programme respectively.
The European Science Foundation says that as others emerge they need to be brought together through a large-scale research initiative taking full advantage of the combined scientific expertise across the European countries and internationally. One of the first steps toward integration is to develop a specific database building on the national research activities in ocean acidification.
Copyright University World News 2007-2010
(In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes.)
RollingThunder
Gold Member
- Mar 22, 2010
- 4,818
- 525
- 155
Already busted ya on that one tool try again....
Want me to dig up the thread and repost it for ya?
LOLOLOL....oh, poor little slack-jawed-idiot, the only thing you've ever "busted" is your own pitiful excuse for a brain. Ocean acidification is a reality that is recognized and studied by scientists all around the world.
RollingThunder
Gold Member
- Mar 22, 2010
- 4,818
- 525
- 155
The power of Christ compels this thread to stay dead!
Damn stupid thread necromancy.
LOL. Can't handle reality so you deny it. No wonder you belong to a cult of reality denial. Too bad nobody can raise your brain from the dead.
Last edited:
gslack
Senior Member
- Mar 26, 2010
- 4,527
- 356
- 48
Already busted ya on that one tool try again....
Want me to dig up the thread and repost it for ya?
LOLOLOL....oh, poor little slack-jawed-idiot, the only thing you've ever "busted" is your own pitiful excuse for a brain. Ocean acidification is a reality that is recognized and studied by scientists all around the world.
You asked for it....
the first page where I showed the OP's flaws...
http://www.usmessageboard.com/2199920-post3.html
I have much more in this thread alone tool.....
Your BS is busted...
Already busted ya on that one tool try again....
Want me to dig up the thread and repost it for ya?
LOLOLOL....oh, poor little slack-jawed-idiot, the only thing you've ever "busted" is your own pitiful excuse for a brain. Ocean acidification is a reality that is recognized and studied by scientists all around the world.
You asked for it....
the first page where I showed the OP's flaws...
http://www.usmessageboard.com/2199920-post3.html
I have much more in this thread alone tool.....
Your BS is busted...
The problem is that the article you're citing is irrelevant to the current situation. Tell me about our own era; the time when humans evolved. That's what we're studying and trying to preserve, NOT an artificial return to those earlier times.
Old Rocks
Diamond Member
- Thread starter
- #554
http://iod.ucsd.edu/courses/sio278/documents/veron_08_coral_reefs.pdf
Abstract The five mass extinction events that the earth
has so far experienced have impacted coral reefs as much
or more than any other major ecosystem. Each has left the
Earth without living reefs for at least four million years,
intervals so great that they are commonly referred to as
‘reef gaps’ (geological intervals where there are no remnants
of what might have been living reefs). The causes
attributed to each mass extinction are reviewed and summarised.
When these causes and the reef gaps that follow
them are examined in the light of the biology of extant
corals and their Pleistocene history, most can be discarded.
Causes are divided into (1) those which are independent of
the carbon cycle: direct physical destruction from bolides,
‘nuclear winters’ induced by dust clouds, sea-level changes,
loss of area during sea-level regressions, loss of
biodiversity, low and high temperatures, salinity, diseases
and toxins and extraterrestrial events and (2) those linked
to the carbon cycle: acid rain, hydrogen sulphide, oxygen
and anoxia, methane, carbon dioxide, changes in ocean
chemistry and pH. By process of elimination, primary
causes of mass extinctions are linked in various ways to the
carbon cycle in general and ocean chemistry in particular
with clear association with atmospheric carbon dioxide
levels. The prospect of ocean acidification is potentially the
most serious of all predicted outcomes of anthropogenic
carbon dioxide increase. This study concludes that acidification
has the potential to trigger a sixth mass extinction
event and to do so independently of anthropogenic
extinctions that are currently taking place.
Keywords Ocean acidification Mass extinctions
Climate change Coral reefs Corals
Introduction
Abstract The five mass extinction events that the earth
has so far experienced have impacted coral reefs as much
or more than any other major ecosystem. Each has left the
Earth without living reefs for at least four million years,
intervals so great that they are commonly referred to as
‘reef gaps’ (geological intervals where there are no remnants
of what might have been living reefs). The causes
attributed to each mass extinction are reviewed and summarised.
When these causes and the reef gaps that follow
them are examined in the light of the biology of extant
corals and their Pleistocene history, most can be discarded.
Causes are divided into (1) those which are independent of
the carbon cycle: direct physical destruction from bolides,
‘nuclear winters’ induced by dust clouds, sea-level changes,
loss of area during sea-level regressions, loss of
biodiversity, low and high temperatures, salinity, diseases
and toxins and extraterrestrial events and (2) those linked
to the carbon cycle: acid rain, hydrogen sulphide, oxygen
and anoxia, methane, carbon dioxide, changes in ocean
chemistry and pH. By process of elimination, primary
causes of mass extinctions are linked in various ways to the
carbon cycle in general and ocean chemistry in particular
with clear association with atmospheric carbon dioxide
levels. The prospect of ocean acidification is potentially the
most serious of all predicted outcomes of anthropogenic
carbon dioxide increase. This study concludes that acidification
has the potential to trigger a sixth mass extinction
event and to do so independently of anthropogenic
extinctions that are currently taking place.
Keywords Ocean acidification Mass extinctions
Climate change Coral reefs Corals
Introduction
Old Rocks
Diamond Member
- Thread starter
- #555
http://www.solas-int.org/resources/ESF__Impacts-OA.pdf
There is growing scientific evidence that, as a result of
increasing anthropogenic carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions,
absorption of CO2 by the oceans has already noticeably
increased the average oceanic acidity from pre-industrial
levels. This global threat requires a global response.
According to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change
(IPCC), continuing CO2 emissions in line with current trends
could make the oceans up to 150% more acidic by 2100 than
they were at the beginning of the Anthropocene.
Acidification decreases the ability of the ocean to absorb
additional atmospheric CO2, which implies that future CO2
emissions are likely to lead to more rapid global warming.
Ocean acidification is also problematic because of its
negative effects on marine ecosystems, especially marine
calcifying organisms, and marine resources and services
upon which human societies largely depend such as energy,
water, and fisheries. For example, it is predicted that by
2100 around 70% of all cold-water corals, especially those
in the higher latitudes, will live in waters undersaturated
in carbonate due to ocean acidification. Recent research
indicates that ocean acidification might also result in
increasing levels of jellyfish in some marine ecosystems.
Aside from direct effects, ocean acidification together
with other global change-induced impacts such as marine
and coastal pollution and the introduction of invasive alien
species are likely to result in more fragile marine ecosystems,
making them more vulnerable to other environmental impacts
resulting from, for example, coastal deforestation and widescale
fisheries.
There is growing scientific evidence that, as a result of
increasing anthropogenic carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions,
absorption of CO2 by the oceans has already noticeably
increased the average oceanic acidity from pre-industrial
levels. This global threat requires a global response.
According to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change
(IPCC), continuing CO2 emissions in line with current trends
could make the oceans up to 150% more acidic by 2100 than
they were at the beginning of the Anthropocene.
Acidification decreases the ability of the ocean to absorb
additional atmospheric CO2, which implies that future CO2
emissions are likely to lead to more rapid global warming.
Ocean acidification is also problematic because of its
negative effects on marine ecosystems, especially marine
calcifying organisms, and marine resources and services
upon which human societies largely depend such as energy,
water, and fisheries. For example, it is predicted that by
2100 around 70% of all cold-water corals, especially those
in the higher latitudes, will live in waters undersaturated
in carbonate due to ocean acidification. Recent research
indicates that ocean acidification might also result in
increasing levels of jellyfish in some marine ecosystems.
Aside from direct effects, ocean acidification together
with other global change-induced impacts such as marine
and coastal pollution and the introduction of invasive alien
species are likely to result in more fragile marine ecosystems,
making them more vulnerable to other environmental impacts
resulting from, for example, coastal deforestation and widescale
fisheries.
Old Rocks
Diamond Member
- Thread starter
- #556
Long-term ocean oxygen depletion in response to carbon dioxide emissions from fossil fuels : Abstract : Nature Geoscience
Long-term ocean oxygen depletion in response to carbon dioxide emissions from fossil fuels
Gary Shaffer1,2,3, Steffen Malskær Olsen3,4 & Jens Olaf Pepke Pedersen3,5
Top of pageOngoing global warming could persist far into the future, because natural processes require decades to hundreds of thousands of years to remove carbon dioxide from fossil-fuel burning from the atmosphere1, 2, 3. Future warming may have large global impacts including ocean oxygen depletion and associated adverse effects on marine life, such as more frequent mortality events4, 5, 6, 7, 8, but long, comprehensive simulations of these impacts are currently not available. Here we project global change over the next 100,000 years using a low-resolution Earth system model9, and find severe, long-term ocean oxygen depletion, as well as a great expansion of ocean oxygen-minimum zones for scenarios with high emissions or high climate sensitivity. We find that climate feedbacks within the Earth system amplify the strength and duration of global warming, ocean heating and oxygen depletion. Decreased oxygen solubility from surface-layer warming accounts for most of the enhanced oxygen depletion in the upper 500 m of the ocean. Possible weakening of ocean overturning and convection lead to further oxygen depletion, also in the deep ocean. We conclude that substantial reductions in fossil-fuel use over the next few generations are needed if extensive ocean oxygen depletion for thousands of years is to be avoided.
Long-term ocean oxygen depletion in response to carbon dioxide emissions from fossil fuels
Gary Shaffer1,2,3, Steffen Malskær Olsen3,4 & Jens Olaf Pepke Pedersen3,5
Top of pageOngoing global warming could persist far into the future, because natural processes require decades to hundreds of thousands of years to remove carbon dioxide from fossil-fuel burning from the atmosphere1, 2, 3. Future warming may have large global impacts including ocean oxygen depletion and associated adverse effects on marine life, such as more frequent mortality events4, 5, 6, 7, 8, but long, comprehensive simulations of these impacts are currently not available. Here we project global change over the next 100,000 years using a low-resolution Earth system model9, and find severe, long-term ocean oxygen depletion, as well as a great expansion of ocean oxygen-minimum zones for scenarios with high emissions or high climate sensitivity. We find that climate feedbacks within the Earth system amplify the strength and duration of global warming, ocean heating and oxygen depletion. Decreased oxygen solubility from surface-layer warming accounts for most of the enhanced oxygen depletion in the upper 500 m of the ocean. Possible weakening of ocean overturning and convection lead to further oxygen depletion, also in the deep ocean. We conclude that substantial reductions in fossil-fuel use over the next few generations are needed if extensive ocean oxygen depletion for thousands of years is to be avoided.
gslack
Senior Member
- Mar 26, 2010
- 4,527
- 356
- 48
LOLOLOL....oh, poor little slack-jawed-idiot, the only thing you've ever "busted" is your own pitiful excuse for a brain. Ocean acidification is a reality that is recognized and studied by scientists all around the world.
You asked for it....
the first page where I showed the OP's flaws...
http://www.usmessageboard.com/2199920-post3.html
I have much more in this thread alone tool.....
Your BS is busted...
The problem is that the article you're citing is irrelevant to the current situation. Tell me about our own era; the time when humans evolved. That's what we're studying and trying to preserve, NOT an artificial return to those earlier times.
Why look its socko... Already busted you on this line of crap in this thread socko, best not make me bring it back too... Article im citing? Dumazz learn to read, its a link to my post in this thread... LOL big time scientist HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Last edited:
gslack
Senior Member
- Mar 26, 2010
- 4,527
- 356
- 48
So either the oceans didn't turn acidic and kill them with 20 times the amount of CO2 in the air, or CO2 has no real measurable impact on PH to the extent if effecting the oceans like they claim. Either way its insane....
------------------------------------
This is an example of "false choice" and a reason why taking examples from millions of years ago, isn't always the logical thing to do. The corals of the past evolved during a time of high CO2 and therefore would be able to tolerate lower pH levels. Modern corals evolved during a time of lower CO2 and don't seem to tolerate an acidic environment as well. You can't use the past as a template for the future, if underlying conditions have changed.
LOL and this is an example of dancing even after the music has stopped.....
Well if I can't use the past as a a template than neither can your side if we use your own logic....
Perhaps our modern planet has evolved and adapted to absorb more CO2? Perhaps the entire theory of GHG's and their effects are overstated? Perhaps the CO2 millions of years ago was actually a bunch of magic beans which grew into killer spores that killed all the dinosaurs?
Freaking asinine argument man... Seriously, the very word calcite should have been a clue... Clacite and aragonite are both forms of calcium carbonite. Ca CO3 ...
Here is some info on them...
ARAGONITE (Calcium Carbonate)
Aragonite is technically unstable at normal surface temperatures and pressures. It is stable at higher pressures, but not at higher temperatures such that in order to keep aragonite stable with increasing temperature, the pressure must also increase. If aragonite is heated to 400 degrees C, it will spontaneously convert to calcite if the pressure is not also increased. Since calcite is the more stable mineral, why does aragonite even form? Well under certain conditions of formation, the crystallization of calcite is somehow discouraged and aragonite will form instead. The magnesium and salt content of the crystallizing fluid, the turbidity of the fluid and the time of crystallization are decidedly important factors, but there are perhaps others. Such areas as sabkhas and oolitic shoals tend to allow significant amounts of aragonite to form. Also metamorphism that includes high pressures and low temperatures (relatively) can form aragonite. After burial, given enough time, the aragonite will almost certainly alter to calcite. Sedimentologists are very interested in aragonite and calcite stability fields because the conversion of aragonite to calcite after deposition has a distinct effect on the character of the sedimentary rocks.
Calcite - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Calcite, like most carbonates, will dissolve with most forms of acid. Calcite can be either dissolved by groundwater or precipitated by groundwater, depending on several factors including the water temperature, pH, and dissolved ion concentrations. Although calcite is fairly insoluble in cold water, acidity can cause dissolution of calcite and release of carbon dioxide gas.
LOL I love that last part especially..... lets repeat that oh so embarrassing bit of science shall we? LOL
Calcite, like most carbonates, will dissolve with most forms of acid. Calcite can be either dissolved by groundwater or precipitated by groundwater, depending on several factors including the water temperature, pH, and dissolved ion concentrations. Although calcite is fairly insoluble in cold water, acidity can cause dissolution of calcite and release of carbon dioxide gas.
Dam that was a severe smackdown now wasn't it.......
SOOOOO, calcite is especially susceptible to acidity and PH factors? LOL so the whole claim you just made about them evolving in such conditions and resistant to CO2 induced acidification is one more example of BS posing as science..... Wow what an embarrassment...
Re-post for socko konradv.... Busted that little argument weeks ago tool....
Last edited:
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