Open Borders

[WillowTree]

I admit it. I'm in the US illegally.

"Transnationalization is not a slogan. Transnationalization is a process, and it is a project. Inside and outside Europe, migrants move from one country to another one, looking for a better future, refusing subordination and exploitation. Crossing the borders, migrants are transnationalizing the world. This process is already taking place, that is why the transnationalization of migrants' struggles, against the border regime, must become a project too."
noborder.org | welcome!

well if you are here illegally why don't you tell us why you think we should pay yer bills, or if you work why you think it's okay to falsify ID or to steal ID>> splain??? whydoncha???

 

[sky dancer]

why don;'t you start by explaining how open borders work exactly,, who pays the bills? for medicine and for education,, are all countries expected to cooperate equally??? doyathink?

Open borders allow freedom of movement of people to come here and work and live. It does not grant citizenship. ID would still be necessary and whoever comes here must abide by our laws.

There already are people with dual citizenship.


It's just an idea, and one I'm investigating. I'm reading about it. Is it you idea that someone has to have every detail worked out in advance of a discussion?

How do you think we create anything? You start first with an idea and then you test it out.

 

[dilloduck]

Open borders allow freedom of movement of people to come here and work and live. It does not grant citizenship. ID would still be necessary and whoever comes here must abide by our laws.

There already are people with dual citizenship.


It's just an idea, and one I'm investigating. I'm reading about it. Is it you idea that someone has to have every detail worked out in advance of a discussion?

How do you think we create anything? You start first with an idea and then you test it out.

Well before this internationalism all takes place how about we follow the rules?

 

[catzmeow]

Since the country started, farm owners have been hiring immigrants...this is nothing new. And hispanics aren't the first group of immigrants that earned the scorn of the white Americans.

All have pretty much integrated into our culture, settled down, and produced American families...even though each group in it's turn was accused of taking jobs away from Americans. The language never changes, just the country of origin.

It's always easy to blame economic problems on a group of people that are different.

I love Ravi's strategy. Make a claim. When this claim is disproven, ignore the evidence, and restate the claim. Well done.

 

[sky dancer]

Well before this internationalism all takes place how about we follow the rules?

You are no fun.

 

[catzmeow]

No. That was Tibet who let the Chinese in to kill 1.2 million and descrate 6000 monasteries.

Thanks Mao.

I see that open borders worked about as well for Tibet as they are working for us....Perhaps buddhists should stick to theology and stay the hell out of politics.

 

[Againsheila]

Open borders is an idea that I'm interested in discussing. We do discuss political ideas here don't we?

Transnationalism is the wave of the future.

Current immigration policy is based on a historical racist and colonial relationship to third world countries.

Current immigration policy makes it easy for people from third world countries to come here while making it almost impossible for people from first world nations to come here.

Whatever articles you are quoting from are wrong. Immigration policy was changed in the 60's. Before that, we had much much fewer immigrants to come into this country and those that did were well educated.

 

[dilloduck]

You are no fun.

neither are the illegals in Austin--they are running around with AK-47s and body armor.

 

[Againsheila]

Of course not. I probably won't see it in my lifetime. It's just the direction the world is going.

Consequently, it makes sense to talk about it. We have already moved toward allowing free trade of goods and services. The free movement of people is next.

Where do we have free trade of goods and services? Let's face it, we let THEIR goods in without tarriffs but they charge tarriffs on the goods we sell to them. How is that free trade????


Further, they don't have to abide by the same rules that businesses in this country do, therefor it makes it cheaper for our jobs to be sent overseas as well as our factories...how is that free????

What we need is FAIR trade.

 

[sky dancer]

I see that open borders worked about as well for Tibet as they are working for us....Perhaps buddhists should stick to theology and stay the hell out of politics.

No way. Living Buddhism is politics. It informs my world view.

 

[Againsheila]

Sure honey. I'll be sure and tell him that. I am an American citizen and a citizen of the world.

You know, I would love to be a citizen of the world, but when they sent my job to India, they wouldn't let me go with it. Nope, to the Indian government those jobs were for their citizens. I could live a lot better in India on $4.00 an hour than I can here on $9.00 an hour.

We are the only country in the world that not only ships our jobs overseas, but allows people from other countries to come in and take the ones we have left.

 

[sky dancer]

Where do we have free trade of goods and services? Let's face it, we let THEIR goods in without tarriffs but they charge tarriffs on the goods we sell to them. How is that free trade????


Further, they don't have to abide by the same rules that businesses in this country do, therefor it makes it cheaper for our jobs to be sent overseas as well as our factories...how is that free????

What we need is FAIR trade.

I agree with you. I'm all for fairness. Unfortunately, plenty of what life deals us individually and collectively isn't fair.

 

[catzmeow]

No way. Living Buddhism is politics. It informs my world view.

Did it inform the worldview of the open borders Tibetans? If so, here's a tip: Your worldview is irreparably non-functional.

 

[dilloduck]

I agree with you. I'm all for fairness. Unfortunately, plenty of what life deals us individually and collectively isn't fair.

yet you chose to ignore some and pay attention to others. There are two sides to the illegal immigration story. You tell one. Is that Buddhism ?

 

[sky dancer]

yet you chose to ignore some and pay attention to others. There are two sides to the illegal immigration story. You tell one. Is that Buddhism ?

Yes. It is Buddhism. Plenty of people are here to tell the other side of the story. I'm always pick the minority side of the story in the immigration debate.

You're talking to a woman with five planets in Libra. Believe me. I look at more than one side of the story.

This is just the side I choose to debate in this topic.

 

[catzmeow]

Yes. It is Buddhism. Plenty of people are here to tell the other side of the story. I'm always pick the minority side of the story in the immigration debate.

You're talking to a woman with five planets in Libra. Believe me. I look at more than one side of the story.

This is just the side I choose to debate in this topic.

Don't you have a horoscope to read and some weed to smoke, hippy dippy?

 

[sky dancer]

You know, I would love to be a citizen of the world, but when they sent my job to India, they wouldn't let me go with it. Nope, to the Indian government those jobs were for their citizens. I could live a lot better in India on $4.00 an hour than I can here on $9.00 an hour.

We are the only country in the world that not only ships our jobs overseas, but allows people from other countries to come in and take the ones we have left.

The truth of the matter is we are all on our way to being world citizens. I have friends who cannot afford health insurance. It is cheaper for them to fly to Asia or Mexico for healthcare than it is to have healthcare in the US without insurance.

Doesn't that strike you as odd?

Same thing with prescription medication. Hey, I'm just as frustrated as you are to call an American company with a service problem and get someone on the phone from some other part of the world who doesn't understand me and who I can't understand.

 

[dilloduck]

Yes. It is Buddhism. Plenty of people are here to tell the other side of the story. I'm always pick the minority side of the story in the immigration debate.

You're talking to a woman with five planets in Libra. Believe me. I look at more than one side of the story.

This is just the side I choose to debate in this topic.

I wouldn't think a Buddhist would believe in such a thing as an underdog.
(It was a damn good cartoon tho !)

Sorry but planets in libra mean about as much to me as stone tablets carved out of a mountain by GOD.

 

[Againsheila]

The truth of the matter is we are all on our way to being world citizens. I have friends who cannot afford health insurance. It is cheaper for them to fly to Asia or Mexico for healthcare than it is to have healthcare in the US without insurance.

Doesn't that strike you as odd?

Same thing with prescription medication. Hey, I'm just as frustrated as you are to call an American company with a service problem and get someone on the phone from some other part of the world who doesn't understand me and who I can't understand.

I seriously doubt it...they aren't doing YOUR job.

Believe it or not, I enjoyed that job, especially the flight benefits. Heck I got to go to Japan, first class both directions for $350. Pay was crap but hey, first class on a 777, no way in heck I could ever afford that otherwise.

 

[sky dancer]

I wouldn't think a Buddhist would believe in such a thing as an underdog.
(It was a damn good cartoon tho !)

Sorry but planets in libra mean about as much to me as stone tablets carved out of a mountain by GOD.

Buddhist practice kindness. Libra in astrology shows the scale. It means balance. It means to weigh both sides of an issue.

I just happen to pick the least popular side to debate in immigration. Why not?