Oregon Gunman: Conservative Republican

[M14 Shooter]

Unfortunately the solution is going to be along the same lines of a personal trainer talking to an obese woman; "You didn't get this way overnight and you won't correct your self overnight." It will take a generation or two., blah blah blah

Taxing or otherwise artificially increasing the cost the exercise of a right with the intent to limit the exercise of same violates the constitution.
Every time.

Point to where it says that in the constitution

Oh... THAT game. OK...
A $1500 tax on abortion, placed with the intent to limit the exercise the right to an abortion does not violate the constitution.
A $1500 tax on churchgoers, placed with the intent to limit the free exercise of religion does not violate the constitution
A $1500 tax on news stories, places with the intent to limit the right to a free press, does not violate the constitution
A $1500 tax on political signs and banners, placed with the intent to limit the right to free speech, does not violate the constitution.
A $1500 tax on the purchase a firearm, placed with the intent to limit the exercise of the right to arms, does not violate the constitution.
Surely, you agree.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I have a better idea...
Instead of playing the name games...

Let's us pray for the victim's this crap has to stop....

What crap is that?

Let me guess you want the killings to continue...

No. Some of your conservative brethern see nothing wrong with mass killings and simply say there is nothing we can do to solve the problem. Just ask them.

Nah I don't give a fuck about them...I am so sick and tired of reading this on the news


What is your answer candy?

We have to stop them

Unfortunately the solution is going to be along the same lines of a personal trainer talking to an obese woman; "You didn't get this way overnight and you won't correct your self overnight." It will take a generation or two.

First, you simply accept that the 2nd Amendment will not be going anywhere. The framers put in place an unassailable fortress around the Constitution. The only successful assault on the document was to revoke an amendment that prohibited alcohol. The resulting increase in violent crime along with a great depression (the country could use a drink about that time) resulted in a favorable atmosphere. Also, an amendment passed by the same folks who were going to repeal it a few terms later didn't seem so egregious as trying to overturn the works of Madison, Monroe and Washington. As crazy as the whole episode with the 19th amendment was, there are lessons to be learned from there. The first step in reducing the gun play that is resulting in so many campus slaughters is to reduce the need for guns in the first place. This is a binary tract that goes for those who perceive a need for self-defense as well as those on offense who follow the Larry the Liquidator mindset of "They have theirs so I have mine". Larry was talking about lawyers of course. The actual quote from IMDB is "They're like nuclear warheads. They have theirs, so I have mine. Once you use them, they fuck up everything." I would imagine that those who use guns daily are of several mindsets but most would probably fall into Larry's camp of rather not using them and risking a felony sentence therein than simply acquiring what they want through other means. I'm sure there are numerous psychopaths who love inflicting pain and torment as well but in general terms, I think a majority would rather just show you they are armed and prefer not to pull the trigger.

We are at a similar cross-roads today with marijuana and other controlled substances. The violence on our city streets is not over purse snatching or punks stealing bicycles. The "real money" is in dealing drugs so the real violence is in dealing out misery to anyone who dare infringes on your turf and tries to take the money from you.

So first and foremost is to legalize some of the drugs that are causing the spike in violence.

This move in and of itself will have 3 effects. First, it allows the armed constabulary to focus more on drugs that are more dangerous such as heroin, crack, methamphetamine, and cocaine. It will stand to reason that the police will be more successful when their focus is not diffused. Secondly, the number of players will be reduced. Not everyone who is dealing pot will "shift" into doing the other four either due to opportunity, territory, infrastructure, or simple seriousness of those drugs compared to merely "getting baked".Lastly, the resulting reduction in violence will cause some who are thinking they need to buy a gun not to. This is important later.

The next step is legislative. Oh boy. It involves attacking supply and demand.

Under DHS Directive 5, the head of DHS can declare something a national emergency. It needn't be a hurricane, typhoon, earthquake, terrorist attack, etc. The language goes like this:

The Secretary shall coordinate the Federal Government's resources utilized in response to or recovery from terrorist attacks, major disasters, or other emergencies if and when any one of the following four conditions applies: (1) a Federal department or agency acting under its own authority has requested the assistance of the Secretary; (2) the resources of State and local authorities are overwhelmed and Federal assistance has been requested by the appropriate State and local authorities; (3) more than one Federal department or agency has become substantially involved in responding to the incident; or (4) the Secretary has been directed to assume responsibility for managing the domestic incident by the President.​

The DOE could act under the first condition. POTUS could act under the 4th.

Anyway, it goes on to read in the annex #16:

16. The Secretary shall develop, submit for review to the Homeland Security Council, and administer a National Response Plan (NRP). The Secretary shall consult with appropriate Assistants to the President (including the Assistant to the President for Economic Policy) and the Director of the Office of Science and Technology Policy, and other such Federal officials as may be appropriate, in developing and implementing the NRP. This plan shall integrate Federal Government domestic prevention, preparedness, response, and recovery plans into one all-discipline, all-hazards plan​

Congress can (and of course should) be brought on board. In the same way costs are inferred with licenses, insurance, and bonding at the State level, federal laws can be passed to require gun makers to carry what amounts to a license with each gun purchased by Dick's, Sporting Goods, Cubela's, Bass Pro Shops, etc. Lets say the license today is $1,000 per firearm. So for a Dick's location to stock it's shelves with 500 guns, that one location has to outlay $500,000 additional dollars.

Sorry.

So when you buy a gun for $299.00; it will cost you $299 + $1,000 license for that particular gun. Don't worry; it's transferable.

Increase the costs of weapons to reduce the overall supply; over time.

Okay, so now Jane Doe has a $299 pistol and a $1,000 license. That $1,000 is invested in that State's employee pension program. The returns start accumulating immediately through compound interest. However, it is capped at a return of, let's say, $10,000 in 10 years. A 100% return rate per year sounds really high but most pensions (including mine from Texas) matches contributions at 200% or so. Jane's license is appreciating.

So 3 things happen here:
1. Jane (being a responsible gun owner who shops retail) is likely to keep her gun because she's making a killing on the investment. This shorts the chances of her selling it.
2. If the gun is stolen, she reports it immediately to cash in the $1,000 policy. Appreciation didn't happen since she didn't hold it for the full 10 years.
3. Most importantly, at the end of 10 years, she can sell her gun back to the Federal Government for whatever they are paying for it ....likely not that much admittedly...but she can use the bond to buy another weapon OR she can cash in the bond for $10,000 cash (plus the initial investment of $1,000). So she walks out of the ATF/State Police office with $11,000 in her purse. She may wish to keep the bond however (or transfer it at a price she demands) to whomever willing to pay her price AND who passes a background check. Governments being governments, the costs of the policy will increase over time so in ten years, the initial investment may be $2,500 making a $299 gun's price $2,799. So you may wish to keep the $1,000 "bond" and use your $10 K to buy a new cool gun and "only" increase it by $1,000. Or simply keep the gun and the policy and do nothing.

Needless to say a FBI/State Police forensic check will be one against bullets recovered to see if there a match to any crimes as well.

Create a market-driven motivation to limit the mobility of guns through the society.

Other ideas for using market forces could be increasing the match from 100% per year to 150% during a buy-back program so if you're 5 years into your ownership history, the State may offer you a period where you can "cash in" for $5,000 to $7,500 so you walk out with $6,000 (5K + your 1K original outlay) or $8,500.

Enforcement needs to be front and center. I would do the following: If you brandish a weapon or indicate you have a weapon during commission of a crime (not defending), it is a federal rap. So if you are making terroristic threats to your ex-wife saying that you'll go home and get a gun and kill her; that is now a federal crime under this statute. And the federal rap comes with no parole. Tell the clerk at a 7/11 you have a gun during a robbery....you get the State robbery charge for however long it lasts then when it's over, you get a federal gun rap. The State lets you out after 3 years of a 10 year sentence, Uncle Sam and his prison goons scoop you up to start your federal sentence. Use a gun in a murder, life in Fort Collins or other fed pen; no parole.

Sell a gun without the policy at a gun show, at your home, or out of your trunk. Boom; federal crime.
Steal a gun from anyone (policy or not), Boom; federal crime.

Use the Bureau of Prisons printing plant (if there is one) to print a gazillion posters detailing the sentences and the fact that if you're sentenced to 9 years, 3 months, 8 days, and 37 minutes you'll serve 9/3/8/37 (7 states away BTW)and put them in every school, gun store, shooting range, etc....

Create an atmosphere to where there are real consequences for gun crimes; not the current slap on the wrist.

Beef up background checks to include interviews with randomly flagged applicants.
Appoint armed guards at each campus. Get rid of the strength coach for the football team and hire some guards
Form partnerships with local gun clubs including the NRA to spread awareness. If they don't want to participate; that's cool but I think most would.

----------------

Anyway, what will happen over time is this: Increased prices lower sales. Lower sales mean less units produced. This reduces overall supply. Creating a market driven model whereby responsible gun ownership is monetarily encouraged and awarded (at the same time creating another penalty for dishonest actors to suffer) will stop the mobility of firearms through the society. Enforcing current laws and enhancing penalties for gun-involved crimes will result in bad actors and their guns being removed from circulation also. Additionally, decriminalizing (and thus removing the violence associated with) some drugs will push the "casual suppliers" out of the market.

Okay, so now Jane Doe has a $299 pistol and a $1,000 license. That $1,000 is invested in that State's employee pension program. The returns start accumulating immediately through compound interest. However, it is capped at a return of, let's say, $10,000 in 10 years. A 100% return rate per year sounds really high but most pensions (including mine from Texas) matches contributions at 200% or so. Jane's license is appreciating.

You want a state to waste $10,000 per gun on your stupid proposal?
Why is this a good idea?

A 100% return rate per year sounds really high

Yes, moronically, mind-blowingly too high.

but most pensions (including mine from Texas) matches contributions at 200% or so.

Yes, that's why most state pension plans are broke.

Jane's license is appreciating.

For no good reason.

 

[Synthaholic]

The never ending desire of some to try and score political points off dead bodies is unreal.

Like vilifying Iraq, who didn't attack us, after 3,000 dead bodies?

 

[Synthaholic]

The never ending desire of some to try and score political points off dead bodies is unreal.

True dat.

Unreal? I tend to think that the almost monthly slaughter of our young people at the hands of armed malcontents is unreal. Whats-more is how conservatives here and elsewhere have just accepted the body count of 10 year old girls as the costs of doing business and that it is far more important the rights of the malcontent are not infringed upon.

And yet you liberals here and elsewhere do nothing to deal with the problem all you ever do is complain about onservatives and the NRA and make general comments about stricter gun laws but never propose a single change change to current laws or offer any news ones that would prevent these type of shootings.

You're either full of shit, or just a fucking liar? Which is it?

1. Background checks for all firearm sales.
2. Close all gun show loopholes.
3. Ban large capacity magazines.
4. Reinstate the assault weapons ban.

There's four off the top of my head.

 

[blackhawk]

The never ending desire of some to try and score political points off dead bodies is unreal.

True dat.

Unreal? I tend to think that the almost monthly slaughter of our young people at the hands of armed malcontents is unreal. Whats-more is how conservatives here and elsewhere have just accepted the body count of 10 year old girls as the costs of doing business and that it is far more important the rights of the malcontent are not infringed upon.

And yet you liberals here and elsewhere do nothing to deal with the problem all you ever do is complain about onservatives and the NRA and make general comments about stricter gun laws but never propose a single change change to current laws or offer any news ones that would prevent these type of shootings.

You're either full of shit, or just a fucking liar? Which is it?

1. Background checks for all firearm sales.
2. Close all gun show loopholes.
3. Ban large capacity magazines.
4. Reinstate the assault weapons ban.

There's four off the top of my head.

We have background checks now.
Few if any who commit these type of crimes get their guns at gun shows,
With few exceptions the majority used in these attacks are standard round clips not large capacity magazines.
Also with few exceptions it's handguns that are used in these type of attacks not assault weapons.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Oregon Gunman described himself as a "Conservative Republican" in an online dating profile.

Spiritual Passions: ironcross45 - Doesn't Like Organized Religion, Left-hand Path, Magick and Occult, Meditation, Not Religious, But Spiritual

And?...Your point?.....

 

[thereisnospoon]

The never ending desire of some to try and score political points off dead bodies is unreal.

True dat.

Unreal? I tend to think that the almost monthly slaughter of our young people at the hands of armed malcontents is unreal. Whats-more is how conservatives here and elsewhere have just accepted the body count of 10 year old girls as the costs of doing business and that it is far more important the rights of the malcontent are not infringed upon.

And yet you liberals here and elsewhere do nothing to deal with the problem all you ever do is complain about onservatives and the NRA and make general comments about stricter gun laws but never propose a single change change to current laws or offer any news ones that would prevent these type of shootings.

You're either full of shit, or just a fucking liar? Which is it?

1. Background checks for all firearm sales.
2. Close all gun show loopholes.
3. Ban large capacity magazines.
4. Reinstate the assault weapons ban.

There's four off the top of my head.

....This guy bought all of the firearms with background checks.
Second....Not a single criminal has ever been within the law when they got their hands on a gun. The government can pass all the gun control laws it can and guess what,? ...The criminals would still get their hands on guns.....Why is this, you stupid liberal?...Because they are fucking criminals.
So regurgitating the Obama songs. First , you have to get your tongue out of his ass. Sycophant.

 

[thereisnospoon]

How much do you want to bet that even though he is a self professed con some of the clowns on the board will make up every excuse to say why he was not up to and including some elaborate conspiracy theory?

Nobody cares. He is one individual. One sick fuck.
Of course you libs will never let a tragedy go to waste. Politicize everything. Even Obama spewed this. "We need to politicize this event"...
You left wingers are ghouls. Not an ounce of respect or feelings toward the victims. To your side, the bodies are political tools.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Oregon Gunman described himself as a "Conservative Republican" in an online dating profile.

Spiritual Passions: ironcross45 - Doesn't Like Organized Religion, Left-hand Path, Magick and Occult, Meditation, Not Religious, But Spiritual

I'm sure Conservatives targeting Christians for execution yeah that's a new the guys probably related to you

Sounds like you're talking about Westboro.

No...You simpleton. The OP was referring to the shooter.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I have a better idea...
Instead of playing the name games...

Let's us pray for the victim's this crap has to stop....

What crap is that?

Don't play stupid.....Oh, I forgot.

 

[thereisnospoon]

And lest we forget, we used to like Islamic terrorists,

Operation Cyclone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Operation Cyclone was the code name for the United States Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) program to arm and finance the Afghan mujahideen prior to and during the Soviet war in Afghanistan, from 1979 to 1989. The program leaned heavily towards supporting militant Islamic groups that were favoured by neighbouring Pakistan, rather than other, less ideological Afghan resistance groups that had also been fighting the Marxist-oriented Democratic Republic of Afghanistan regime since before the Soviet intervention[citation needed]. Operation Cyclone was one of the longest and most expensive covert CIA operations ever undertaken;[1] funding began with $20–$30 million per year in 1980 and rose to $630 million per year in 1987.[2] Funding continued after 1989 as the mujahideen battled the forces of Mohammad Najibullah's PDPA during the civil war in Afghanistan (1989–1992).[3]"

And because of this aid those we aided became the Taliban.

What an idiotic comment.
Thank you Garner Ted Armstrong.
STFU

 

[Vigilante]

• Media Narrative: Half-Black Oregon Killer is a "White Supremacist"
  Front Page Magazine ^ | October 2, 2015 | Daniel Greenfield
  Was he a Half-White Supremacist? According to the LA Times, Chris Harper Mercer, the Oregon killer, was a "White Supremacist". One slight problem. Mercer identified as multi-racial. His mother was black. He doesn't seem to have even known his father. He identified with black TV killer Vester Lee Flanagan. This doesn't seem to have stopped the media with George Zimmerman who was labeled a white Hispanic, so maybe Chris Harper Mercer was a white Black? Was he a Half-White Supremacist? I'm not an expert on "White Supremacism", but being half-black and then shooting a bunch of white Christians would make...

 

[thereisnospoon]

I have a better idea...
Instead of playing the name games...

Let's us pray for the victim's this crap has to stop....

What crap is that?

Let me guess you want the killings to continue...

No. Some of your conservative brethern see nothing wrong with mass killings and simply say there is nothing we can do to solve the problem. Just ask them.

Yes., we enjoy the carnage.
You are too stupid to realize how stupid you are.
Go take a flying fuck on a rolling donut.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I have a better idea...
Instead of playing the name games...

Let's us pray for the victim's this crap has to stop....

What crap is that?

Let me guess you want the killings to continue...

No. Some of your conservative brethern see nothing wrong with mass killings and simply say there is nothing we can do to solve the problem. Just ask them.

Nah I don't give a fuck about them...I am so sick and tired of reading this on the news


What is your answer candy?

We have to stop them

Do not engage that idiot.
She is a card carrying emoting hysterical non thinking feminazi liberal.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Oregon Gunman described himself as a "Conservative Republican" in an online dating profile.

Spiritual Passions: ironcross45 - Doesn't Like Organized Religion, Left-hand Path, Magick and Occult, Meditation, Not Religious, But Spiritual

Conservatives are by nature and social design intolerant.

Murder is by definition the most clear form of intolerance.

Some Muslims are extremely intolerant..therefore we get ISIL and those that perpetrated 9/11.

Some Christians are extremely intolerant therefore we get the despicable acts they perpetrate.

Some people are of no particular religion but have developed extreme intolerance and we get wackos like this fine Oregon fellow.

Nonsense!! Conservatives value what is tried and true UNLESS A BETTER WAY OF DOING THINGS CAN BE DEMONSTRATED. Shrill bleatings for "hopeychangey" just doesn't cut the mustard!! Extremists exist in many form; totalitarian regimes were full of the scum. And if I recall correctly the vast majority of them were radicals in the developing days.

Greg

Nonsense! Conservatives value only what they accept. They are certainly NOT open to any "BETTER WAY". They are just like fundamentalist Muslims in that they believe in fantasy stories and are intolerant of any other possibilities. Conservatives feel like they are victims. They are more concerned with defending their beliefs than any possible "BETTER WAY".

And I suppose you believe liberalism is "the better way"?....Please.
Hey knucklehead. The breakdown of civility in this country over the last 6 years is due to liberalism's influence.

 

[Rustic]

Progressives will always take everything out of context... The truth is far too foreign to them.

 

[M14 Shooter]

4. Reinstate the assault weapons ban.

Really.
Please provide a sound argument as to why this rifle should be banned.

 

[Rustic]

The so called assault weapon is just a common firearm no deadlier than any other rifle... Progressives are just too ignorant know the difference.

Common sense is not their wheelhouse...

 

[Slyhunter]

I've yet to see a mass murderer who identified as a Liberal Democrat.

Coincidence?
















































No.

Hitler, Mao, Stalin, Fidel and the Jung Il and Um were all Liberal Democrats

when you look up the word liberal and educate your self, come on back and join the party! Liberals are not totalitarian dictators...that is more in line with those identifying themselves as conservatives.

Cuba, Venezuela.

 

[Slyhunter]

I've yet to see a mass murderer who identified as a Liberal Democrat.

Coincidence?

No.

Hitler, Mao, Stalin, Fidel and the Jung Il and Um were all Liberal Democrats

when you look up the word liberal and educate your self, come on back and join the party! Liberals are not totalitarian dictators...that is more in line with those identifying themselves as conservatives.

I have never met a liberal that fits the dictionary definition of a liberal. They disappeared many years ago.

Dictionary definition, I don't know.
Thomas Payne definition of a Liberal, just look at the Libertarian Party.