Pence did the right thing

[XponentialChaos]

If you have concrete evidence of this amorphous claim of presidential disrespect, I'd be somewhat interested in seeing it.

It’s pretty obvious. The president wants the Vice President to overthrow the results of the democratically held election, and you see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Done. Got it.

 

[MinTrut]

It’s pretty obvious. The president wants the Vice President to overthrow the results of the democratically held election, and you see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Done. Got it.

I certainly appreciate the several seconds of thought you may have given your redundant reply.

In your defense, I'd say that thinking as you're told to (this includes both WHAT you're told to think about, and HOW you're told to think about it), as well as expressing yourself as you're told to, are excellent short-term strategies; going along to get along a deeply embedded tribal (aka core human cult) behavior which ensures immediate individual survival.

And that brings us full circle back to the topic.

Mike Pence is a repugnant individual who uses faith as a fig leaf, and did as custom dictated.

He is thus neither a hero nor a scoundrel, but simply repugnant, as ever.

Doing other than as custom dictated had no personal upside for Pence, and even Trump has failed to understand or articulate the TRUE nature of 2020 election fraud, and Pence's inabiliy to properly address it in any meaningful way.

For what it's worth, I both pity and envy you; the lively comfort of the hivemind is very real.

 

[XponentialChaos]

I certainly appreciate the several seconds of thought you may have given your redundant reply.

Well since you didn’t refute my point in your rambling, I don’t see a problem with it.

The president wants the Vice President to overthrow the results of the democratically held election, and you see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

 

[scruffy]

Nothing in the Constitution permits that.

Actually, the Constitution => REQUIRES <= it.

It's called the Guarantee Clause.

 

[scruffy]

That’s the problem. It doesn’t say anything about it. It says what “shall” be done which is mandatory language. And that’s what Pence did.

The language presupposes that all the individual Secretaries of State have appropriately certified their elections.

Responsibility travels down the chain. If there is evidence the SoS has not or has fraudulently certified, the VP is required by our Constitution not to certify.

There was no such actual evidence in this case (at the time - at least none that could be conveniently and quickly packaged for legal and public consumption), Pence did the only thing he could. Here's the envelopes, here's the signatures, I must certify.

I believe, that if Pence himself had been convinced there was fraud, he would have acted differently. (Haven't yet read his book, btw).

 

[Pellinore]

I’ll say it again. Former Vice President did the right thing when he determined that he had no Constitutional or legal or moral authority to do anything but proceed with the election certification.

Mike Pence Says James Madison Was Reason for Him to Certify Election

Many of Donald Trump's supporters turned on Pence after he presided over the Senate's approval of the 2020 Electoral College vote on January 6.

www.newsweek.com

Correct.

His job was to read the results. He had as much power to change them as the host has to change who won the Oscars.

The power to challenge the electoral votes belongs to Congress. There is a process where a Representative and Senator together can file a challenge to a state's electoral totals, after which the whole Congress debates and then votes on it, but none were challenged in that way.

It baffles me that it's almost two years since this happened, and people still argue the point. Does anyone really think that such a massive loophole—allowing any VP running for re-election to simply award his team the win with no checks or balances to stop him—could have existed in our system for more than 200 years, with no one noticing it until 2020?

 

[MinTrut]

Well since you didn’t refute my point in your rambling, I don’t see a problem with it.

Your point is a fantasy built on a fantasy, and is refuted as such.

The president wants the Vice President to overthrow the results of the democratically held election, and you see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

It must be bliss not to think for oneself, but simply parrot the cynical delusions of others.

 

[XponentialChaos]

Your point is a fantasy built on a fantasy, and is refuted as such.

It must be bliss not to think for oneself, but simply parrot the cynical delusions of others.

You keep repeating that I’m not thinking for myself. It’s intellectually dishonest to assume that I haven’t thought about this and arrived at my own conclusion. Maybe, just maybe, I actually see something wrong with a President who tells his Vice President to ignore the will of the American people. What a crazy concept.

Maybe you should try being honest instead of making stupid assumptions.

 

[BackAgain]

The language presupposes that all the individual Secretaries of State have appropriately certified their elections.

Responsibility travels down the chain. If there is evidence the SoS has not or has fraudulently certified, the VP is required by our Constitution not to certify.

There was no such actual evidence in this case (at the time - at least none that could be conveniently and quickly packaged for legal and public consumption), Pence did the only thing he could. Here's the envelopes, here's the signatures, I must certify.

I believe, that if Pence himself had been convinced there was fraud, he would have acted differently. (Haven't yet read his book, btw).

Whatever it presupposes, it isn’t for the VP to challenge. I’m not suggesting that there isn’t a proper route to challenge those state ballots. But it’s not for the VP to do.

And judging by how our court system interposed countless procedural bars to even having challenges to any court cases, including a twisted notion of “standing,” we may need to enact some specific laws for the purpose of enabling us to challenge these things.

 

[MinTrut]

You keep repeating that I’m not thinking for myself.

And you keep repeating your shock and outrage that I'm not shocked and outraged by your fantasy.

But this is how the internet is.

It’s intellectually dishonest to assume that I haven’t thought about this and arrived at my own conclusion.

You clearly have no mind of your own.

This was demonstrated when you glossed over my questions about GENUINELY troubling actions by Trump, and Bush II and Obama's war crimes.

You are outraged as you are instructed to be.

You are focused on what you are told to be focused on, and hold the opinions you are instructed to hold.

When and if you are prepared for deprogramming, you will seek it.

Maybe, just maybe, I actually see something wrong with a President who tells his Vice President to ignore the will of the American people.

See above.

What a crazy concept.

Not so much crazy as tragic, but the individual benefits of hivemind thinking far outweigh the cost, so your intellectual dishonesty finds itself in large, safe company.

Maybe you should try being honest instead of making stupid assumptions.

I find this ironic, but we can certainly continue this forever, and you seem to want to do so, so I'll await your next redundant expression of parroted outrage.

In the meantime - and beyond - Pence will remain a shitweasel, and Trump's wishes will remain a nothing burger.

 

[XponentialChaos]

You clearly have no mind of your own.

So you’re just going to keep doubling down on your baseless assumption. Gotcha.

You’ve clearly proven that you’re an idiot.

 

[Lesh]

Responsibility travels down the chain. If there is evidence the SoS has not or has fraudulently certified, the VP is required by our Constitution not to certify.

His job was to read the results. He had as much power to change them as the host has to change who won the Oscars.

 

[MinTrut]

So you’re just going to keep doubling down on your baseless assumption.

The irony here is great, though by now incredibly dull.

Gotcha.

No, I don't think you do.

Your mind is filled with the buzzing of the hive.

You’ve clearly proven that you’re an idiot.

You just won't address my points; you can't.

Your mind enslaved to the hive so thoroughly it obscures your ability to think independently in any way.

But yes - Pence is a shitweasel, and Trump's wishes a nothing burger.

Shall we rinse and repeat, or are we finished now?

 

[XponentialChaos]

The irony here is great, though by now incredibly dull.

No, I don't think you do.

Your mind is filled with the buzzing of the hive.

You just won't address my points; you can't.

Your mind enslaved to the hive so thoroughly it obscures your ability to think independently in any way.

But yes - Pence is a shitweasel, and Trump's wishes a nothing burger.

Shall we rinse and repeat, or are we finished now?

You’re welcome to leave any time. You’ve already proven that you’re a mindless fool and you are too stupid to understand that your rambling has done exactly nothing to refute anything I‘ve said.

 

[MinTrut]

You’re welcome to leave any time.

I just can't quit the contact buzz.

You’ve already proven that you’re a mindless fool

Projection/denial.

and you are too stupid to understand that your rambling has done exactly nothing to refute anything I‘ve said.

The weak and incompetent often seek the safety of the hive or herd - just FYI.

But yeah - Pence is a piece of work.

 

[XponentialChaos]

I just can't quit the contact buzz.

Projection/denial.

The weak and incompetent often seek the safety of the hive or herd - just FYI.



But yeah - Pence is a piece of work.

So still nothing to refute anything I said. Just you being a weak-minded brainwashed fool. Hopefully you figure things out soon, but I‘m not expecting much out of you.

 

[MinTrut]

So still nothing to refute anything I said.

I cannot refute your shock and outrage.

I could not do so even were they based in reality.

Just you being a weak-minded brainwashed fool.

The internet really was made for people like you.

Hopefully you figure things out soon, but I‘m not expecting much out of you.

Say - why not compromise?

Perhaps I could join you in shock and outrage!

I see that your capacity for independent thought is paralyzed (one hopes not permanently), but you may still have functional core instincts.

Beyond Pence's *heroic* rubber stamping as lauded in the OP, do you find him incredibly creepy on a human level?

If so, I can join you in shock and outrage that such a creep was elevated to such power.

And if not, I can express shock and outrage at your incapacity to perceive his extreme creepiness.

It's a win-win situation, with shock and outrage 100% guaranteed!

 

[whitehall]

Democrats like it but James Madison never said it.

 

[XponentialChaos]

I cannot refute your shock and outrage.

I could not do so even were they based in reality.

The internet really was made for people like you.

Say - why not compromise?

Perhaps I could join you in shock and outrage!

I see that your capacity for independent thought is paralyzed (one hopes not permanently), but you may still have functional core instincts.

Beyond Pence's *heroic* rubber stamping as lauded in the OP, do you find him incredibly creepy on a human level?

If so, I can join you in shock and outrage that such a creep was elevated to such power.

And if not, I can express shock and outrage at your incapacity to perceive his extreme creepiness.

It's a win-win situation, with shock and outrage 100% guaranteed!

So just more brainwashed rambling that doesn’t refute anything I said. Just baseless claims based on your feelings, not facts. It’s a shame that you don’t at least try thinking for yourself.