[POLL] - Liberals, how much is a "fair share?" - Taxes

[bripat9643]

Only morons swallow that libturd bullshit that corporate executives are parasites. The taxpayers don't pay their salaries, so by definition they aren't parasites.

On the other hand, every employee at the Dept of Education is a useless tick on the ass of society.

"The taxpayers don't pay their salaries, so by definition they aren't parasites."

Workers, consumers, and shareholders do. When a small useless thing lives at the expense of a big thing, that is a parasite.

Well, you've certainly explained something about YOUR existence to us here, and we thank you. However, your ignorance of what those you envy actually do in their jobs is no basis for anything except contempt from others.

PMS and JoeNormal obviously don't have a clue about what executives do. If they had ever worked for a badly managed company, they would understand the value of executives.

 

[PMZ]

"The taxpayers don't pay their salaries, so by definition they aren't parasites."

Workers, consumers, and shareholders do. When a small useless thing lives at the expense of a big thing, that is a parasite.

Well, you've certainly explained something about YOUR existence to us here, and we thank you. However, your ignorance of what those you envy actually do in their jobs is no basis for anything except contempt from others.

PMS and JoeNormal obviously don't have a clue about what executives do. If they had ever worked for a badly managed company, they would understand the value of executives.

It's not their value, it's their compensation that's the problem. Many are overpayed by an order of magnitude, some by two. By any standard. They are accountable only to each other for their pay. A situation that is dysfunctional in the extreme.

 

[JoeNormal]

Only morons swallow that libturd bullshit that corporate executives are parasites. The taxpayers don't pay their salaries, so by definition they aren't parasites.

On the other hand, every employee at the Dept of Education is a useless tick on the ass of society.

They set their own compensation packages you friggen moron. It's as far from a meritocracy as it gets.

The exchange is purely voluntary. If it wasn't, it would be illegal, you friggen moron.

Whether the deserve what the receive is purely an existential question, not an ethical or legal question.

The transfer of money to government parasites, on the other hand, is conducted at gunpoint.

The 'purity' of this simpleminded ideology never ceases to amuse me. It'd be fun to measure the average IQ of it's proponents.

 

[JoeNormal]

Only morons swallow that libturd bullshit that corporate executives are parasites. The taxpayers don't pay their salaries, so by definition they aren't parasites.

On the other hand, every employee at the Dept of Education is a useless tick on the ass of society.

"The taxpayers don't pay their salaries, so by definition they aren't parasites."

Workers, consumers, and shareholders do. When a small useless thing lives at the expense of a big thing, that is a parasite.

Well, you've certainly explained something about YOUR existence to us here, and we thank you. However, your ignorance of what those you envy actually do in their jobs is no basis for anything except contempt from others.

Tell me how many major corporations you've worked for and how many movers and shakers you've known and then we'll compare notes.

 

[JoeNormal]

Well, you've certainly explained something about YOUR existence to us here, and we thank you. However, your ignorance of what those you envy actually do in their jobs is no basis for anything except contempt from others.

PMS and JoeNormal obviously don't have a clue about what executives do. If they had ever worked for a badly managed company, they would understand the value of executives.

It's not their value, it's their compensation that's the problem. Many are overpayed by an order of magnitude, some by two. By any standard. They are accountable only to each other for their pay. A situation that is dysfunctional in the extreme.

Exactly right. The CEO of Caterpillar (I believe) tried to defend the outrageous compensation of top execs by saying that's just what you have to offer to get top talent in an international market. His compensation was over 300 times the average worker's. Meanwhile, the CEO of Kubota made 20 times the average.

 

[ShawnChris13]

CEOs are crooks charging whatever they want because they know they can get away with it. Even if they do break the law they're only going to be put on house arrest. No accountability has created chaotic money grubbing high society narcissistic assholes.

 

[PMZ]

Everyone needs to be accountable to someone. Many corporate executives have escaped that. There is hardly a more important issue to be resolved in the US today.

I think that they somehow have to be treated like politicians in serving at the pleasure of their constituents. They won't cause that to happen. We as consumers need to organize to get it done.

 

[dcraelin]

PMS and JoeNormal obviously don't have a clue about what executives do. If they had ever worked for a badly managed company, they would understand the value of executives.

It's not their value, it's their compensation that's the problem. Many are overpayed by an order of magnitude, some by two. By any standard. They are accountable only to each other for their pay. A situation that is dysfunctional in the extreme.

Exactly right. The CEO of Caterpillar (I believe) tried to defend the outrageous compensation of top execs by saying that's just what you have to offer to get top talent in an international market. His compensation was over 300 times the average worker's. Meanwhile, the CEO of Kubota made 20 times the average.

Some time back wasnt there was a movement to give shareholders more say on pay, which was rejected I believe by most corporate boards?

Clinton had an interesting proposal once that corporations shouldn't be able to deduct from taxes the full pay of their executives if it was over a certain amount. Probably something that should be done.

heres an interesting link on some TeaParty members teaming up with the Sierra club and Common Cause, Tea Party Strikes Out Against the Atlanta Braves to fight an idiotic stadium move by the braves. This is a good development and more of this sort of thing should be done to stop corporate welfare recipients.

l

 

[PMZ]

It's not their value, it's their compensation that's the problem. Many are overpayed by an order of magnitude, some by two. By any standard. They are accountable only to each other for their pay. A situation that is dysfunctional in the extreme.

Exactly right. The CEO of Caterpillar (I believe) tried to defend the outrageous compensation of top execs by saying that's just what you have to offer to get top talent in an international market. His compensation was over 300 times the average worker's. Meanwhile, the CEO of Kubota made 20 times the average.

Some time back wasnt there was a movement to give shareholders more say on pay, which was rejected I believe by most corporate boards?

Clinton had an interesting proposal once that corporations shouldn't be able to deduct from taxes the full pay of their executives if it was over a certain amount. Probably something that should be done.

heres an interesting link on some TeaParty members teaming up with the Sierra club and Common Cause, Tea Party Strikes Out Against the Atlanta Braves to fight an idiotic stadium move by the braves. This is a good development and more of this sort of thing should be done to stop corporate welfare recipients.

l

One thing that you can count on. No progress on curbing executive compensation abuse with Republicans in office.

 

[OODA_Loop]

One thing that you can count on. No progress on curbing executive compensation abuse with Republicans in office.

Executive compensation abuse.

Executive compensation is sanctioned and contractually approved by the shareholders.

Someone else's success does not hurt you.

 

[ShawnChris13]

One thing that you can count on. No progress on curbing executive compensation abuse with Republicans in office.

Executive compensation abuse.



Executive compensation is sanctioned and contractually approved by the shareholders.



Someone else's success does not hurt you.

Not their success. Success isn't an issue. The issue is the tax loophole that companies paid to get created so they could cheat the system. US needs to get rid of the tax loopholes, then we can debate how much their success is worth when companies actually have to pay taxes on their payroll.

 

[PMZ]

One thing that you can count on. No progress on curbing executive compensation abuse with Republicans in office.

Executive compensation abuse.

Executive compensation is sanctioned and contractually approved by the shareholders.

Someone else's success does not hurt you.

"Executive compensation is sanctioned and contractually approved by the shareholders."

It's typically approved by the BOD who are also corporate executives. It's an incestuous relationship.

"Someone else's success does not hurt you."

That money comes at the expense of some combination of customers, workers and shareholders.

 

[JoeNormal]

One thing that you can count on. No progress on curbing executive compensation abuse with Republicans in office.

Executive compensation abuse.

Executive compensation is sanctioned and contractually approved by the shareholders.

Someone else's success does not hurt you.

Of course it does. The only thing I've agreed with BriPat on in the last several pages is that when parasites (like top execs) take exorbitant sums of money out of the system, there's less available to pay the productive members.

 

[PMZ]

One thing that you can count on. No progress on curbing executive compensation abuse with Republicans in office.

Executive compensation abuse.



Executive compensation is sanctioned and contractually approved by the shareholders.



Someone else's success does not hurt you.

Not their success. Success isn't an issue. The issue is the tax loophole that companies paid to get created so they could cheat the system. US needs to get rid of the tax loopholes, then we can debate how much their success is worth when companies actually have to pay taxes on their payroll.

Corporate taxes are based on earnings. Earnings = income - expenses. Everyone's salary is an expense and therefore not taxed.

Where nefariousness comes in are stock options because the are taxed to the receiver, not the corporation, as capital gains.

It's always easier to get rich from wealth than from work.

 

[OODA_Loop]

One thing that you can count on. No progress on curbing executive compensation abuse with Republicans in office.

Executive compensation abuse.

Executive compensation is sanctioned and contractually approved by the shareholders.

Someone else's success does not hurt you.

Of course it does. The only thing I've agreed with BriPat on in the last several pages is that when parasites (like top execs) take exorbitant sums of money out of the system, there's less available to pay the productive members.

The beauty is you have the ability to market yourself at whatever level of remuneration you deem appropriate.

Demonstrated production is certainly a great way to increase your value.

The CEO can make all he wants. The more the better.

The CEO has spots under him/her and down the line.

All opportunity.

 

[PMZ]

Executive compensation abuse.

Executive compensation is sanctioned and contractually approved by the shareholders.

Someone else's success does not hurt you.

Of course it does. The only thing I've agreed with BriPat on in the last several pages is that when parasites (like top execs) take exorbitant sums of money out of the system, there's less available to pay the productive members.

The beauty is you have the ability to market yourself at whatever level of remuneration you deem appropriate.

Demonstrated production is certainly a great way to increase your value.

The CEO can make all he wants. The more the better.

The CEO has spots under him/her and down the line.

All opportunity.

"The more the better."

This is the kind of non thinking that allowed the problem to get traction in the first place.

Shouldn't we all get paid the more the better?

How about if we get paid according to the value that we add.

Whatever, the same rules ought to be applied to every employee.

 

[OODA_Loop]

How about if we get paid according to the value that we add.

Exactly as my post alludes to increasing your value.

 

[ShawnChris13]

Executive compensation abuse.



Executive compensation is sanctioned and contractually approved by the shareholders.



Someone else's success does not hurt you.

Not their success. Success isn't an issue. The issue is the tax loophole that companies paid to get created so they could cheat the system. US needs to get rid of the tax loopholes, then we can debate how much their success is worth when companies actually have to pay taxes on their payroll.

Corporate taxes are based on earnings. Earnings = income - expenses. Everyone's salary is an expense and therefore not taxed.

Where nefariousness comes in are stock options because the are taxed to the receiver, not the corporation, as capital gains.

It's always easier to get rich from wealth than from work.

When I get paid my taxes are taken out immediately because I'm paid as an employee. There shouldn't be a way to pay employees otherwise. Instead of writing some tax free check corporations should have to look at those taxes paid for every employee, instead of these loopholes they had hidden in the system.

 

[PMZ]

How about if we get paid according to the value that we add.

Exactly as my post alludes to increasing your value.

Why do you think that executives add several hundred times the value of workers who actually make the product or people who directly serve the customer, who's the sole judge of value?

 

[bripat9643]

They set their own compensation packages you friggen moron. It's as far from a meritocracy as it gets.

The exchange is purely voluntary. If it wasn't, it would be illegal, you friggen moron.

Whether the deserve what the receive is purely an existential question, not an ethical or legal question.

The transfer of money to government parasites, on the other hand, is conducted at gunpoint.

The 'purity' of this simpleminded ideology never ceases to amuse me. It'd be fun to measure the average IQ of it's proponents.

I realize you find logic mystifying. That's why you're a liberal.