Question for those who actually believe 'transgenderism' is a real thing?

[flacaltenn]

On the issue of transgenderism, leftists seem to deny some aspects of the science and enshrine others: the existence of sex chromosome abnormalities and other disorders of sexual development (DSDs) are seen as "proof" of multiple genders....despite the fact that most people who carry these abnormalities do not suffer from gender dysphoria (the DSM 5 diagnosis assigned to transgenderism).

Why do the leftists here completely ignore the fact that the vast majority of the people who have these abnormalities do not suffer from gender dysphoria and try to pretend as if the science is settled?

Also why do you guys lie and say Transgenderism a.k.a Gender Dysphoria is not in the DSM?

What benefit do you get from lying and denying scientific facts and statistics?

Because it's NOT just chromosome disorders. It's varying magnitudes of hormonal production, size or variance in genitalia, etc. It could be actually psychological as well as physical. There's a LOT to sort out before you can DECLARE a patient an actual candidate for transgender status.. From the Psych view of it ------


Diagnosis of Gender Dysphoria
By Dr Ananya Mandal, MD

Gender dysphoria is a condition where then person identifies himself or herself with the opposite of their original biological sex. This is not a mental disorder. However, some people may need therapy.

Diagnosis of gender dysphoria is thus important to rule out other concurrent or underlying mental disorders like anxiety, depression etc. (1)

A multidisciplinary team is required for diagnosis
Assessment of persons with gender dysphoria and diagnosis of the condition is a multidisciplinary action.

A detailed psychiatric history, psychosexual development and behavior history, neuropsychological testing and behavioral analysis may be needed.

The team may comprise of:

Psychiatrists
Psychologists
Neurologists
Endocrinologists (who specialize in hormonal functions)
Urologists (who specialize in the urinary tract and its abnormalities)
Behavioral and occupation therapists
Counsellors etc.
Gender dysphoria must be separated from homosexuality. Not all persons with gender dysphoria are homosexual. (1, 2)

Two phase diagnosis
Diagnosis may be a challenge since results of psychological testing may not be conclusive.

The International Harry Benjamin Gender Dysphoria Association lays down guidelines for a two phase diagnosis. (1)

Phase I – Diagnosis is based on the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual for Mental Disorders IV (Text Revision) or DSM – IV TR.
Phase II – Here the patient is assessed if he or she can live in the desired sex role permanently. This involves family information and counselling and name change. Hormonal therapy, gender re-assignation surgery and psychotherapy is administered as needed.

Ruling out other diagnosis
Differential diagnosis or other diagnosis that need to be ruled out during assessment of a suspected person with gender dysphoria include (1):–

Nonconformity to stereotypical sex role behaviors
Transvestic fetishism – The person may have a sexual fetish with cross dressing
Concurrent congenital intersex condition – The person may have ambiguous genitalia
Schizophrenia

So to GET to a clinical diagnosis as a TRUE Transexual candidate --- you must first rule out fetishes, simple behavioural issues, Schizoids, Depression, anxiety OR ACTUAL PHYSICAL birth conditions..

People with actual OBSERVABLE and MEASURABLE physical abnormalities have to have a medical team decide the feasibility of moving in EITHER direction. Improving the BORN condition -- or transitioning to the OPPOSITE condition.

Lots of moving parts. ALL of them SANE and somewhat scientific. No yelling and screaming required..

Yes, gender dysphoria, they changed the DSM diagnosis of GID (Gender Identity Disorder) because of pressure from extreme left wing groups because they didn't want them to be "stigmatized" with a mental illness, but it is a mental disease with one of the most prominent and common symptoms which is "delusion."

No they are not actually REQUIRED to see a licensed clinical psychiatrist. They only have to see a "gender specialist" and have been living as a woman for a couple/3 years. That is ALL that is required for them to be able to have surgery.

I'm sure there (in fact I KNOW) there are other treatments other than genital mutilation. These people were fine before the extreme leftist groups involved themselves. Just look at suicide rates before the 1950s and 1960s. That should clear up any "confusion" you have on this issue.

The doctor in the quote I gave above disagrees with you. I bolded it. The dysphoria diagnosis is not a mental illness. It's a declaration that there is a legitimate case for transsexual conversion. Either because because they have RULED OUT other mental conditions that are treated differently like anxiety, depression, multiple personality disorder OR the patient presents with actual PHYSICAL sexual ambiguities.

That's how you SORT legitimate transsexuals from cross-dressers, Rue Paul, or Bruce Jenner or the dweeb that just wants to get in the women's locker room.. We're not gonna depend on public opinion in EACH and EVERY case.. That's chaos and stupidity..

Ever seen pix of folks born with MEASURABLE sexual ambiguities?? Or have you led a sheltered life?

I don't see anything about "gender specialists" in your post.

Sexual ambiguities are completely different than your run of the mill transsexual who doesn't have any physical anomalies. Apples and oranges.

And if you notice, it all says "may." From what I've read, they can be referred right off to a gender specialist, and if they have a history of "cross dressing" or living as the opposite gender, then they can get their surgeries. And to give CHILDREN hormonal therapy based on this criteria is pretty BAD medicine.

As long as they have screened and diagnosed -- I'm fine with the declaration. Now the only other thing required to END this public brawl is a legal way of DECLARING their new sex orientiation once the Med specialists have signed off on it. TARGET doesn't get to decide who gets into the which changing rooms and bathrooms. The DOCTORS and the county CLERK that records your sex on PUBLIC RECORDS does. This Obama crap about self-declaration HAS to die. That's a fatally flawed plan for handling this.

Simple --- End of discussion. Show your ID if you're "carded" for access to a sex segregated facility. No one is harmed,.. Allow a sexual status to include M or F and a qualifier if you are "transitioning". Make the transitioning declaration subject to 2 or 5 year renewal and we're done. No need for another battle in the culture wars for 0.054% of the population..

 

[flacaltenn]

Except that they are referred to "gender specialists."

You didn't the read the link I provided. To RULE OUT other afflictions and assess any physical issues that they might have been born with -- A TEAM of both psych and med doctors MIGHT BE REQUIRED. Endocrine, Neurology, DNA, Urology, as well as psych specialists from a similar number of disciplines. This is NOT as easy as a "gender specialist" deciding to start hormone treatment or surgery on their own. It's a TEAM effort to figure out who are the TRUE transgender candidates.

And what about when it comes to kids? You think it is appropriate to give kids potentially dangerous hormonal therapy when it is a fact that 70-80% of them outgrow their gender confusion? Also there is the fact that just because they are not diagnosed, that doesn't mean it isn't related to some other problem.

I am still of the opinion that this type of gender confusion stems from some type of early childhood trauma.

I agree.. Except in cases where the med community determines there are sufficient CONGENITAL deficits to act on it that young. Any OTHER diagnosis that allows transitioning is child abuse..

 

[OffensivelyOpenMinded]

On the issue of transgenderism, leftists seem to deny some aspects of the science and enshrine others: the existence of sex chromosome abnormalities and other disorders of sexual development (DSDs) are seen as "proof" of multiple genders....despite the fact that most people who carry these abnormalities do not suffer from gender dysphoria (the DSM 5 diagnosis assigned to transgenderism).

Why do the leftists here completely ignore the fact that the vast majority of the people who have these abnormalities do not suffer from gender dysphoria and try to pretend as if the science is settled?

Also why do you guys lie and say Transgenderism a.k.a Gender Dysphoria is not in the DSM?

What benefit do you get from lying and denying scientific facts and statistics?

Because it's NOT just chromosome disorders. It's varying magnitudes of hormonal production, size or variance in genitalia, etc. It could be actually psychological as well as physical. There's a LOT to sort out before you can DECLARE a patient an actual candidate for transgender status.. From the Psych view of it ------


Diagnosis of Gender Dysphoria
By Dr Ananya Mandal, MD

Gender dysphoria is a condition where then person identifies himself or herself with the opposite of their original biological sex. This is not a mental disorder. However, some people may need therapy.

Diagnosis of gender dysphoria is thus important to rule out other concurrent or underlying mental disorders like anxiety, depression etc. (1)

A multidisciplinary team is required for diagnosis
Assessment of persons with gender dysphoria and diagnosis of the condition is a multidisciplinary action.

A detailed psychiatric history, psychosexual development and behavior history, neuropsychological testing and behavioral analysis may be needed.

The team may comprise of:

Psychiatrists
Psychologists
Neurologists
Endocrinologists (who specialize in hormonal functions)
Urologists (who specialize in the urinary tract and its abnormalities)
Behavioral and occupation therapists
Counsellors etc.
Gender dysphoria must be separated from homosexuality. Not all persons with gender dysphoria are homosexual. (1, 2)

Two phase diagnosis
Diagnosis may be a challenge since results of psychological testing may not be conclusive.

The International Harry Benjamin Gender Dysphoria Association lays down guidelines for a two phase diagnosis. (1)

Phase I – Diagnosis is based on the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual for Mental Disorders IV (Text Revision) or DSM – IV TR.
Phase II – Here the patient is assessed if he or she can live in the desired sex role permanently. This involves family information and counselling and name change. Hormonal therapy, gender re-assignation surgery and psychotherapy is administered as needed.

Ruling out other diagnosis
Differential diagnosis or other diagnosis that need to be ruled out during assessment of a suspected person with gender dysphoria include (1):–

Nonconformity to stereotypical sex role behaviors
Transvestic fetishism – The person may have a sexual fetish with cross dressing
Concurrent congenital intersex condition – The person may have ambiguous genitalia
Schizophrenia

So to GET to a clinical diagnosis as a TRUE Transexual candidate --- you must first rule out fetishes, simple behavioural issues, Schizoids, Depression, anxiety OR ACTUAL PHYSICAL birth conditions..

People with actual OBSERVABLE and MEASURABLE physical abnormalities have to have a medical team decide the feasibility of moving in EITHER direction. Improving the BORN condition -- or transitioning to the OPPOSITE condition.

Lots of moving parts. ALL of them SANE and somewhat scientific. No yelling and screaming required..

Yes, gender dysphoria, they changed the DSM diagnosis of GID (Gender Identity Disorder) because of pressure from extreme left wing groups because they didn't want them to be "stigmatized" with a mental illness, but it is a mental disease with one of the most prominent and common symptoms which is "delusion."

No they are not actually REQUIRED to see a licensed clinical psychiatrist. They only have to see a "gender specialist" and have been living as a woman for a couple/3 years. That is ALL that is required for them to be able to have surgery.

I'm sure there (in fact I KNOW) there are other treatments other than genital mutilation. These people were fine before the extreme leftist groups involved themselves. Just look at suicide rates before the 1950s and 1960s. That should clear up any "confusion" you have on this issue.

The doctor in the quote I gave above disagrees with you. I bolded it. The dysphoria diagnosis is not a mental illness. It's a declaration that there is a legitimate case for transsexual conversion. Either because because they have RULED OUT other mental conditions that are treated differently like anxiety, depression, multiple personality disorder OR the patient presents with actual PHYSICAL sexual ambiguities.

That's how you SORT legitimate transsexuals from cross-dressers, Rue Paul, or Bruce Jenner or the dweeb that just wants to get in the women's locker room.. We're not gonna depend on public opinion in EACH and EVERY case.. That's chaos and stupidity..

Ever seen pix of folks born with MEASURABLE sexual ambiguities?? Or have you led a sheltered life?

I don't see anything about "gender specialists" in your post.

Sexual ambiguities are completely different than your run of the mill transsexual who doesn't have any physical anomalies. Apples and oranges.

And if you notice, it all says "may." From what I've read, they can be referred right off to a gender specialist, and if they have a history of "cross dressing" or living as the opposite gender, then they can get their surgeries. And to give CHILDREN hormonal therapy based on this criteria is pretty BAD medicine.

The operations do not do ANYTHING to help them. The stats show this. Why in the hell when we know it doesn't help them in anyway, continue to practice this mutilation of delusional people?

By the way, how do these doctors figure out whether a 'transwoman' is really a "trans-dragon-woman "?

Transgender Woman Now Transitioning into a Dragon, by Katherine Timpf, National Review


FFs, I just am not buying into this shit. It doesn't pass the smell test. Eggheads tend to be so smart, they will believe and propagate really stupid shit just to look smarter.

This stuff is bullshit though. Sorry trannies and their fans, I can't roll with this madness.

 

[OffensivelyOpenMinded]

Sorry Chris...didn't mean to quote you.

 

[flacaltenn]

When YOU do the triage -- you find the LEGITIMATE transsexuals and transsexual candidates. That's what this entire scream fest is missing..

Who decides objectively that the patient is a "woman trapped in a man's body"? The patient or the doctor? And if it's a doctor, I'd like to get his licensing number. Nevermind why.. Well, OK, the fact that he failed human anatomy would be one of the reasons why..

EXACTLY why a very multi-disciplinary med team needs to do the assessments. You cannot form a legally protected class of any type where the membership is simply decided by "self-declaration".. That leads to chaos and doesn't protect the TRUE members of that class. That's why the whole nation is screeching at one another.

Fix the damn problem the RIGHT way.. The declaration should be a medical/legal process. and then NOBODY is whipping it out in the wrong segregated areas..

 

[ChrisL]

Except that they are referred to "gender specialists."

You didn't the read the link I provided. To RULE OUT other afflictions and assess any physical issues that they might have been born with -- A TEAM of both psych and med doctors MIGHT BE REQUIRED. Endocrine, Neurology, DNA, Urology, as well as psych specialists from a similar number of disciplines. This is NOT as easy as a "gender specialist" deciding to start hormone treatment or surgery on their own. It's a TEAM effort to figure out who are the TRUE transgender candidates.

And what about when it comes to kids? You think it is appropriate to give kids potentially dangerous hormonal therapy when it is a fact that 70-80% of them outgrow their gender confusion? Also there is the fact that just because they are not diagnosed, that doesn't mean it isn't related to some other problem.

I am still of the opinion that this type of gender confusion stems from some type of early childhood trauma.

I agree.. Except in cases where the med community determines there are sufficient CONGENITAL deficits to act on it that young. Any OTHER diagnosis that allows transitioning is child abuse..

Well, that's what they do. They allow children to begin HRT as young as 16, to stop and/or delay their puberty. IMO, this is a money making operation, like big pharma. Once they get these children confused enough, then they will agree to be mutilated under the surgeon's knife, and those operations are BIG money.

And what does it mean to "think like a girl" or to "think like a boy" anyways? And why are these people so obsessed with this? Just be a PERSON.

I imagine in the future (if this keeps going on) they will recommend children start hormones as soon as they are ready to start puberty.

Real life Dr. Frankenstein's is what they are to me!

 

[ChrisL]

I just have a hard time with the fact that they do permanent damage to an otherwise healthy body over what could very well be a mental disorder.

 

[OffensivelyOpenMinded]

I just have a hard time with the fact that they do permanent damage to an otherwise healthy body over what could very well be a mental disorder.

It's not right at all. These people need to be in therapy, not being used as a political tool. I swear Obama has no shame whatsoever, the Democratic Party has no shame.

The Republicans haven't been great either, but at least they don't promote this dumb fuckery.

 

[ChrisL]

I just have a hard time with the fact that they do permanent damage to an otherwise healthy body over what could very well be a mental disorder.

It's not right at all. These people need to be in therapy, not being used as a political tool. I swear Obama has no shame whatsoever, the Democratic Party has no shame.

The Republicans haven't been great either, but at least they don't promote this dumb fuckery.

I hate both parties!

 

[ChrisL]

On the issue of transgenderism, leftists seem to deny some aspects of the science and enshrine others: the existence of sex chromosome abnormalities and other disorders of sexual development (DSDs) are seen as "proof" of multiple genders....despite the fact that most people who carry these abnormalities do not suffer from gender dysphoria (the DSM 5 diagnosis assigned to transgenderism).

Why do the leftists here completely ignore the fact that the vast majority of the people who have these abnormalities do not suffer from gender dysphoria and try to pretend as if the science is settled?

Also why do you guys lie and say Transgenderism a.k.a Gender Dysphoria is not in the DSM?

What benefit do you get from lying and denying scientific facts and statistics?

Because it's NOT just chromosome disorders. It's varying magnitudes of hormonal production, size or variance in genitalia, etc. It could be actually psychological as well as physical. There's a LOT to sort out before you can DECLARE a patient an actual candidate for transgender status.. From the Psych view of it ------


Diagnosis of Gender Dysphoria
By Dr Ananya Mandal, MD

Gender dysphoria is a condition where then person identifies himself or herself with the opposite of their original biological sex. This is not a mental disorder. However, some people may need therapy.

Diagnosis of gender dysphoria is thus important to rule out other concurrent or underlying mental disorders like anxiety, depression etc. (1)

A multidisciplinary team is required for diagnosis
Assessment of persons with gender dysphoria and diagnosis of the condition is a multidisciplinary action.

A detailed psychiatric history, psychosexual development and behavior history, neuropsychological testing and behavioral analysis may be needed.

The team may comprise of:

Psychiatrists
Psychologists
Neurologists
Endocrinologists (who specialize in hormonal functions)
Urologists (who specialize in the urinary tract and its abnormalities)
Behavioral and occupation therapists
Counsellors etc.
Gender dysphoria must be separated from homosexuality. Not all persons with gender dysphoria are homosexual. (1, 2)

Two phase diagnosis
Diagnosis may be a challenge since results of psychological testing may not be conclusive.

The International Harry Benjamin Gender Dysphoria Association lays down guidelines for a two phase diagnosis. (1)

Phase I – Diagnosis is based on the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual for Mental Disorders IV (Text Revision) or DSM – IV TR.
Phase II – Here the patient is assessed if he or she can live in the desired sex role permanently. This involves family information and counselling and name change. Hormonal therapy, gender re-assignation surgery and psychotherapy is administered as needed.

Ruling out other diagnosis
Differential diagnosis or other diagnosis that need to be ruled out during assessment of a suspected person with gender dysphoria include (1):–

Nonconformity to stereotypical sex role behaviors
Transvestic fetishism – The person may have a sexual fetish with cross dressing
Concurrent congenital intersex condition – The person may have ambiguous genitalia
Schizophrenia

So to GET to a clinical diagnosis as a TRUE Transexual candidate --- you must first rule out fetishes, simple behavioural issues, Schizoids, Depression, anxiety OR ACTUAL PHYSICAL birth conditions..

People with actual OBSERVABLE and MEASURABLE physical abnormalities have to have a medical team decide the feasibility of moving in EITHER direction. Improving the BORN condition -- or transitioning to the OPPOSITE condition.

Lots of moving parts. ALL of them SANE and somewhat scientific. No yelling and screaming required..

Yes, gender dysphoria, they changed the DSM diagnosis of GID (Gender Identity Disorder) because of pressure from extreme left wing groups because they didn't want them to be "stigmatized" with a mental illness, but it is a mental disease with one of the most prominent and common symptoms which is "delusion."

No they are not actually REQUIRED to see a licensed clinical psychiatrist. They only have to see a "gender specialist" and have been living as a woman for a couple/3 years. That is ALL that is required for them to be able to have surgery.

I'm sure there (in fact I KNOW) there are other treatments other than genital mutilation. These people were fine before the extreme leftist groups involved themselves. Just look at suicide rates before the 1950s and 1960s. That should clear up any "confusion" you have on this issue.

The doctor in the quote I gave above disagrees with you. I bolded it. The dysphoria diagnosis is not a mental illness. It's a declaration that there is a legitimate case for transsexual conversion. Either because because they have RULED OUT other mental conditions that are treated differently like anxiety, depression, multiple personality disorder OR the patient presents with actual PHYSICAL sexual ambiguities.

That's how you SORT legitimate transsexuals from cross-dressers, Rue Paul, or Bruce Jenner or the dweeb that just wants to get in the women's locker room.. We're not gonna depend on public opinion in EACH and EVERY case.. That's chaos and stupidity..

Ever seen pix of folks born with MEASURABLE sexual ambiguities?? Or have you led a sheltered life?

I don't see anything about "gender specialists" in your post.

Sexual ambiguities are completely different than your run of the mill transsexual who doesn't have any physical anomalies. Apples and oranges.

And if you notice, it all says "may." From what I've read, they can be referred right off to a gender specialist, and if they have a history of "cross dressing" or living as the opposite gender, then they can get their surgeries. And to give CHILDREN hormonal therapy based on this criteria is pretty BAD medicine.

As long as they have screened and diagnosed -- I'm fine with the declaration. Now the only other thing required to END this public brawl is a legal way of DECLARING their new sex orientiation once the Med specialists have signed off on it. TARGET doesn't get to decide who gets into the which changing rooms and bathrooms. The DOCTORS and the county CLERK that records your sex on PUBLIC RECORDS does. This Obama crap about self-declaration HAS to die. That's a fatally flawed plan for handling this.

Simple --- End of discussion. Show your ID if you're "carded" for access to a sex segregated facility. No one is harmed,.. Allow a sexual status to include M or F and a qualifier if you are "transitioning". Make the transitioning declaration subject to 2 or 5 year renewal and we're done. No need for another battle in the culture wars for 0.054% of the population..

It's not the "end of discussion." That is a less than satisfactory ending!

 

[Bob Blaylock]

As long as they have screened and diagnosed -- I'm fine with the declaration. Now the only other thing required to END this public brawl is a legal way of DECLARING their new sex orientiation once the Med specialists have signed off on it. TARGET doesn't get to decide who gets into the which changing rooms and bathrooms. The DOCTORS and the county CLERK that records your sex on PUBLIC RECORDS does. This Obama crap about self-declaration HAS to die. That's a fatally flawed plan for handling this.

Simple --- End of discussion. Show your ID if you're "carded" for access to a sex segregated facility. No one is harmed,.. Allow a sexual status to include M or F and a qualifier if you are "transitioning". Make the transitioning declaration subject to 2 or 5 year renewal and we're done. No need for another battle in the culture wars for 0.054% of the population..

That solves nothing.

The fact remains that a man who has a card, certified by any number of quacks, declaring him to be a “woman”, is still a man, and his presence in women's restrooms still constitutes sexual abuse of any women whose privacy he thus invades.

The only real solution ever will be to stop playing along with this madness and perversion, and recognize that a man is not, and never will be a woman, and will never have any legitimate business being in women's restrooms and similar facilities.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

I just have a hard time with the fact that they do permanent damage to an otherwise healthy body over what could very well be absolutely is entirely a mental disorder.

Fixed it for you.

 

[ChrisL]

Oh, so Mr. Flacaltenn calls "end of discussion" and that is the end of the discussion.

 

[OffensivelyOpenMinded]

I just have a hard time with the fact that they do permanent damage to an otherwise healthy body over what could very well be a mental disorder.

It's not right at all. These people need to be in therapy, not being used as a political tool. I swear Obama has no shame whatsoever, the Democratic Party has no shame.

The Republicans haven't been great either, but at least they don't promote this dumb fuckery.

I hate both parties!

Yeah they both have screwed up big time. That's why Trump is so popular. Anybody but a politician.

 

[ChrisL]

I just have a hard time with the fact that they do permanent damage to an otherwise healthy body over what could very well be a mental disorder.

It's not right at all. These people need to be in therapy, not being used as a political tool. I swear Obama has no shame whatsoever, the Democratic Party has no shame.

The Republicans haven't been great either, but at least they don't promote this dumb fuckery.

I hate both parties!

Yeah they both have screwed up big time. That's why Trump is so popular. Anybody but a politician.

I don't like him either. He's slimy.

 

[OffensivelyOpenMinded]

I just have a hard time with the fact that they do permanent damage to an otherwise healthy body over what could very well be a mental disorder.

It's not right at all. These people need to be in therapy, not being used as a political tool. I swear Obama has no shame whatsoever, the Democratic Party has no shame.

The Republicans haven't been great either, but at least they don't promote this dumb fuckery.

I hate both parties!

Yeah they both have screwed up big time. That's why Trump is so popular. Anybody but a politician.

I don't like him either. He's slimy.

Yeah well, so is all the politicians. I guess only slimy people get into political office.

 

[flacaltenn]

Except that they are referred to "gender specialists."

You didn't the read the link I provided. To RULE OUT other afflictions and assess any physical issues that they might have been born with -- A TEAM of both psych and med doctors MIGHT BE REQUIRED. Endocrine, Neurology, DNA, Urology, as well as psych specialists from a similar number of disciplines. This is NOT as easy as a "gender specialist" deciding to start hormone treatment or surgery on their own. It's a TEAM effort to figure out who are the TRUE transgender candidates.

And what about when it comes to kids? You think it is appropriate to give kids potentially dangerous hormonal therapy when it is a fact that 70-80% of them outgrow their gender confusion? Also there is the fact that just because they are not diagnosed, that doesn't mean it isn't related to some other problem.

I am still of the opinion that this type of gender confusion stems from some type of early childhood trauma.

I agree.. Except in cases where the med community determines there are sufficient CONGENITAL deficits to act on it that young. Any OTHER diagnosis that allows transitioning is child abuse..

Well, that's what they do. They allow children to begin HRT as young as 16, to stop and/or delay their puberty. IMO, this is a money making operation, like big pharma. Once they get these children confused enough, then they will agree to be mutilated under the surgeon's knife, and those operations are BIG money.

And what does it mean to "think like a girl" or to "think like a boy" anyways? And why are these people so obsessed with this? Just be a PERSON.

I imagine in the future (if this keeps going on) they will recommend children start hormones as soon as they are ready to start puberty.

Real life Dr. Frankenstein's is what they are to me!

I have a hard time in general with the psych community and their diagnostic methods anyways. So i'm not fond of putting them in charge of important societal issues. But in THIS case -- someone has to validate and wade thru the evidence for starting ANY person on a sexual transition. When they can MEASURE stuff and develop quantitative testing methods -- I'd be more inclined to empower their influence on public policies.

 

[Moonglow]

Except that they are referred to "gender specialists."

You didn't the read the link I provided. To RULE OUT other afflictions and assess any physical issues that they might have been born with -- A TEAM of both psych and med doctors MIGHT BE REQUIRED. Endocrine, Neurology, DNA, Urology, as well as psych specialists from a similar number of disciplines. This is NOT as easy as a "gender specialist" deciding to start hormone treatment or surgery on their own. It's a TEAM effort to figure out who are the TRUE transgender candidates.

And what about when it comes to kids? You think it is appropriate to give kids potentially dangerous hormonal therapy when it is a fact that 70-80% of them outgrow their gender confusion? Also there is the fact that just because they are not diagnosed, that doesn't mean it isn't related to some other problem.

I am still of the opinion that this type of gender confusion stems from some type of early childhood trauma.

I agree.. Except in cases where the med community determines there are sufficient CONGENITAL deficits to act on it that young. Any OTHER diagnosis that allows transitioning is child abuse..

Well, that's what they do. They allow children to begin HRT as young as 16, to stop and/or delay their puberty. IMO, this is a money making operation, like big pharma. Once they get these children confused enough, then they will agree to be mutilated under the surgeon's knife, and those operations are BIG money.

And what does it mean to "think like a girl" or to "think like a boy" anyways? And why are these people so obsessed with this? Just be a PERSON.

I imagine in the future (if this keeps going on) they will recommend children start hormones as soon as they are ready to start puberty.

Real life Dr. Frankenstein's is what they are to me!

I have a hard time in general with the psych community and their diagnostic methods anyways. So i'm not fond of putting them in charge of important societal issues. But in THIS case -- someone has to validate and wade thru the evidence for starting ANY person on a sexual transition. When they can MEASURE stuff and develop quantitative testing methods -- I'd be more inclined to empower their influence on public policies.

Should they use the pea pod biological experiment for answers?

 

[flacaltenn]

As long as they have screened and diagnosed -- I'm fine with the declaration. Now the only other thing required to END this public brawl is a legal way of DECLARING their new sex orientiation once the Med specialists have signed off on it. TARGET doesn't get to decide who gets into the which changing rooms and bathrooms. The DOCTORS and the county CLERK that records your sex on PUBLIC RECORDS does. This Obama crap about self-declaration HAS to die. That's a fatally flawed plan for handling this.

Simple --- End of discussion. Show your ID if you're "carded" for access to a sex segregated facility. No one is harmed,.. Allow a sexual status to include M or F and a qualifier if you are "transitioning". Make the transitioning declaration subject to 2 or 5 year renewal and we're done. No need for another battle in the culture wars for 0.054% of the population..

That solves nothing.

The fact remains that a man who has a card, certified by any number of quacks, declaring him to be a “woman”, is still a man, and his presence in women's restrooms still constitutes sexual abuse of any women whose privacy he thus invades.

The only real solution ever will be to stop playing along with this madness and perversion, and recognize that a man is not, and never will be a woman, and will never have any legitimate business being in women's restrooms and similar facilities.

Not necessarily true. TRUE transgendered folks who are COMMITTED to the process pretty much APPEAR to be their desired sex. And unless you get to groping each other -- you'd never ever figure it out.

A declaration by a medical TEAM --- not a quack. Assures the INTENTIONS of that person are fully considered, above board and not in any way a RISK to you or your family.

That IS the solution. Not the self-declaration nonsense that the Left and the Prez are promoting. .

 

[flacaltenn]

Oh, so Mr. Flacaltenn calls "end of discussion" and that is the end of the discussion.

Nope... The public is riled up. All the posturing and bickering will go on until some real problem fixers come in and DESIGN a solution to this issue. You are not gonna get any where with fear and loathing and bickering.

BUT

Feel free to continue to ignore the fact that regardless of whether these folk are either ABSOLUTELY mental or have a valid issue ---- It's the Medical community that's gonna determine that.. And it's the LEGAL declaration on the public record that matters in terms of what they sex they are.. (NOT the birth certificate -- which is where NC did screw with the Constitutional equal treatment)