Questions on Decriminalization/Legalization movement

[nodoginnafight]

Oh gee - someone is going to disagree with a pro-legalization position by saying, "you're too stoned to think straight."

What a crock.
Considering the list above and the fact that three out of our last four presidents admitted smoking pot and two out of the last four admitted to doing coke.

This whole "you can't think straight if you've ever smoked pot" line is just waaaay too stupid.

If you can't think of a better argument to defend your position, well .... your position blows.

 

[Katzndogz]

Considering what has happened to the presidency, that sort of proves the point. Did we have better presidents before they were pot users?

 

[KevinWestern]

Prohibition would never have happened had there not been anti-German hysteria at the time and targeting German-American brewers was done to prove just how American you really were. That is what happened. That was the game changer. A collusion of knuckleheads.

I refuse to perpetuate the notion that a suit somehow makes someone more upstanding. It impacts how we look at white collar crime as a whole.

Thanks for the interesting convo.

I still have problems with that (decriminalization) argument because it doesn't close the black market door. You’re comparing the thugs at the top with the thugs at the bottom, and although you make valid points I’d like to ask you – have you ever heard of a Miller lite dealer gunning down a row of kids in a driveby? Ever you ever heard of the CEO of Budweiser ordering his minions to cut off the heads of competitors and lay them on the streets to intimidate the competition? Does Jack Daniels hire armies of underage kids, arm them with guns, and tell them to go push the whiskey on the streets to other kids?

You assert they’re they same, but I don’t agree. Is big business in bed with the gov't/corrupt in US? Sure. But at least they don't rule with a machine gun.

The entire MJ supply-chain network right now is lawless, ruthless, violent, and has no regard if a ten year old buys it vs. a fifty year old. They can care less if they use a potentially toxic pesticide on their crops because there’s absolutely no regulatory agency telling them they can’t. They won't get fined by the FDA. I push for legalization partly because I think that it’s a good thing to get rid of this violence, it’s a good thing to make sure the MAJORITY of dealers check IDs, it’s a good thing if the government made sure all crops were grown in a healthy manner, etc.

You get my point?

 

[Pogo]

Considering what has happened to the presidency, that sort of proves the point. Did we have better presidents before they were pot users?

Uh - there weren't any before that.
If you mean 'before there were pot users in the office of POTUS', the first one would be Washington. If you mean 'before humans smoked pot', you're going back about seven thousand years.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Considering what has happened to the presidency, that sort of proves the point. Did we have better presidents before they were pot users?

how far do you want to go back?....lets see....George Washington,Thomas Jefferson, James Madison,James Monroe,Andrew Jackson,Zachary Taylor,Franklin Pierce,some say even Abraham Lincoln partaked once in a while....John Kennedy was supposed to have used it when his back was hurting bad.....

 

[nodoginnafight]

Considering what has happened to the presidency, that sort of proves the point. Did we have better presidents before they were pot users?

Not sure ... and I'm not sure how many previous presidents smoked some pot.

But it's hard to argue that pot smokers are incapable of success, because they might not have been on my list of great presidents, but pot did not keep them from rising to the very top of their profession.

 

[BlindBoo]

I hardly ever drink. Like I said before - I'm very health conscious. I realize alcohol may be worse then pot when abused and alcohol abuse is a problem. I don't think prohibition of alcohol would effectively deal with the problem. The problem with pot is that the potential for abuse is greater and even in moderation it is bad for you.

Except that is blatantly false and nothing that you have brought to the table has shown that to be even remotely true.

the very concept is asinine. MJ cannot kill you period. MJ is not physically addictive, period. Alcohol is both. It is also the only substance that I am aware of that can KILL YOU FOR QUITTING!

What bullshit. Pot kills. There is driving impaired..... a doctor operating stoned.... cancer ( or did you forget it is a carcinogen) ...... just plain stoned violence. ... ti say pot doesn't kill is a huge fucking lie

tapatalk post

I feel like you're in a time warp.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkB1Yi5OSYA]1970s Anti-Marijuana Commercial - YouTube[/ame]


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_mC6EZ8Jpk]Magician Selling Drugs To Kids - 1970's Anti-Drug PSA - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Disir]

Prohibition would never have happened had there not been anti-German hysteria at the time and targeting German-American brewers was done to prove just how American you really were. That is what happened. That was the game changer. A collusion of knuckleheads.

I refuse to perpetuate the notion that a suit somehow makes someone more upstanding. It impacts how we look at white collar crime as a whole.

Thanks for the interesting convo.

I still have problems with that (decriminalization) argument because it doesn't close the black market door. You’re comparing the thugs at the top with the thugs at the bottom, and although you make valid points I’d like to ask you – have you ever heard of a Miller lite dealer gunning down a row of kids in a driveby? Ever you ever heard of the CEO of Budweiser ordering his minions to cut off the heads of competitors and lay them on the streets to intimidate the competition? Does Jack Daniels hire armies of underage kids, arm them with guns, and tell them to go push the whiskey on the streets to other kids?

You assert they’re they same, but I don’t agree.

The entire MJ supply-chain network right now is lawless, ruthless, violent, and has no regard if a ten year old buys it vs. a fifty year old. They can care less if they use a potentially toxic pesticide on their crops because there’s absolutely no regulatory agency telling them they can’t. They won't get fined by the FDA. I push for legalization partly because I think that it’s a good thing to get rid of this violence, it’s a good thing to make sure the MAJORITY of dealers check IDs, it’s a good thing if the government made sure all crops were grown in a healthy manner, etc.

You get my point?

Banks Financing Mexico Gangs Admitted in Wells Fargo Deal - Bloomberg

HSBC, accused of financial dealings linked to terrorists and drug cartels, heads to Senate subcommittee - latimes.com

How a big US bank laundered billions from Mexico's murderous drug gangs | World news | The Observer

International banks have aided Mexican drug gangs - Los Angeles Times

^^^^Those guys wear suits.


The Pueblo Chieftain | Street dealer: High taxes will send weed users

 

[Katzndogz]

Considering what has happened to the presidency, that sort of proves the point. Did we have better presidents before they were pot users?

Not sure ... and I'm not sure how many previous presidents smoked some pot.

But it's hard to argue that pot smokers are incapable of success, because they might not have been on my list of great presidents, but pot did not keep them from rising to the very top of their profession.

As the people become less intelligent and informed possibly because of a reliance on drugs you will see many more incompetents rise. How many people know who their senators are? Who is the vice president? Vote for obama he's black. That is what gets through the fog.

The user with impaired judgment and reduced decision making ability will eventually be at the mercy of the unimpaired. Especially marijuana that causes a cumulative effect of loss of brain function. Even a drug user like Jerry Brown knows how legalization will end.

 

[nodoginnafight]

Considering what has happened to the presidency, that sort of proves the point. Did we have better presidents before they were pot users?

Not sure ... and I'm not sure how many previous presidents smoked some pot.

But it's hard to argue that pot smokers are incapable of success, because they might not have been on my list of great presidents, but pot did not keep them from rising to the very top of their profession.

As the people become less intelligent and informed possibly because of a reliance on drugs you will see many more incompetents rise. How many people know who their senators are? Who is the vice president? Vote for obama he's black. That is what gets through the fog.

The user with impaired judgment and reduced decision making ability will eventually be at the mercy of the unimpaired. Especially marijuana that causes a cumulative effect of loss of brain function. Even a drug user like Jerry Brown knows how legalization will end.

Even though we've demonstrated how many high achievers past and present have been so very successful, you get revert to your default setting.

OK, fine. You aren't interested facts, logic, statistics, or studies .... you just wanna keep regurgitating your bumper-sticker.

I propose that as we review our nation's policy - we ignore stuff that adds nothing, makes no attempt to document, and relies on an agreement between everyone else to do the same.

 

[Rocko]

also a lot of overwhelming evidence that it is made out to be much worse than it is.....and quit being a hypocrite Rock.....Alcohol is much worse and yet you have no problems with that and the damage it has done......is the reason because you do some drinking once in a while?....

I hardly ever drink. Like I said before - I'm very health conscious. I realize alcohol may be worse then pot when abused and alcohol abuse is a problem. I don't think prohibition of alcohol would effectively deal with the problem. The problem with pot is that the potential for abuse is greater and even in moderation it is bad for you.

Except that is blatantly false and nothing that you have brought to the table has shown that to be even remotely true.

the very concept is asinine. MJ cannot kill you period. MJ is not physically addictive, period. Alcohol is both. It is also the only substance that I am aware of that can KILL YOU FOR QUITTING!

The affects of alcohol are more harmful to most people who abuse alcohol, however if you smoke pot, you have a greater likelihood of being a pothead than the likelihood of an alcohol drinker becoming an alcoholic. It doesn't matter if you don't get withdrawal from quiting pot (there is some evidence that people do btw), it's just as addictive as any narcotic.

 

[Pogo]

I hardly ever drink. Like I said before - I'm very health conscious. I realize alcohol may be worse then pot when abused and alcohol abuse is a problem. I don't think prohibition of alcohol would effectively deal with the problem. The problem with pot is that the potential for abuse is greater and even in moderation it is bad for you.

Except that is blatantly false and nothing that you have brought to the table has shown that to be even remotely true.

the very concept is asinine. MJ cannot kill you period. MJ is not physically addictive, period. Alcohol is both. It is also the only substance that I am aware of that can KILL YOU FOR QUITTING!

The affects of alcohol are more harmful to most people who abuse alcohol, however if you smoke pot, you have a greater likelihood of being a pothead than the likelihood of an alcohol drinker becoming an alcoholic. It doesn't matter if you don't get withdrawal from quiting pot (there is some evidence that people do btw), it's just as addictive as any narcotic.

No it's not, you're full of bullshit.

I know that's not erudite reasoning but it's the same level you're posting on so maybe it will sink in.

 

[KevinWestern]

Banks Financing Mexico Gangs Admitted in Wells Fargo Deal - Bloomberg

HSBC, accused of financial dealings linked to terrorists and drug cartels, heads to Senate subcommittee - latimes.com

How a big US bank laundered billions from Mexico's murderous drug gangs | World news | The Observer

International banks have aided Mexican drug gangs - Los Angeles Times

^^^^Those guys wear suits.


The Pueblo Chieftain | Street dealer: High taxes will send weed users

I'm well aware of major bank dealings w/ drug dealers. But my question was does Budweiser (or whatever major alcohol producer) hire twelve year olds with guns, or cut off the heads of rivals, etc?

The point being, does the legal alcohol business generate the same levels of VIOLENCE in the US as the illegal drug trade?

.

 

[Rocko]

Except that is blatantly false and nothing that you have brought to the table has shown that to be even remotely true.

the very concept is asinine. MJ cannot kill you period. MJ is not physically addictive, period. Alcohol is both. It is also the only substance that I am aware of that can KILL YOU FOR QUITTING!

The affects of alcohol are more harmful to most people who abuse alcohol, however if you smoke pot, you have a greater likelihood of being a pothead than the likelihood of an alcohol drinker becoming an alcoholic. It doesn't matter if you don't get withdrawal from quiting pot (there is some evidence that people do btw), it's just as addictive as any narcotic.

No it's not, you're full of bullshit.

I know that's not erudite reasoning but it's the same level you're posting on so maybe it will sink in.

Okay sparky

Consuming a great amount of alcohol to get drunk requires effort, whereas smoking pot to get high doesn't require much effort at all. Would you agree with that assessment?

 

[Harry Dresden]

Considering what has happened to the presidency, that sort of proves the point. Did we have better presidents before they were pot users?

Not sure ... and I'm not sure how many previous presidents smoked some pot.

But it's hard to argue that pot smokers are incapable of success, because they might not have been on my list of great presidents, but pot did not keep them from rising to the very top of their profession.

As the people become less intelligent and informed possibly because of a reliance on drugs you will see many more incompetents rise. How many people know who their senators are? Who is the vice president? Vote for obama he's black. That is what gets through the fog.

The user with impaired judgment and reduced decision making ability will eventually be at the mercy of the unimpaired. Especially marijuana that causes a cumulative effect of loss of brain function. Even a drug user like Jerry Brown knows how legalization will end.

yea thats what it is....everyone is doing drugs except you....right Katz?...

 

[Harry Dresden]

I hardly ever drink. Like I said before - I'm very health conscious. I realize alcohol may be worse then pot when abused and alcohol abuse is a problem. I don't think prohibition of alcohol would effectively deal with the problem. The problem with pot is that the potential for abuse is greater and even in moderation it is bad for you.

Except that is blatantly false and nothing that you have brought to the table has shown that to be even remotely true.

the very concept is asinine. MJ cannot kill you period. MJ is not physically addictive, period. Alcohol is both. It is also the only substance that I am aware of that can KILL YOU FOR QUITTING!

The affects of alcohol are more harmful to most people who abuse alcohol, however if you smoke pot, you have a greater likelihood of being a pothead than the likelihood of an alcohol drinker becoming an alcoholic. It doesn't matter if you don't get withdrawal from quiting pot (there is some evidence that people do btw), it's just as addictive as any narcotic.

and yet you never post anything backing that up.....i wonder why?....

 

[Harry Dresden]

The affects of alcohol are more harmful to most people who abuse alcohol, however if you smoke pot, you have a greater likelihood of being a pothead than the likelihood of an alcohol drinker becoming an alcoholic. It doesn't matter if you don't get withdrawal from quiting pot (there is some evidence that people do btw), it's just as addictive as any narcotic.

No it's not, you're full of bullshit.

I know that's not erudite reasoning but it's the same level you're posting on so maybe it will sink in.

Okay sparky

Consuming a great amount of alcohol to get drunk requires effort, whereas smoking pot to get high doesn't require much effort at all. Would you agree with that assessment?

yea the guy sitting there watching the Lakers with a 6 pack is really putting forth a great effort to get drunk.....Rock you know absolutely nothing about the Pot world.....why dont you go get Katz and Thantos and you guys go rent "Reefer Madness".....im sure you 3 will think its the most factual documentary ever produced......

 

[QuickHitCurepon]

1) Marijuana is not addictive.

2) You replace the current policy with nothing, let the states and the free market work things out, like they did when alcohol prohibition was ended.

3) You don not address any health issues with more government, which itself is the problem to begin with.

Amerijuana is rushin' on it. Let's get high.

 

[QuickHitCurepon]

Addiction is as it does.

 

[Rocko]

No it's not, you're full of bullshit.

I know that's not erudite reasoning but it's the same level you're posting on so maybe it will sink in.

Okay sparky

Consuming a great amount of alcohol to get drunk requires effort, whereas smoking pot to get high doesn't require much effort at all. Would you agree with that assessment?

yea the guy sitting there watching the Lakers with a 6 pack is really putting forth a great effort to get drunk.....Rock you know absolutely nothing about the Pot world.....why dont you go get Katz and Thantos and you guys go rent "Reefer Madness".....im sure you 3 will think its the most factual documentary ever produced......

What's harder to do for someone who isn't an experienced drinker or smoker, drink a six pack or smoke a joint or blunt?