Republicans taking Blame for Shutdown - Polls

[Plasmaball]

Where do the kooks get this "The Democrats never compromised" nonsense? The Democrats compromised on everything when the bill was written and voted on.

Remember kooks, we don't negotiate with hostage-takers, because that would just guarantee more hostage-taking. You want a law changed, check out this thing called "The Constitution" (remember that?) for the how to do it. That is, win enough elections so you can pass a new law. If you can't win enough elections, that's not our problem, and it doesn't give you justification for hostage-taking.

They understand winning elections, they can't seem to get the idea that ideas win elections, not bigotry and voter suppression. The GOP has a plan, one which leads not to governance by the people, rather governance by the Brother's Koch and their kind.

A vote for a Republican is a vote for a dystopian plutocracy. A society where only the few are allowed to vote, and the rule of law justifies such suppression.

Ideas win elections? Then Explain President Obama.

hope and change is an idea.
Now go play with your Playdoh, adult topics are too difficult for you.

 

[Nyvin]

Republicans passed a budget. Not our fault that the Democrats in the Senate and White House wont even consider a compromise.

And it's not exactly like this is going to hurt Republicans. I know that the conventional "wisdom" says that it will. But the last last big one still had Republicans Controlling Congress with more wins.

The dem spin machine and the corrupt media are desperately trying every trick and lie because deep down inside they know that a shutdown will hurt obama and the dems because the american people are smarter than the dems think they are.

They know who is causing this, they know that the dems are not allowed to admit that obamacare is a massive failure because its the only thing that barry has done.

We don't know if obamacare is a failure because it isn't even implemented yet.

And however much Obama has done as president is a heck of a lot more then Boehner has done as speaker, Pelosi passes 900-1200 bills when she's speaker and Boehner averages 326. Even Newt Gingrich did better then that.

 

[Faun]

Why does the GOP need to knuckle under to Obama and the Demcraps before negotiations even start? Who does Obama think he is, Vladimir Putin?

Because ACA has already been passed, verfied by the supreme court, and it's mandatory spending which will happen with or without a budget passed (CR passed). There is no point for it to be on the budget other than the fact the GOP has no other way to shut it down (or at least try to)

That isnt much of a reason. The House has the power of the purse, granted by the Constitution. They can use it. The Democrats could have stopped the Iraq War any time after 2006 by cutting off funding, even though the war had been authorized.
You are right that this is the way the GOP can shut down Obamacare. So they need to go for it. Because Obamacare is the biggest disaster this country has seen, economically. Worse than Smoot-Hawley.

What a pity you don't understand the Constitution. For had you, you would not have made such a ludicrous comment as the one I highlighted.

No, the House does not have the power of the purse. The Congress does. You're yet another imbecile who doesn't know the difference between "the House" and "the Congress."

Article I, Section. 8.

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

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[Redfish]

Republicans passed a budget. Not our fault that the Democrats in the Senate and White House wont even consider a compromise.

And it's not exactly like this is going to hurt Republicans. I know that the conventional "wisdom" says that it will. But the last last big one still had Republicans Controlling Congress with more wins.

The dem spin machine and the corrupt media are desperately trying every trick and lie because deep down inside they know that a shutdown will hurt obama and the dems because the american people are smarter than the dems think they are.

They know who is causing this, they know that the dems are not allowed to admit that obamacare is a massive failure because its the only thing that barry has done.

We don't know if obamacare is a failure because it isn't even implemented yet.

And however much Obama has done as president is a heck of a lot more then Boehner has done as speaker, Pelosi passes 900-1200 bills when she's speaker and Boehner averages 326. Even Newt Gingrich did better then that.

why does the country need 1200 new bills (laws) ? We would be better off with a congress that only passed one bill per year---------a budget.

 

[Redfish]

Because ACA has already been passed, verfied by the supreme court, and it's mandatory spending which will happen with or without a budget passed (CR passed). There is no point for it to be on the budget other than the fact the GOP has no other way to shut it down (or at least try to)

That isnt much of a reason. The House has the power of the purse, granted by the Constitution. They can use it. The Democrats could have stopped the Iraq War any time after 2006 by cutting off funding, even though the war had been authorized.
You are right that this is the way the GOP can shut down Obamacare. So they need to go for it. Because Obamacare is the biggest disaster this country has seen, economically. Worse than Smoot-Hawley.

What a pity you don't understand the Constitution. For had you, you would not have made such a ludicrous comment as the one I highlighted.

No, the House does not have the power of the purse. The Congress does. You're yet another imbecile who doesn't know the difference between "the House" and "the Congress."

Article I, Section. 8.

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

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funding bills start in the house, thats the point he was making

 

[antique4xpu]

Isn't Black Jimmy Obama the "leader" of the nation? He sure as shit is, and the fucking Libberhoids continue to suck his ass and blame Republicans....

Take some responsibility for once, assholes.

why are you dressed that way? ....... is your sheet dirty?

 

[Nyvin]

Republicans passed a budget. Not our fault that the Democrats in the Senate and White House wont even consider a compromise.

And it's not exactly like this is going to hurt Republicans. I know that the conventional "wisdom" says that it will. But the last last big one still had Republicans Controlling Congress with more wins.

The GOP "Compromise" basically comes down to

A. Do not implement ACA

or

B. Do not implement ACA

Can you understand why the Senate isn't interested in this "compromise"

 

[Faun]

good gawd-a-mighty, is there a liarberal here with a scintilla of brain power ?
the following link is exposing the truth behind this "shut down."

Budget showdown a test of wills as shutdown deadline comes into view | Fox News <------<<< click here

For the moment, the ball is in Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid's court. The House, early Sunday morning, approved a bill that would fund the government past Monday while delaying ObamaCare by a year. It would also repeal a widely unpopular medical device tax.

But Reid has outright stated he will not accept any measures that undermine the health care law as part of the budget bill. Reid spokesman Adam Jentleson said Sunday that Reid, as he vowed, will reject this bill.

so who is it that is NOT in a compromising mood ? sure as hell is NOT the Republicans

Riiiiight ... so if a thief put's a gun to your head and demands your wallet, YOU, and not the gun wielding thief, are to blame when he blows your head off because you didn't want to hand your wallet over?

 

[Stephanie]

I posted this earlier...
Editorial: Power To The People By Power Of The Purse -


SNIP:
BY: Publius

The Constitution in Article 1, section 1 states clearly “All legislative powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States,” What could be so confusing about that? It does not say a “Supreme Executive with plenipotentiary powers shall….” Or an “Overbearing Judiciary may from time to time…..

” A legislative body one house of which is directly elected by the citizenry every two years (sounds like term limits to me!) and the other which originally was elected by state legislatures (see progressive assault on freedom 17th amendment) but is now subject to popular vote every six years, has the responsibility to levy taxes, provide for the common defense and promote the general welfare.

The list of enumerated powers is defined and LIMITED. So, what’s the big deal? The libbies want you to believe we live in “Plato’s Republic” where direct democracy is the order of the day. But other than the fact that some are frolicking in “Plato’s Closet”, we live in a constitutional republic with elected representation.

And better yet, those representatives who are elected every two years by the citizens of the district in which they reside, hold the real power….”The Power of the Purse!” The branch most closely in tune with the wishes and desires of the populace is, by design. The House of Representatives.

That is the body solely responsible for originating taxation legislation. When Chief Justice Roberts in his ruling last year called the ObummerCare mandate a “tax”, I think he knew what he was doing…….Congress created this obamination legislatively, they can eliminate it the same way. Congress can repeal the tax increases imposed and refuse to fund the rest…..they can exercise “The Power of the Purse!”

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...people-by-power-of-the-purse.html#post7901129

 

[Faun]

you don't have to fund a law moron

see checks and balances

The system of checks and balances do not extend to existing laws. No single body of government should have so much power that they get to unilaterally decide which laws should be effectively terminated by defunding them.

In fact, your reference to "checks and balances" is being abrogated by the House in their attempt to defund a law because they don't like it. The reason we have a system of checks and balances is to prevent any one body of government from exercising too much power. Now you're defending one body which is attempting to do just that.

And I'm not saying the House can't wreck the economy by shutting down the economy. They absolutely can. I'm saying they shouldn't.

You're committing a logical fallacy called begging the question, which is just assuming the truth of your own position.

I'm asking how prior congresses can force current congresses to spend money. You're just saying they have to because they can.

What you're responding to is my response to someone who idiotically referred to the system of "checks and balances." Clearly demonstrating absolutely no clue what that even means since they seem to be under the delusion it means giving the House of Representatives absolute power over laws which require funding. It doesn't. It's actually a system designed to prevent that type of tyranny.

 

[Nyvin]

And better yet, those representatives who are elected every two years by the citizens of the district in which they reside, hold the real power&#8230;.&#8221;The Power of the Purse!&#8221; The branch most closely in tune with the wishes and desires of the populace is, by design. The House of Representatives.

After looking at how much congressional districts are artificially drawn to the liking of the state government in power at the time....I would say the House of Representatives is the LEAST closely in tune with the wishes and desires of the populace.

Type "Gerrymandering" into google and read about it for yourself.

 

[Stephanie]

Woodward: Shutdown and Ensuing Economic Crisis Will Be on 'Obama's Head'

[ame=http://youtu.be/tLY8OAW5ZzE]Woodward: Shutdown and Ensuing Economic Crisis Will Be on 'Obama's Head' - YouTube[/ame]



but you people KEEP making excuse for your thug in chief...

 

[mamooth]

"We won't be extorted now, we won't be extorted two weeks from now, we won't be extorted in December." -- Senator Chuck Schumer

The GOP panic is a palpable thing. They could only win if the Democrats caved, but the Democrats show no signs of blinking. In fact, the Democrats are kind of smiling a bit, as they watch the Republicans squirm. I wouldn't want to be John Boehner's liver right now.

 

[TemplarKormac]

And better yet, those representatives who are elected every two years by the citizens of the district in which they reside, hold the real power….”The Power of the Purse!” The branch most closely in tune with the wishes and desires of the populace is, by design. The House of Representatives.

After looking at how much congressional districts are artificially drawn to the liking of the state government in power at the time....I would say the House of Representatives is the LEAST closely in tune with the wishes and desires of the populace.

Type "Gerrymandering" into google and read about it for yourself.

So um.. forcing an insurance mandate on them is "closely in tune with the wishes of the populace"?

 

[Nyvin]

And better yet, those representatives who are elected every two years by the citizens of the district in which they reside, hold the real power….”The Power of the Purse!” The branch most closely in tune with the wishes and desires of the populace is, by design. The House of Representatives.

After looking at how much congressional districts are artificially drawn to the liking of the state government in power at the time....I would say the House of Representatives is the LEAST closely in tune with the wishes and desires of the populace.

Type "Gerrymandering" into google and read about it for yourself.

So um.. forcing an insurance mandate on them is "closely in tune with the wishes of the populace"?

Well, who got elected in 2012? Obama or Romney? (hint - Obama supported the mandate)

 

[Faun]

And Obamacare is not the personal agenda of Harry Reid and Barack Obama? Gettoutatown.

Like it or not, it's the law.

If this legislation is not enacted and we embark on a government shutdown, the consequences are severe: Our brave men and women of our military don't get paid; our recovering economy will take a huge hit, and our most vulnerable citizens - including the elderly and veterans who rely on critical government programs and services - could be left high and dry.

Obama stole billions from medicare to fund obozocare, medicare is the law and obama unilaterally defunded part of it. Where did he get that authority?

Obama stole nothing. He had the approval of the Congress to pass this law. So your infantile query of where Obama gets that authority is smashed like a bug on the windshield of the 18 wheeler as the fallacy you intended it to be.

Congress is not obligated to fund every bill passed by congress, there is something called the appropriation and authorization process. do a little study, you might not look so stupid.

Greaaaat ... yet another moron who doesn't know the difference between "the Congress" and "the House of Representatives."

Are there any Righties here who know U.S. civics??

 

[Faun]

That isnt much of a reason. The House has the power of the purse, granted by the Constitution. They can use it. The Democrats could have stopped the Iraq War any time after 2006 by cutting off funding, even though the war had been authorized.
You are right that this is the way the GOP can shut down Obamacare. So they need to go for it. Because Obamacare is the biggest disaster this country has seen, economically. Worse than Smoot-Hawley.

What a pity you don't understand the Constitution. For had you, you would not have made such a ludicrous comment as the one I highlighted.

No, the House does not have the power of the purse. The Congress does. You're yet another imbecile who doesn't know the difference between "the House" and "the Congress."

Article I, Section. 8.

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

more...
​

funding bills start in the house, thats the point he was making

Bullshit. You are too inept to redeem his point, which wasn't about where spending starts. That's clear by his comment, which only serves to highlight his ignorance of how our government works.

"The House has the power of the purse, granted by the Constitution." ~ Rabbi

That doesn't even imply what you suggested.

 

[Stephanie]

"We won't be extorted now, we won't be extorted two weeks from now, we won't be extorted in December." -- Senator Chuck Schumer

The GOP panic is a palpable thing. They could only win if the Democrats caved, but the Democrats show no signs of blinking. In fact, the Democrats are kind of smiling a bit, as they watch the Republicans squirm. I wouldn't want to be John Boehner's liver right now.

yeah thugs and assholes like Reid and most in the Democrat party are real heroes to their low life base...how the hell can WE THE PEOPLE extort those lowlifes........ out of OUR ( TAXPAYERS) money? WE have a RIGHT not to give these idiots anymore of OUR MONEY, just because they want it to fund some FASCIST GOVERNMENT program they put on us under your Dear thug Leader...

my gawd, the stupid and hostility from these elected asses you voted for, you people EAT IT UP

 

[Snookie]

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2013/images/09/11/rel8g.pdf

Question 13
If the federal government shuts down, do you
think that Barack Obama or the Republicans in Congress
would be more responsible for that?

Obama 33%
Republicans 51%
Both 12%
Neither 3%
No opinion 1%

CNN Poll: Who would get blamed for government shutdown? ? CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

If the government shuts down, the Republicans in Congress may take more of the blame: 44 percent of Americans say they would blame the Republicans in Congress more if there is a partial shutdown of the federal government on Oct. 1, while fewer - 35 percent - would put more of the blame on Barack Obama and the Democrats in Congress. Sixteen percent volunteer that they would blame both sides equally.

Poll Results - Bloomberg

Blame Democrats - 39%
Blame GOP - 45%

Every Poll I'm seeing places the blame on this retarded shutdown on the GOP...and rightfully so. Pushing your own personal agenda through a blackmail threat since you don't have the votes otherwise is truly evil.

This action to try to destroy a valid health care law will lose the republicans nearly all of the latino vote..

 

[The Rabbi]

How? The Great Recession and their efforts to delay recovery so they might have time to rewrite history and blame Obama for it which began in 2007. In fact such was not a bad idea, they convinced some of the dumber 'conservatives' that Obama was responsible for the Great Recession of 2007 -2009. Simply ask CrusaderFrank, Stephanie, Willow tree or the Rabbi.

You didnt answer the question.
The Great Recession is not the problem. That's long past. The Not-So-Great Recovery is the problem. Virtually every metric on the economy is worse today than when Obama took office: household income, household wealth, etc etc. The only ones making out are the very wealthy.
Obama's recovery is worse than Bush's recession.
The Dems had unlimited access to government for 2 years and passed many programs and bills. Obama's control of the executive branch has gone on for 5 years. The result is the worst economy since the Great Depression.

You can't lie your way through this. As you've been informed, whether you comprehend it or not, two of the leading indicators of the economy are GDP and unemployment; and both have improved over the last four years.

Unemployment has not improved. Unemployment is worse. Count the number of people who have left the workforce and the actual UE rate is over 10%. Add in factors like length of tiem unemployed etc and it is worse still. Segregate the data by race and blacks have had it worst of all.
Household income is down, household wealth is down. GDP growth is a paltry 2% and gets readjusted downward every quarter. This is in contrast to other recoveries where growth out of a recession was very high, over 5% sometimes.
The worst economic performance ever.