Salvation by the Blood of Jesus Christ and What that Really Means

[JimBowie1958]

JimBowie on Christianity replicates the story of the magician who wanted to buy the "Christian Magic" from the apostles.

lol, now I KNOW I am right, roflmao

 

[JimBowie1958]

JimBowie on Christianity replicates the story of the magician who wanted to buy the "Christian Magic" from the apostles.

I do not know who Jim Bowie is - I haven't read anything he has written before this thread to the best of my remembrance, Jake. On the matter of the one who wanted to buy the Holy Spirit, can you imagine the sheer arrogance and audacity of someone believing that they could do such a thing? That story really makes me wonder about some people, Jake. Although I have to tell you that Simon was a sorcerer. So his wickedness and need for attention was noted from the beginning.

Here is the story:

Now for some time a man named Simon had practiced sorcery in the city and amazed all the people of Samaria. He boasted that he was someone great and all the people, both high and low, gave him their attention and exclaimed, "This man is the divine power known as the Great Power. They followed him because he had amazed them for a long time with his magic.

But when they believed Philip as he preached the good news of the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women, Simon himself believed and was baptized. And he followed Philip everywhere, astonished by the great signs and miracles he saw.

When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that Samaria had accepted the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them. When they arrived, they prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, because the Holy Spirit had not yet come upon any of them, they had simply been baptised into the name of the Lord Jesus.

Then Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.

When Simon ( the one who had been called Simon the Sorcerer ) saw that the Spirit was given at the laying on of the apostles hands, he offered them money and said, Give me also this ability so that everyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit.

Peter answered, May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money! You have no part or share in this ministry because your heart is not right before God. Repent of this wickedeness and pray to the Lord. Perhaps he will forgive you for having such a thought in your heart. For I see that you are full of bitterness and captive to sin.

Then Simon answered, Pray to the Lord for me so that nothing you have said may happen to me.

When they had testified and proclaimed the word of the Lord, Peter and John returned to Jerusalem, preaching the gospel in many Samaritan villages.

- Acts 8: 9 - 25

Note that the problem with this Sorcerer who had believed was that his heart was not right within him. He was full of bitterness and captive to sin. This is the condition of all those who are involved in the art of sorcery, witchcraft, paganism.

They are full of bitterness and captive to sin.

Notice that when Simon learns he is in danger of the judgment of God over the matter that he quickly asks Peter to pray nothing Peter said will come upon him. Also notice that Peter doesn't pray for him.

Why?

Because Simon STILL has not repented of his sins. He makes no mention of being sorrowful for the bitterness in his heart, he makes no mention of his wretched condition - being captive to sin.. he makes no repentance and without repentance? There is no forgiveness for sin. Good job, Jake, on bringing up the story of the Sorcerer who wanted to buy the Holy Spirit - it is a powerful lesson for those who dare to even "think such a thing" in their own hearts. - Jeri

Well, it doesn't say Peter prayed or didn't pray.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

 

[AVG-JOE]

For one thing, All God's men and servant were created in His heavenly Kingdom and we'll remain in Heaven forever. This means no one is going to heaven after their flesh perishes. Since we're already invisible thoughts of God stored as wavelengths of energy, we have to be processed into a defined world in order to identify ourselves as a living being. Our brain is the processor of energy ( information ) that gives us the illusions we see, taste, smell and touch in this world.

Keep thinking that if it helps you sleep, CopperTop.

 

[AVG-JOE]

How can anybody be cleansed by the blood of Jesus without knowing what the blood of Jesus is metaphorical of?

What do you say "the blood of Jesus" means and how does it cleanse?

This belief came from false religious ideas going all the way back to Babylon, where religion and religious ideas got it's start. It came from God's plan called the beast, which is a plan to teach men how to build things starting with teaching men how to connect the stars to get building shapes. Then God had to teach them how to build those shapes with materials from the earth such as bricks, blocks and carved stone and all the other materials man uses for building things.

Horsefeathers.



According to Divine Law, life is in the blood. Life is also the promise for obedience to the Law.

It follows then, that the blood of Jesus is the way he conformed to the Divine commands that gave him the life promised for obedience to the Law. .

Flesh is teaching. Jesus taught that the law has deeper subjects hidden by metaphors not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used encapsulated by his command to eat his flesh, a direct reference to Kosher law..

Unless you eat his flesh, accept his teaching about the figurative nature of the Law, and drink his blood, conform to the law in the way that Jesus did you cannot have the eternal life promised for obedience to the law in you.

That's gross.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

JimBowie on Christianity replicates the story of the magician who wanted to buy the "Christian Magic" from the apostles.

I do not know who Jim Bowie is - I haven't read anything he has written before this thread to the best of my remembrance, Jake. On the matter of the one who wanted to buy the Holy Spirit, can you imagine the sheer arrogance and audacity of someone believing that they could do such a thing? That story really makes me wonder about some people, Jake. Although I have to tell you that Simon was a sorcerer. So his wickedness and need for attention was noted from the beginning.

Here is the story:

Now for some time a man named Simon had practiced sorcery in the city and amazed all the people of Samaria. He boasted that he was someone great and all the people, both high and low, gave him their attention and exclaimed, "This man is the divine power known as the Great Power. They followed him because he had amazed them for a long time with his magic.

But when they believed Philip as he preached the good news of the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women, Simon himself believed and was baptized. And he followed Philip everywhere, astonished by the great signs and miracles he saw.

When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that Samaria had accepted the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them. When they arrived, they prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, because the Holy Spirit had not yet come upon any of them, they had simply been baptised into the name of the Lord Jesus.

Then Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.

When Simon ( the one who had been called Simon the Sorcerer ) saw that the Spirit was given at the laying on of the apostles hands, he offered them money and said, Give me also this ability so that everyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit.

Peter answered, May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money! You have no part or share in this ministry because your heart is not right before God. Repent of this wickedeness and pray to the Lord. Perhaps he will forgive you for having such a thought in your heart. For I see that you are full of bitterness and captive to sin.

Then Simon answered, Pray to the Lord for me so that nothing you have said may happen to me.

When they had testified and proclaimed the word of the Lord, Peter and John returned to Jerusalem, preaching the gospel in many Samaritan villages.

- Acts 8: 9 - 25

Note that the problem with this Sorcerer who had believed was that his heart was not right within him. He was full of bitterness and captive to sin. This is the condition of all those who are involved in the art of sorcery, witchcraft, paganism.

They are full of bitterness and captive to sin.

Notice that when Simon learns he is in danger of the judgment of God over the matter that he quickly asks Peter to pray nothing Peter said will come upon him. Also notice that Peter doesn't pray for him.

Why?

Because Simon STILL has not repented of his sins. He makes no mention of being sorrowful for the bitterness in his heart, he makes no mention of his wretched condition - being captive to sin.. he makes no repentance and without repentance? There is no forgiveness for sin. Good job, Jake, on bringing up the story of the Sorcerer who wanted to buy the Holy Spirit - it is a powerful lesson for those who dare to even "think such a thing" in their own hearts. - Jeri

Well, it doesn't say Peter prayed or didn't pray.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

Actually in this matter his silence spoke volumes. Let me give the example - Peter walked as Jesus did in accordance to the Gospel. Jesus while hanging on the cross had two thieves hanging on either side of him. Both men were guilty. One man was pardoned and went to Paradise with Jesus that day ---------->located in same vicinity as hell - where they were later ascended to heaven with him after Jesus took the keys to "Hell AND DEATH" ..... the other one went to hell an unrepentant sinner. Why did Jesus reply to one thief and forgive him while not the other. Did not both thieves speak to him? Yes. One said, If you are the Son of God get me down off of this cross and out of my troubles here! ( he said get us off this cross only because he knew if he had any chance at all it was hinged on the other thief who he probably talked into joining him in the first place! )

There was no repentance or sorrow from the man.... only "get me out of my troubles that I brought down upon myself here"........ therein Jesus didn't respond to him. It was as if the man had not even spoken! The response was SILENCE.

Now the other thiefs response was quite different - in todays language it would have went something like this..........BE QUIET! We deserve this death but this man has done nothing wrong! He is innocent! Jesus! When you enter into YOUR KINGDOM will you remember me? Jesus said, Verily, verily I say unto you you shall be with me in Paradise this day.... Paradise being situated within viewing distance from hell where Death was located along side hell until Jesus took the keys and those with him in Paradise at the time of his own ascension. See how beautifully everything is answered when you just apply the Word of God to it? The sorcerer was not responded to because he had not repented. Instead he said, Get me out of my trouble here, Peter! Pray that none of these things come upon me!
Hey! Unrepented sin is unrepented sin and Peter never said, HE WOULD PRAY. HE TOLD SIMON - YOU PRAY! YOU BETTER PRAY FOR YOURSELF. GO TO JESUS AND PRAY FOR YOURSELF AND ASK HIM TO FORGIVE YOU AND MAYBE HE WILL HAVE PITY ON YOU. YOU PRAY SIMON. YOU PRAY. I'M NOT PRAYING FOR YOU. YOU PRAY FOR YOURSELF. GET IT???

It is written:
Peter answered, May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money! You have no part or share in this ministry because your heart is not right before God. Repent of this wickedeness and pray to the Lord. Perhaps he will forgive you for having such a thought in your heart. For I see that you are full of bitterness and captive to sin.

Then Simon answered, Pray to the Lord for me so that nothing you have said may happen to me.

When they had testified and proclaimed the word of the Lord, Peter and John returned to Jerusalem, preaching the gospel in many Samaritan villages.
_______________________

As you read the story again you will find I am right. Peter told him to pray for himself and Peter never changed his mind about that. He simply walked away as he was finished dealing with the man. - Jeri

p.s. People cannot fool the Holy Ghost. They can fool others. But not the Holy Ghost and not those who are filled with the Holy Ghost. They are striving against God, not men.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Jim, you will notice in my first response I didn't tell you that Peter had instructed Simon to pray for himself and ask the Lord to forgive him. The words were written right there in the story. Peter told him to pray for himself and repent to the Lord and maybe the Lord would have mercy upon him.

It wasn't until today the Lord led me back over here to read your thread - using AVG JOE as the bait - because I'm always interested in hearing what Joe has to say.. ( smile ) and therein found your reply stating you didn't believe we could know whether or not Peter ever prayed for him. Only then did the Holy Spirit give me the words to write to you on the truth of Peter having told Simon to pray for himself and repent. There is a time and a season for everything and that includes answers.

You see, Jim. Without repentance there is no forgiveness. Peter saw what was in Simons heart and if he had prayed for Simon to be healed he would have been in big trouble with God. A servant of God has to obey the LORD. Sometimes God will tell his servants, do not pray for that person. I am dealing with them. Or tell that person to repent. In other words, let them pray for themselves. Deliver the message and then go. That is what a servant does. They are like couriers, messengers, they just deliver the mail and then when they are all finished? They leave and go to the next place. - Jeri

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

JimBowie on Christianity replicates the story of the magician who wanted to buy the "Christian Magic" from the apostles.

The Lord showed me this morning that is not who Jim is at all. You have spoken wrongly about him, Jake. - Jeri

 

[AmericanFirst]

In this country, the US, you hear quite often that we all must be saved by the Name or Blood of Jesus Christ, and I whole heartedly believe that is true, but....


That is not the same as having faith or even knowledge of Jesus.



If we set up any rule of order, there are usually exceptions, and the salvation by faith in Christ rule is itself no exception. I know that there are exceptions because Abraham, Moses and King David were exceptions by way of faith and God's Promises at that time.

But when all is said and done, I believe that when King David enters Heaven it will/was by the cleansing power of the Blood of Christ, though David did not know Jesus as his Savior. King David and Moses and Enoch had simpler faith and concepts of God than the Trinity, and yet their faith was still held as credit to them.

Now in our post-Resurrection Age, God calls all men to Him through Jesus Christ, that is also True, but that message has been delivered through Jesus Christ and that in and of itself does not require anyone to have faith in Jesus personally. They could still worship God in their own light of understanding and receive full credit for that faith like Enoch did, though his concept of God was probably not much more than God = god of the sky/mountains, but who knows?

If we do good from a genuine heart of love and faith, if we genuinely do what we think is right, it is credited to us as faith in God, even if we are atheists who refuse to lie to themselves, though these are extremely rare kinds of atheists.

Another thing Jesus said was that if we knock on the door the door will be opened to the inquirer. That does not require me or you to butt into peoples lives and be rude 'for their own sake'. Living a life of service and love is more impactful than a million Chick Tracts.

So let us not presumptive about who is going where in the next life. Instead let us focus on what we can do to serve the poor and widowed in this life today.

How many of us who think of ourselves as firm Christians have not visited our won parents in years? How many of us give no charity (other than by extorted taxation)? How many of us have done so much as given a single hour of service to those around us who need us for more reasons than we likely realize?

I suspect more atheists will enter heaven than we think, and fewer 'Christians'.

John 14:6 Jesus answered, "I am the way, the truth, and the life, no man shall see the father but through me." Belief in Jesus as your savior is the only way into Heaven.

 

[BreezeWood]

In this country, the US, you hear quite often that we all must be saved by the Name or Blood of Jesus Christ, and I whole heartedly believe that is true, but....


That is not the same as having faith or even knowledge of Jesus.



If we set up any rule of order, there are usually exceptions, and the salvation by faith in Christ rule is itself no exception. I know that there are exceptions because Abraham, Moses and King David were exceptions by way of faith and God's Promises at that time.

But when all is said and done, I believe that when King David enters Heaven it will/was by the cleansing power of the Blood of Christ, though David did not know Jesus as his Savior. King David and Moses and Enoch had simpler faith and concepts of God than the Trinity, and yet their faith was still held as credit to them.

Now in our post-Resurrection Age, God calls all men to Him through Jesus Christ, that is also True, but that message has been delivered through Jesus Christ and that in and of itself does not require anyone to have faith in Jesus personally. They could still worship God in their own light of understanding and receive full credit for that faith like Enoch did, though his concept of God was probably not much more than God = god of the sky/mountains, but who knows?

If we do good from a genuine heart of love and faith, if we genuinely do what we think is right, it is credited to us as faith in God, even if we are atheists who refuse to lie to themselves, though these are extremely rare kinds of atheists.

Another thing Jesus said was that if we knock on the door the door will be opened to the inquirer. That does not require me or you to butt into peoples lives and be rude 'for their own sake'. Living a life of service and love is more impactful than a million Chick Tracts.

So let us not presumptive about who is going where in the next life. Instead let us focus on what we can do to serve the poor and widowed in this life today.

How many of us who think of ourselves as firm Christians have not visited our won parents in years? How many of us give no charity (other than by extorted taxation)? How many of us have done so much as given a single hour of service to those around us who need us for more reasons than we likely realize?

I suspect more atheists will enter heaven than we think, and fewer 'Christians'.

John 14:6 Jesus answered, "I am the way, the truth, and the life, no man shall see the father but through me." Belief in Jesus as your savior is the only way into Heaven.

... is the only way into Heaven.


the Everlasting is fine enough for me, the freed Spirit will find its own way.

.

 

[The Irish Ram]

In this country, the US, you hear quite often that we all must be saved by the Name or Blood of Jesus Christ, and I whole heartedly believe that is true, but....


That is not the same as having faith or even knowledge of Jesus.



If we set up any rule of order, there are usually exceptions, and the salvation by faith in Christ rule is itself no exception. I know that there are exceptions because Abraham, Moses and King David were exceptions by way of faith and God's Promises at that time.

But when all is said and done, I believe that when King David enters Heaven it will/was by the cleansing power of the Blood of Christ, though David did not know Jesus as his Savior. King David and Moses and Enoch had simpler faith and concepts of God than the Trinity, and yet their faith was still held as credit to them.

Now in our post-Resurrection Age, God calls all men to Him through Jesus Christ, that is also True, but that message has been delivered through Jesus Christ and that in and of itself does not require anyone to have faith in Jesus personally. They could still worship God in their own light of understanding and receive full credit for that faith like Enoch did, though his concept of God was probably not much more than God = god of the sky/mountains, but who knows?

If we do good from a genuine heart of love and faith, if we genuinely do what we think is right, it is credited to us as faith in God, even if we are atheists who refuse to lie to themselves, though these are extremely rare kinds of atheists.

Another thing Jesus said was that if we knock on the door the door will be opened to the inquirer. That does not require me or you to butt into peoples lives and be rude 'for their own sake'. Living a life of service and love is more impactful than a million Chick Tracts.

So let us not presumptive about who is going where in the next life. Instead let us focus on what we can do to serve the poor and widowed in this life today.

How many of us who think of ourselves as firm Christians have not visited our won parents in years? How many of us give no charity (other than by extorted taxation)? How many of us have done so much as given a single hour of service to those around us who need us for more reasons than we likely realize?

I suspect more atheists will enter heaven than we think, and fewer 'Christians'.

I don't think so Jim, The worst Christian under the blood of Christ is still under the blood of Christ. The best atheist and all his good works can't remove the penalty for all the not so good works. The Bible is pretty clear about who is going where and why. It isn't a presumption.

You can't work your way into Heaven. Removing your sin with pure blood is the only acceptable substitute for your transgressions. You can't sin and then stick ten bucks in a homeless man's pocket and call it even. We aren't graded on a curve.

No man goes to the Father without the gift of salvation Christ bought for us. He paid for it with His life. It was that important.
If we could work our way through sin, Christ's work on the cross wouldn't have been necessary. But it was, because our very best doesn't come close to meeting the sin free requirement of Heaven.
Redemption is a gift that only Jesus can offer.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I do not know who Jim Bowie is - I haven't read anything he has written before this thread to the best of my remembrance, Jake. On the matter of the one who wanted to buy the Holy Spirit, can you imagine the sheer arrogance and audacity of someone believing that they could do such a thing? That story really makes me wonder about some people, Jake. Although I have to tell you that Simon was a sorcerer. So his wickedness and need for attention was noted from the beginning.

Here is the story:

Now for some time a man named Simon had practiced sorcery in the city and amazed all the people of Samaria. He boasted that he was someone great and all the people, both high and low, gave him their attention and exclaimed, "This man is the divine power known as the Great Power. They followed him because he had amazed them for a long time with his magic.

But when they believed Philip as he preached the good news of the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women, Simon himself believed and was baptized. And he followed Philip everywhere, astonished by the great signs and miracles he saw.

When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that Samaria had accepted the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them. When they arrived, they prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, because the Holy Spirit had not yet come upon any of them, they had simply been baptised into the name of the Lord Jesus.

Then Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.

When Simon ( the one who had been called Simon the Sorcerer ) saw that the Spirit was given at the laying on of the apostles hands, he offered them money and said, Give me also this ability so that everyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit.

Peter answered, May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money! You have no part or share in this ministry because your heart is not right before God. Repent of this wickedeness and pray to the Lord. Perhaps he will forgive you for having such a thought in your heart. For I see that you are full of bitterness and captive to sin.

Then Simon answered, Pray to the Lord for me so that nothing you have said may happen to me.

When they had testified and proclaimed the word of the Lord, Peter and John returned to Jerusalem, preaching the gospel in many Samaritan villages.

- Acts 8: 9 - 25

Note that the problem with this Sorcerer who had believed was that his heart was not right within him. He was full of bitterness and captive to sin. This is the condition of all those who are involved in the art of sorcery, witchcraft, paganism.

They are full of bitterness and captive to sin.

Notice that when Simon learns he is in danger of the judgment of God over the matter that he quickly asks Peter to pray nothing Peter said will come upon him. Also notice that Peter doesn't pray for him.

Why?

Because Simon STILL has not repented of his sins. He makes no mention of being sorrowful for the bitterness in his heart, he makes no mention of his wretched condition - being captive to sin.. he makes no repentance and without repentance? There is no forgiveness for sin. Good job, Jake, on bringing up the story of the Sorcerer who wanted to buy the Holy Spirit - it is a powerful lesson for those who dare to even "think such a thing" in their own hearts. - Jeri

Well, it doesn't say Peter prayed or didn't pray.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

Actually in this matter his silence spoke volumes. Let me give the example - Peter walked as Jesus did in accordance to the Gospel. Jesus while hanging on the cross had two thieves hanging on either side of him. Both men were guilty. One man was pardoned and went to Paradise with Jesus that day ---------->located in same vicinity as hell - where they were later ascended to heaven with him after Jesus took the keys to "Hell AND DEATH" ..... the other one went to hell an unrepentant sinner. Why did Jesus reply to one thief and forgive him while not the other. Did not both thieves speak to him? Yes. One said, If you are the Son of God get me down off of this cross and out of my troubles here! ( he said get us off this cross only because he knew if he had any chance at all it was hinged on the other thief who he probably talked into joining him in the first place! )

There was no repentance or sorrow from the man.... only "get me out of my troubles that I brought down upon myself here"........ therein Jesus didn't respond to him. It was as if the man had not even spoken! The response was SILENCE.

Now the other thiefs response was quite different - in todays language it would have went something like this..........BE QUIET! We deserve this death but this man has done nothing wrong! He is innocent! Jesus! When you enter into YOUR KINGDOM will you remember me? Jesus said, Verily, verily I say unto you you shall be with me in Paradise this day.... Paradise being situated within viewing distance from hell where Death was located along side hell until Jesus took the keys and those with him in Paradise at the time of his own ascension. See how beautifully everything is answered when you just apply the Word of God to it? The sorcerer was not responded to because he had not repented. Instead he said, Get me out of my trouble here, Peter! Pray that none of these things come upon me!
Hey! Unrepented sin is unrepented sin and Peter never said, HE WOULD PRAY. HE TOLD SIMON - YOU PRAY! YOU BETTER PRAY FOR YOURSELF. GO TO JESUS AND PRAY FOR YOURSELF AND ASK HIM TO FORGIVE YOU AND MAYBE HE WILL HAVE PITY ON YOU. YOU PRAY SIMON. YOU PRAY. I'M NOT PRAYING FOR YOU. YOU PRAY FOR YOURSELF. GET IT???

It is written:
Peter answered, May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money! You have no part or share in this ministry because your heart is not right before God. Repent of this wickedeness and pray to the Lord. Perhaps he will forgive you for having such a thought in your heart. For I see that you are full of bitterness and captive to sin.

Then Simon answered, Pray to the Lord for me so that nothing you have said may happen to me.

When they had testified and proclaimed the word of the Lord, Peter and John returned to Jerusalem, preaching the gospel in many Samaritan villages.
_______________________

As you read the story again you will find I am right. Peter told him to pray for himself and Peter never changed his mind about that. He simply walked away as he was finished dealing with the man. - Jeri

p.s. People cannot fool the Holy Ghost. They can fool others. But not the Holy Ghost and not those who are filled with the Holy Ghost. They are striving against God, not men.

lol, point still stands; no comment is still no comment.

 

[JimBowie1958]

In this country, the US, you hear quite often that we all must be saved by the Name or Blood of Jesus Christ, and I whole heartedly believe that is true, but....


That is not the same as having faith or even knowledge of Jesus.



If we set up any rule of order, there are usually exceptions, and the salvation by faith in Christ rule is itself no exception. I know that there are exceptions because Abraham, Moses and King David were exceptions by way of faith and God's Promises at that time.

But when all is said and done, I believe that when King David enters Heaven it will/was by the cleansing power of the Blood of Christ, though David did not know Jesus as his Savior. King David and Moses and Enoch had simpler faith and concepts of God than the Trinity, and yet their faith was still held as credit to them.

Now in our post-Resurrection Age, God calls all men to Him through Jesus Christ, that is also True, but that message has been delivered through Jesus Christ and that in and of itself does not require anyone to have faith in Jesus personally. They could still worship God in their own light of understanding and receive full credit for that faith like Enoch did, though his concept of God was probably not much more than God = god of the sky/mountains, but who knows?

If we do good from a genuine heart of love and faith, if we genuinely do what we think is right, it is credited to us as faith in God, even if we are atheists who refuse to lie to themselves, though these are extremely rare kinds of atheists.

Another thing Jesus said was that if we knock on the door the door will be opened to the inquirer. That does not require me or you to butt into peoples lives and be rude 'for their own sake'. Living a life of service and love is more impactful than a million Chick Tracts.

So let us not presumptive about who is going where in the next life. Instead let us focus on what we can do to serve the poor and widowed in this life today.

How many of us who think of ourselves as firm Christians have not visited our won parents in years? How many of us give no charity (other than by extorted taxation)? How many of us have done so much as given a single hour of service to those around us who need us for more reasons than we likely realize?

I suspect more atheists will enter heaven than we think, and fewer 'Christians'.

John 14:6 Jesus answered, "I am the way, the truth, and the life, no man shall see the father but through me." Belief in Jesus as your savior is the only way into Heaven.

So did Enoch believe in Jesus?

 

[hobelim]

In this country, the US, you hear quite often that we all must be saved by the Name or Blood of Jesus Christ, and I whole heartedly believe that is true, but....


That is not the same as having faith or even knowledge of Jesus.



If we set up any rule of order, there are usually exceptions, and the salvation by faith in Christ rule is itself no exception. I know that there are exceptions because Abraham, Moses and King David were exceptions by way of faith and God's Promises at that time.

But when all is said and done, I believe that when King David enters Heaven it will/was by the cleansing power of the Blood of Christ, though David did not know Jesus as his Savior..

How can anybody be cleansed by the blood of Jesus without knowing what the blood of Jesus is metaphorical of?

What do you say "the blood of Jesus" means and how does it cleanse?

Well, take for example King David under the Old Testament. He did not know Jesus, but knew God and worshipped and loved God. When he goes into the divine presence of God, his sins will be forgiven not because of animal sacrifice but due to the sacrifice of Jesus.

God adds to His church and God cleanses with the blood of Jesus those who He judges as righteous by faith. If that requires direct knowledge of Jesus then no one could enter into Heaven prior to the birth of Christ and that is provably wrong.

It is only by a strict literal reading of the applicable passages that one can claim that one must know Jesus Christ in order to be saved and only one exception breaks that requirement. It has no 'wiggle room'.

It is a blessing to know Jesus Christ and to live in faith and fellowship with Him and other Christians, no doubt, and missionary work is HUGELY still necessary and needed, but God will judge; it is no simple formulaic process at all.

I showed you what I understand the blood of Jesus to mean by showing that the law states that life is in the blood and life is the promise for compliance which suggests that the blood of Jesus is the way he complied with the law..

You did not respond to this but instead wrote what you wrote which still doesn't explain what YOU mean by the blood of Jesus or how you think it cleanses.

David found a book of the law hidden within the walls of the temple.

The walls of the sanctuary of God is the law which defines the boundary between good and evil and life and death; David found a book of the law hidden within the law.

That's what eat my flesh and drink my blood is referring to...............

The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. the man who found it buried it again.....Mathew 13:44

 

[theword]

How can anybody be cleansed by the blood of Jesus without knowing what the blood of Jesus is metaphorical of?

What do you say "the blood of Jesus" means and how does it cleanse?

Well, take for example King David under the Old Testament. He did not know Jesus, but knew God and worshipped and loved God. When he goes into the divine presence of God, his sins will be forgiven not because of animal sacrifice but due to the sacrifice of Jesus.

God adds to His church and God cleanses with the blood of Jesus those who He judges as righteous by faith. If that requires direct knowledge of Jesus then no one could enter into Heaven prior to the birth of Christ and that is provably wrong.

It is only by a strict literal reading of the applicable passages that one can claim that one must know Jesus Christ in order to be saved and only one exception breaks that requirement. It has no 'wiggle room'.

It is a blessing to know Jesus Christ and to live in faith and fellowship with Him and other Christians, no doubt, and missionary work is HUGELY still necessary and needed, but God will judge; it is no simple formulaic process at all.

I showed you what I understand the blood of Jesus to mean by showing that the law states that life is in the blood and life is the promise for compliance which suggests that the blood of Jesus is the way he complied with the law..

You did not respond to this but instead wrote what you wrote which still doesn't explain what YOU mean by the blood of Jesus or how you think it cleanses.

David found a book of the law hidden within the walls of the temple.

The walls of the sanctuary of God is the law which defines the boundary between good and evil and life and death; David found a book of the law hidden within the law.

That's what eat my flesh and drink my blood is referring to...............

The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. the man who found it buried it again.....Mathew 13:44

It's the energy ( spirit ) that gives life to men, not the blood. Our new bodies in Paradise won't need blood to keep our life going.

John 6
63: It is the spirit that gives life, the flesh is of no avail; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life.

 

[hobelim]

The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. the man who found it buried it again.....Mathew 13:44

It's the energy ( spirit ) that gives life to men, not the blood. Our new bodies in Paradise won't need blood to keep our life going.

John 6
63: It is the spirit that gives life, the flesh is of no avail; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life.

brad, you need to read your own quotes.

the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life.

energy does not give life, words give life according to Jesus, words that are both spirit and life.

in this world or the next, without the blood which is life there is no life.