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1. A host of other right-wing Republicans had sought to dramatize the communism issue, but only McCarthy succeeded. And McCarthy succeeded while the others did not in part because of his thoroughgoing contempt for the rules of political controversy.
Michael Paul Rogin, The Intellectuals and McCarthy: The Radical Specter, p. 251
He forced liberals to explain themselves in full view of the American people. So they made McCarthy the issue.
2. So....the gripe is not that he was wrong....just that he was mean??
a.As a result of the Venona Papers, and declassification of KGB files verifies pretty much all of McCarthys charges .and no one was ruined by McCarthy revelations .The greatest complaint against McCarthy was that he was unkind .even mean .to those in question.
3. But, how can any Democrat lodge that complaint after this:
a.Pelosi slams insurers as "immoral" villains
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi is trying to unite her divided caucus around a common enemy -- the health insurance industry -- previewing an August recess line of attack by Democrats trying to maintain momentum on health care reform.
they've been immoral all along," she added. "They are the villains in this, they have been part of the problem in a major way. They are doing everything in their power to stop a public option from happening
"This is the fight of our lives," she added. Pelosi slams insurers as "immoral" villains - On Congress - POLITICO.com
4.On September 11 evil registered lobbyist for United Health Steve Elmendorf
During the summer Pelosi continually accused medical healthcare insurance companies of everything her limited intellect could dream up.
Pelosi tripple crosses ?evil? insurance firms bribing her to kill ?public option? with a fund raiser « Coach is Right
Sounds pretty mean
McCarthy isn't a hero, he ruined people's lives. Owen Lattimore's career was ruined and he even left the country.
He accused a lot of innocent people, and even went after the Army.
You guys seem to forget the lives of innocent people he destroyed.
1. A host of other right-wing Republicans had sought to dramatize the communism issue, but only McCarthy succeeded. And McCarthy succeeded while the others did not in part because of his thoroughgoing contempt for the rules of political controversy.
Michael Paul Rogin, The Intellectuals and McCarthy: The Radical Specter, p. 251
He forced liberals to explain themselves in full view of the American people. So they made McCarthy the issue.
2. So....the gripe is not that he was wrong....just that he was mean??
a.As a result of the Venona Papers, and declassification of KGB files verifies pretty much all of McCarthys charges .and no one was ruined by McCarthy revelations .The greatest complaint against McCarthy was that he was unkind .even mean .to those in question.
3. But, how can any Democrat lodge that complaint after this:
a.Pelosi slams insurers as "immoral" villains
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi is trying to unite her divided caucus around a common enemy -- the health insurance industry -- previewing an August recess line of attack by Democrats trying to maintain momentum on health care reform.
they've been immoral all along," she added. "They are the villains in this, they have been part of the problem in a major way. They are doing everything in their power to stop a public option from happening
"This is the fight of our lives," she added. Pelosi slams insurers as "immoral" villains - On Congress - POLITICO.com
4.On September 11 evil registered lobbyist for United Health Steve Elmendorf
During the summer Pelosi continually accused medical healthcare insurance companies of everything her limited intellect could dream up.
Pelosi tripple crosses ?evil? insurance firms bribing her to kill ?public option? with a fund raiser « Coach is Right
Sounds pretty mean
People were ruined by him. If you don't think that, you are a nit wit.
What about people like Lena Horne etc?
McCarthy was not a hero, he was a dangerous fool who destroyed many people lives, and our government allowed him to. You should be ashamed of yourself for even defending what he did to many innocent people.
Oh! And Psst, it's not illegal to be a communist.
Why does it matter If they were communist or not? It isn't illegal to hold a certain political view. And I already named two.1. A host of other right-wing Republicans had sought to dramatize the communism issue, but only McCarthy succeeded. And McCarthy succeeded while the others did not in part because of his thoroughgoing contempt for the rules of political controversy.
Michael Paul Rogin, The Intellectuals and McCarthy: The Radical Specter, p. 251
He forced liberals to explain themselves in full view of the American people. So they made McCarthy the issue.
2. So....the gripe is not that he was wrong....just that he was mean??
a.As a result of the Venona Papers, and declassification of KGB files verifies pretty much all of McCarthys charges .and no one was ruined by McCarthy revelations .The greatest complaint against McCarthy was that he was unkind .even mean .to those in question.
3. But, how can any Democrat lodge that complaint after this:
a.Pelosi slams insurers as "immoral" villains
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi is trying to unite her divided caucus around a common enemy -- the health insurance industry -- previewing an August recess line of attack by Democrats trying to maintain momentum on health care reform.
they've been immoral all along," she added. "They are the villains in this, they have been part of the problem in a major way. They are doing everything in their power to stop a public option from happening
"This is the fight of our lives," she added. Pelosi slams insurers as "immoral" villains - On Congress - POLITICO.com
4.On September 11 evil registered lobbyist for United Health Steve Elmendorf
During the summer Pelosi continually accused medical healthcare insurance companies of everything her limited intellect could dream up.
Pelosi tripple crosses ?evil? insurance firms bribing her to kill ?public option? with a fund raiser « Coach is Right
Sounds pretty mean
People were ruined by him. If you don't think that, you are a nit wit.
It very simple to prove which of us is the nit-wit.....and you aren't going to like the result.
"People were ruined by him."
OK.....name a few.
Should be easy enough for you.
Name any who weren't communists, who were ruined by Senator McCarthy.
What about people like Lena Horne etc?
McCarthy was not a hero, he was a dangerous fool who destroyed many people lives, and our government allowed him to. You should be ashamed of yourself for even defending what he did to many innocent people.
Oh! And Psst, it's not illegal to be a communist.
1. When anti-communism took its toll in Hollywood, the blacklisting took the deadly form of not having ones name in the credits, or living in Paris, or not being able to sell a teleplay for as much as three years. This for folks who had no problem with Ukrainian farmers and their children eating their shoes.
2. From blacklist survivor Norma Barzman about her exile in Paris: We had dinner with Picasso every Tuesday night when we were at our country house in Provence. It was hard, but it was the time of my life. (Dennis Hamilton, Keeper of the Flame: A Blacklist Survivor, Los Angeles Times, October 3, 2000) The horror, the horror.
Ten Hollywood scribblers who subscribed to an ideology responsible for murder by the millions refused to admit their membership in the Communist Party to a House Committee. All they had to do was fess up. But they felt they had the right not to tell the truth, so they were briefly jailed for contempt. (Ann Coulter, Treason, p.77)
Tragic, eh?
3. BTW, when the Ten claimed a First Amendment right not to answer the Houses questions, the Supreme Court refused to even hear the case. (THE SUPREME COURT: The Hollywood Ten - TIME)
What about people like Lena Horne etc?
McCarthy was not a hero, he was a dangerous fool who destroyed many people lives, and our government allowed him to. You should be ashamed of yourself for even defending what he did to many innocent people.
Oh! And Psst, it's not illegal to be a communist.
1. When anti-communism took its toll in Hollywood, the blacklisting took the deadly form of not having ones name in the credits, or living in Paris, or not being able to sell a teleplay for as much as three years. This for folks who had no problem with Ukrainian farmers and their children eating their shoes.
2. From blacklist survivor Norma Barzman about her exile in Paris: We had dinner with Picasso every Tuesday night when we were at our country house in Provence. It was hard, but it was the time of my life. (Dennis Hamilton, Keeper of the Flame: A Blacklist Survivor, Los Angeles Times, October 3, 2000) The horror, the horror.
Ten Hollywood scribblers who subscribed to an ideology responsible for murder by the millions refused to admit their membership in the Communist Party to a House Committee. All they had to do was fess up. But they felt they had the right not to tell the truth, so they were briefly jailed for contempt. (Ann Coulter, Treason, p.77)
Tragic, eh?
3. BTW, when the Ten claimed a First Amendment right not to answer the Houses questions, the Supreme Court refused to even hear the case. (THE SUPREME COURT: The Hollywood Ten - TIME)
Lena Horne was a black woman, she had to spend her time singing in night clubs. And you are justifying what he did because someone enjoyed being exiled in Paris?
I would rather go to Paris by choice.
How about Arthur Miller?
My friend is a self proclaimed Marxist should she be jailed or forced to live another country because of this?
Why does it matter If they were communist or not? It isn't illegal to hold a certain political view. And I already named two.People were ruined by him. If you don't think that, you are a nit wit.
It very simple to prove which of us is the nit-wit.....and you aren't going to like the result.
"People were ruined by him."
OK.....name a few.
Should be easy enough for you.
Name any who weren't communists, who were ruined by Senator McCarthy.
Unless you think McCarthy was justified in ruining Owen Lattimore's career, who cleared of all charges? How about Lena Horne?
Yeah you are a nit wit, and you obviously have no problem the government regulations people's political views.
1. When anti-communism took its toll in Hollywood, the blacklisting took the deadly form of not having ones name in the credits, or living in Paris, or not being able to sell a teleplay for as much as three years. This for folks who had no problem with Ukrainian farmers and their children eating their shoes.
2. From blacklist survivor Norma Barzman about her exile in Paris: We had dinner with Picasso every Tuesday night when we were at our country house in Provence. It was hard, but it was the time of my life. (Dennis Hamilton, Keeper of the Flame: A Blacklist Survivor, Los Angeles Times, October 3, 2000) The horror, the horror.
Ten Hollywood scribblers who subscribed to an ideology responsible for murder by the millions refused to admit their membership in the Communist Party to a House Committee. All they had to do was fess up. But they felt they had the right not to tell the truth, so they were briefly jailed for contempt. (Ann Coulter, Treason, p.77)
Tragic, eh?
3. BTW, when the Ten claimed a First Amendment right not to answer the Houses questions, the Supreme Court refused to even hear the case. (THE SUPREME COURT: The Hollywood Ten - TIME)
Lena Horne was a black woman, she had to spend her time singing in night clubs. And you are justifying what he did because someone enjoyed being exiled in Paris?
I would rather go to Paris by choice.
How about Arthur Miller?
My friend is a self proclaimed Marxist should she be jailed or forced to live another country because of this?
Lena Horne was a government worker???
and Arthur Miller...too????
Wow.
OK...now for the truth:
1. " the House Un-American Activities Committee; anti-Communist probes into Hollywood, labor unions, and America's schools and universities; the Rosenberg trial; blacklisting in the media and schoolteachers fired for disloyalty had nothing to do with McCarthy and he had nothing to do with them (although when asked, he generally approved of them, as most other Americans did).
McCarthy's own committee in the Senate, the Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations, which he chaired for less than two years, had a specific duty to investigate communism in the federal government and among government employees."
Joseph McCarthy
You didn't know that, did you?
Did you want to say something about nit-wits?
More?
2. "That fact tends to get lost when historians dwell exclusively on the stories of harassment, professional disgrace, and other indignities suffered as a result of McCarthy's and other anti-Communist investigations. Dalton Trumbo, Dashiell Hammett, Howard Fast, Paul Robeson, Steve Nelson, Frances Farmer, and Lillian Hellman appear in standard treatments of the period in the same way in which the names of martyrs grace the pages of histories of the early church. Their personal ordeals are constantly presented as proof that America in those days must have been in the grip of an anti-Communist hysteria and a "witch-hunt." (In order not to be left out, Hellman told her own tale of woe in a short book of breathtaking dishonesty, entitled Scoundrel Time.)
3. The best and most generous estimate is that during the entire decade of the red scare, ten thousand Americans lost their jobs because of their past or present affiliation with the Communist Party or one of its auxiliary organizations. Of those who lost their jobs, two thousand worked in the government, and in perhaps forty cases McCarthy himself was directly or indirectly responsible for their being fired. In only one case that of Owen Lattimore can anyone make the argument that McCarthy's allegations led to any actual legal proceedings, and there a judge eventually threw out most of the indictment. Paradoxically, the fact that McCarthy never sent anyone to prison is also turned against him; opponents claimed that during his entire career, he never actually exposed a single spy or Communist a claim that is manifestly untrue, as we will see.
4.In fact, the number of people who did spend time in prison remained small. A grand total of 108 Communist Party members were convicted under the antisubversion provisions of the Smith Act, which Congress passed in 1941 (long before McCarthy was a member) and applied as equally to Nazi and fascist organizations as it did to Communists. Another twenty Communist Party members were imprisoned under state and local laws. Fewer than a dozen Americans went to jail for espionage activities (one of them being Alger Hiss, who was convicted of perjury). Exactly two were sentenced to death for conspiracy to commit espionage: Julius and Ethel Rosenberg."
Ibid.
'Claiming to have been blacklisted is Hollywoods version of coming over on the Mayflower.
Thanks to brave American patriots like Senator Joseph McCarthy, today Communists in America are substantially less likely to be employed in the Code Room at the Pentagon. These days, they are more likely to be scribbling little essays in the main street media.'
Coulter
Why does it matter If they were communist or not? It isn't illegal to hold a certain political view. And I already named two.It very simple to prove which of us is the nit-wit.....and you aren't going to like the result.
"People were ruined by him."
OK.....name a few.
Should be easy enough for you.
Name any who weren't communists, who were ruined by Senator McCarthy.
Unless you think McCarthy was justified in ruining Owen Lattimore's career, who cleared of all charges? How about Lena Horne?
Yeah you are a nit wit, and you obviously have no problem the government regulations people's political views.
1. I showed you that Lattimore's life was not ruined, in fact he benefited.
2. Even the truth about Owen Lattimore, the most famous of McCarthy's "victims," has finally come out, thanks to a former Chinese espionage agent's memoirs and declassified FBI files, which go a long way to vindicate McCarthy's original charges. Joseph McCarthy
3."Why does it matter If they were communist or not? "
At the time, the communist party's avowed interest was the violent overthrowing of the United Stated government.
Communists like Alger Hiss was a spy for the Soviet Union, convicted of perjury. Latttimore was a spy as well.
McCarthy isn't a hero, he ruined people's lives. Owen Lattimore's career was ruined and he even left the country.
He accused a lot of innocent people, and even went after the Army.
You guys seem to forget the lives of innocent people he destroyed.
What about people like Lena Horne etc?
McCarthy was not a hero, he was a dangerous fool who destroyed many people lives, and our government allowed him to. You should be ashamed of yourself for even defending what he did to many innocent people.
Oh! And Psst, it's not illegal to be a communist.
What about Val Lorwin? He spent years defending himself. He was a socialist who loathed the communist party but that didn't stop the government or McCarthy who took the word of someone he knew in college.
So what do you think of McCarthyism PC? You okay with people being black listed And falsely accused?
Lena Horne was a black woman, she had to spend her time singing in night clubs. And you are justifying what he did because someone enjoyed being exiled in Paris?
I would rather go to Paris by choice.
How about Arthur Miller?
My friend is a self proclaimed Marxist should she be jailed or forced to live another country because of this?
Lena Horne was a government worker???
and Arthur Miller...too????
Wow.
OK...now for the truth:
1. " the House Un-American Activities Committee; anti-Communist probes into Hollywood, labor unions, and America's schools and universities; the Rosenberg trial; blacklisting in the media and schoolteachers fired for disloyalty had nothing to do with McCarthy and he had nothing to do with them (although when asked, he generally approved of them, as most other Americans did).
McCarthy's own committee in the Senate, the Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations, which he chaired for less than two years, had a specific duty to investigate communism in the federal government and among government employees."
Joseph McCarthy
You didn't know that, did you?
Did you want to say something about nit-wits?
More?
2. "That fact tends to get lost when historians dwell exclusively on the stories of harassment, professional disgrace, and other indignities suffered as a result of McCarthy's and other anti-Communist investigations. Dalton Trumbo, Dashiell Hammett, Howard Fast, Paul Robeson, Steve Nelson, Frances Farmer, and Lillian Hellman appear in standard treatments of the period in the same way in which the names of martyrs grace the pages of histories of the early church. Their personal ordeals are constantly presented as proof that America in those days must have been in the grip of an anti-Communist hysteria and a "witch-hunt." (In order not to be left out, Hellman told her own tale of woe in a short book of breathtaking dishonesty, entitled Scoundrel Time.)
3. The best and most generous estimate is that during the entire decade of the red scare, ten thousand Americans lost their jobs because of their past or present affiliation with the Communist Party or one of its auxiliary organizations. Of those who lost their jobs, two thousand worked in the government, and in perhaps forty cases McCarthy himself was directly or indirectly responsible for their being fired. In only one case that of Owen Lattimore can anyone make the argument that McCarthy's allegations led to any actual legal proceedings, and there a judge eventually threw out most of the indictment. Paradoxically, the fact that McCarthy never sent anyone to prison is also turned against him; opponents claimed that during his entire career, he never actually exposed a single spy or Communist a claim that is manifestly untrue, as we will see.
4.In fact, the number of people who did spend time in prison remained small. A grand total of 108 Communist Party members were convicted under the antisubversion provisions of the Smith Act, which Congress passed in 1941 (long before McCarthy was a member) and applied as equally to Nazi and fascist organizations as it did to Communists. Another twenty Communist Party members were imprisoned under state and local laws. Fewer than a dozen Americans went to jail for espionage activities (one of them being Alger Hiss, who was convicted of perjury). Exactly two were sentenced to death for conspiracy to commit espionage: Julius and Ethel Rosenberg."
Ibid.
'Claiming to have been blacklisted is Hollywoods version of coming over on the Mayflower.
Thanks to brave American patriots like Senator Joseph McCarthy, today Communists in America are substantially less likely to be employed in the Code Room at the Pentagon. These days, they are more likely to be scribbling little essays in the main street media.'
Coulter
I am speaking of McCarthyism, nit wit.
No where did I state he was involved. I am using them as examples of what his way of thinking and your way of thinking causes. And what his crusade caused?
And you don't think McCarthy had anything to do With Arthur Miller? He went after the radio host, you don't think he had them go after Miller?
And what about Owen Lattimore? He was cleared of everything, but he lost work due to McCarthy falsely accusing him.
So I will be clearer. His ideas and his witch hunt ruined people's lives. And if you think he had nothing to do with the house committee you are very naive.
