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Italy is facing serious challenges, with demand for critical care far outstripping supply. Health officials there are having to make very difficult decisions about who to treat – in the knowledge that deciding not to treat will very likely lead to death.
On Thursday the Italian College of Anesthesia, Analgesia, Resuscitation and Intensive Care, issued guidelines advising doctors how to deploy scarce resources when the need for them is outstripped by the demand of critically ill patients. The guidelines state that priority should be given to those who have, first, “greater likelihood of survival and, second, who have more potential years of life”.
As a result, patients with underlying conditions and elderly patients, who are deemed to stand less chance of surviving the virus, may not be treated in favour of healthier and/or younger people who have more chance of recovery.
In the coming months we may face a similar situation in the UK where we do not have the resources necessary to treat all people who will catch Covid-19. So how do healthcare professionals decide who to treat?
Coronavirus may force UK doctors to decide who they’ll save | Jonathan Ives
Very frightening indeed. If you have chronic illnesses or are elderly, what would be going through your mind if you were diagnosed with COVID 19 in Italy, and possibly the entire UK down the road? As a person with both problems, I can tell you I would be scared Shtless.
But I don't have to worry about that, because I'm in the United States, and in the United States, we don't have socialized medical care. If I would unfortunately get the virus, I know I'll be well cared for. If my 88 year old father would get the virus, I know he will be well cared for. Same for my 86 year old mother.
Until we run out of beds.For one, we are treating every American that has the virus.
I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - WikipediaThe socialists here will deny it, but we all know that this is exactly what happens with socialist medicine.
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - WikipediaThe socialists here will deny it, but we all know that this is exactly what happens with socialist medicine.
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
It doesn't. Italy has socialist medicine and thet are going to focus on younger people instead of seniors during the coronavirus epidemic.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - WikipediaThe socialists here will deny it, but we all know that this is exactly what happens with socialist medicine.
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Propaganda parrots.I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - Wikipedia
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
So you are not an American?
Did you have trouble reading the name of the forum?
It's amazing how these clueless idiots come here, pretend they are more American, and pretend they know the American system better than Americans, even though they have never even used it.
We don't want your stupid advice or your opinions. Crawl back to your own country.
I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - WikipediaThe socialists here will deny it, but we all know that this is exactly what happens with socialist medicine.
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
Italy is having to triage. The rules of triage have absolutely nothing to do with having socialized or for-profit medicine if applied correctly.It doesn't. Italy has socialist medicine and thet are going to focus on younger people instead of seniors during the coronavirus epidemic.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - WikipediaThe socialists here will deny it, but we all know that this is exactly what happens with socialist medicine.
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Italy is having to triage. The rules of triage have absolutely nothing to do with having socialized or for-profit medicine if applied correctly.It doesn't. Italy has socialist medicine and thet are going to focus on younger people instead of seniors during the coronavirus epidemic.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - WikipediaThe socialists here will deny it, but we all know that this is exactly what happens with socialist medicine.
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
You know what's even more amazing. People on here feeling they can link socialized medicine to triage and then get all indignant when people who know and have actual experience in both socialized and for-profit healthcare reply. I've always hated people who are willing to dish it but can't take it.I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - Wikipedia
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
So you are not an American?
Did you have trouble reading the name of the forum?
It's amazing how these clueless idiots come here, pretend they are more American, and pretend they know the American system better than Americans, even though they have never even used it.
We don't want your stupid advice or your opinions. Crawl back to your own country.
Italy is facing serious challenges, with demand for critical care far outstripping supply. Health officials there are having to make very difficult decisions about who to treat – in the knowledge that deciding not to treat will very likely lead to death.
On Thursday the Italian College of Anesthesia, Analgesia, Resuscitation and Intensive Care, issued guidelines advising doctors how to deploy scarce resources when the need for them is outstripped by the demand of critically ill patients. The guidelines state that priority should be given to those who have, first, “greater likelihood of survival and, second, who have more potential years of life”.
As a result, patients with underlying conditions and elderly patients, who are deemed to stand less chance of surviving the virus, may not be treated in favour of healthier and/or younger people who have more chance of recovery.
In the coming months we may face a similar situation in the UK where we do not have the resources necessary to treat all people who will catch Covid-19. So how do healthcare professionals decide who to treat?
Coronavirus may force UK doctors to decide who they’ll save | Jonathan Ives
Very frightening indeed. If you have chronic illnesses or are elderly, what would be going through your mind if you were diagnosed with COVID 19 in Italy, and possibly the entire UK down the road? As a person with both problems, I can tell you I would be scared Shtless.
But I don't have to worry about that, because I'm in the United States, and in the United States, we don't have socialized medical care. If I would unfortunately get the virus, I know I'll be well cared for. If my 88 year old father would get the virus, I know he will be well cared for. Same for my 86 year old mother.
It has already been stated by several health and medical experts that the U.S. may reach the same crisis of having to ration and triage between life and death. Socialized healthcare has nothing to do with it. It's all about resources and supply and demand.
You're not gonne win me over, so you might as well move on and sell your propaganda to some naive college kids.Italy is having to triage. The rules of triage have absolutely nothing to do with having socialized or for-profit medicine if applied correctly.It doesn't. Italy has socialist medicine and thet are going to focus on younger people instead of seniors during the coronavirus epidemic.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - WikipediaThe socialists here will deny it, but we all know that this is exactly what happens with socialist medicine.
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
You know what's even more amazing. People on here feeling they can link socialized medicine to triage and then get all indignant when people who know and have actual experience in both socialized and for-profit healthcare reply. I've always hated people who are willing to dish it but can't take it.I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyone
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
So you are not an American?
Did you have trouble reading the name of the forum?
It's amazing how these clueless idiots come here, pretend they are more American, and pretend they know the American system better than Americans, even though they have never even used it.
We don't want your stupid advice or your opinions. Crawl back to your own country.
Oh really? So you are claiming that everybody in the US gets all the care they require?I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - Wikipedia
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
Nobody is dying in the street with our system. We have a law that everybody is entitled to emergency care regardless of ability to pay. Furthermore, hospitals and clinics often have charity accounts for those evil rich white people to contribute funds, so that people who have no resources can get care too.
Why do so many doctors from socialist countries come to the USA to practice their skills and live here?Oh really? So you are claiming that everybody in the US gets all the care they require?I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyone
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
Nobody is dying in the street with our system. We have a law that everybody is entitled to emergency care regardless of ability to pay. Furthermore, hospitals and clinics often have charity accounts for those evil rich white people to contribute funds, so that people who have no resources can get care too.
It's called triage. We have the same thing here only they include ability to pay in the decision. There are only so many resources available in any medical system. After the limits are exceeded doctors and managers start making these terrible decisions of who to treat and who to pray for. Our own system is about to be stressed beyond their limits and people will die from lack of treatment. Deal with it.
Oh really? So you are claiming that everybody in the US gets all the care they require?I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyone
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
Nobody is dying in the street with our system. We have a law that everybody is entitled to emergency care regardless of ability to pay. Furthermore, hospitals and clinics often have charity accounts for those evil rich white people to contribute funds, so that people who have no resources can get care too.
Oh really? So you are claiming that everybody in the US gets all the care they require?I'm sorry to tell you this but I know for a fact you are lying by omission here. My wife is American and I know for a fact that the level of treatment someone receives differs significantly from person to person. And that beyond basic care, treatment is unavailable to significant portions of your populace by the simple means of it being unaffordable.Health Care Resources
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Because their main factor is we are not socialized, and that means only people with insurance or government plans are actually covered. We do treat all our citizens regardless.
Nobody is dying in the street with our system. We have a law that everybody is entitled to emergency care regardless of ability to pay. Furthermore, hospitals and clinics often have charity accounts for those evil rich white people to contribute funds, so that people who have no resources can get care too.
Perhaps not all the care, but enough to keep them going. If you want a sex change operation, or a face lift, and you have no money or coverage, you are shit out of luck. If you have a heart attack, the hospital is not going to refuse you at the emergency room doors because you have no coverage.
And that's from your extensive knowledge of socialized healthcare? As to capacity. I've already shown the statistics that the US has fewer hospital beds than most countries that have socialized medicine. It scores mediocre in the number of doctors per capita too. So what does that say about for-profit healthcare if it lacks that much capacity compared to other nations?Italy is having to triage. The rules of triage have absolutely nothing to do with having socialized or for-profit medicine if applied correctly.It doesn't. Italy has socialist medicine and thet are going to focus on younger people instead of seniors during the coronavirus epidemic.Health Care ResourcesOnly amateurs use Wikipedia. It's an unsecure site and can be edited by anyoneList of OECD countries by hospital beds - Wikipedia
The US doesn't exactly lead the charts here. So explain to me what the excuse is for your for-profit system?
Original source cited by Wikipedia. Stats are still the same. So why does the US compare so badly against most countries that have socialized medicine?
Horseshit.
Of course the capacity of the system and how well it has prepared has everything to do with how well it fares.
In socialist medicine countries they have allocated their resources to cutting of penises from children so that they can become their true selves. Virus treatment is secondary.
