The 20-year-old woman drowned after her father stopped lifeguards saving her at a beach in Dubai as

[Pogo]

I saw it on the news on AOL. Wow. Sure are pushing a story to make it seem current.

Still....I keep hearing a duck quacking.

Maybe you have the Disney channel on?

 

[Pogo]

I have heard of asian CULTURES who honor their fathers and whatnot, but I have never heard of anyone of hindu or buddhist faiths stoning, murdering, etc that were NOT muslim. Sorry Pogo. But that sucker is quacking all over the place.

I don't know what rock you hide under to not know about bride burnings and honour killings going on in India for thousands of years but here's an entire page of gory stories. Let me know when you find one that has anything to do with "Islam".

Are Hindus engaging in honor killings at Dubai and in the US now? Not that I've heard. So...irrelevant. Quit defending murderous Islam.

There's nothing in that post about "Islam". Gracie noted she's never heard of the practice within Hindus. So I showed her a bunch of 'em. Whether the perpetrators are "Hindu" or "Sikh" or something else, THAT is what's irrelevant. I doubt those details are even in the stories since --- THIS IS NOT A RELIGIOUS RITUAL.

 

[westwall]

So sad to think that a father didn't want his daughter saved because she would be touched by a lifeguard.


Dubai drowning: 'More women could die without female lifeguards' says safety chief after dad stops daughter's rescue

• 17:33, 10 AUGUST 2015
• BY RICHARD WHEATSTONE

The 20-year-old woman drowned after her father stopped lifeguards saving her at a beach in Dubai as it would have caused 'dishonour'

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Drowning: The 20-year-old died after getting into difficulty off the coast of Dubai
A Dubai safety chief has warned more people could drown in the city unless female lifeguards are hired to save struggling women and girls.

A woman drowned off the coast of Dubai when her father stopped male lifeguards trying to save her because it would 'dishonour' her.

The man reportedly grappled with lifeguards as they tried to save the 20-year-old woman as he did not want them to touch her.

Continue reading at:
Dubai drowning More women could die without female lifeguards says safety chief after dad stops daughter s rescue - Mirror Online?

You can find the same and similar in the U.S. People who's religious beliefs don't allow them to get medical help for their children. Or keep them from getting their children vaccinated.

You want to talk about a line between freedom of religion and life? Well which is it? Should someone be forced, against their religious beliefs, to save their life? Isn't allowing your child to die because of your religious beliefs a form of abortion?

And, the parents of children who die, are charged with a crime and sent to prison.

 

[IsaacNewton]

So sad to think that a father didn't want his daughter saved because she would be touched by a lifeguard.


Dubai drowning: 'More women could die without female lifeguards' says safety chief after dad stops daughter's rescue

• 17:33, 10 AUGUST 2015
• BY RICHARD WHEATSTONE

The 20-year-old woman drowned after her father stopped lifeguards saving her at a beach in Dubai as it would have caused 'dishonour'

• 2782 Shares
• 
  The 20-year-old woman drowned after her father stopped lifeguards saving her at a beach in Dubai as it would have caused 'dishonour'
  
  " data-content-image="http://i1.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article5144883.ece/ALTERNATES/s1200/Holidays.png">Share
• The 20-year-old woman drowned after her father stopped lifeguards saving her at a beach in Dubai as it would have caused 'dishonour'
  
  " data-content-image="">Tweet
• The 20-year-old woman drowned after her father stopped lifeguards saving her at a beach in Dubai as it would have caused 'dishonour'
  
  " data-content-image="">+1
• The 20-year-old woman drowned after her father stopped lifeguards saving her at a beach in Dubai as it would have caused 'dishonour'
  
  " data-content-image="http://i1.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article5144883.ece/ALTERNATES/s1200/Holidays.png">Pinterest

Drowning: The 20-year-old died after getting into difficulty off the coast of Dubai
A Dubai safety chief has warned more people could drown in the city unless female lifeguards are hired to save struggling women and girls.

A woman drowned off the coast of Dubai when her father stopped male lifeguards trying to save her because it would 'dishonour' her.

The man reportedly grappled with lifeguards as they tried to save the 20-year-old woman as he did not want them to touch her.

Continue reading at:
Dubai drowning More women could die without female lifeguards says safety chief after dad stops daughter s rescue - Mirror Online?

You can find the same and similar in the U.S. People who's religious beliefs don't allow them to get medical help for their children. Or keep them from getting their children vaccinated.

You want to talk about a line between freedom of religion and life? Well which is it? Should someone be forced, against their religious beliefs, to save their life? Isn't allowing your child to die because of your religious beliefs a form of abortion?

And, the parents of children who die, are charged with a crime and sent to prison.

Some are, some aren't.

 

[HenryBHough]

Think of it as an extremely late term abortion. libbies, and you'll quickly get over it.

 

[Roudy]

Aw come on, get real here, we are in a Muslim country, and the lifeguards because they were male were not allowed to save the girl. You're grasping at straws here. It's not like this barbaric faith hasn't caused Muslims to do this kind of barbarity before.

And AGAIN .... the officials IN that country, ON the scene, who are presumably themselves Muslims, tried to rescue the girl, were stopped by the intervening "Asian" father, and then arrested and sued him for what he did.

>> Lt. Col. Burqibah added that the girl’s father was later arrested by Dubai Police for stopping the rescue team from saving his daughter’s life and doing their job.

““This is one of the incidents which I cannot forget. It shocked me and many others who were involved in the case.

... Lt. Col. Burqibah added that the girl’s father was later arrested by Dubai Police for stopping the rescue team from saving his daughter’s life and doing their job.
"He was prosecuted and sued by the concerned authorities.” --- Emirates 24/7 <<​

Col. Burquibah was apparently relating a story from two decades ago that still haunts him.. For exactly the same reason it haunts us.



--- And yet somehow you want to blame "Islam". In a story that makes no mention of any kind of religion at all.

What's wrong with this picture?

Whats wrong with this pictures is....drumroll....islam is known for honor killings. Therefore, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's usually a duck. In this case, it turned out to be a turkey.

No actually it isn't. That's only if you read hacks like Roudy who are clearly making it up as they go.
"Honor killings" are a cultural artifact left over from thousands of years of patriarchal traditions. They still go on in some cultures -- because it's a cultural thing -- exclusive of any religion.

For example they go on in both India and Pakistan, committed by Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs.... men who have nothing in common in religion but very much have the subcontinent cultural traditions in common. On the other hand they don't happen in, say, Morocco or Tunisia, which are as Muslim as they come.

So the commonality here is culture -- not religion. And this cultural bullshit was around long before any of those religions were even founded. It's got DEEP roots. As a woman you need to know this.

Second thing wrong with this picture is....drumroll...why print that story NOW? And who reported it? Or rather, who chose to have it reported? MEDIA. And what was the MEDIA's true agenda in printing this old story?
Lots of things wrong with this. Not just one thing.

Yup, I pointed out that it's from 1996. I always check out these scary-monster stories from the middle east; we take them with many grains of salt.

Bottom line though, there's no mention of anybody's religion here; and if we want to assume one, well the authorites who tried to save the girl were local in Dubai --- which means Muslims. They were trying to be the good guys.

Somebody needs to walk me through how we get "Islam did this" out of that. Why would these (presumably Muslim) officials arrest the guy and prosecute him, if that's the case? Hm?

The girl's father was a devout Muslim who would have rather seen his daughter dead than a male lifeguard touch her body in order to save her from drowning. The only culture in "Asia" who would behave like this are people of the Islamic faith. Even the honor killings in India are conducted by, mostly, drum roll please...PEOPLE OF THE MUSLIM FAITH.

Honour killings bring dishonour to India - Al Jazeera English

Killed in the name of 'honour'

"Honour killings" are traditionally associated with developing countries with significant Muslim populations, and India has been no exception.

Indian Muslim Mothers Charged In Honor Killings Of Daughters Who Married Hindu Men

Mohammad Shafia who murdered daughter in honour killing said he d do the same again Daily Mail Online

Bull. Fucking. Shit.

----- Number one, there's absolutely no mention of "devout" (or non-devout) "Muslim" (or any other religion) attached to the father, the daughter, the lifeguards, the police who arrested him, the writer, the publisher, the owner of the internet server it sits on, the local ice cream vendor, anyone in the story at all, anywhere. Including its source links. You're pulling this shit completely out of your ass.

---- Number two, the concept of "honor killing" is widespread worldwide, especially among tribal units with a nomadic historical background, practiced in Mediterranean Europe (rooting back to ancient Rome's doctrine of pater familias) as well as the Inca and Aztecs in the Americas. NONE of them were Muslim, as Islam hadn't even been invented yet --- which again confirms my characterization of a socio-CULTURAL/tribal tradition... not a religious one.

Italy didn't toughen its laws against it until less than forty years ago (1981). Brazil didn't clamp down until 1991. Yet none of those Italian or Brazilian honor killings had jack squat to do with being Catholic.

>> The cultural features which lead to honor killings are complex. Honor killings involve violence and fear as a tool of maintaining control. Honor killings are argued to have their origin among nomadic peoples and herdsmen: such populations carry all their valuables with them and risk having them stolen, and do not have proper recourse to law. As a result, inspiring fear, using aggression, and cultivating a reputation for violent revenge in order to protect property is preferred to other behaviors. In societies where there is a weak rule of law, people must build fierce reputations.[22]

In many cultures where honor is of central value, men are sources, or active generators /agents of that honor, while the only effect that women can have on honor is to destroy it. << -- Honor Killing Wiki Page

>> The incident in Subalpur village in West Bengal’s Birbhum district, in which a 20-year-old tribal woman was gang-raped by a dozen men as punishment for alleged immoral conduct, is shocking in its unimaginable brutality and points to a larger malaise. The order by a kangaroo court led by a village headman is proof that a section of rural India is outside the pale of the country’s constitutional values and judicial system. Ill-informed men with medieval social attitudes and patriarchal prejudices are allowed to adjudicate on the conduct and morality of women and pass unconscionable forms of punishment, such as social ostracism, payment of arbitrary fines and, as in this case, sexual violence in lieu of monetary penalty. <<
​

That's in India, from this page full of honour killing news, and it illustrates AGAIN the tribal sociocultural origins that have nothing to do with Hinduism, or Sikhism, or Islam or any other religion.

Oh wait, I already said that. You just weren't listening.



---- Number three, honor killing is prohibited in Islam anyway:

>> There is no such concept in Islam that is called “honor killing”. Islam holds every soul in high esteem and does not allow any transgression upon it. It does not allow people to take the law in their own hands and administer justice, because doing so will be leading to chaos and lawlessness. Therefore, based on this, Islam does not permit such killings.

First of all, in order to sanction killing, it must be through a binding verdict issued by an authoritative law court. Individuals themselves have no authority either to judge cases or pass judgments. Therefore, a Muslim should not sanction such killing because doing so will be leading to the rule of the law of the jungle. A civilized society cannot be run by such laws.” --- Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, senior lecturer and Islamic scholar, Islamic Institute of Toronto

“Like all other religions, Islam strictly prohibits murder and killing without legal justification. Allah, Most High, says, “Whoso slayeth a believer of set purpose, his reward is Hell for ever. Allah is wroth against him and He hath cursed him and prepared for him an awful doom.” (An-Nisa’: 93)

The so-called “honor killing” is based on ignorance and disregard of morals and laws, which cannot be abolished except by disciplinary punishments.

It goes without saying that people are not entitled to take the law in their own hands, for it’s the responsibility of the Muslim State and its concerned bodies to maintain peace, security, etc., and to prevent chaos and disorder from creeping into the Muslim society.”--- Sheikh `Atiyyah Saqr, former head of Al-Azhar Fatwa Committee (source for both here)​

---- Number four, if this bullshit you pick out of your nose had any validity we should expect to see honor killings wherever we see Islam, yet we don't. On the other hand India's swimming in it, and trying to pass its own tougher legislation. Trying to pass laws to change culture -- kinda like gun control laws here.

I'm pretty sure there's not a whole lotta Muslims in India. I'm pretty sure that's why they divided the British colonial territory into India and Pakistan.

Albania had/has a long tradition of it within the Kanun, the local oral-tradition community laws that are thought to date all the way back to the Bronze Age, Islam didn't even reach Albania until the 14th century and is only followed by slightly over half the population; yet honor killings were fairly common in rural Albania (and elsewhere in the Balkans) up until the dictatorial communist government took over after WWII.

The Incas and Aztecs encountered by the Spanish were practicing it, as well as in our own time the Cosa Nostra, who tend to use machine guns, in a tradition of "honor" that goes back to ancient Rome.

None of this shit has anything to do with Islam, which did not exist in ancient Rome, which did not exist in the Bronze Age, which did not exist among the Native Americans of the 16th century. Nor, by definition, does it exist among Hindus and Sikhs in India. Nor does the Mafia doing it make it "Catholic".


---- And number five, we did all this shit before, you and your ilk got your asses handed back to you then, and here you come with the same made-up crap expecting different results. All you're doing here is trying to foment hate by making shit up with absolutely no evidence whatsoever. When you do that, yer gonna get yer ass called on it, pronto.

Yawn. Typical liberal-speak. Fact is, honor killings, child brides, women as slaves are more prevalent in Muslim societies. You listing exceptions here and there doesn't add up didly, compared to general systemic problem with Muslim societies, all having to do with the way their prophet, who married an 8 year old treated women. And, since he is considered the most perfect human being in Islam, Muslim men model their lives after him.

The father of the girl let his daughter die than allow the male lifeguards close to his daughter. The big complaint in the article was that there needs to be more women lifeguards in this Muslim country, why? Because devout Muslim assholes like this girl's father who treat their women like cattle, would feel more at ease. UAE is a Muslim country, and the vast majority of visitors there are from Muslim countries. So I would say yes, the asshole was most likely an Asian from a Muslim country like Indonesia or Malaysia, which has the most Muslims in the world.

 

[Gracie]

The big complaint in the article was that there needs to be more women lifeguards in this Muslim country, why? Because devout Muslim assholes like this girl's father who treat their women like cattle, would feel more at ease

This ^

 

[Roudy]

I have heard of asian CULTURES who honor their fathers and whatnot, but I have never heard of anyone of hindu or buddhist faiths stoning, murdering, etc that were NOT muslim. Sorry Pogo. But that sucker is quacking all over the place.

I don't know what rock you hide under to not know about bride burnings and honour killings going on in India for thousands of years but here's an entire page of gory stories. Let me know when you find one that has anything to do with "Islam".

Are Hindus engaging in honor killings at Dubai and in the US now? Not that I've heard. So...irrelevant. Quit defending murderous Islam.

LOL Didn't you know? Hindus and Chinese people are going to Dubai and acting like insane devout Muslims now.

 

[Roudy]

I have heard of asian CULTURES who honor their fathers and whatnot, but I have never heard of anyone of hindu or buddhist faiths stoning, murdering, etc that were NOT muslim. Sorry Pogo. But that sucker is quacking all over the place.

I don't know what rock you hide under to not know about bride burnings and honour killings going on in India for thousands of years but here's an entire page of gory stories. Let me know when you find one that has anything to do with "Islam".

Are Hindus engaging in honor killings at Dubai and in the US now? Not that I've heard. So...irrelevant. Quit defending murderous Islam.

There's nothing in that post about "Islam". Gracie noted she's never heard of the practice within Hindus. So I showed her a bunch of 'em. Whether the perpetrators are "Hindu" or "Sikh" or something else, THAT is what's irrelevant. I doubt those details are even in the stories since --- THIS IS NOT A RELIGIOUS RITUAL.

I don't know you which planet you're living on, but every time I hear about honor killings, child brides, people(?) kidnapping women and forcing them into slavery etc. it's always been some fucking Islamic retard and not an Asian or Hindu.

 

[IsaacNewton]

And AGAIN .... the officials IN that country, ON the scene, who are presumably themselves Muslims, tried to rescue the girl, were stopped by the intervening "Asian" father, and then arrested and sued him for what he did.

>> Lt. Col. Burqibah added that the girl’s father was later arrested by Dubai Police for stopping the rescue team from saving his daughter’s life and doing their job.

““This is one of the incidents which I cannot forget. It shocked me and many others who were involved in the case.

... Lt. Col. Burqibah added that the girl’s father was later arrested by Dubai Police for stopping the rescue team from saving his daughter’s life and doing their job.
"He was prosecuted and sued by the concerned authorities.” --- Emirates 24/7 <<​

Col. Burquibah was apparently relating a story from two decades ago that still haunts him.. For exactly the same reason it haunts us.



--- And yet somehow you want to blame "Islam". In a story that makes no mention of any kind of religion at all.

What's wrong with this picture?

Whats wrong with this pictures is....drumroll....islam is known for honor killings. Therefore, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's usually a duck. In this case, it turned out to be a turkey.

No actually it isn't. That's only if you read hacks like Roudy who are clearly making it up as they go.
"Honor killings" are a cultural artifact left over from thousands of years of patriarchal traditions. They still go on in some cultures -- because it's a cultural thing -- exclusive of any religion.

For example they go on in both India and Pakistan, committed by Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs.... men who have nothing in common in religion but very much have the subcontinent cultural traditions in common. On the other hand they don't happen in, say, Morocco or Tunisia, which are as Muslim as they come.

So the commonality here is culture -- not religion. And this cultural bullshit was around long before any of those religions were even founded. It's got DEEP roots. As a woman you need to know this.

Second thing wrong with this picture is....drumroll...why print that story NOW? And who reported it? Or rather, who chose to have it reported? MEDIA. And what was the MEDIA's true agenda in printing this old story?
Lots of things wrong with this. Not just one thing.

Yup, I pointed out that it's from 1996. I always check out these scary-monster stories from the middle east; we take them with many grains of salt.

Bottom line though, there's no mention of anybody's religion here; and if we want to assume one, well the authorites who tried to save the girl were local in Dubai --- which means Muslims. They were trying to be the good guys.

Somebody needs to walk me through how we get "Islam did this" out of that. Why would these (presumably Muslim) officials arrest the guy and prosecute him, if that's the case? Hm?

The girl's father was a devout Muslim who would have rather seen his daughter dead than a male lifeguard touch her body in order to save her from drowning. The only culture in "Asia" who would behave like this are people of the Islamic faith. Even the honor killings in India are conducted by, mostly, drum roll please...PEOPLE OF THE MUSLIM FAITH.

Honour killings bring dishonour to India - Al Jazeera English

Killed in the name of 'honour'

"Honour killings" are traditionally associated with developing countries with significant Muslim populations, and India has been no exception.

Indian Muslim Mothers Charged In Honor Killings Of Daughters Who Married Hindu Men

Mohammad Shafia who murdered daughter in honour killing said he d do the same again Daily Mail Online

Bull. Fucking. Shit.

----- Number one, there's absolutely no mention of "devout" (or non-devout) "Muslim" (or any other religion) attached to the father, the daughter, the lifeguards, the police who arrested him, the writer, the publisher, the owner of the internet server it sits on, the local ice cream vendor, anyone in the story at all, anywhere. Including its source links. You're pulling this shit completely out of your ass.

---- Number two, the concept of "honor killing" is widespread worldwide, especially among tribal units with a nomadic historical background, practiced in Mediterranean Europe (rooting back to ancient Rome's doctrine of pater familias) as well as the Inca and Aztecs in the Americas. NONE of them were Muslim, as Islam hadn't even been invented yet --- which again confirms my characterization of a socio-CULTURAL/tribal tradition... not a religious one.

Italy didn't toughen its laws against it until less than forty years ago (1981). Brazil didn't clamp down until 1991. Yet none of those Italian or Brazilian honor killings had jack squat to do with being Catholic.

>> The cultural features which lead to honor killings are complex. Honor killings involve violence and fear as a tool of maintaining control. Honor killings are argued to have their origin among nomadic peoples and herdsmen: such populations carry all their valuables with them and risk having them stolen, and do not have proper recourse to law. As a result, inspiring fear, using aggression, and cultivating a reputation for violent revenge in order to protect property is preferred to other behaviors. In societies where there is a weak rule of law, people must build fierce reputations.[22]

In many cultures where honor is of central value, men are sources, or active generators /agents of that honor, while the only effect that women can have on honor is to destroy it. << -- Honor Killing Wiki Page

>> The incident in Subalpur village in West Bengal’s Birbhum district, in which a 20-year-old tribal woman was gang-raped by a dozen men as punishment for alleged immoral conduct, is shocking in its unimaginable brutality and points to a larger malaise. The order by a kangaroo court led by a village headman is proof that a section of rural India is outside the pale of the country’s constitutional values and judicial system. Ill-informed men with medieval social attitudes and patriarchal prejudices are allowed to adjudicate on the conduct and morality of women and pass unconscionable forms of punishment, such as social ostracism, payment of arbitrary fines and, as in this case, sexual violence in lieu of monetary penalty. <<
​

That's in India, from this page full of honour killing news, and it illustrates AGAIN the tribal sociocultural origins that have nothing to do with Hinduism, or Sikhism, or Islam or any other religion.

Oh wait, I already said that. You just weren't listening.



---- Number three, honor killing is prohibited in Islam anyway:

>> There is no such concept in Islam that is called “honor killing”. Islam holds every soul in high esteem and does not allow any transgression upon it. It does not allow people to take the law in their own hands and administer justice, because doing so will be leading to chaos and lawlessness. Therefore, based on this, Islam does not permit such killings.

First of all, in order to sanction killing, it must be through a binding verdict issued by an authoritative law court. Individuals themselves have no authority either to judge cases or pass judgments. Therefore, a Muslim should not sanction such killing because doing so will be leading to the rule of the law of the jungle. A civilized society cannot be run by such laws.” --- Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, senior lecturer and Islamic scholar, Islamic Institute of Toronto

“Like all other religions, Islam strictly prohibits murder and killing without legal justification. Allah, Most High, says, “Whoso slayeth a believer of set purpose, his reward is Hell for ever. Allah is wroth against him and He hath cursed him and prepared for him an awful doom.” (An-Nisa’: 93)

The so-called “honor killing” is based on ignorance and disregard of morals and laws, which cannot be abolished except by disciplinary punishments.

It goes without saying that people are not entitled to take the law in their own hands, for it’s the responsibility of the Muslim State and its concerned bodies to maintain peace, security, etc., and to prevent chaos and disorder from creeping into the Muslim society.”--- Sheikh `Atiyyah Saqr, former head of Al-Azhar Fatwa Committee (source for both here)​

---- Number four, if this bullshit you pick out of your nose had any validity we should expect to see honor killings wherever we see Islam, yet we don't. On the other hand India's swimming in it, and trying to pass its own tougher legislation. Trying to pass laws to change culture -- kinda like gun control laws here.

I'm pretty sure there's not a whole lotta Muslims in India. I'm pretty sure that's why they divided the British colonial territory into India and Pakistan.

Albania had/has a long tradition of it within the Kanun, the local oral-tradition community laws that are thought to date all the way back to the Bronze Age, Islam didn't even reach Albania until the 14th century and is only followed by slightly over half the population; yet honor killings were fairly common in rural Albania (and elsewhere in the Balkans) up until the dictatorial communist government took over after WWII.

The Incas and Aztecs encountered by the Spanish were practicing it, as well as in our own time the Cosa Nostra, who tend to use machine guns, in a tradition of "honor" that goes back to ancient Rome.

None of this shit has anything to do with Islam, which did not exist in ancient Rome, which did not exist in the Bronze Age, which did not exist among the Native Americans of the 16th century. Nor, by definition, does it exist among Hindus and Sikhs in India. Nor does the Mafia doing it make it "Catholic".


---- And number five, we did all this shit before, you and your ilk got your asses handed back to you then, and here you come with the same made-up crap expecting different results. All you're doing here is trying to foment hate by making shit up with absolutely no evidence whatsoever. When you do that, yer gonna get yer ass called on it, pronto.

Yawn. Typical liberal-speak. Fact is, honor killings, child brides, women as slaves are more prevalent in Muslim societies. You listing exceptions here and there doesn't add up didly, compared to general systemic problem with Muslim societies, all having to do with the way their prophet, who married an 8 year old treated women. And, since he is considered the most perfect human being in Islam, Muslim men model their lives after him.

The father of the girl didn't let his daughter die than allow the male lifeguards close to his daughter. The big complaint in the article was that there needs to be more women lifeguards in this Muslim country, why? Because devout Muslim assholes like this girl's father who treat their women like cattle, would feel more at ease. UAE is a Muslim country, and the vast majority of visitors there are from Muslim countries. So I would say yes, the asshole was most likely an Asian from a Muslim country like Indonesia or Malaysia which has the most Muslims in the world.

In other words you reject any facts that oppose your hatred of particular groups.

Enough said.

 

[Roudy]

Whats wrong with this pictures is....drumroll....islam is known for honor killings. Therefore, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's usually a duck. In this case, it turned out to be a turkey.

No actually it isn't. That's only if you read hacks like Roudy who are clearly making it up as they go.
"Honor killings" are a cultural artifact left over from thousands of years of patriarchal traditions. They still go on in some cultures -- because it's a cultural thing -- exclusive of any religion.

For example they go on in both India and Pakistan, committed by Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs.... men who have nothing in common in religion but very much have the subcontinent cultural traditions in common. On the other hand they don't happen in, say, Morocco or Tunisia, which are as Muslim as they come.

So the commonality here is culture -- not religion. And this cultural bullshit was around long before any of those religions were even founded. It's got DEEP roots. As a woman you need to know this.

Second thing wrong with this picture is....drumroll...why print that story NOW? And who reported it? Or rather, who chose to have it reported? MEDIA. And what was the MEDIA's true agenda in printing this old story?
Lots of things wrong with this. Not just one thing.

Yup, I pointed out that it's from 1996. I always check out these scary-monster stories from the middle east; we take them with many grains of salt.

Bottom line though, there's no mention of anybody's religion here; and if we want to assume one, well the authorites who tried to save the girl were local in Dubai --- which means Muslims. They were trying to be the good guys.

Somebody needs to walk me through how we get "Islam did this" out of that. Why would these (presumably Muslim) officials arrest the guy and prosecute him, if that's the case? Hm?

The girl's father was a devout Muslim who would have rather seen his daughter dead than a male lifeguard touch her body in order to save her from drowning. The only culture in "Asia" who would behave like this are people of the Islamic faith. Even the honor killings in India are conducted by, mostly, drum roll please...PEOPLE OF THE MUSLIM FAITH.

Honour killings bring dishonour to India - Al Jazeera English

Killed in the name of 'honour'

"Honour killings" are traditionally associated with developing countries with significant Muslim populations, and India has been no exception.

Indian Muslim Mothers Charged In Honor Killings Of Daughters Who Married Hindu Men

Mohammad Shafia who murdered daughter in honour killing said he d do the same again Daily Mail Online

Bull. Fucking. Shit.

----- Number one, there's absolutely no mention of "devout" (or non-devout) "Muslim" (or any other religion) attached to the father, the daughter, the lifeguards, the police who arrested him, the writer, the publisher, the owner of the internet server it sits on, the local ice cream vendor, anyone in the story at all, anywhere. Including its source links. You're pulling this shit completely out of your ass.

---- Number two, the concept of "honor killing" is widespread worldwide, especially among tribal units with a nomadic historical background, practiced in Mediterranean Europe (rooting back to ancient Rome's doctrine of pater familias) as well as the Inca and Aztecs in the Americas. NONE of them were Muslim, as Islam hadn't even been invented yet --- which again confirms my characterization of a socio-CULTURAL/tribal tradition... not a religious one.

Italy didn't toughen its laws against it until less than forty years ago (1981). Brazil didn't clamp down until 1991. Yet none of those Italian or Brazilian honor killings had jack squat to do with being Catholic.

>> The cultural features which lead to honor killings are complex. Honor killings involve violence and fear as a tool of maintaining control. Honor killings are argued to have their origin among nomadic peoples and herdsmen: such populations carry all their valuables with them and risk having them stolen, and do not have proper recourse to law. As a result, inspiring fear, using aggression, and cultivating a reputation for violent revenge in order to protect property is preferred to other behaviors. In societies where there is a weak rule of law, people must build fierce reputations.[22]

In many cultures where honor is of central value, men are sources, or active generators /agents of that honor, while the only effect that women can have on honor is to destroy it. << -- Honor Killing Wiki Page

>> The incident in Subalpur village in West Bengal’s Birbhum district, in which a 20-year-old tribal woman was gang-raped by a dozen men as punishment for alleged immoral conduct, is shocking in its unimaginable brutality and points to a larger malaise. The order by a kangaroo court led by a village headman is proof that a section of rural India is outside the pale of the country’s constitutional values and judicial system. Ill-informed men with medieval social attitudes and patriarchal prejudices are allowed to adjudicate on the conduct and morality of women and pass unconscionable forms of punishment, such as social ostracism, payment of arbitrary fines and, as in this case, sexual violence in lieu of monetary penalty. <<
​

That's in India, from this page full of honour killing news, and it illustrates AGAIN the tribal sociocultural origins that have nothing to do with Hinduism, or Sikhism, or Islam or any other religion.

Oh wait, I already said that. You just weren't listening.



---- Number three, honor killing is prohibited in Islam anyway:

>> There is no such concept in Islam that is called “honor killing”. Islam holds every soul in high esteem and does not allow any transgression upon it. It does not allow people to take the law in their own hands and administer justice, because doing so will be leading to chaos and lawlessness. Therefore, based on this, Islam does not permit such killings.

First of all, in order to sanction killing, it must be through a binding verdict issued by an authoritative law court. Individuals themselves have no authority either to judge cases or pass judgments. Therefore, a Muslim should not sanction such killing because doing so will be leading to the rule of the law of the jungle. A civilized society cannot be run by such laws.” --- Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, senior lecturer and Islamic scholar, Islamic Institute of Toronto

“Like all other religions, Islam strictly prohibits murder and killing without legal justification. Allah, Most High, says, “Whoso slayeth a believer of set purpose, his reward is Hell for ever. Allah is wroth against him and He hath cursed him and prepared for him an awful doom.” (An-Nisa’: 93)

The so-called “honor killing” is based on ignorance and disregard of morals and laws, which cannot be abolished except by disciplinary punishments.

It goes without saying that people are not entitled to take the law in their own hands, for it’s the responsibility of the Muslim State and its concerned bodies to maintain peace, security, etc., and to prevent chaos and disorder from creeping into the Muslim society.”--- Sheikh `Atiyyah Saqr, former head of Al-Azhar Fatwa Committee (source for both here)​

---- Number four, if this bullshit you pick out of your nose had any validity we should expect to see honor killings wherever we see Islam, yet we don't. On the other hand India's swimming in it, and trying to pass its own tougher legislation. Trying to pass laws to change culture -- kinda like gun control laws here.

I'm pretty sure there's not a whole lotta Muslims in India. I'm pretty sure that's why they divided the British colonial territory into India and Pakistan.

Albania had/has a long tradition of it within the Kanun, the local oral-tradition community laws that are thought to date all the way back to the Bronze Age, Islam didn't even reach Albania until the 14th century and is only followed by slightly over half the population; yet honor killings were fairly common in rural Albania (and elsewhere in the Balkans) up until the dictatorial communist government took over after WWII.

The Incas and Aztecs encountered by the Spanish were practicing it, as well as in our own time the Cosa Nostra, who tend to use machine guns, in a tradition of "honor" that goes back to ancient Rome.

None of this shit has anything to do with Islam, which did not exist in ancient Rome, which did not exist in the Bronze Age, which did not exist among the Native Americans of the 16th century. Nor, by definition, does it exist among Hindus and Sikhs in India. Nor does the Mafia doing it make it "Catholic".


---- And number five, we did all this shit before, you and your ilk got your asses handed back to you then, and here you come with the same made-up crap expecting different results. All you're doing here is trying to foment hate by making shit up with absolutely no evidence whatsoever. When you do that, yer gonna get yer ass called on it, pronto.

Yawn. Typical liberal-speak. Fact is, honor killings, child brides, women as slaves are more prevalent in Muslim societies. You listing exceptions here and there doesn't add up didly, compared to general systemic problem with Muslim societies, all having to do with the way their prophet, who married an 8 year old treated women. And, since he is considered the most perfect human being in Islam, Muslim men model their lives after him.

The father of the girl didn't let his daughter die than allow the male lifeguards close to his daughter. The big complaint in the article was that there needs to be more women lifeguards in this Muslim country, why? Because devout Muslim assholes like this girl's father who treat their women like cattle, would feel more at ease. UAE is a Muslim country, and the vast majority of visitors there are from Muslim countries. So I would say yes, the asshole was most likely an Asian from a Muslim country like Indonesia or Malaysia which has the most Muslims in the world.

In other words you reject any facts that oppose your hatred of particular groups.

Enough said.

Not as much as you stretch and contort the truth in an effort to whitewash the barbarity emanating from a particular group. Not to mention the bullshit comparisons and equating the U.S. with said groups and their behavior.

 

[rightwinger]

I sincerely hope the father rots in hell

 

[Roudy]

Do Hindus believe in Hell? LOL

 

[Pogo]

And AGAIN .... the officials IN that country, ON the scene, who are presumably themselves Muslims, tried to rescue the girl, were stopped by the intervening "Asian" father, and then arrested and sued him for what he did.

>> Lt. Col. Burqibah added that the girl’s father was later arrested by Dubai Police for stopping the rescue team from saving his daughter’s life and doing their job.

““This is one of the incidents which I cannot forget. It shocked me and many others who were involved in the case.

... Lt. Col. Burqibah added that the girl’s father was later arrested by Dubai Police for stopping the rescue team from saving his daughter’s life and doing their job.
"He was prosecuted and sued by the concerned authorities.” --- Emirates 24/7 <<​

Col. Burquibah was apparently relating a story from two decades ago that still haunts him.. For exactly the same reason it haunts us.



--- And yet somehow you want to blame "Islam". In a story that makes no mention of any kind of religion at all.

What's wrong with this picture?

Whats wrong with this pictures is....drumroll....islam is known for honor killings. Therefore, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's usually a duck. In this case, it turned out to be a turkey.

No actually it isn't. That's only if you read hacks like Roudy who are clearly making it up as they go.
"Honor killings" are a cultural artifact left over from thousands of years of patriarchal traditions. They still go on in some cultures -- because it's a cultural thing -- exclusive of any religion.

For example they go on in both India and Pakistan, committed by Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs.... men who have nothing in common in religion but very much have the subcontinent cultural traditions in common. On the other hand they don't happen in, say, Morocco or Tunisia, which are as Muslim as they come.

So the commonality here is culture -- not religion. And this cultural bullshit was around long before any of those religions were even founded. It's got DEEP roots. As a woman you need to know this.

Second thing wrong with this picture is....drumroll...why print that story NOW? And who reported it? Or rather, who chose to have it reported? MEDIA. And what was the MEDIA's true agenda in printing this old story?
Lots of things wrong with this. Not just one thing.

Yup, I pointed out that it's from 1996. I always check out these scary-monster stories from the middle east; we take them with many grains of salt.

Bottom line though, there's no mention of anybody's religion here; and if we want to assume one, well the authorites who tried to save the girl were local in Dubai --- which means Muslims. They were trying to be the good guys.

Somebody needs to walk me through how we get "Islam did this" out of that. Why would these (presumably Muslim) officials arrest the guy and prosecute him, if that's the case? Hm?

The girl's father was a devout Muslim who would have rather seen his daughter dead than a male lifeguard touch her body in order to save her from drowning. The only culture in "Asia" who would behave like this are people of the Islamic faith. Even the honor killings in India are conducted by, mostly, drum roll please...PEOPLE OF THE MUSLIM FAITH.

Honour killings bring dishonour to India - Al Jazeera English

Killed in the name of 'honour'

"Honour killings" are traditionally associated with developing countries with significant Muslim populations, and India has been no exception.

Indian Muslim Mothers Charged In Honor Killings Of Daughters Who Married Hindu Men

Mohammad Shafia who murdered daughter in honour killing said he d do the same again Daily Mail Online

Bull. Fucking. Shit.

----- Number one, there's absolutely no mention of "devout" (or non-devout) "Muslim" (or any other religion) attached to the father, the daughter, the lifeguards, the police who arrested him, the writer, the publisher, the owner of the internet server it sits on, the local ice cream vendor, anyone in the story at all, anywhere. Including its source links. You're pulling this shit completely out of your ass.

---- Number two, the concept of "honor killing" is widespread worldwide, especially among tribal units with a nomadic historical background, practiced in Mediterranean Europe (rooting back to ancient Rome's doctrine of pater familias) as well as the Inca and Aztecs in the Americas. NONE of them were Muslim, as Islam hadn't even been invented yet --- which again confirms my characterization of a socio-CULTURAL/tribal tradition... not a religious one.

Italy didn't toughen its laws against it until less than forty years ago (1981). Brazil didn't clamp down until 1991. Yet none of those Italian or Brazilian honor killings had jack squat to do with being Catholic.

>> The cultural features which lead to honor killings are complex. Honor killings involve violence and fear as a tool of maintaining control. Honor killings are argued to have their origin among nomadic peoples and herdsmen: such populations carry all their valuables with them and risk having them stolen, and do not have proper recourse to law. As a result, inspiring fear, using aggression, and cultivating a reputation for violent revenge in order to protect property is preferred to other behaviors. In societies where there is a weak rule of law, people must build fierce reputations.[22]

In many cultures where honor is of central value, men are sources, or active generators /agents of that honor, while the only effect that women can have on honor is to destroy it. << -- Honor Killing Wiki Page

>> The incident in Subalpur village in West Bengal’s Birbhum district, in which a 20-year-old tribal woman was gang-raped by a dozen men as punishment for alleged immoral conduct, is shocking in its unimaginable brutality and points to a larger malaise. The order by a kangaroo court led by a village headman is proof that a section of rural India is outside the pale of the country’s constitutional values and judicial system. Ill-informed men with medieval social attitudes and patriarchal prejudices are allowed to adjudicate on the conduct and morality of women and pass unconscionable forms of punishment, such as social ostracism, payment of arbitrary fines and, as in this case, sexual violence in lieu of monetary penalty. <<
​

That's in India, from this page full of honour killing news, and it illustrates AGAIN the tribal sociocultural origins that have nothing to do with Hinduism, or Sikhism, or Islam or any other religion.

Oh wait, I already said that. You just weren't listening.



---- Number three, honor killing is prohibited in Islam anyway:

>> There is no such concept in Islam that is called “honor killing”. Islam holds every soul in high esteem and does not allow any transgression upon it. It does not allow people to take the law in their own hands and administer justice, because doing so will be leading to chaos and lawlessness. Therefore, based on this, Islam does not permit such killings.

First of all, in order to sanction killing, it must be through a binding verdict issued by an authoritative law court. Individuals themselves have no authority either to judge cases or pass judgments. Therefore, a Muslim should not sanction such killing because doing so will be leading to the rule of the law of the jungle. A civilized society cannot be run by such laws.” --- Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, senior lecturer and Islamic scholar, Islamic Institute of Toronto

“Like all other religions, Islam strictly prohibits murder and killing without legal justification. Allah, Most High, says, “Whoso slayeth a believer of set purpose, his reward is Hell for ever. Allah is wroth against him and He hath cursed him and prepared for him an awful doom.” (An-Nisa’: 93)

The so-called “honor killing” is based on ignorance and disregard of morals and laws, which cannot be abolished except by disciplinary punishments.

It goes without saying that people are not entitled to take the law in their own hands, for it’s the responsibility of the Muslim State and its concerned bodies to maintain peace, security, etc., and to prevent chaos and disorder from creeping into the Muslim society.”--- Sheikh `Atiyyah Saqr, former head of Al-Azhar Fatwa Committee (source for both here)​

---- Number four, if this bullshit you pick out of your nose had any validity we should expect to see honor killings wherever we see Islam, yet we don't. On the other hand India's swimming in it, and trying to pass its own tougher legislation. Trying to pass laws to change culture -- kinda like gun control laws here.

I'm pretty sure there's not a whole lotta Muslims in India. I'm pretty sure that's why they divided the British colonial territory into India and Pakistan.

Albania had/has a long tradition of it within the Kanun, the local oral-tradition community laws that are thought to date all the way back to the Bronze Age, Islam didn't even reach Albania until the 14th century and is only followed by slightly over half the population; yet honor killings were fairly common in rural Albania (and elsewhere in the Balkans) up until the dictatorial communist government took over after WWII.

The Incas and Aztecs encountered by the Spanish were practicing it, as well as in our own time the Cosa Nostra, who tend to use machine guns, in a tradition of "honor" that goes back to ancient Rome.

None of this shit has anything to do with Islam, which did not exist in ancient Rome, which did not exist in the Bronze Age, which did not exist among the Native Americans of the 16th century. Nor, by definition, does it exist among Hindus and Sikhs in India. Nor does the Mafia doing it make it "Catholic".


---- And number five, we did all this shit before, you and your ilk got your asses handed back to you then, and here you come with the same made-up crap expecting different results. All you're doing here is trying to foment hate by making shit up with absolutely no evidence whatsoever. When you do that, yer gonna get yer ass called on it, pronto.

Yawn. Typical liberal-speak. Fact is, honor killings, child brides, women as slaves are more prevalent in Muslim societies. You listing exceptions here and there doesn't add up didly, compared to general systemic problem with Muslim societies, all having to do with the way their prophet, who married an 8 year old treated women. And, since he is considered the most perfect human being in Islam, Muslim men model their lives after him.

The father of the girl didn't let his daughter die than allow the male lifeguards close to his daughter. The big complaint in the article was that there needs to be more women lifeguards in this Muslim country, why? Because devout Muslim assholes like this girl's father who treat their women like cattle, would feel more at ease. UAE is a Muslim country, and the vast majority of visitors there are from Muslim countries. So I would say yes, the asshole was most likely an Asian from a Muslim country like Indonesia or Malaysia which has the most Muslims in the world.

AGAIN you continue to pull it out of your ass. How the fuck much you GOT in there?

Would you agree to assume the lifeguards the guy interfered with, and the police who arrested him, being in the Emirates, were Muslim?

If so, how do you explain Islam working "against" Islam?
Yer a piece of work. You're presented with no evidence whatsoever FOR your point, all kinds of evidence that tear it to shreds, and yet you continue....

​

Pitiful. I guess while I was studying Anthropology you were getting your Master Baiter's in Bullshittery.

HBV Historical Overview

• >> Laws, which appear to promote violence against women for the expression of sexual autonomy, are notable in Assyrian law codes dating back to 6000 BCE, and the codes of Hammurabi.

• Within the Bible, in Numbers 25:6-19, the figure of Phineas slays both a man and a woman in the temple for marrying across racial boundaries, which ends a plague and guarantees priesthood to his lineage.

• Guru Gobind Singh, a central figure in the Sikhi religion called for the rejection of ‘honour’ killers from the community, stating that ‘whosoever takes food from the slayers of daughters, shall die unabsolved’; despite his prohibition, ‘honour’ killings continue to be a serious issue within contemporary India, with Sikh families common perpetrators.

• Under Roman law, fathers had absolute power of life or death over all members of their families; males who did not take action against female relatives who were considered to have violated the sexual code were persecuted by their peers.

• In medieval Albania, the legal code known as the Kanun of Lekë Dukagjini allowed for the killing of women believed to have committed adultery in terms of blood revenge, which still has its effects on contemporary Albania.

• During John Calvin’s control over Geneva, adulterous women were drowned in the river Rhone.

• Within Ching dynasty China, fathers and husbands had the right to kill daughters deemed to have dishonoured them.

• Abuses of women that relate to a notion of ‘honour’, such as the exchange of girls as compensation for crimes of the male relatives, and levirate, where a widow is obliged to marry her husband’s brother occur across sub-Saharan Africa.

• ‘Honour’ killings have been recorded in the Southern Mediterranean, including Greece, Spain and Italy right up to the modern era. A law allowing for murder justified by ‘honour’ remained part of the Italian penal code right up to 1980 when it was removed from the statute books due to feminist campaigning.

• It is unknown how many societies outside the areas commonly associated with ‘honour’-based violence enact the collective murder and abuse of women deemed to have offended traditional sexual morality, yet individual cases have been noted in places as diverse as the Philippines and Western Samoa.

While the history of HBV (honour-based violence) is sketchy and will doubtless be filled in as historians, sociologists and students of women’s history conduct further analysis, the clear point is that there is no single ethnic, cultural or religious indicator of HBV. Rather that HBV has occurred within many different societies, and many different periods in history, within male-dominated societies where there is an insistence upon the control of female autonomy. <<​

----- which is exactly what I said here from the outset. And not one of these has jack shit to do with "Islam". Most in fact predate it. By up to seven thousand years.

Funny, I had to actually PAY for my Anthro classes.

That'll be $122.63.

 

[featherlite]

What a stupid reason to let your loved one die. Seems logical that instinct would take over and he'd rush them out to save her .How could you just do nothing.

 

[Roudy]

Whats wrong with this pictures is....drumroll....islam is known for honor killings. Therefore, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's usually a duck. In this case, it turned out to be a turkey.

No actually it isn't. That's only if you read hacks like Roudy who are clearly making it up as they go.
"Honor killings" are a cultural artifact left over from thousands of years of patriarchal traditions. They still go on in some cultures -- because it's a cultural thing -- exclusive of any religion.

For example they go on in both India and Pakistan, committed by Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs.... men who have nothing in common in religion but very much have the subcontinent cultural traditions in common. On the other hand they don't happen in, say, Morocco or Tunisia, which are as Muslim as they come.

So the commonality here is culture -- not religion. And this cultural bullshit was around long before any of those religions were even founded. It's got DEEP roots. As a woman you need to know this.

Second thing wrong with this picture is....drumroll...why print that story NOW? And who reported it? Or rather, who chose to have it reported? MEDIA. And what was the MEDIA's true agenda in printing this old story?
Lots of things wrong with this. Not just one thing.

Yup, I pointed out that it's from 1996. I always check out these scary-monster stories from the middle east; we take them with many grains of salt.

Bottom line though, there's no mention of anybody's religion here; and if we want to assume one, well the authorites who tried to save the girl were local in Dubai --- which means Muslims. They were trying to be the good guys.

Somebody needs to walk me through how we get "Islam did this" out of that. Why would these (presumably Muslim) officials arrest the guy and prosecute him, if that's the case? Hm?

The girl's father was a devout Muslim who would have rather seen his daughter dead than a male lifeguard touch her body in order to save her from drowning. The only culture in "Asia" who would behave like this are people of the Islamic faith. Even the honor killings in India are conducted by, mostly, drum roll please...PEOPLE OF THE MUSLIM FAITH.

Honour killings bring dishonour to India - Al Jazeera English

Killed in the name of 'honour'

"Honour killings" are traditionally associated with developing countries with significant Muslim populations, and India has been no exception.

Indian Muslim Mothers Charged In Honor Killings Of Daughters Who Married Hindu Men

Mohammad Shafia who murdered daughter in honour killing said he d do the same again Daily Mail Online

Bull. Fucking. Shit.

----- Number one, there's absolutely no mention of "devout" (or non-devout) "Muslim" (or any other religion) attached to the father, the daughter, the lifeguards, the police who arrested him, the writer, the publisher, the owner of the internet server it sits on, the local ice cream vendor, anyone in the story at all, anywhere. Including its source links. You're pulling this shit completely out of your ass.

---- Number two, the concept of "honor killing" is widespread worldwide, especially among tribal units with a nomadic historical background, practiced in Mediterranean Europe (rooting back to ancient Rome's doctrine of pater familias) as well as the Inca and Aztecs in the Americas. NONE of them were Muslim, as Islam hadn't even been invented yet --- which again confirms my characterization of a socio-CULTURAL/tribal tradition... not a religious one.

Italy didn't toughen its laws against it until less than forty years ago (1981). Brazil didn't clamp down until 1991. Yet none of those Italian or Brazilian honor killings had jack squat to do with being Catholic.

>> The cultural features which lead to honor killings are complex. Honor killings involve violence and fear as a tool of maintaining control. Honor killings are argued to have their origin among nomadic peoples and herdsmen: such populations carry all their valuables with them and risk having them stolen, and do not have proper recourse to law. As a result, inspiring fear, using aggression, and cultivating a reputation for violent revenge in order to protect property is preferred to other behaviors. In societies where there is a weak rule of law, people must build fierce reputations.[22]

In many cultures where honor is of central value, men are sources, or active generators /agents of that honor, while the only effect that women can have on honor is to destroy it. << -- Honor Killing Wiki Page

>> The incident in Subalpur village in West Bengal’s Birbhum district, in which a 20-year-old tribal woman was gang-raped by a dozen men as punishment for alleged immoral conduct, is shocking in its unimaginable brutality and points to a larger malaise. The order by a kangaroo court led by a village headman is proof that a section of rural India is outside the pale of the country’s constitutional values and judicial system. Ill-informed men with medieval social attitudes and patriarchal prejudices are allowed to adjudicate on the conduct and morality of women and pass unconscionable forms of punishment, such as social ostracism, payment of arbitrary fines and, as in this case, sexual violence in lieu of monetary penalty. <<
​

That's in India, from this page full of honour killing news, and it illustrates AGAIN the tribal sociocultural origins that have nothing to do with Hinduism, or Sikhism, or Islam or any other religion.

Oh wait, I already said that. You just weren't listening.



---- Number three, honor killing is prohibited in Islam anyway:

>> There is no such concept in Islam that is called “honor killing”. Islam holds every soul in high esteem and does not allow any transgression upon it. It does not allow people to take the law in their own hands and administer justice, because doing so will be leading to chaos and lawlessness. Therefore, based on this, Islam does not permit such killings.

First of all, in order to sanction killing, it must be through a binding verdict issued by an authoritative law court. Individuals themselves have no authority either to judge cases or pass judgments. Therefore, a Muslim should not sanction such killing because doing so will be leading to the rule of the law of the jungle. A civilized society cannot be run by such laws.” --- Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, senior lecturer and Islamic scholar, Islamic Institute of Toronto

“Like all other religions, Islam strictly prohibits murder and killing without legal justification. Allah, Most High, says, “Whoso slayeth a believer of set purpose, his reward is Hell for ever. Allah is wroth against him and He hath cursed him and prepared for him an awful doom.” (An-Nisa’: 93)

The so-called “honor killing” is based on ignorance and disregard of morals and laws, which cannot be abolished except by disciplinary punishments.

It goes without saying that people are not entitled to take the law in their own hands, for it’s the responsibility of the Muslim State and its concerned bodies to maintain peace, security, etc., and to prevent chaos and disorder from creeping into the Muslim society.”--- Sheikh `Atiyyah Saqr, former head of Al-Azhar Fatwa Committee (source for both here)​

---- Number four, if this bullshit you pick out of your nose had any validity we should expect to see honor killings wherever we see Islam, yet we don't. On the other hand India's swimming in it, and trying to pass its own tougher legislation. Trying to pass laws to change culture -- kinda like gun control laws here.

I'm pretty sure there's not a whole lotta Muslims in India. I'm pretty sure that's why they divided the British colonial territory into India and Pakistan.

Albania had/has a long tradition of it within the Kanun, the local oral-tradition community laws that are thought to date all the way back to the Bronze Age, Islam didn't even reach Albania until the 14th century and is only followed by slightly over half the population; yet honor killings were fairly common in rural Albania (and elsewhere in the Balkans) up until the dictatorial communist government took over after WWII.

The Incas and Aztecs encountered by the Spanish were practicing it, as well as in our own time the Cosa Nostra, who tend to use machine guns, in a tradition of "honor" that goes back to ancient Rome.

None of this shit has anything to do with Islam, which did not exist in ancient Rome, which did not exist in the Bronze Age, which did not exist among the Native Americans of the 16th century. Nor, by definition, does it exist among Hindus and Sikhs in India. Nor does the Mafia doing it make it "Catholic".


---- And number five, we did all this shit before, you and your ilk got your asses handed back to you then, and here you come with the same made-up crap expecting different results. All you're doing here is trying to foment hate by making shit up with absolutely no evidence whatsoever. When you do that, yer gonna get yer ass called on it, pronto.

Yawn. Typical liberal-speak. Fact is, honor killings, child brides, women as slaves are more prevalent in Muslim societies. You listing exceptions here and there doesn't add up didly, compared to general systemic problem with Muslim societies, all having to do with the way their prophet, who married an 8 year old treated women. And, since he is considered the most perfect human being in Islam, Muslim men model their lives after him.

The father of the girl didn't let his daughter die than allow the male lifeguards close to his daughter. The big complaint in the article was that there needs to be more women lifeguards in this Muslim country, why? Because devout Muslim assholes like this girl's father who treat their women like cattle, would feel more at ease. UAE is a Muslim country, and the vast majority of visitors there are from Muslim countries. So I would say yes, the asshole was most likely an Asian from a Muslim country like Indonesia or Malaysia which has the most Muslims in the world.

AGAIN you continue to pull it out of your ass. How the fuck much you GOT in there?

Would you agree to assume the lifeguards the guy interfered with, and the police who arrested him, being in the Emirates, were Muslim?

If so, how do you explain Islam working "against" Islam?
Yer a piece of work. You're presented with no evidence whatsoever FOR your point, all kinds of evidence that tear it to shreds, and yet you continue....

​

Pitiful. I guess while I was studying Anthropology you were getting your Master Baiter's in Bullshittery.

HBV Historical Overview

• >> Laws, which appear to promote violence against women for the expression of sexual autonomy, are notable in Assyrian law codes dating back to 6000 BCE, and the codes of Hammurabi.

• Within the Bible, in Numbers 25:6-19, the figure of Phineas slays both a man and a woman in the temple for marrying across racial boundaries, which ends a plague and guarantees priesthood to his lineage.

• Guru Gobind Singh, a central figure in the Sikhi religion called for the rejection of ‘honour’ killers from the community, stating that ‘whosoever takes food from the slayers of daughters, shall die unabsolved’; despite his prohibition, ‘honour’ killings continue to be a serious issue within contemporary India, with Sikh families common perpetrators.

• Under Roman law, fathers had absolute power of life or death over all members of their families; males who did not take action against female relatives who were considered to have violated the sexual code were persecuted by their peers.

• In medieval Albania, the legal code known as the Kanun of Lekë Dukagjini allowed for the killing of women believed to have committed adultery in terms of blood revenge, which still has its effects on contemporary Albania.

• During John Calvin’s control over Geneva, adulterous women were drowned in the river Rhone.

• Within Ching dynasty China, fathers and husbands had the right to kill daughters deemed to have dishonoured them.

• Abuses of women that relate to a notion of ‘honour’, such as the exchange of girls as compensation for crimes of the male relatives, and levirate, where a widow is obliged to marry her husband’s brother occur across sub-Saharan Africa.

• ‘Honour’ killings have been recorded in the Southern Mediterranean, including Greece, Spain and Italy right up to the modern era. A law allowing for murder justified by ‘honour’ remained part of the Italian penal code right up to 1980 when it was removed from the statute books due to feminist campaigning.

• It is unknown how many societies outside the areas commonly associated with ‘honour’-based violence enact the collective murder and abuse of women deemed to have offended traditional sexual morality, yet individual cases have been noted in places as diverse as the Philippines and Western Samoa.

While the history of HBV (honour-based violence) is sketchy and will doubtless be filled in as historians, sociologists and students of women’s history conduct further analysis, the clear point is that there is no single ethnic, cultural or religious indicator of HBV. Rather that HBV has occurred within many different societies, and many different periods in history, within male-dominated societies where there is an insistence upon the control of female autonomy. <<​

----- which is exactly what I said here from the outset.

Funny, I had to actually PAY for my Anthro classes.

That'll be $122.63.

Keep up. The headline said "we need more female lifeguards". It didn't say "Hindu nutjob behaves like a radical Muslim". Ha ha ha.

Historical shmistorical. Fact remains, honor killings are more prevalent in Muslim societies.

 

[Roudy]

What a stupid reason to let your loved one die. Seems logical that instinct would take over and he'd rush them out to save her .How could you just do nothing.

Because a female is not worth more than goat to a devout Muslim. They are allowed to legally have multiple wives, they are allowed to beat their women. What do you expect? Funny part is these so called "pro women, feminist" liberals are always the first ones rushing to their defense.

 

[Gracie]

Sorry to disappoint you, Pogo, but simple me is simple me. When I hear about someone being stoned to death or heads lopped off or honor killings I immediately think ISLAM. So let it be written so shall it be done ....in my head. And I am not inclined to change my initial gut reaction to what is blatantly obvious. Islam sucks. Actually, most religions suck. Which is why I walk my own path.

Dad didn't want MEN to save his daughter due to it being dishonorable, 10 to 1 its a fuckin muslim.

 

[Judicial review]

Sorry to disappoint you, Pogo, but simple me is simple me. When I hear about someone being stoned to death or heads lopped off or honor killings I immediately think ISLAM. So let it be written so shall it be done ....in my head. And I am not inclined to change my initial gut reaction to what is blatantly obvious. Islam sucks. Actually, most religions suck. Which is why I walk my own path.

Dad didn't want MEN to save his daughter due to it being dishonorable, 10 to 1 its a fuckin muslim.

10 commandments is such a good movie.

 

[Roudy]

Sorry to disappoint you, Pogo, but simple me is simple me. When I hear about someone being stoned to death or heads lopped off or honor killings I immediately think ISLAM. So let it be written so shall it be done ....in my head. And I am not inclined to change my initial gut reaction to what is blatantly obvious. Islam sucks. Actually, most religions suck. Which is why I walk my own path.

Dad didn't want MEN to save his daughter due to it being dishonorable, 10 to 1 its a fuckin muslim.

1000000 to 1 it's a fucking Muslim.