The dreaded gay-wedding-cake saga ends: bakers must pay 135 K

[Pop23]

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.

Placing a lien on the home doesn't mean the State is taking away their home.

A lien on a property means the property can't be sold while the lien is in place. What it does is prevent debtors from selling assets (in this case a home) and skipping town with the profit on the sale of the asset.

Lien's on real property are a normal part of the business process if someone refused to pay a debt.

On top of that the Klien's can still appeal the BOLI ruling in court challenging both the fine and request an injunction against the lien during the appeal process. The courts would then make the call.


>>>>

Liens are a bitch, no doubt, but there is a theory that since the lien reduced the value of the house (try getting a home improvement loan on a home with a lien) that real estate taxes should be disallowed, or that the lien holder be the payer.

Lien's don't reduce the value of a house.

(Not getting loan to improve the condition of the house is not a reduction in the existing value of the house.)


>>>>

It's simply a theory I've heard bandied about. I do administrate tax protests of properties from time to time, it is amazing how many creative ways there are to get a reduction in value.

 

[JoeB131]

I would refuse. They should do what their religious convictions lead them to do. Or perhaps they will pay the fine, and yet continue to practice their faith.

Regardless, that isn't the point. The point is they are in fact being threatened in losing their home. As much as you leftist claim to never try and punish people of faith, here is a clear example that you are.

Hey, there are a whole bunch of people in prison who found Jesus. We still punish them for their crimes.

The Klein's committed a crime. They broke the PA laws of Oregon, and then further complicated matters by publishing the names and addresses of the peopel who complained about them.

THAT'S what they were fined for.

 

[Faun]

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.


Fox News is reporting that the fascist state of Oregon is ramping up its persecution campaign against Christian bakers who declined to bake a wedding cake for a same sex lesbian couple. Aaron and Melissa Klein, the owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa, have been told that if they don’t pay the $135,000 awarded to the lesbian couple who sued them, a lien will be placed against their home next week.

Speaking to Todd Starnes of Fox News, Klein said that the case in on appeal and the couple is worried that if they win the appeal, they will never get their money back. ” “This is intimidation and bullying – that’s exactly what it is,” Klein said.

The fascist state of Orgeon has also placed a gag order on the Kleins that makes it illegal for them to talk openly about their desire to participate and profit from same sex weddings through their small business....

H8 Wins Oregon Threatens Home of Christian Bakers - Breitbart

Look at how the rightie lies ... he claims the state is threatening to take their home; but then links to a Fox News article which doesn't state that.

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.​

This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Are you as stupid as boedicca who claimed the state was threatening to take away their home?

 

[Pop23]

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.

Placing a lien on the home doesn't mean the State is taking away their home.

A lien on a property means the property can't be sold while the lien is in place. What it does is prevent debtors from selling assets (in this case a home) and skipping town with the profit on the sale of the asset.

Lien's on real property are a normal part of the business process if someone refused to pay a debt.

On top of that the Klien's can still appeal the BOLI ruling in court challenging both the fine and request an injunction against the lien during the appeal process. The courts would then make the call.


>>>>

Liens are a bitch, no doubt, but there is a theory that since the lien reduced the value of the house (try getting a home improvement loan on a home with a lien) that real estate taxes should be disallowed, or that the lien holder be the payer.

Lien's don't reduce the value of a house.

(Not getting loan to improve the condition of the house is not a reduction in the existing value of the house.)


>>>>

Part of the theory is, that by not being able to maintain the home, and borrowing money to do so, the home loses value. The entity that holds the lien then assumes the role of the person responsible for the upkeep of its value.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.

Placing a lien on the home doesn't mean the State is taking away their home.

A lien on a property means the property can't be sold while the lien is in place. What it does is prevent debtors from selling assets (in this case a home) and skipping town with the profit on the sale of the asset.

Lien's on real property are a normal part of the business process if someone refused to pay a debt.

On top of that the Klien's can still appeal the BOLI ruling in court challenging both the fine and request an injunction against the lien during the appeal process. The courts would then make the call.


>>>>

Liens are a bitch, no doubt, but there is a theory that since the lien reduced the value of the house (try getting a home improvement loan on a home with a lien) that real estate taxes should be disallowed, or that the lien holder be the payer.

Lien's don't reduce the value of a house.

(Not getting loan to improve the condition of the house is not a reduction in the existing value of the house.)


>>>>

Part of the theory is, that by not being able to maintain the home, and borrowing money to do so, the home loses value. The entity that holds the lien then assumes the role of the person responsible for the upkeep of its value.

Not being able to sell the home by having a lien and not being able to skip town with the profit does not mean the house is not being maintained.

My mortgage company has held the loan on this house for 16 years. They have a lien on the house and I cannot sell it without them releasing the lien. They are not responsible for maintaining the house.

Since the damage award is $135,000 and they have collected about $500,000 in donations, then they shouldn't have a problem maintaining the home.

>>>>

 

[Vandalshandle]

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.
This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Then they should pay the damned money. Not seeing a problem here, they raised twice that from bigots on line.

I would refuse. They should do what their religious convictions lead them to do.
Or perhaps they will pay the fine, and yet continue to practice their faith.

Regardless, that isn't the point. The point is they are in fact being threatened in losing their home. As much as you leftist claim to never try and punish people of faith, here is a clear example that you are.

Does their faith require them to publish the name and addresses of the two lesbians on Facebook, and through the press, subjecting them and their families' to stalking and death threats?

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.
This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Then they should pay the damned money. Not seeing a problem here, they raised twice that from bigots on line.

I would refuse. They should do what their religious convictions lead them to do.
Or perhaps they will pay the fine, and yet continue to practice their faith.

Regardless, that isn't the point. The point is they are in fact being threatened in losing their home. As much as you leftist claim to never try and punish people of faith, here is a clear example that you are.

Does their faith require them to publish the name and addresses of the two lesbians on Facebook, and through the press, subjecting them and their families' to stalking and death threats?

The moment the lesbos decided to make a stink about it they gave up any right to privacy

 

[Vandalshandle]

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.
This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Then they should pay the damned money. Not seeing a problem here, they raised twice that from bigots on line.

I would refuse. They should do what their religious convictions lead them to do.
Or perhaps they will pay the fine, and yet continue to practice their faith.

Regardless, that isn't the point. The point is they are in fact being threatened in losing their home. As much as you leftist claim to never try and punish people of faith, here is a clear example that you are.

Does their faith require them to publish the name and addresses of the two lesbians on Facebook, and through the press, subjecting them and their families' to stalking and death threats?

The moment the lesbos decided to make a stink about it they gave up any right to privacy

Sorry, Sas, but I really should have put you on ignore long ago. Your pride in your bigotry is hateful and I have no need to be sucked into your world of negativity. Adios.....

 

[Andylusion]

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.

Placing a lien on the home doesn't mean the State is taking away their home.

A lien on a property means the property can't be sold while the lien is in place. What it does is prevent debtors from selling assets (in this case a home) and skipping town with the profit on the sale of the asset.

Lien's on real property are a normal part of the business process if someone refused to pay a debt.

On top of that the Klien's can still appeal the BOLI ruling in court challenging both the fine and request an injunction against the lien during the appeal process. The courts would then make the call.


>>>>

Liens are a bitch, no doubt, but there is a theory that since the lien reduced the value of the house (try getting a home improvement loan on a home with a lien) that real estate taxes should be disallowed, or that the lien holder be the payer.

There's no reason to have a lien put on their house. Purportedly, they've already collected over $200 in donations; there's no excuse not to put $135K of it into an escrow account until their appeal is settled.

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.


Fox News is reporting that the fascist state of Oregon is ramping up its persecution campaign against Christian bakers who declined to bake a wedding cake for a same sex lesbian couple. Aaron and Melissa Klein, the owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa, have been told that if they don’t pay the $135,000 awarded to the lesbian couple who sued them, a lien will be placed against their home next week.

Speaking to Todd Starnes of Fox News, Klein said that the case in on appeal and the couple is worried that if they win the appeal, they will never get their money back. ” “This is intimidation and bullying – that’s exactly what it is,” Klein said.

The fascist state of Orgeon has also placed a gag order on the Kleins that makes it illegal for them to talk openly about their desire to participate and profit from same sex weddings through their small business....

H8 Wins Oregon Threatens Home of Christian Bakers - Breitbart

Look at how the rightie lies ... he claims the state is threatening to take their home; but then links to a Fox News article which doesn't state that.

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.​

This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Are you as stupid as boedicca who claimed the state was threatening to take away their home?

Can a judgment creditor foreclose on my home Nolo.com

If you are sued in court for a sum of money and lose the case, the prevailing party will be granted a judgment. That party may then obtain a judgment lien, which is a lien that attaches to your real estate. In some cases, the judgment creditor can force the sale of your property in order to get paid.​

The creditor can force the home to be sold.

Are you suggesting they can't? Is it a homestead? If it was homestead, then it is exempt.

Are are you trying to mince words by saying "the state didn't specifically threaten 'we are going to take your home'", which would be technically true, but practically irrelevant.

If they refuse to pay, a lien can be placed on the home. If the home has equity to pay the lien, they can ask a judge to force the sale of the home.

What am I missing?

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.
This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Then they should pay the damned money. Not seeing a problem here, they raised twice that from bigots on line.

I would refuse. They should do what their religious convictions lead them to do.
Or perhaps they will pay the fine, and yet continue to practice their faith.

Regardless, that isn't the point. The point is they are in fact being threatened in losing their home. As much as you leftist claim to never try and punish people of faith, here is a clear example that you are.

Does their faith require them to publish the name and addresses of the two lesbians on Facebook, and through the press, subjecting them and their families' to stalking and death threats?

The moment the lesbos decided to make a stink about it they gave up any right to privacy

Sorry, Sas, but I really should have put you on ignore long ago. Your pride in your bigotry is hateful and I have no need to be sucked into your world of negativity. Adios.....

Like I care if a queer ignores me?

 

[Vandalshandle]

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.

Placing a lien on the home doesn't mean the State is taking away their home.

A lien on a property means the property can't be sold while the lien is in place. What it does is prevent debtors from selling assets (in this case a home) and skipping town with the profit on the sale of the asset.

Lien's on real property are a normal part of the business process if someone refused to pay a debt.

On top of that the Klien's can still appeal the BOLI ruling in court challenging both the fine and request an injunction against the lien during the appeal process. The courts would then make the call.


>>>>

Liens are a bitch, no doubt, but there is a theory that since the lien reduced the value of the house (try getting a home improvement loan on a home with a lien) that real estate taxes should be disallowed, or that the lien holder be the payer.

There's no reason to have a lien put on their house. Purportedly, they've already collected over $200 in donations; there's no excuse not to put $135K of it into an escrow account until their appeal is settled.

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.


Fox News is reporting that the fascist state of Oregon is ramping up its persecution campaign against Christian bakers who declined to bake a wedding cake for a same sex lesbian couple. Aaron and Melissa Klein, the owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa, have been told that if they don’t pay the $135,000 awarded to the lesbian couple who sued them, a lien will be placed against their home next week.

Speaking to Todd Starnes of Fox News, Klein said that the case in on appeal and the couple is worried that if they win the appeal, they will never get their money back. ” “This is intimidation and bullying – that’s exactly what it is,” Klein said.

The fascist state of Orgeon has also placed a gag order on the Kleins that makes it illegal for them to talk openly about their desire to participate and profit from same sex weddings through their small business....

H8 Wins Oregon Threatens Home of Christian Bakers - Breitbart

Look at how the rightie lies ... he claims the state is threatening to take their home; but then links to a Fox News article which doesn't state that.

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.​

This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Are you as stupid as boedicca who claimed the state was threatening to take away their home?

Can a judgment creditor foreclose on my home Nolo.com

If you are sued in court for a sum of money and lose the case, the prevailing party will be granted a judgment. That party may then obtain a judgment lien, which is a lien that attaches to your real estate. In some cases, the judgment creditor can force the sale of your property in order to get paid.​

The creditor can force the home to be sold.

Are you suggesting they can't? Is it a homestead? If it was homestead, then it is exempt.

Are are you trying to mince words by saying "the state didn't specifically threaten 'we are going to take your home'", which would be technically true, but practically irrelevant.

If they refuse to pay, a lien can be placed on the home. If the home has equity to pay the lien, they can ask a judge to force the sale of the home.

What am I missing?

Not in my state, they can't. All they can do is wait for you to sell it.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.

Placing a lien on the home doesn't mean the State is taking away their home.

A lien on a property means the property can't be sold while the lien is in place. What it does is prevent debtors from selling assets (in this case a home) and skipping town with the profit on the sale of the asset.

Lien's on real property are a normal part of the business process if someone refused to pay a debt.

On top of that the Klien's can still appeal the BOLI ruling in court challenging both the fine and request an injunction against the lien during the appeal process. The courts would then make the call.


>>>>

Liens are a bitch, no doubt, but there is a theory that since the lien reduced the value of the house (try getting a home improvement loan on a home with a lien) that real estate taxes should be disallowed, or that the lien holder be the payer.

There's no reason to have a lien put on their house. Purportedly, they've already collected over $200 in donations; there's no excuse not to put $135K of it into an escrow account until their appeal is settled.

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.


Fox News is reporting that the fascist state of Oregon is ramping up its persecution campaign against Christian bakers who declined to bake a wedding cake for a same sex lesbian couple. Aaron and Melissa Klein, the owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa, have been told that if they don’t pay the $135,000 awarded to the lesbian couple who sued them, a lien will be placed against their home next week.

Speaking to Todd Starnes of Fox News, Klein said that the case in on appeal and the couple is worried that if they win the appeal, they will never get their money back. ” “This is intimidation and bullying – that’s exactly what it is,” Klein said.

The fascist state of Orgeon has also placed a gag order on the Kleins that makes it illegal for them to talk openly about their desire to participate and profit from same sex weddings through their small business....

H8 Wins Oregon Threatens Home of Christian Bakers - Breitbart

Look at how the rightie lies ... he claims the state is threatening to take their home; but then links to a Fox News article which doesn't state that.

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.​

This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Are you as stupid as boedicca who claimed the state was threatening to take away their home?

Can a judgment creditor foreclose on my home Nolo.com

If you are sued in court for a sum of money and lose the case, the prevailing party will be granted a judgment. That party may then obtain a judgment lien, which is a lien that attaches to your real estate. In some cases, the judgment creditor can force the sale of your property in order to get paid.​

The creditor can force the home to be sold.

Are you suggesting they can't? Is it a homestead? If it was homestead, then it is exempt.

Are are you trying to mince words by saying "the state didn't specifically threaten 'we are going to take your home'", which would be technically true, but practically irrelevant.

If they refuse to pay, a lien can be placed on the home. If the home has equity to pay the lien, they can ask a judge to force the sale of the home.

What am I missing?

You are jumping steps in the process.

The process, speaking logically, is A then B then C then D.

Claiming that a creditor placing a lien on the home (step A) means that the state has taken the home (step D).

"A" is a step to ensure that valuable assets are not sold while the debt exists. "A" does not equal "D".


>>>>

 

[Pop23]

Apparently, a $135K fine isn't enough for the Special Snowflake Totalitarians.

Now the state is threatening to take away their home if they don't pay up. This is a preview of future state asset forfeitures for anyone who doesn't share the required Groupthink.

Placing a lien on the home doesn't mean the State is taking away their home.

A lien on a property means the property can't be sold while the lien is in place. What it does is prevent debtors from selling assets (in this case a home) and skipping town with the profit on the sale of the asset.

Lien's on real property are a normal part of the business process if someone refused to pay a debt.

On top of that the Klien's can still appeal the BOLI ruling in court challenging both the fine and request an injunction against the lien during the appeal process. The courts would then make the call.


>>>>

Liens are a bitch, no doubt, but there is a theory that since the lien reduced the value of the house (try getting a home improvement loan on a home with a lien) that real estate taxes should be disallowed, or that the lien holder be the payer.

Lien's don't reduce the value of a house.

(Not getting loan to improve the condition of the house is not a reduction in the existing value of the house.)


>>>>

Part of the theory is, that by not being able to maintain the home, and borrowing money to do so, the home loses value. The entity that holds the lien then assumes the role of the person responsible for the upkeep of its value.

Not being able to sell the home by having a lien and not being able to skip town with the profit does not mean the house is not being maintained.

My mortgage company has held the loan on this house for 16 years. They have a lien on the house and I cannot sell it without them releasing the lien. They are not responsible for maintaining the house.

Since the damage award is $135,000 and they have collected about $500,000 in donations, then they shouldn't have a problem maintaining the home.

>>>>

True, in this individual case.

Your mortgage is an obligation that you and your mortgage company mutually agreed to with certain pledges each made to each other.

The lien is quit a different animal alltogether

 

[Pop23]

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.
This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Then they should pay the damned money. Not seeing a problem here, they raised twice that from bigots on line.

I would refuse. They should do what their religious convictions lead them to do.
Or perhaps they will pay the fine, and yet continue to practice their faith.

Regardless, that isn't the point. The point is they are in fact being threatened in losing their home. As much as you leftist claim to never try and punish people of faith, here is a clear example that you are.

Does their faith require them to publish the name and addresses of the two lesbians on Facebook, and through the press, subjecting them and their families' to stalking and death threats?

The moment the lesbos decided to make a stink about it they gave up any right to privacy

If it filed in court using their names, then you might be right.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Did you read something other than what I did?

Bakers who refused to make lesbian wedding cake told to pay 135K by Monday -- or else Fox News

Two Christian bakers who refused to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding have been ordered to pay $135,000 in damages by July 13 or else the state of Oregon could place a lien on their home.
This is standard procedure. If you don't pay the fines, they put a lien on your property. Just like if you owed the IRS money, they would put a lien on your home.

Then they should pay the damned money. Not seeing a problem here, they raised twice that from bigots on line.

I would refuse. They should do what their religious convictions lead them to do.
Or perhaps they will pay the fine, and yet continue to practice their faith.

Regardless, that isn't the point. The point is they are in fact being threatened in losing their home. As much as you leftist claim to never try and punish people of faith, here is a clear example that you are.

Does their faith require them to publish the name and addresses of the two lesbians on Facebook, and through the press, subjecting them and their families' to stalking and death threats?

The moment the lesbos decided to make a stink about it they gave up any right to privacy

If it filed in court using their names, then you might be right.

Of course I'm right, it became a matter of public record.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Placing a lien on the home doesn't mean the State is taking away their home.

A lien on a property means the property can't be sold while the lien is in place. What it does is prevent debtors from selling assets (in this case a home) and skipping town with the profit on the sale of the asset.

Lien's on real property are a normal part of the business process if someone refused to pay a debt.

On top of that the Klien's can still appeal the BOLI ruling in court challenging both the fine and request an injunction against the lien during the appeal process. The courts would then make the call.


>>>>

Liens are a bitch, no doubt, but there is a theory that since the lien reduced the value of the house (try getting a home improvement loan on a home with a lien) that real estate taxes should be disallowed, or that the lien holder be the payer.

Lien's don't reduce the value of a house.

(Not getting loan to improve the condition of the house is not a reduction in the existing value of the house.)


>>>>

Part of the theory is, that by not being able to maintain the home, and borrowing money to do so, the home loses value. The entity that holds the lien then assumes the role of the person responsible for the upkeep of its value.

Not being able to sell the home by having a lien and not being able to skip town with the profit does not mean the house is not being maintained.

My mortgage company has held the loan on this house for 16 years. They have a lien on the house and I cannot sell it without them releasing the lien. They are not responsible for maintaining the house.

Since the damage award is $135,000 and they have collected about $500,000 in donations, then they shouldn't have a problem maintaining the home.

>>>>

True, in this individual case.

Your mortgage is an obligation that you and your mortgage company mutually agreed to with certain pledges each made to each other.

The lien is quit a different animal alltogether

Not really.

The property cannot be sold with a lien on it. Whether that lien is derived from a mortgage or from a judicial finding for damages, they restrict the sale of the home.

The Klien's are planning to appeal the finding, as part of the finding they can ask for an injunction preventing the lien. Then it will be up to the State court.


>>>>

 

[Pop23]

Liens are a bitch, no doubt, but there is a theory that since the lien reduced the value of the house (try getting a home improvement loan on a home with a lien) that real estate taxes should be disallowed, or that the lien holder be the payer.

Lien's don't reduce the value of a house.

(Not getting loan to improve the condition of the house is not a reduction in the existing value of the house.)


>>>>

Part of the theory is, that by not being able to maintain the home, and borrowing money to do so, the home loses value. The entity that holds the lien then assumes the role of the person responsible for the upkeep of its value.

Not being able to sell the home by having a lien and not being able to skip town with the profit does not mean the house is not being maintained.

My mortgage company has held the loan on this house for 16 years. They have a lien on the house and I cannot sell it without them releasing the lien. They are not responsible for maintaining the house.

Since the damage award is $135,000 and they have collected about $500,000 in donations, then they shouldn't have a problem maintaining the home.

>>>>

True, in this individual case.

Your mortgage is an obligation that you and your mortgage company mutually agreed to with certain pledges each made to each other.

The lien is quit a different animal alltogether

Not really.

The property cannot be sold with a lien on it. Whether that lien is derived from a mortgage or from a judicial finding for damages, they restrict the sale of the home.

The Klien's are planning to appeal the finding, as part of the finding they can ask for an injunction preventing the lien. Then it will be up to the State court.


>>>>

A mortgage lien and a governmental lien are worlds different!

One is voluntary and the other is forced upon the property.

 

[Pop23]

Then they should pay the damned money. Not seeing a problem here, they raised twice that from bigots on line.

I would refuse. They should do what their religious convictions lead them to do.
Or perhaps they will pay the fine, and yet continue to practice their faith.

Regardless, that isn't the point. The point is they are in fact being threatened in losing their home. As much as you leftist claim to never try and punish people of faith, here is a clear example that you are.

Does their faith require them to publish the name and addresses of the two lesbians on Facebook, and through the press, subjecting them and their families' to stalking and death threats?

The moment the lesbos decided to make a stink about it they gave up any right to privacy

If it filed in court using their names, then you might be right.

Of course I'm right, it became a matter of public record.

Then I'm not seeing the issue? It should have been brought to the parties attention when the violation was reported.

I'm sure during the hearing/trial they would have been notified they would be called.

Public records are, after all, public.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Lien's don't reduce the value of a house.

(Not getting loan to improve the condition of the house is not a reduction in the existing value of the house.)


>>>>

Part of the theory is, that by not being able to maintain the home, and borrowing money to do so, the home loses value. The entity that holds the lien then assumes the role of the person responsible for the upkeep of its value.

Not being able to sell the home by having a lien and not being able to skip town with the profit does not mean the house is not being maintained.

My mortgage company has held the loan on this house for 16 years. They have a lien on the house and I cannot sell it without them releasing the lien. They are not responsible for maintaining the house.

Since the damage award is $135,000 and they have collected about $500,000 in donations, then they shouldn't have a problem maintaining the home.

>>>>

True, in this individual case.

Your mortgage is an obligation that you and your mortgage company mutually agreed to with certain pledges each made to each other.

The lien is quit a different animal alltogether

Not really.

The property cannot be sold with a lien on it. Whether that lien is derived from a mortgage or from a judicial finding for damages, they restrict the sale of the home.

The Klien's are planning to appeal the finding, as part of the finding they can ask for an injunction preventing the lien. Then it will be up to the State court.


>>>>

A mortgage lien and a governmental lien are worlds different!

One is voluntary and the other is forced upon the property.

The method of entering a lien does not change the basic operation of a lien.


>>>>

 

[Andylusion]

I would refuse. They should do what their religious convictions lead them to do. Or perhaps they will pay the fine, and yet continue to practice their faith.

Regardless, that isn't the point. The point is they are in fact being threatened in losing their home. As much as you leftist claim to never try and punish people of faith, here is a clear example that you are.

Hey, there are a whole bunch of people in prison who found Jesus. We still punish them for their crimes.

The Klein's committed a crime. They broke the PA laws of Oregon, and then further complicated matters by publishing the names and addresses of the peopel who complained about them.

THAT'S what they were fined for.

Ok? Did I deny any of the above?

Yes, if you murder someone, and then repent and become a Christian, you still have to pay for the crime. I never suggested otherwise.

And as Christian we are instructed to follow the law as much as we can, provided it doesn't violate our faith. If I see a Christian shoplift from a store, I'm going to turn him in to the police. That is in keeping with my faith.

Nor would I blame pagans for turning him into police.

However, when you throw people in Jail for their faith... that's a different matter. Now I still don't blame you, but I will support and defend a Christian attacked for their faith, to my own death.

You say "well it's the law".... doesn't matter. If the law violates my faith, then you are attacking me for my faith.

I assume you are familiar with Daniel Chapter 6? If not, here's the cliff notes. Daniel was a devout follower of G-d, and prayed to G-d every day. So his enemies convinced the King to make a law that no one could pray to anyone, but the King. Daniel, followed his faith, and continued to pray to G-d. So they charged him with a crime, and sentenced him to death.

"Oh but he was just breaking the law. They were not attacking his faith". No, it was violation of his faith.

Same here. The law is a violation of our faith... thus we are breaking it. You can rationalize the motives all you want, but the fact is you are persecuting us for our faith.

And quite frankly, I fully support what they did in releasing the names and addresses of the people who are persecuting Christians. I think those being accused have a right to face their accuser. And by the way.... it's not just them that is being attacked. All Christians in America are attacked. That's why we have donated to them. I myself have donated to the Memorize Pizza and Sweet Cakes, both. Proudly, by the way.

I agree with the other Christians here. You can have your privacy, when you keep things private. The moment you bring all your crap out in public... then it's public. They choose to make this a public flogging, and so they deserve to have their information out in public. I want to know who is attacking my faith.

And by the way, I absolutely promise here and now, that if what happened to Sweet Cakes, happens to me, I will post the name and address of EVERYONE that does that to me. Not mad.... just making that clear. Absolutely. You attack me in public, I'll make everything I can about you public too.

You reap what you sow.