"The Obamacare implosion is worse than you think"

[william the wie]

Would you stop quoting the people you call idiots? Ignore does not work on quotes

 

[emilynghiem]

you may have posted it before I've never seen it ... so you're just assuming I have seen it before... the fact that you couldn't post it again, says you never posted in the first place after all, you republicans are know liars ... their aren't any government mandates where you get that from is beyond me ...

[MENTION=36822]billyerock1991[/MENTION] is ^ ^ this from you ^ ^ or someone else you quoted?

(1) for employer mandates, businesses such as Hobby Lobby are required to provide insurance UNDER SPECIFIC REGULATIONS and MINIMUM requirements or ELSE PAY
MILLIONS IN FINES (1.3 million per day due to 1000's of employees = close to 500 million)

(2) for individual mandates, people are required to report on income tax returns that insurance was purchased which MEETS FEDERAL REGULATIONS or else pay
up to 1% of one's earned income (which is double for couples).

If you are saying there are "no govt mandates,"
where are you getting this? What are the expensive federal lawsuits over, then?

What are you considering a mandate if these do not count, billy?

Thanks, trying to understand.

 

[emilynghiem]

so what does it say about the plan that cost 120% more??? it says that plan had noting that would help the people who had it ... thats what it says...

I am only responsible for what I say not for what you (don't) understand.

here's what you don't understand ... again if a plan is going to cost you double, which by the way no plan has yet that Ive seen on any of the ACA plans has gone up 120% as a silver plan owner, I saw my plan cut in half of the cost .... almost 5 times cut the cost of the deductible... I went to 1200 dollar deductible when I had a 5000 dollar deductible ... It cover more then the plan I use to have ... so you won't convince me with your inability to understand what the ACA plans are and what they really cost ...what are these "the ten essentials" you speak of ??? I challenge you or anyone here to show us where your past health care plan ... then show us where these ten things caused it to go up 120% ... the name of that plan .... you won't come up with one ... all you're doing is quoting some right wing site and you call that your proof ... show us on the ACA web site ... that's what I call a understanding of what things cost and what are lies ...

Examples of ppl I know personally
1. My friend D would normally have gotten free help at the county hospital through a gold card. Because the household income counts his and his mother's benefits (which isn't enough to pay their bills much less medical bills) then he would have to pay 8800.00 out of pocket before insurance covers. In the meantime his body is breaking down and suffering.
He does not have any money at all. He lost his job due to his health failing and all his cards are maxed out.

2. My friend C is in great health and can wait to buy insurance, and does not need it now when there are other expenses he needs to pay for first.

If this bill continues without changing the mandates, the tax penalty will deduct 1% of his income automatically.

So that is thousands of dollars more that he never agreed to pay under federal mandates.

Note: I asked him about buying cheap insurance, but his Constitutional beliefs do not allow him or me to go along with forcing people to buy things because of federal govt we believe is being ABUSED unconstitutionally.

if he consented to compromise, then this could be an option.

but if people are not willing to compromise their beliefs in Constitutional govt and limits,
then this penalty itself is "discriminating against people on the basis of creed."

So it is costing more money, and normally C would have freedom as before to buy insurance or not, and NOT violate any beliefs about Constitutional limits on govt.
But now with these mandates in place, there is no way to buy insurance freely, in keeping with beliefs in civil liberty, because of govt regulations and mandates imposed globally.

3. I currently get my insurance through work. Because of threats to cut the staff and jobs where I work, I have been under CONSTANT strain and even depression from worrying that I would not be able to buy REQUIRED insurance if my work got cut.

I am using my salary from both my jobs to pay for charges on credit where I invested money in helping historic community and school districts suffering damage from govt abuses. So I need that money to pay bills (caused by govt abuses and destruction of community nonprofits and volunteers relying on my salaries to operate).

So this ACA added pressure and threats to cut my income, where before I was free to get help from other family and friends to pay medical costs "if these came up."

I no longer have that freedom, but would be forced by govt to pay for medical care "in advance through insurance" instead of paying more immediate emergency costs whle the other costs could be "covered other ways besides forcing me to buy insurance or pay fines"

4. Added note: because I do not have a lawyer or access or resources to sue to regain my freedom that was lost because of these mandates, I am stuck with the pressure on me.

Not only do I have to keep working two jobs to pay for other damages by govt abuse, but now have to do so with this added pressure, and with no legal recourse to defend or get back the freedom that has been imposed upon.

So now I suffer political discrimination on top of the problems I was already paying for caused by govt abuse and lack of accountability for the damages dumped on me to pay because nobody else would help.

Thanks but no thanks.
Nobody will listen because they are too busy fighting politically to solve the problem.
so 5. all the people who cannot buy the medicine or access the treatment they had before
are NOT being heard because of political media bias where people don't trust news sources.
(just like iraq vets getting antibiotics from the feed stores because the gulf syndrome didn't exist.)

I cannot find a lawyer to help (because it is too expensive to sue over a principle -- there have to be monetary damages that lawyers can use to get paid from for the work it takes,
and when you throw in fighting govt where their legal expenses are paid for with infinite public funds, that is never an equal battle when you are paying for both sides if you get help at all for yours)
and neither can my friend D find help whose health is failing and body is barely staying alive while he waits for "something to change."

If the point was to make health care accessible and affordable for all,
why aren't the Democrats lending money to help people until it can be paid back when the benefits come in?

I put my own money into fixing problems caused by Democrat abuses of govt.
Why am I expected to pay even more on top of that?

Why is "buying insurance the only way" that isn't fined with penalties I can't afford to pay or make others pay without violating our beliefs in this being unconstitutional?
If I think saving national history from being destroyed by govt abuses at taxpayers expense
is MORE important than buying insurance, why should I be fined? why can't I get help with health care from charity and use my income to solve other problems caused by govt abuse?
Why should I be forced to pay even more money when I didn't commit abuses, while people who DID commit govt abuse as public expense are not required to pay back costs?

How backwards is this?

 

[Zoom-boing]

you may have posted it before I've never seen it ... so you're just assuming I have seen it before... the fact that you couldn't post it again, says you never posted in the first place after all, you republicans are know liars ...

A total immature idiot will be a total immature idiot.

as always ya got nuttin' here we have zoom ding-a-ling posting 120% cost and he couldn't seem to remember that he posted one thread back... and with your lack of brilliance to defend him you try and call me the idiot ... I hope you're not attorney, looks like you got egg on your face, and one lost case ... I love it when you republicans are cornered with your stupid remarks ... it makes you even look more stupids, if there's such a thing ...

You're the idiot would fails to comprehend, as YOU posted this in reference to the 120% icrease:

no plan has yet that Ive seen on any of the ACA plans has gone up 120%

Derpy derp. Those increases aren't referring to the (un)aca. Where'd you get that from? Oh yeah, you just spewed it out because you don't know what they hell you're talking about.

From the link:

Local insurance brokers are reporting spikes ranging from 35 percent to 120 percent on policies that renew from July to December. The increases are especially acute among employers with workforces made up of younger, healthier men. That’s because Obamacare prohibits offering lower rates to healthier groups. It also narrows the allowed premium gap between older and younger enrollees.

obamacare prohibits (forbids) offering lower rates to healthier groups. Why oh WHY? So that all those who DO have a pre-exsiting condition don't have to pay more. Those healthier people are now paying more IN THE FORM OF HIGHER PREMIUMS, for all the reasons I've previously listed AS WELL AS to cover the lower costs that those with p.e.'s get to enjoy. That is utter bullshit, feel good "fairness" from the lying lips of obama. People who have a p.e. are a higher risk to insure and THEY SHOULD be paying more. Period.

In fucking loonatic leftist world, everything has to be fair and equal. Bullshit.

 

[billyerock1991]

I am only responsible for what I say not for what you (don't) understand.

here's what you don't understand ... again if a plan is going to cost you double, which by the way no plan has yet that Ive seen on any of the ACA plans has gone up 120% as a silver plan owner, I saw my plan cut in half of the cost .... almost 5 times cut the cost of the deductible... I went to 1200 dollar deductible when I had a 5000 dollar deductible ... It cover more then the plan I use to have ... so you won't convince me with your inability to understand what the ACA plans are and what they really cost ...what are these "the ten essentials" you speak of ??? I challenge you or anyone here to show us where your past health care plan ... then show us where these ten things caused it to go up 120% ... the name of that plan .... you won't come up with one ... all you're doing is quoting some right wing site and you call that your proof ... show us on the ACA web site ... that's what I call a understanding of what things cost and what are lies ...

Examples of ppl I know personally
1. My friend D would normally have gotten free help at the county hospital through a gold card. Because the household income counts his and his mother's benefits (which isn't enough to pay their bills much less medical bills) then he would have to pay 8800.00 out of pocket before insurance covers. In the meantime his body is breaking down and suffering.
He does not have any money at all. He lost his job due to his health failing and all his cards are maxed out.

2. My friend C is in great health and can wait to buy insurance, and does not need it now when there are other expenses he needs to pay for first.

If this bill continues without changing the mandates, the tax penalty will deduct 1% of his income automatically.

So that is thousands of dollars more that he never agreed to pay under federal mandates.

Note: I asked him about buying cheap insurance, but his Constitutional beliefs do not allow him or me to go along with forcing people to buy things because of federal govt we believe is being ABUSED unconstitutionally.

if he consented to compromise, then this could be an option.

but if people are not willing to compromise their beliefs in Constitutional govt and limits,
then this penalty itself is "discriminating against people on the basis of creed."

So it is costing more money, and normally C would have freedom as before to buy insurance or not, and NOT violate any beliefs about Constitutional limits on govt.
But now with these mandates in place, there is no way to buy insurance freely, in keeping with beliefs in civil liberty, because of govt regulations and mandates imposed globally.

3. I currently get my insurance through work. Because of threats to cut the staff and jobs where I work, I have been under CONSTANT strain and even depression from worrying that I would not be able to buy REQUIRED insurance if my work got cut.

I am using my salary from both my jobs to pay for charges on credit where I invested money in helping historic community and school districts suffering damage from govt abuses. So I need that money to pay bills (caused by govt abuses and destruction of community nonprofits and volunteers relying on my salaries to operate).

So this ACA added pressure and threats to cut my income, where before I was free to get help from other family and friends to pay medical costs "if these came up."

I no longer have that freedom, but would be forced by govt to pay for medical care "in advance through insurance" instead of paying more immediate emergency costs whle the other costs could be "covered other ways besides forcing me to buy insurance or pay fines"

4. Added note: because I do not have a lawyer or access or resources to sue to regain my freedom that was lost because of these mandates, I am stuck with the pressure on me.

Not only do I have to keep working two jobs to pay for other damages by govt abuse, but now have to do so with this added pressure, and with no legal recourse to defend or get back the freedom that has been imposed upon.

So now I suffer political discrimination on top of the problems I was already paying for caused by govt abuse and lack of accountability for the damages dumped on me to pay because nobody else would help.

Thanks but no thanks.
Nobody will listen because they are too busy fighting politically to solve the problem.
so 5. all the people who cannot buy the medicine or access the treatment they had before
are NOT being heard because of political media bias where people don't trust news sources.
(just like iraq vets getting antibiotics from the feed stores because the gulf syndrome didn't exist.)

I cannot find a lawyer to help (because it is too expensive to sue over a principle -- there have to be monetary damages that lawyers can use to get paid from for the work it takes,
and when you throw in fighting govt where their legal expenses are paid for with infinite public funds, that is never an equal battle when you are paying for both sides if you get help at all for yours)
and neither can my friend D find help whose health is failing and body is barely staying alive while he waits for "something to change."

If the point was to make health care accessible and affordable for all,
why aren't the Democrats lending money to help people until it can be paid back when the benefits come in?

I put my own money into fixing problems caused by Democrat abuses of govt.
Why am I expected to pay even more on top of that?

Why is "buying insurance the only way" that isn't fined with penalties I can't afford to pay or make others pay without violating our beliefs in this being unconstitutional?
If I think saving national history from being destroyed by govt abuses at taxpayers expense
is MORE important than buying insurance, why should I be fined? why can't I get help with health care from charity and use my income to solve other problems caused by govt abuse?
Why should I be forced to pay even more money when I didn't commit abuses, while people who DID commit govt abuse as public expense are not required to pay back costs?

How backwards is this?

emily you need to stop copying your post from that weird web site you go to all the time and paste it here as if it has some sort of value... these
alleged scenarios of yours are funny at best

the guy said he had to pay his deductible first before he could get his meds... that's a lie ... I know it, they know it ... for somebody having to pay for their deductible first and not get health care that's a lie too .... all they have to do is show up in any emergency room and they will take him in and fix the problem .... then they disguss the deductible if they lost their job thanks to obama care they can go on medicaid ... so I don't buy your poor poor pitiful A B AND C scenarios ... you were trying to make it as if it were some real person, I know its made up...

 

[billyerock1991]

A total immature idiot will be a total immature idiot.

as always ya got nuttin' here we have zoom ding-a-ling posting 120% cost and he couldn't seem to remember that he posted one thread back... and with your lack of brilliance to defend him you try and call me the idiot ... I hope you're not attorney, looks like you got egg on your face, and one lost case ... I love it when you republicans are cornered with your stupid remarks ... it makes you even look more stupids, if there's such a thing ...

You're the idiot would fails to comprehend, as YOU posted this in reference to the 120% icrease:

no plan has yet that Ive seen on any of the ACA plans has gone up 120%

Derpy derp. Those increases aren't referring to the (un)aca. Where'd you get that from? Oh yeah, you just spewed it out because you don't know what they hell you're talking about.

From the link:

Local insurance brokers are reporting spikes ranging from 35 percent to 120 percent on policies that renew from July to December. The increases are especially acute among employers with workforces made up of younger, healthier men. That’s because Obamacare prohibits offering lower rates to healthier groups. It also narrows the allowed premium gap between older and younger enrollees.

obamacare prohibits (forbids) offering lower rates to healthier groups. Why oh WHY? So that all those who DO have a pre-exsiting condition don't have to pay more. Those healthier people are now paying more IN THE FORM OF HIGHER PREMIUMS, for all the reasons I've previously listed AS WELL AS to cover the lower costs that those with p.e.'s get to enjoy. That is utter bullshit, feel good "fairness" from the lying lips of obama. People who have a p.e. are a higher risk to insure and THEY SHOULD be paying more. Period.

In fucking loonatic leftist world, everything has to be fair and equal. Bullshit.

you know whats real funny ??? here I posted Zoom ding-a-ling's post now he's arguing with me that his post is wrong ... that's what Ive been saying from the beginning ... it can't get any better then that...Zoom ding-a-ling posted bull shit, then you call them on it, they say your lying, because now their post isn't true ... below is this fools post

Old 05-05-2014, 05:57 PM
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Zoom-boing Zoom-boing is offline
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Quote:
LAS VEGAS REVIEW-JOURNAL

Local business owners might be hoping the Affordable Care Act’s insurance mandates cover sticker shock.

The law’s employer coverage mandate doesn’t take effect until 2015, but early plan renewals are starting to roll in. And for some businesses, the premium jumps are positively painful.

Local insurance brokers are reporting spikes ranging from 35 percent to 120 percent on policies that renew from July to December. The increases are especially acute among employers with workforces made up of younger, healthier men. That’s because Obamacare prohibits offering lower rates to healthier groups. It also narrows the allowed premium gap between older and younger enrollees.

“It’s like if there were no more safe-driver discounts with State Farm,” said local insurance broker Frank Nolimal of Assurance Ltd. “Everybody has the same rate, whether you have three DUIs, or you’re a (nondrinking) churchgoing Mormon.”

The changes put as many as 90,000 policies across Nevada at risk of cancellation or nonrenewal this fall, said Las Vegas insurance broker William Wright, president of Chamber Insurance and Benefits. That’s more than three times the 25,000 enrollees affected in October, when Obamacare-compliant plans first hit the market.

Some workers are at higher risk than others of losing company-sponsored coverage. Professional, white-collar companies such as law or engineering firms will bite the bullet and renew at higher prices because they need to compete for scarce skilled labor, Nolimal said.

But moderately skilled or low-skilled people making $8 to $14 an hour working for landscaping businesses, fire-prevention firms or fencing companies could lose work-based coverage because the plans cost so much relative to salaries.

Employees who keep their coverage might see leaner take-home pay, which could hurt the economy.

Nolimal said one business client whose monthly premiums will rise from $160 to $340 in June plans to shift most of the increase onto his employees.

“Just like when you see gasoline prices going up an extra dime a gallon, it takes money out of the economy for things like buying a new stereo or having dinner out on the town,” Nolimal said.

The premium hikes could have political implications, as well. Nolimal estimated that as many as 85 percent of small-group plans will renew in November and December. Because new premiums go out 60 days before coverage takes effect, those price hikes will hit mailboxes in September and October — just before November’s elections.
Own a small business? Brace for Obamacare pain | Las Vegas Review-Journal
__________________
During the 3 1/2 years of World War II that started with the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbor in December 1941 and ended with the surrender of Germany and Japan in 1945, the U.S. produced 22 aircraft carriers, 8 battleships, 48 cruisers, 349 destroyers, 420 destroyer escorts, 203 submarines, 34 million tons of merchant ships, 100,000 fighter aircraft, 98,000 bombers, 24,000 transport aircraft, 58,000 training aircraft, 93,000 tanks, 257,000 artillery pieces, 105,000 mortars, 3,000,000 machine guns, and 2,500,000 military trucks. We put 16.1 million men in uniform in the various armed services, invaded Africa, invaded Sicily and Italy, won the battle for the Atlantic, planned and executed D-Day, marched across the Pacific and Europe, developed the atomic bomb and ultimately conquered Japan and Germany.

It's worth noting, that during almost the exact amount of time, the Obama administration couldn't build a functioning web site.

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now he's arguing with himself

 

[Zoom-boing]

^ Even when highlighted and specifically shown what he failed to understand, bill-ye-has-a-head-full-of-idiot still doesn't get it.

So what does bill-ye-has-drunk-the-koolaid-and-is-a-believer do? He reposts the article that he misunderstood!



bill-ye-are-a-dope-fer-shure can't seem to figure out how the quote function works either.

Cya, bill-ye-are-too-stupid-to-respond-to-anymore-I'm-done-with-ye.

 

[Amelia]

Obamacare Employer Mandate Will Hurt Low-Wage Workers

 

[billyerock1991]

^ Even when highlighted and specifically shown what he failed to understand, bill-ye-has-a-head-full-of-idiot still doesn't get it.

So what does bill-ye-has-drunk-the-koolaid-and-is-a-believer do? He reposts the article that he misunderstood!



bill-ye-are-a-dope-fer-shure can't seem to figure out how the quote function works either.

Cya, bill-ye-are-too-stupid-to-respond-to-anymore-I'm-done-with-ye.

translation=you should have said OOPs I goofed ....

instead ya made a bigger fool of yourself ... it was your post that I quoted ...you came back and challenged me that I'm wrong after quoting your source ...that you said your post was bull ... I though "WHAT THE FUCK" he's arguing with himself ... thats funny ... so Zoom-ding-a-ling tries to save face .. oh you really got be BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOY... I'm a just a stinging all over my body....

 

[Amelia]

Californians with Obamacare are driving to Mexico for cheaper, better healthcare

 

[william the wie]

Californians with Obamacare are driving to Mexico for cheaper, better healthcare

How much is the increase in CA and TX?

 

[Zoom-boing]

^ Even when highlighted and specifically shown what he failed to understand, bill-ye-has-a-head-full-of-idiot still doesn't get it.

So what does bill-ye-has-drunk-the-koolaid-and-is-a-believer do? He reposts the article that he misunderstood!



bill-ye-are-a-dope-fer-shure can't seem to figure out how the quote function works either.

Cya, bill-ye-are-too-stupid-to-respond-to-anymore-I'm-done-with-ye.

translation=you should have said OOPs I goofed ....

instead ya made a bigger fool of yourself ... it was your post that I quoted ...you came back and challenged me that I'm wrong after quoting your source ...that you said your post was bull ... I though "WHAT THE FUCK" he's arguing with himself ... thats funny ... so Zoom-ding-a-ling tries to save face .. oh you really got be BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOY... I'm a just a stinging all over my body....

^ Projection and lack of reading comprehension.

The link never said that the plans on the (un)aca were increasing by 120%, moron. YOU did.

 

[billyerock1991]

^ Even when highlighted and specifically shown what he failed to understand, bill-ye-has-a-head-full-of-idiot still doesn't get it.

So what does bill-ye-has-drunk-the-koolaid-and-is-a-believer do? He reposts the article that he misunderstood!



bill-ye-are-a-dope-fer-shure can't seem to figure out how the quote function works either.

Cya, bill-ye-are-too-stupid-to-respond-to-anymore-I'm-done-with-ye.

translation=you should have said OOPs I goofed ....

instead ya made a bigger fool of yourself ... it was your post that I quoted ...you came back and challenged me that I'm wrong after quoting your source ...that you said your post was bull ... I though "WHAT THE FUCK" he's arguing with himself ... thats funny ... so Zoom-ding-a-ling tries to save face .. oh you really got be BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOY... I'm a just a stinging all over my body....

^ Projection and lack of reading comprehension.

The link never said that the plans on the (un)aca were increasing by 120%, moron. YOU did.

so you/re sayin it was implied meaning right ??? so when the president says you can save as much as 2500 dollars a year in health care cost, that doesn't imply he's promising you will save 2500 dollars a year, right ??? or am I to believe that 120% is what the cost is going to be ...

 

[Zoom-boing]

translation=you should have said OOPs I goofed ....

instead ya made a bigger fool of yourself ... it was your post that I quoted ...you came back and challenged me that I'm wrong after quoting your source ...that you said your post was bull ... I though "WHAT THE FUCK" he's arguing with himself ... thats funny ... so Zoom-ding-a-ling tries to save face .. oh you really got be BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOY... I'm a just a stinging all over my body....

^ Projection and lack of reading comprehension.

The link never said that the plans on the (un)aca were increasing by 120%, moron. YOU did.

so you/re sayin it was implied meaning right ??? so when the president says you can save as much as 2500 dollars a year in health care cost, that doesn't imply he's promising you will save 2500 dollars a year, right ??? or am I to believe that 120% is what the cost is going to be ...

How do you even remember to breath on your own?

The plans on the (UN)ACA are not the ones increasing by 35%-120%, that is NOT what the article said. That was YOUR claim, see YOUR quote below. It was pointed out to you several times . . . but all you can do is blather and change the subject. Loser.

again if a plan is going to cost you double, which by the way no plan has yet that Ive seen on any of the ACA plans has gone up 120%

obama did say that premiums for the typical family would decrease by $2,500 per year. He ran on it. You missed that the way you missed the ten mandated essentials.

obama not only promised to cut the typical family's premium by $2,500/yr, he went even further ... it wasn't policy or ideology, he made a moral commitment. But he didn't sign any such law that would cut the typical family's premium, did he? His promise (pledge) was a lie.

I have made a solemn pledge that I will sign a universal health care bill into law by the end of my first term as president that will cover every American and cut the cost of a typical family's premiums by up to $2500 a year. That's not simply a matter of policy or ideology – it's a moral commitment.

A Politics of Conscience

^ Not good enough? Go to minte 2:09 on the vid ...

"My plan begins by covering every American. If you already have health insurance the only thing that will change for you under this plan is the amount of money you will spend on premiums. That will be less than what you're spending now."



Premiums have gone up on those who already have insurance, premiums haven't gone down, certainly not by the $2,500 he said they would go down by.

When it came to health care premiums for the typical family, Obama said he would cut the annual cost by $2,500. Months before Obama took office, a New York Times reporter dubbed it one of the most audacious pledges of the campaign.

We reached out to David Cutler, an economist who advised Obama during the 2008 campaign and helped calculate the $2,500 figure that appeared in Obama's speeches. He said the calculation encompassed total health care costs, not just premiums. These would include out-of-pocket costs, employer-provided insurance costs, and taxes to pay for public insurance programs.

Cutler acknowledged that Obama made "occasional misstatements&#8221; that tied the $2,500 reduction to premiums and not total medical spending. We can't judge whether Obama misspoke, but we checked the Project Vote Smart database of public statements by politicians, which shows that Obama said premiums (and only premiums) would go down for the typical or average family by $2,500 repeatedly. You can see examples throughout the arc of his 2008 presidential campaign here, here, here, and here. <-- these are links at the site showing obama saying premiums would be reduced.

It is also true that Obama used the number in a more expansive context sometimes, such as here during a speech in Newport News, Va, and here in a response to a report about Medicare and Social Security.

The Obameter: Cut the cost of a typical family's health insurance premium by up to $2,500 a year | PolitiFact


Here is obama saying the same:

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_o65vMUk5so#t=12[/ame]


And again in writing if you can't access the vid.


August 6, 2008

OBAMA: A system where we're gonna work with your employers to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

October 4, 2008

OBAMA: We will start by reducing premiums by as much as $2,500 per family.

September 6, 2008

OBAMA: Here's what change is saying to people who already have health insurance and the employers who are providing it: We'll work to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

May 3, 2008

OBAMA: I also have a health care plan that would save the average family $2,500 on their premiums.

January 3, 2008

OBAMA: And if you already have health care, then we're gonna reduce costs an average of $2,500 per family on premiums.


October 7, 2008

OBAMA: We're gonna work with your employer to lower the costs of your premiums by up to $2,500 a year.

Campaign Ad

OBAMA: And we'll cut the costs of a typical family's health care by up to $2,500 per year.

March 14, 2008

OBAMA: And if you've got health care, we're gonna work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

February 23, 2008

OBAMA: And we will lower premiums for the typical family by $2,500 a year.

June 17, 2007

OBAMA: And cut the cost of health care by up to $2,500 per family.

August 17, 2008

OBAMA: And if you already have health care, then we're gonna work with your employer to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

Campaign Ad

EVAN BAYH: Barack's policies will provide health care cost reductions of about $2,500 for the typical family.

June 27, 2008

OBAMA: It's time to bring down the typical family's premium by about $2,500. And it's time to bring down the costs for the entire country.

February 19, 2008

OBAMA: And if you already have health insurance, we will lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

April 22, 2008

OBAMA: We're gonna work with your employer through a catastrophic reinsurance plan to lower premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

October 15, 2008

OBAMA: The only thing we're gonna try to do is lower costs so that those cost savings are passed on to you. And we estimate we can cut the average family's premium by about $2,500 a year.

March 1, 2008

OBAMA: We'll work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

Campaign Ad

NARRATOR: Barack Obama will provide rural America with affordable health care, and save the typical American family $2,500 a year.

May 30, 2008

OBAMA: And reduces every family's premiums by as much as $2,500.

April 20, 2008

OBAMA: If your employer does offer you health care, then we're gonna work with your employer to lower premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

March 13, 2008

OBAMA: And cut the cost of a typical family's premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

FREEDOM EDEN: Obama: 20 Promises for $2,500



You got a plan from the (un)aca. Do you get a subsidy?

 

[Zoom-boing]

Just talked to my brother. You know, the one who had an individual catastrophic policy that he paid $170/month low deductible for and that obama magically allowed him to keep until now. He just got his letter from BC .... for the plan that they are saying is close to his old plan he will now be paying $500 dollars a month with a $6,000 deductible.

If health insurance wasn't affordable prior to this train wreck how the hell is it affordable now??

 

[william the wie]

Just talked to my brother. You know, the one who had an individual catastrophic policy that he paid $170/month no deductible for and that obama magically allowed him to keep until now. He just got his letter from BC .... for the plan that they are saying is close to his old plan he will now be paying $500 dollars a month with a $6,000 deductible.

If health insurance wasn't affordable prior to this train wreck how the hell is it affordable now??

That is slowly getting out. But the killer will be the drip, drip, drip of bad news on many fronts.

 

[emilynghiem]

Dear [MENTION=36822]billyerock1991[/MENTION]:
Thanks for the progress! at least I am not being confused with a different person.
As for different websites, it is the other way around, billy.

I take issues from my real life, trying to live in a politically historic district,
and paste THAT online, filling up my own websites, and also forums like this
with the same garbage, which has been going on for the 20 years I have volunteered.

Glad you find this funny, it is so sad I have written it as Political Satire.

Unfortunately, billy, it is real.
If you have questions for my friend Daron, he has nothing to gain by lying.
As a Democrat no one will listen to his story, not even you, so there is no political gain.

Note: To clarify your point, because his condition is longterm and requires a year for the next stage of medical treatment, there is NO WAY the ER can take care of this.

They will refer him elsewhere that can, and that costs money.

I had another friend whose cancer was not treated properly in time through the county system, and it cost him time that sped up the spread of cancer and shortened his remaining time.

Sorry to say, the health care bill did not solve any of these problems.
There were there before, and they are still here; because the issue of service provision was not addressed; only getting more people signed up under insurance plans.

So the people this helps get help, the people this doesn't help don't get help,
and the people who don't agree with paying for a new system that doesn't help everyone
are pissed off on all sides -- both the Singlepayer folks and the free market folks who aren't represented by this set up, but are forced to pay for insurance under terms none of us agreed to.

emily you need to stop copying your post from that weird web site you go to all the time and paste it here as if it has some sort of value... these
alleged scenarios of yours are funny at best

the guy said he had to pay his deductible first before he could get his meds... that's a lie ... I know it, they know it ... for somebody having to pay for their deductible first and not get health care that's a lie too .... all they have to do is show up in any emergency room and they will take him in and fix the problem .... then they disguss the deductible if they lost their job thanks to obama care they can go on medicaid ... so I don't buy your poor poor pitiful A B AND C scenarios ... you were trying to make it as if it were some real person, I know its made up...

 

[billyerock1991]

Dear [MENTION=36822]billyerock1991[/MENTION]:
Thanks for the progress! at least I am not being confused with a different person.
As for different websites, it is the other way around, billy.

I take issues from my real life, trying to live in a politically historic district,
and paste THAT online, filling up my own websites, and also forums like this
with the same garbage, which has been going on for the 20 years I have volunteered.

Glad you find this funny, it is so sad I have written it as Political Satire.

Unfortunately, billy, it is real.
If you have questions for my friend Daron, he has nothing to gain by lying.
As a Democrat no one will listen to his story, not even you, so there is no political gain.

Note: To clarify your point, because his condition is longterm and requires a year for the next stage of medical treatment, there is NO WAY the ER can take care of this.

They will refer him elsewhere that can, and that costs money.

I had another friend whose cancer was not treated properly in time through the county system, and it cost him time that sped up the spread of cancer and shortened his remaining time.

Sorry to say, the health care bill did not solve any of these problems.
There were there before, and they are still here; because the issue of service provision was not addressed; only getting more people signed up under insurance plans.

So the people this helps get help, the people this doesn't help don't get help,
and the people who don't agree with paying for a new system that doesn't help everyone
are pissed off on all sides -- both the Singlepayer folks and the free market folks who aren't represented by this set up, but are forced to pay for insurance under terms none of us agreed to.

emily you need to stop copying your post from that weird web site you go to all the time and paste it here as if it has some sort of value... these
alleged scenarios of yours are funny at best

the guy said he had to pay his deductible first before he could get his meds... that's a lie ... I know it, they know it ... for somebody having to pay for their deductible first and not get health care that's a lie too .... all they have to do is show up in any emergency room and they will take him in and fix the problem .... then they disguss the deductible if they lost their job thanks to obama care they can go on medicaid ... so I don't buy your poor poor pitiful A B AND C scenarios ... you were trying to make it as if it were some real person, I know its made up...

you talk about ACA health care and yet its only been in existents for 5 months ... that's why when I see your story, and that's what it is a story, as bull shit... If he has his insurance through his company, he willt get screw out of anything through the ACA... if he is in his companies insurance program he will get fuck by his insurer ... in 2015 that will be the end of that ... you see he isn't any part of the ACA right now ... you can try to tell me that you get screw by the ACA now, I've bee fucked by the best insurers before the ACA was here ... now that the ACA is here I get the best health care Ive ever had ... so you can tap dance around your bull shit stories on how the ACA is bad, I won't buy it ... Yesterday gallup poll posted that 61% of the american people have said they are happy with the ACA where only 38% aren't ... that too will change ...people who are using it now are getting great service and they are happy with it now ... you can' try all you bullshit scenarios you want, nobody on the ACA insurance programs will buy it ...

 

[billyerock1991]

^ Projection and lack of reading comprehension.

The link never said that the plans on the (un)aca were increasing by 120%, moron. YOU did.

so you/re sayin it was implied meaning right ??? so when the president says you can save as much as 2500 dollars a year in health care cost, that doesn't imply he's promising you will save 2500 dollars a year, right ??? or am I to believe that 120% is what the cost is going to be ...

How do you even remember to breath on your own?

The plans on the (UN)ACA are not the ones increasing by 35%-120%, that is NOT what the article said. That was YOUR claim, see YOUR quote below. It was pointed out to you several times . . . but all you can do is blather and change the subject. Loser.




obama did say that premiums for the typical family would decrease by $2,500 per year. He ran on it. You missed that the way you missed the ten mandated essentials.

obama not only promised to cut the typical family's premium by $2,500/yr, he went even further ... it wasn't policy or ideology, he made a moral commitment. But he didn't sign any such law that would cut the typical family's premium, did he? His promise (pledge) was a lie.

I have made a solemn pledge that I will sign a universal health care bill into law by the end of my first term as president that will cover every American and cut the cost of a typical family's premiums by up to $2500 a year. That's not simply a matter of policy or ideology – it's a moral commitment.

A Politics of Conscience

^ Not good enough? Go to minte 2:09 on the vid ...

"My plan begins by covering every American. If you already have health insurance the only thing that will change for you under this plan is the amount of money you will spend on premiums. That will be less than what you're spending now."



Premiums have gone up on those who already have insurance, premiums haven't gone down, certainly not by the $2,500 he said they would go down by.

When it came to health care premiums for the typical family, Obama said he would cut the annual cost by $2,500. Months before Obama took office, a New York Times reporter dubbed it one of the most audacious pledges of the campaign.

We reached out to David Cutler, an economist who advised Obama during the 2008 campaign and helped calculate the $2,500 figure that appeared in Obama's speeches. He said the calculation encompassed total health care costs, not just premiums. These would include out-of-pocket costs, employer-provided insurance costs, and taxes to pay for public insurance programs.

Cutler acknowledged that Obama made "occasional misstatements” that tied the $2,500 reduction to premiums and not total medical spending. We can't judge whether Obama misspoke, but we checked the Project Vote Smart database of public statements by politicians, which shows that Obama said premiums (and only premiums) would go down for the typical or average family by $2,500 repeatedly. You can see examples throughout the arc of his 2008 presidential campaign here, here, here, and here. <-- these are links at the site showing obama saying premiums would be reduced.

It is also true that Obama used the number in a more expansive context sometimes, such as here during a speech in Newport News, Va, and here in a response to a report about Medicare and Social Security.

The Obameter: Cut the cost of a typical family's health insurance premium by up to $2,500 a year | PolitiFact


Here is obama saying the same:

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_o65vMUk5so#t=12[/ame]


And again in writing if you can't access the vid.


August 6, 2008

OBAMA: A system where we're gonna work with your employers to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

October 4, 2008

OBAMA: We will start by reducing premiums by as much as $2,500 per family.

September 6, 2008

OBAMA: Here's what change is saying to people who already have health insurance and the employers who are providing it: We'll work to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

May 3, 2008

OBAMA: I also have a health care plan that would save the average family $2,500 on their premiums.

January 3, 2008

OBAMA: And if you already have health care, then we're gonna reduce costs an average of $2,500 per family on premiums.


October 7, 2008

OBAMA: We're gonna work with your employer to lower the costs of your premiums by up to $2,500 a year.

Campaign Ad

OBAMA: And we'll cut the costs of a typical family's health care by up to $2,500 per year.

March 14, 2008

OBAMA: And if you've got health care, we're gonna work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

February 23, 2008

OBAMA: And we will lower premiums for the typical family by $2,500 a year.

June 17, 2007

OBAMA: And cut the cost of health care by up to $2,500 per family.

August 17, 2008

OBAMA: And if you already have health care, then we're gonna work with your employer to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

Campaign Ad

EVAN BAYH: Barack's policies will provide health care cost reductions of about $2,500 for the typical family.

June 27, 2008

OBAMA: It's time to bring down the typical family's premium by about $2,500. And it's time to bring down the costs for the entire country.

February 19, 2008

OBAMA: And if you already have health insurance, we will lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

April 22, 2008

OBAMA: We're gonna work with your employer through a catastrophic reinsurance plan to lower premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

October 15, 2008

OBAMA: The only thing we're gonna try to do is lower costs so that those cost savings are passed on to you. And we estimate we can cut the average family's premium by about $2,500 a year.

March 1, 2008

OBAMA: We'll work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

Campaign Ad

NARRATOR: Barack Obama will provide rural America with affordable health care, and save the typical American family $2,500 a year.

May 30, 2008

OBAMA: And reduces every family's premiums by as much as $2,500.

April 20, 2008

OBAMA: If your employer does offer you health care, then we're gonna work with your employer to lower premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

March 13, 2008

OBAMA: And cut the cost of a typical family's premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

FREEDOM EDEN: Obama: 20 Promises for $2,500



You got a plan from the (un)aca. Do you get a subsidy?

you do love to lie don't you Zoom ding-a-ling do you see the word I promise ??? didn't think so ... your dialog here is edited, you do know that don't ya??? I do...

 

[Zoom-boing]

so you/re sayin it was implied meaning right ??? so when the president says you can save as much as 2500 dollars a year in health care cost, that doesn't imply he's promising you will save 2500 dollars a year, right ??? or am I to believe that 120% is what the cost is going to be ...

How do you even remember to breath on your own?

The plans on the (UN)ACA are not the ones increasing by 35%-120%, that is NOT what the article said. That was YOUR claim, see YOUR quote below. It was pointed out to you several times . . . but all you can do is blather and change the subject. Loser.




obama did say that premiums for the typical family would decrease by $2,500 per year. He ran on it. You missed that the way you missed the ten mandated essentials.

obama not only promised to cut the typical family's premium by $2,500/yr, he went even further ... it wasn't policy or ideology, he made a moral commitment. But he didn't sign any such law that would cut the typical family's premium, did he? His promise (pledge) was a lie.



A Politics of Conscience

^ Not good enough? Go to minte 2:09 on the vid ...

"My plan begins by covering every American. If you already have health insurance the only thing that will change for you under this plan is the amount of money you will spend on premiums. That will be less than what you're spending now."



Premiums have gone up on those who already have insurance, premiums haven't gone down, certainly not by the $2,500 he said they would go down by.

When it came to health care premiums for the typical family, Obama said he would cut the annual cost by $2,500. Months before Obama took office, a New York Times reporter dubbed it one of the most audacious pledges of the campaign.

We reached out to David Cutler, an economist who advised Obama during the 2008 campaign and helped calculate the $2,500 figure that appeared in Obama's speeches. He said the calculation encompassed total health care costs, not just premiums. These would include out-of-pocket costs, employer-provided insurance costs, and taxes to pay for public insurance programs.

Cutler acknowledged that Obama made "occasional misstatements&#8221; that tied the $2,500 reduction to premiums and not total medical spending. We can't judge whether Obama misspoke, but we checked the Project Vote Smart database of public statements by politicians, which shows that Obama said premiums (and only premiums) would go down for the typical or average family by $2,500 repeatedly. You can see examples throughout the arc of his 2008 presidential campaign here, here, here, and here. <-- these are links at the site showing obama saying premiums would be reduced.

It is also true that Obama used the number in a more expansive context sometimes, such as here during a speech in Newport News, Va, and here in a response to a report about Medicare and Social Security.

The Obameter: Cut the cost of a typical family's health insurance premium by up to $2,500 a year | PolitiFact


Here is obama saying the same:

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_o65vMUk5so#t=12[/ame]


And again in writing if you can't access the vid.


August 6, 2008

OBAMA: A system where we're gonna work with your employers to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

October 4, 2008

OBAMA: We will start by reducing premiums by as much as $2,500 per family.

September 6, 2008

OBAMA: Here's what change is saying to people who already have health insurance and the employers who are providing it: We'll work to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

May 3, 2008

OBAMA: I also have a health care plan that would save the average family $2,500 on their premiums.

January 3, 2008

OBAMA: And if you already have health care, then we're gonna reduce costs an average of $2,500 per family on premiums.


October 7, 2008

OBAMA: We're gonna work with your employer to lower the costs of your premiums by up to $2,500 a year.

Campaign Ad

OBAMA: And we'll cut the costs of a typical family's health care by up to $2,500 per year.

March 14, 2008

OBAMA: And if you've got health care, we're gonna work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

February 23, 2008

OBAMA: And we will lower premiums for the typical family by $2,500 a year.

June 17, 2007

OBAMA: And cut the cost of health care by up to $2,500 per family.

August 17, 2008

OBAMA: And if you already have health care, then we're gonna work with your employer to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

Campaign Ad

EVAN BAYH: Barack's policies will provide health care cost reductions of about $2,500 for the typical family.

June 27, 2008

OBAMA: It's time to bring down the typical family's premium by about $2,500. And it's time to bring down the costs for the entire country.

February 19, 2008

OBAMA: And if you already have health insurance, we will lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

April 22, 2008

OBAMA: We're gonna work with your employer through a catastrophic reinsurance plan to lower premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

October 15, 2008

OBAMA: The only thing we're gonna try to do is lower costs so that those cost savings are passed on to you. And we estimate we can cut the average family's premium by about $2,500 a year.

March 1, 2008

OBAMA: We'll work with your employer to lower your premiums by $2,500 per family per year.

Campaign Ad

NARRATOR: Barack Obama will provide rural America with affordable health care, and save the typical American family $2,500 a year.

May 30, 2008

OBAMA: And reduces every family's premiums by as much as $2,500.

April 20, 2008

OBAMA: If your employer does offer you health care, then we're gonna work with your employer to lower premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

March 13, 2008

OBAMA: And cut the cost of a typical family's premiums by up to $2,500 per family per year.

FREEDOM EDEN: Obama: 20 Promises for $2,500



You got a plan from the (un)aca. Do you get a subsidy?

you do love to lie don't you Zoom ding-a-ling do you see the word I promise ??? didn't think so ... your dialog here is edited, you do know that don't ya??? I do...

Why yes, yes I do. Right here, as posted and linked above:

I have made a solemn pledge that I will sign a universal health care bill into law by the end of my first term as president that will cover every American and cut the cost of a typical family's premiums by up to $2500 a year. That's not simply a matter of policy or ideology &#8211; it's a moral commitment.

A Politics of Conscience

obama not only promised to cut the typical family's premium by $2,500/yr, he went even further ... it wasn't policy or ideology, he made a moral commitment. But he didn't sign any such law that would cut the typical family's premium, did he? His promise (pledge) was a lie.

And again he says it here, also quoted and linked above:

When it came to health care premiums for the typical family, Obama said he would cut the annual cost by $2,500. Months before Obama took office, a New York Times reporter dubbed it one of the most audacious pledges of the campaign.

We reached out to David Cutler, an economist who advised Obama during the 2008 campaign and helped calculate the $2,500 figure that appeared in Obama's speeches. He said the calculation encompassed total health care costs, not just premiums. These would include out-of-pocket costs, employer-provided insurance costs, and taxes to pay for public insurance programs.

Cutler acknowledged that Obama made "occasional misstatements&#8221; that tied the $2,500 reduction to premiums and not total medical spending. We can't judge whether Obama misspoke, but we checked the Project Vote Smart database of public statements by politicians, which shows that Obama said premiums (and only premiums) would go down for the typical or average family by $2,500 repeatedly. You can see examples throughout the arc of his 2008 presidential campaign here, here, here, and here. <-- these are links at the site showing obama saying premiums would be reduced.

It is also true that Obama used the number in a more expansive context sometimes, such as here during a speech in Newport News, Va, and here in a response to a report about Medicare and Social Security.

The Obameter: Cut the cost of a typical family's health insurance premium by up to $2,500 a year | PolitiFact


Your lack of reading comprehension is deplorable so I made the font really big. You know, so you wouldn't miss what obama actually said. In his own words.

Premiums for the typical family have NOT gone down $2,500, have NOT gone down some number up to $2,500, have NOT gone down at all. They are increasing at a greater rate than if the (un)aca hadn't passed.

I am taking your lack of response to my showing your "aca increasing premiums by 120%" statement is just pure stupidity on your part as an admission that you're a fucking idiot.

The video links and dialog speak for themselves. obama repeatedly said that premiums for the typical family would be lowered/reduced by up to $2,500 or by $2,500 ... I guess which of those depended on what the teleprompter said that day. He PLEDGED it. He made a MORAL COMMITMENT to it. He RAN ON IT.

He. Is. A. Liar.

Period.

You failed to answer my question: You got a plan from the (un)aca. Do you get a subsidy?


Poor, poor bill-ye-teh-zombies-have-taken-over-yer-brain.