The topless parade. Pride or shame?

[sear]

"When women parade around in public topless it portrays all women negatively." #218

That's an interesting opinion. But it's not the only perspective.

When ISIL lines up 10 innocent humans and beheads them on camera, en masse,
does that portray all humanity negatively?

When 3 brave Americans help prevent a high speed train massacre,
does that portray all humanity positively?

I've never seen a one-sided coin.
When discussing the worst person ever born, we could say it makes all humanity look bad.
OR
we could say, in comparison to him, everyone else ever born was better.

Statistically, the central tendency of the bell-curves of populations should not be misjudged by the six sigma fringes.
Focus on the median and mean. You'll be sampling a more representative segment of the population.

 

[Katzndogz]

"Seriously though I would be weirded out seeing female family members at the dinner table topless...." #193

It would be inappropriate for males to be topless in such situations as well, under most civilized circumstances.

Exceptions might be:
- infants
- picnicking on a sweltering hot day by the shore of the lake

I wouldn't want to see my mother, or my sisters topless.

It's all a matter of what you're accustomed to and most people just aren't accustomed to family nudity. Our household is clothing optional meaning there are no rules compelling anyone to wear or not wear clothes. Occasionally Mom will be topless at the dinner table or I will too. In this hot weather, the kids almost never wear clothes at all, even during dinner. This would be a culture shock to those not used to it, but for those of us who are, it's no big deal at all.

While this is not something I would do myself, it's your home and your family. That's not the issue.

When women parade around in public topless it portrays all women negatively.

That's your opinion. I think that women being told everything above the waist and below the neck is obscene is a terrible insult to women.

And whether it be in the home or in public, the issue is what people are accustomed to seeing. I think if we relaxed nudity standards a little, we'd be just fine. Compared to the 1920's when women wore dresses to swim in, we've come a long way and demonstrated an ability to adjust our axiom.

It's an insult to women, all women, because it was such a struggle to get to be treated as more than tits. You may think that we should relax our standards and get used to nudity, the reality is, when a man gets to the office for a hiring interview, that's all he will see. We will rocket back to the bad old days when men never looked a woman in the eye and never considered a woman as a serious contender.

 

[sear]

" I think that women being told everything above the waist and below the neck is obscene is a terrible insult to women. " #220

Certainly.
And some may indeed miscommunicate the message that horribly. But to quote an articulate man:

"The fact that somebody over-sells an idea doesn't make it a bad idea. It makes them a bad salesman." Rep. Barney Frank (D-MA ret)

There's no need to be insulting.
There are some things humans do in private: elementary digital nasal hygiene, elimination of solid or liquid bodily waste, sex (with partner, or without), etc.

Some of the most stunning visual images I've ever had have been of scantily clad, or naked women.
But there's a time & a place.
Not everything that doesn't meet conventional standards of propriety is automatically therefore "obscene".

 

[danielpalos]

"Seriously though I would be weirded out seeing female family members at the dinner table topless...." #193

It would be inappropriate for males to be topless in such situations as well, under most civilized circumstances.

Exceptions might be:
- infants
- picnicking on a sweltering hot day by the shore of the lake

I wouldn't want to see my mother, or my sisters topless.

It's all a matter of what you're accustomed to and most people just aren't accustomed to family nudity. Our household is clothing optional meaning there are no rules compelling anyone to wear or not wear clothes. Occasionally Mom will be topless at the dinner table or I will too. In this hot weather, the kids almost never wear clothes at all, even during dinner. This would be a culture shock to those not used to it, but for those of us who are, it's no big deal at all.

While this is not something I would do myself, it's your home and your family. That's not the issue.

When women parade around in public topless it portrays all women negatively.

equality is never negative.

 

[danielpalos]

"Seriously though I would be weirded out seeing female family members at the dinner table topless...." #193

It would be inappropriate for males to be topless in such situations as well, under most civilized circumstances.

Exceptions might be:
- infants
- picnicking on a sweltering hot day by the shore of the lake

I wouldn't want to see my mother, or my sisters topless.

It's all a matter of what you're accustomed to and most people just aren't accustomed to family nudity. Our household is clothing optional meaning there are no rules compelling anyone to wear or not wear clothes. Occasionally Mom will be topless at the dinner table or I will too. In this hot weather, the kids almost never wear clothes at all, even during dinner. This would be a culture shock to those not used to it, but for those of us who are, it's no big deal at all.

While this is not something I would do myself, it's your home and your family. That's not the issue.

When women parade around in public topless it portrays all women negatively.

That's your opinion. I think that women being told everything above the waist and below the neck is obscene is a terrible insult to women.

And whether it be in the home or in public, the issue is what people are accustomed to seeing. I think if we relaxed nudity standards a little, we'd be just fine. Compared to the 1920's when women wore dresses to swim in, we've come a long way and demonstrated an ability to adjust our axiom.

It's an insult to women, all women, because it was such a struggle to get to be treated as more than tits. You may think that we should relax our standards and get used to nudity, the reality is, when a man gets to the office for a hiring interview, that's all he will see. We will rocket back to the bad old days when men never looked a woman in the eye and never considered a woman as a serious contender.

chics; you really do only make more in the porn sector. i am willing to vote for the female politician with the cutest snatch, on that basis alone.

 

[sear]

"equality is never negative." #224

The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets or steal bread.
Anatole France (1844–1924), French author

 

[Samuel Nixon]

Of course it's a shame. I don't want to see old lesbians going naked on the streets of our cities. Why are there no attractive girls in such events? It's not a very pleasant picture for the eyes of straight people.

There were some attractive girls, but in the minority. Cause the beauty of the breasts unfortunately wasn't the point.
I believe that these women want the whole humanity to degenerate and get the development level of some African tribal people.

 

[ChrisL]

I think some people are making a much bigger deal out of this than it actually is. How many women were there doing this? Like 30? BFD. It is certainly not the end of civilized society.

 

[danielpalos]

"equality is never negative." #224

The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets or steal bread.
Anatole France (1844–1924), French author

Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

Thomas Jefferson

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

"equality is never negative." #224

The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets or steal bread.
Anatole France (1844–1924), French author

Do you get the irony in that quote? It was meant to be sarcastic and it militates against your argument because the immediate context to this discussion is that prudes write all the laws regarding nudity just like the rich write all the laws governing the behavior of the poor...which was the irony of that quote.

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

I think some people are making a much bigger deal out of this than it actually is. How many women were there doing this? Like 30? BFD. It is certainly not the end of civilized society.

More like the beginning where society pushes back against the prudes who write laws not based on practical thinking but rather irrational phobias. Nudity laws make crime out of what harms nobody and nothing. It's time prudes were pushed out of the way so freedom can see the light of day.

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

Of course it's a shame. I don't want to see old lesbians going naked on the streets of our cities. Why are there no attractive girls in such events? It's not a very pleasant picture for the eyes of straight people.

There were some attractive girls, but in the minority. Cause the beauty of the breasts unfortunately wasn't the point.
I believe that these women want the whole humanity to degenerate and get the development level of some African tribal people.

^^^^ some can't see past their nudity, others can't see past the color of their skin. It's all bigotry.

 

[ChrisL]

I think some people are making a much bigger deal out of this than it actually is. How many women were there doing this? Like 30? BFD. It is certainly not the end of civilized society.

More like the beginning where society pushes back against the prudes who write laws not based on practical thinking but rather irrational phobias. Nudity laws make crime out of what harms nobody and nothing. It's time prudes were pushed out of the way so freedom can see the light of day.

Such as laws not allowing gays to marry?

 

[Katzndogz]

Women are proving to be just as worthless as men always said they were.

Show those tits girls, no one wants to hear what you have to say anyway.

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

I think some people are making a much bigger deal out of this than it actually is. How many women were there doing this? Like 30? BFD. It is certainly not the end of civilized society.

More like the beginning where society pushes back against the prudes who write laws not based on practical thinking but rather irrational phobias. Nudity laws make crime out of what harms nobody and nothing. It's time prudes were pushed out of the way so freedom can see the light of day.

Such as laws not allowing gays to marry?

I've come around on that one too, maybe you didn't notice. I think all laws that don't prevent tangible harm need to get the boot.

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

Women are proving to be just as worthless as men always said they were.

Show those tits girls, no one wants to hear what you have to say anyway.

They're worthless in your mind, and "men" never called women worthless. Sounds like you have come down with a case of feminism and it's polluting your otherwise sound thinking on every other issue.

 

[Katzndogz]

What I would like to see is some woman applying for an executive job told "take your clothes off and let us see how big your tits really are."

That would be a hoot and a half.

That will REALLY put those prudes in their place.

 

[Katzndogz]

Women are proving to be just as worthless as men always said they were.

Show those tits girls, no one wants to hear what you have to say anyway.

They're worthless in your mind, and "men" never called women worthless. Sounds like you have come down with a case of feminism and it's polluting your otherwise sound thinking on every other issue.

That's exactly how it was and why women fought so hard to be taken seriously. Now foolish women want to drag us back to those dark ages where competence was assumed to only be male and women were judged by their cup size.

It's a very sad thing to witness.

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

What I would like to see is some woman applying for an executive job told "take your clothes off and let us see how big your tits really are."

That would be a hoot and a half.

That will REALLY put those prudes in their place.

So if we let women go topless then laws against sexual harassment would go down the drain? It seems you have no logical arguments, but prudes never do.

 

[sear]

"Do you get the irony in that quote?" #230

Why would I have posted it if I didn't?

"It was meant to be sarcastic"

I'd say "satirical".

"and it militates against your argument because" #230

Perhaps it does so to your misperception of my intended point.

My intended point is:

"equality is never negative." #224

is not, in the extreme, absolutely correct. That is my argument. In what way is it militated against?

I consider it valid as a general rule.
That doesn't mean there aren't exceptions.
And the word "never" in the assertion is a superlative. How can there be exceptions to a superlative?