Trump Gets Smacked Down Again on DACA

[Bob Blaylock]

People who want to wrench innocents away from their homes, to send them to their deaths in a foreign country they've never known; THAT is evil.

Taking the side of foreign invaders against that of your own country and your own fellow Americans is treason.

 

[Vandalshandle]

The GOP really should consider this a victory, of sorts. Now that there are less illegal immigrants to hold as scapegoats for their not having all become millionaires, they really do need someone to hate. DACA is almost as good as Muslims in that regard. Hating blacks is so passe'. Of course, they still have the Latinos who, though they are citizens, do not speak English fluently. Anyway, the more people they can blame their troubles on, the more they can motivate Bubba and Billy Bob, down in Mississippi, to vote.

 

[del]

Taking the side of foreign invaders against that of your own country and your own fellow Americans is treason.

being an overwrought drama queen is hilarious

thanks for that

 

[Bob Blaylock]

If a toddler is in the back seat of Dad's car and Dad robs a bank .. is the toddler a criminal?

So dad goes to jail and the toddler does not. The DACA kids stay and their parents are deported. Fair enough.

The toddler doesn't get to keep the proceeds from Dad's robbery.

The “Dreamer” ought not be allowed to stay where he never had the legal right to be.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Children broke the law when their parents brought them in? Why are you so hateful?

Their parents broke the law sneaking them into this country. THEY broke the law remaining here as adults and not doing what was necessary to become legal citizens.

They are responsible, as adults, to do what is necessary to become legal citizens. If they fail to do this, they need to go.

DACA is illegal because it is a law that makes it legal to break the law. That, by default, is an invalid law. Why it's still around is anyones guess.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Children broke the law when their parents brought them in? Why are you so hateful?

Their parents broke the law sneaking them into this country. THEY broke the law remaining here as adults and not doing what was necessary to become legal citizens.

They are responsible, as adults, to do what is necessary to become legal citizens. If they fail to do this, they need to go.

DACA is illegal because it is a law that makes it legal to break the law. That, by default, is an invalid law. Why it's still around is anyones guess.

DACA is illegal because it is a law that makes it legal to break the law.

It's not a law.
Never passed House or Senate.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Well not a law, what is it, an executive order?

 

[GreenBean]

Great news for dreamers. It looks like this will stay mired in courts until the Democrat majorities are sworn in next January.

Talk about 'Dreamers' ... keep dreaming dude

 

[GreenBean]

Children broke the law when their parents brought them in? Why are you so hateful?

Their parents broke the law sneaking them into this country. THEY broke the law remaining here as adults and not doing what was necessary to become legal citizens.

They are responsible, as adults, to do what is necessary to become legal citizens. If they fail to do this, they need to go.

DACA is illegal because it is a law that makes it legal to break the law. That, by default, is an invalid law. Why it's still around is anyones guess.

DACA is illegal because it is a law that makes it legal to break the law.

It's not a law.
Never passed House or Senate.

DACA is not really even a Law it is an executive order that circumvented the constitutional system of checks and balances. Obama vastly over exceeded his authority

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Well not a law, what is it, an executive order?

To understand the gravity of the situation, a bit of background is necessary. A president’s authority over immigration law is limited and defined by the Constitution and by statutory law. At no point may he take action that contradicts the Constitution or statutes, and if he intends to enact new policies that are consistent with his statutory and constitutional power, he generally must do so through a regulatory rulemaking process mandated and defined by the Administrative Procedure Act (APA) — a process that requires giving the public notice of a new proposed regulation and an opportunity to comment on its merit and legality.

When President Obama announced DACA in 2012, he skipped this step. Rather than securing statutory protection for so-called “Dreamers” when his party held a lock on power, and rather than even attempting a regulatory rulemaking process, the Obama administration granted Dreamers sweeping protections from immigration enforcement and did so by memo.

The administration justified this extraordinary new program by calling it a mere exercise of “prosecutorial discretion” and thus exempt from APA rulemaking requirements.

DACA & Judicial Threat to the Rule of Law | National Review

 

[EverCurious]

Whats totally fucked up in here, why I hate the fucking media, is that President Trump has /always/ been soft on DACA, he just wanted it done /legally/ not by EO, that's it. The media has lied so successfully about it that you idiots all believe he hates the dreamers - which is a complete fucking lie.

It's just pathetic how useless the media has become.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Wrong, I am saying that minorities, including legal resident and citizens are disproportionally arrested, prosecuted, and given the harsher sentences. Got it?

Even in Detroit which has a Police dept which is headed by a Black chief, and has Black majority of Police officers?

Yet, these Black Police in Detroit tell us the same story, that Detroit a major Black majority city has a major Black murder rate issue...

Classic logical fallacy which are often employed by those who do not actually have an argument....on two counts.

1. it is a Non sequitur because you are ignoring my premise, that minorities are disproportionately targeted, with your observation that Detroit is disproportionately black. If the population is majority black, of course the crime rate will be skewed to black perpetrators

2. It is a Straw man fallacy in that you are assigning the argument - that black people do not commit crimes -to me , and argument that I did not make,.

The Black dominated Detroit Police Dept are the ones recording the murder data.... Furthermore a lot of the victims of crime are gasp "Black" and identify Black criminals behind the attacks...

Nice try, though..

You don't understand logical fallacies and the basic principles of debate, do you?

Aka liberal bullshit!

Really? Please explain how logical fallacies are liberal bullshit. Your inability to properly and honestly debate is NOT bullshit though. It appears to be the reality.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

What did I mis interpret?

If I have to spell it out for you, it is hopeless

Translated to mean you cannot in fact spell it out.

What I think he is saying is that illegal aliens are picked on. If they were citizens and criminals, the justice system would just let them go.

SJW talk for "Citizen Privilege?"

Wrong, I am saying that minorities, including legal resident and citizens are disproportionally arrested, prosecuted, and given the harsher sentences. Got it?

You might be able to make that argument for members of the black community who have known prior records, but with no supporting data, it sounds like a specious claim.

No supporting evidence? Are you fucking serious??

http://www.sentencingproject.org/wp...Manual-for-Practitioners-and-Policymakers.pdf

 

[MisterBeale]

If I have to spell it out for you, it is hopeless

Translated to mean you cannot in fact spell it out.

What I think he is saying is that illegal aliens are picked on. If they were citizens and criminals, the justice system would just let them go.

SJW talk for "Citizen Privilege?"

Wrong, I am saying that minorities, including legal resident and citizens are disproportionally arrested, prosecuted, and given the harsher sentences. Got it?

You might be able to make that argument for members of the black community who have known prior records, but with no supporting data, it sounds like a specious claim.

No supporting evidence? Are you fucking serious??

http://www.sentencingproject.org/wp...Manual-for-Practitioners-and-Policymakers.pdf

Thank you for that, I am aware of this.

But as I already state, this is well known, and affects our national black and Hispanic citizen groups. Their incarnation rates compared to the general population do not come close to the illegal aliens compared to the general population of illegal aliens, so, again I state, THIS CANNOT BE THE CAUSE OF HIGHER INCARCERATION RATES. We already went over this in my previous post. I already told you I was aware of this. YOU NEED to tell me how illegals are different than OTHER minority citizen groups. This information that you have posted only explains why all minority groups are incarcerated at higher rates than Caucasians, it does not explain why illegals are incarcerated at higher rates than other minorities.

If it were, you would expect similar rates of incarceration for minority citizens, but the fact of the matter is, citizens of color are NOT incarcerated and similar rates. Thus, bigotry cannot be used as an explanation.



Try again, or face the overwhelming conclusion, law breakers, criminals and gang members cross the border in disproportion numbers to the general population, or, not being integrated into the legitimate economy, forces many young men and women to turn to crime in disproportionately large numbers compared to naturalized and legal citizens.

 

[Ame®icano]

This made my day. The third Federal Court to rule against the Trump Administration on DACA. And it was done so poetically


Another Federal Judge Rules Against Trump's Order To Cancel DACA | HuffPost

In September, President Donald Trump canceled the Obama-era DACA program, which shields undocumented immigrants who arrived in the U.S. as youths from deportation. But in a stinging rebuke of the Trump administration’s legal logic, U.S. District Judge John Bates described the program’s cancellation as “arbitrary and capricious because the Department [of Homeland Security] failed adequately to explain its conclusion that the program was unlawful.”

“Neither the meager legal reasoning nor the assessment of litigation risk provided by DHS to support its rescission decision is sufficient to sustain termination of the DACA program,” Bates wrote in the opinion.

This ruling is different than the others:

The ruling has no immediate effect, and the decision to cancel DACA has already been stalled by a nationwide injunction. Bates’ ruling is unique, however, because it opens the possibility that U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services might have to start accepting new DACA applications. The current injunctions only require the federal government to renew the applications of people who have already been approved for the program.

Sooo, those judges are saying it's unconstitutional to cancel unconstitutional EO?

What makes you think those judges have constitutional jurisdiction on the matter?

 

[DrLove]

We are talking about people who have been here since they were children and regard themselves as Americans. Terrorists ? Really ? What a joke.

Doesn't matter what they regard themselves. They're here illegally by lawbreaking, and shouldn't be here imposing the harms of immigration in the long list.

If a toddler is in the back seat of Dad's car and Dad robs a bank .. is the toddler a criminal?

Take that BS elsewhere

So dad goes to jail and the toddler does not. The DACA kids stay and their parents are deported. Fair enough.

Now you're talking about deporting millions and separating families at a cost of tens of billions.

And how you figure those tearful goodbyes are gonna play on the evening news?

 

[dannyboys]

DACA will end up in the SC.
Then we'll see what they think of BONOBO signing an illegal EO............strictly for political reasons.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Translated to mean you cannot in fact spell it out.

What I think he is saying is that illegal aliens are picked on. If they were citizens and criminals, the justice system would just let them go.

SJW talk for "Citizen Privilege?"

Wrong, I am saying that minorities, including legal resident and citizens are disproportionally arrested, prosecuted, and given the harsher sentences. Got it?

You might be able to make that argument for members of the black community who have known prior records, but with no supporting data, it sounds like a specious claim.

No supporting evidence? Are you fucking serious??

http://www.sentencingproject.org/wp...Manual-for-Practitioners-and-Policymakers.pdf

Thank you for that, I am aware of this.

But as I already state, this is well known, and affects our national black and Hispanic citizen groups. Their incarnation rates compared to the general population do not come close to the illegal aliens compared to the general population of illegal aliens, so, again I state, THIS CANNOT BE THE CAUSE OF HIGHER INCARCERATION RATES. We already went over this in my previous post. I already told you I was aware of this. YOU NEED to tell me how illegals are different than OTHER minority citizen groups. This information that you have posted only explains why all minority groups are incarcerated at higher rates than Caucasians, it does not explain why illegals are incarcerated at higher rates than other minorities.

If it were, you would expect similar rates of incarceration for minority citizens, but the fact of the matter is, citizens of color are NOT incarcerated and similar rates. Thus, bigotry cannot be used as an explanation.



Try again, or face the overwhelming conclusion, law breakers, criminals and gang members cross the border in disproportion numbers to the general population, or, not being integrated into the legitimate economy, forces many young men and women to turn to crime in disproportionately large numbers compared to naturalized and legal citizens.

What? You're saying that undocumented immigrants are incarcerated at a higher rate than other minority groups? I don't think so. If you documented that someplace I missed it.

Lets start with the fact that their rate of incarceration is lower that that of all non -immigrants.

How big a problem is crime committed by immigrants?

According to analysis of the 2010 census and the American Communities Survey done by the non-profit American Immigration Council, immigrants to the United States are significantly less likely than native-born citizens to be incarcerated. The authors found that 1.6 percent of immigrant males age 18-39 are incarcerated, compared to 3.3 percent of the native-born.

The divide was even sharper when the authors examined the incarceration rate among immigrant men the authors believe likely to be undocumented — specifically less-educated men from El Salvador and Guatemala between age 18-29. According to AIC senior researcher Walter Ewing, there are very few ways for men in this demographic to emigrate legally. According to the analysis, these likely undocumented immigrants had an incarceration rate of 1.7 percent, compared with 10.7 percent for native-born men without a high school diploma.

It follows that it you were to isolate US born minorities from the incarceration rate of all native born Americans, that rate would be even higher and the disparity between them and immigrants would be even greater.

You have to stop believing what Trump tells you. It's a fools game.

During his campaign, President Trump often spoke about immigrants as criminals, and highlighted violent crimes to make his point, including the 2015 shooting death of Kathryn Steinle, who authorities say was killed by an undocumented immigrant from Mexico who had been deported five times. It was a powerful example, but not exactly representative of the millions of immigrants living in the country today, researchers say.

Here is more: Contrary to Trump’s Claims, Immigrants Are Less Likely to Commit Crimes

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

This made my day. The third Federal Court to rule against the Trump Administration on DACA. And it was done so poetically


Another Federal Judge Rules Against Trump's Order To Cancel DACA | HuffPost

In September, President Donald Trump canceled the Obama-era DACA program, which shields undocumented immigrants who arrived in the U.S. as youths from deportation. But in a stinging rebuke of the Trump administration’s legal logic, U.S. District Judge John Bates described the program’s cancellation as “arbitrary and capricious because the Department [of Homeland Security] failed adequately to explain its conclusion that the program was unlawful.”

“Neither the meager legal reasoning nor the assessment of litigation risk provided by DHS to support its rescission decision is sufficient to sustain termination of the DACA program,” Bates wrote in the opinion.

This ruling is different than the others:

The ruling has no immediate effect, and the decision to cancel DACA has already been stalled by a nationwide injunction. Bates’ ruling is unique, however, because it opens the possibility that U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services might have to start accepting new DACA applications. The current injunctions only require the federal government to renew the applications of people who have already been approved for the program.

Sooo, those judges are saying it's unconstitutional to cancel unconstitutional EO?

What makes you think those judges have constitutional jurisdiction on the matter?

1. On what basis are you claiming that the EO is unconstitutional?

2. Federal Judges do indeed have constitutional jurisdiction.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Translated to mean you cannot in fact spell it out.

What I think he is saying is that illegal aliens are picked on. If they were citizens and criminals, the justice system would just let them go.

SJW talk for "Citizen Privilege?"

Wrong, I am saying that minorities, including legal resident and citizens are disproportionally arrested, prosecuted, and given the harsher sentences. Got it?

You might be able to make that argument for members of the black community who have known prior records, but with no supporting data, it sounds like a specious claim.

No supporting evidence? Are you fucking serious??

http://www.sentencingproject.org/wp...Manual-for-Practitioners-and-Policymakers.pdf

Thank you for that, I am aware of this.

But as I already state, this is well known, and affects our national black and Hispanic citizen groups. Their incarnation rates compared to the general population do not come close to the illegal aliens compared to the general population of illegal aliens, so, again I state, THIS CANNOT BE THE CAUSE OF HIGHER INCARCERATION RATES. We already went over this in my previous post. I already told you I was aware of this. YOU NEED to tell me how illegals are different than OTHER minority citizen groups. This information that you have posted only explains why all minority groups are incarcerated at higher rates than Caucasians, it does not explain why illegals are incarcerated at higher rates than other minorities.

If it were, you would expect similar rates of incarceration for minority citizens, but the fact of the matter is, citizens of color are NOT incarcerated and similar rates. Thus, bigotry cannot be used as an explanation.



Try again, or face the overwhelming conclusion, law breakers, criminals and gang members cross the border in disproportion numbers to the general population, or, not being integrated into the legitimate economy, forces many young men and women to turn to crime in disproportionately large numbers compared to naturalized and legal citizens.

Since this thread is about the Dreamers, perhaps you would like to discuss their incarceration rate

The DREAMer Incarceration Rate

News of individual DREAMers committing crimes contributed to the public perception that DREAMers are disproportionately crime prone and may influence President Trump’s decision to cancel or continue DACA.4 In fact, DREAMers have lower incarceration rates than native-born Americans of the same age and education level.

INCARCERATIONS
We estimate that DREAMers had an incarceration rate of 0.98 percent in 2015 compared to a native-born incarceration rate of 1.12 percent, a DACA-ineligible illegal immigrant incarceration rate of 0.38 percent, and a legal immigrant incarceration rate of 0.24 percent (Figure 1). The native-born incarceration rate is 14 percent higher than the DREAMer incarceration rate, while DACA-ineligible illegal immigrants and legal immigrants have the lowest rates of all. Our residual statistical technique estimates that there are about 1.4 million DREAMers in the United States, which increases our confidence in this estimate because it lies right between the DREAMer population estimates made by the Pew Research Center and the Migration Policy Institute.18