CDZ Two options...the European model of self defense, and the American model of Self defensse.

[Blues Man]

You think the rights granted in the amendments you mentioned are the only rights we have? All the other rights we have are just as important, even if there isn't a special amendment granting each of them. A right is a right is a right. We can discuss the cost of specific permits if you want to, I think some of them are too high too, but there is no question that permits are perfectly allowable.

You might note that the poll tax was a fee required to vote in federal elections. Congress specifically eliminated that specific fee, but no others. When congress specifically eliminates any or all the rest of the required fees, you might have a point, but that has not happened.

OK so permits are allowable.

So you'd be OK with requiring a fee be paid and a permit acquired for the exercise of all rights.

If you want to post on the internet and exercise your First Amendment right you have to pay a fee and get a permit.

If you want to be protected from illegal searches and seizures then you must pay a fee and obtain a permit.

If you want to vote pay a fee get a permit.

It's either acceptable to charge these fees or it isn't.

If it is acceptable for the Second then it has to be acceptable for all

 

[Blues Man]

You're changing the goal post again. You're the one who brought up the silly idea of needing a permit just to enter a showroom.

Your quibbling about an example. YOU said you have a right to buy a boat but I said you do not need to pay for a permit in order to buy that boat.

So if permits are acceptable then you should have to pay for a permit that allows you to exercise your right to buy a boat.

 

[BULLDOG]

So a permit you pay for to vote is legal?

No. It was legal until the 24th amendment was enacted and eliminated that particular fee, but only for federal elections, and no others.

 

[Blues Man]

No. It was legal until the 24th amendment was enacted and eliminated that particular fee, but only for federal elections, and no others.
View attachment 613488

US Supreme Court: Gun licensing fees are unconstitutional – One Armed Man

www.one-armed-man.com

Murdock v. Pennsylvania


“A State may not impose a charge for the enjoyment of a right granted by the Federal Constitution.”



Hence firearm license and permit fees as well as requiring courses are unconstitutional

 

[BULLDOG]

OK so permits are allowable.

So you'd be OK with requiring a fee be paid and a permit acquired for the exercise of all rights.

If you want to post on the internet and exercise your First Amendment right you have to pay a fee and get a permit.

If you want to be protected from illegal searches and seizures then you must pay a fee and obtain a permit.

If you want to vote pay a fee get a permit.

It's either acceptable to charge these fees or it isn't.

If it is acceptable for the Second then it has to be acceptable for all

Well that would just be silly. No, I don't think a fee should be required for the exercize of each right. That is not the claim you made. You opposed any and all fees on the basis that all fees are wrong. That is clearly not the case. As I said earlier, we can discuss whether a fee might be too high, or even if a specific fee should be required but claiming fees are wrong just because they are a fee is a nonstarter.

 

[Blues Man]

Well that would just be silly. No, I don't think a fee should be required for the exercize of each right. That is not the claim you made. You opposed any and all fees on the basis that all fees are wrong. That is clearly not the case. As I said earlier, we can discuss whether a fee might be too high, or even if a specific fee should be required but claiming fees are wrong just because they are a fee is a nonstarter.

It was my original question that you dodged so many times you forgot what it was

POST # 656

I asked:

How many other rights are there that you have to get and pay for a BG check, pay for a course, pay for a permit and have to get fingerprinted before you can exercise them?

So now are you going to answer the question?

 

[Blues Man]

Well that would just be silly. No, I don't think a fee should be required for the exercize of each right. That is not the claim you made. You opposed any and all fees on the basis that all fees are wrong. That is clearly not the case. As I said earlier, we can discuss whether a fee might be too high, or even if a specific fee should be required but claiming fees are wrong just because they are a fee is a nonstarter.

OK quote where I said I oppose any and all fees. And how the hell did you come up with sales tax as a cost of exercising a right?

I never said that not even once.

 

[BULLDOG]

US Supreme Court: Gun licensing fees are unconstitutional – One Armed Man

www.one-armed-man.com

Murdock v. Pennsylvania


“A State may not impose a charge for the enjoyment of a right granted by the Federal Constitution.”



Hence firearm license and permit fees as well as requiring courses are unconstitutional

Murdock V Pennsylvania was concerning Jehova's Witness selling religious tracts door to door.

 

[Blues Man]

Murdock V Pennsylvania was concerning Jehova's Witness selling religious tracts door to door.

No it also applies to all Constitutional rights as the line states.

“A State may not impose a charge for the enjoyment of a right granted by the Federal Constitution.”

 

[BULLDOG]

OK so permits are allowable.

So you'd be OK with requiring a fee be paid and a permit acquired for the exercise of all rights.

If you want to post on the internet and exercise your First Amendment right you have to pay a fee and get a permit.

If you want to be protected from illegal searches and seizures then you must pay a fee and obtain a permit.

If you want to vote pay a fee get a permit.

It's either acceptable to charge these fees or it isn't.

If it is acceptable for the Second then it has to be acceptable for all

Poll taxes are seperate and beyond our discussion. We have a constitutonal amendment dealing with that.
Just because permits are allowable, and some permits make sense doesn't mean any or all permit requirements are reasonable. -

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Poll taxes are seperate and beyond our discussion. We have a constitutonal amendment dealing with that.
Just because permits are allowable, and some permits make sense doesn't mean any or all permit requirements are reasonable. -

LOL either a permit is allowed or it isnt. Since it is not allowed on ANY OTHER right why would you claim it is ok on the 2nd?

 

[BULLDOG]

Your quibbling about an example. YOU said you have a right to buy a boat but I said you do not need to pay for a permit in order to buy that boat.

So if permits are acceptable then you should have to pay for a permit that allows you to exercise your right to buy a boat.

I do have to pay tax on the purchase price of a boat. That is a fee. I also have to pay to have the title transferred into my name. Another fee. Of course I also have to buy life jackets, fire extenguishers, and all the other safety equipment that is governmentally required if I'm going to boat on navigable waters. All in all, there is quite a bit more than the purchase price of a boat that the government imposes on my right to own and enjoy a boat.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I do have to pay tax on the purchase price of a boat. That is a fee. I also have to pay to have the title transferred into my name. Another fee. Of course I also have to buy life jackets, fire extenguishers, and all the other safety equipment that is governmentally required if I'm going to boat on navigable waters. All in all, there is quite a bit more than the purchase price of a boat that the government imposes on my right to own and enjoy a boat.

LOL not the same AT ALL and you know it you lying sack of shit.

 

[BULLDOG]

US Supreme Court: Gun licensing fees are unconstitutional – One Armed Man

www.one-armed-man.com

Murdock v. Pennsylvania


“A State may not impose a charge for the enjoyment of a right granted by the Federal Constitution.”



Hence firearm license and permit fees as well as requiring courses are unconstitutional

Cool. I'm not going buy a hunting license, and I'll tell the game warden to come talk to you when he gives me a ticket.

 

[BULLDOG]

It was my original question that you dodged so many times you forgot what it was

POST # 656

I asked:

How many other rights are there that you have to get and pay for a BG check, pay for a course, pay for a permit and have to get fingerprinted before you can exercise them?

So now are you going to answer the question?

I thought you were all for states setting their own rules. There are no federal gun requirements for any of the things you list. Since a drivers license is now required to vote, that would cover the fingerprint and permit.

 

[BULLDOG]

OK quote where I said I oppose any and all fees. And how the hell did you come up with sales tax as a cost of exercising a right?

I never said that not even once.

Are you trying to claim you haven't been arguing that fees were unconstitutional? Really?

 

[Blues Man]

Poll taxes are seperate and beyond our discussion. We have a constitutonal amendment dealing with that.
Just because permits are allowable, and some permits make sense doesn't mean any or all permit requirements are reasonable. -

No they are no different than requiring a person paying a fee before exercising any Constitutionally guaranteed right.

Why is charging X dollars to vote any different than charging hundreds of dollars in order to exercise your Second Amendment rights?

 

[Blues Man]

I thought you were all for states setting their own rules. There are no federal gun requirements for any of the things you list. Since a drivers license is now required to vote, that would cover the fingerprint and permit.

States cannot pass laws that violate the US Constitution.

 

[Blues Man]

Cool. I'm not going buy a hunting license, and I'll tell the game warden to come talk to you when he gives me a ticket.

You do not have a Constitutionally protected right to hunt

 

[BULLDOG]

LOL either a permit is allowed or it isnt. Since it is not allowed on ANY OTHER right why would you claim it is ok on the 2nd?

As far as I know, everything I do is constitutional. Each and every permit, tax or fee that I am required is so I can exercize my rights.