CDZ Two options...the European model of self defense, and the American model of Self defensse.

[BULLDOG]

That progressives mean to ban and confiscate guns, and that they mean to facilitate this by passing registration first, is neither wrong nor a conspiracy theory.

So, no more gun registration beyond our existing Form 4473s. And that's a final decision.

Getting a little arrogant there, aren't you. I'm pretty sure that decision isn't up to you to make.

 

[Open Bolt]

Getting a little arrogant there, aren't you.

No.

I'm pretty sure that decision isn't up to you to make.

Your mistake. I'm part of what you would call the gun lobby. Alone I am just one person. But together the gun lobby has absolute power to stop all new federal gun laws.

 

[BULLDOG]

No.



Your mistake. I'm part of what you would call the gun lobby. Alone I am just one person. But together the gun lobby has absolute power to stop all new federal gun laws.

Your politicians have been sufficiently bribed for quite a while. You think you will own them forever?

 

[Open Bolt]

Your politicians have been sufficiently bribed for quite a while. You think you will own them forever?

Our power has nothing to do with bribery. It has to do with rural voters always voting people out of office if they violate the Second Amendment.

Parties need rural districts to control the House, so political parties cannot afford to cross us.

Yes I think that will last forever.

 

[GLASNOST]

This article ...
"... a gun .... gives you the ability to defend yourself against an armed, physically superior, or mentally unstable attacker ..."

So, it gives you the ability to attack a physically superior person despite you being mentally unstable. Every American should have a gun. What could go wrong with that? Self-annihilation? Sounds good to me.

 

[Blues Man]

So, it gives you the ability to attack a physically superior person despite you being mentally unstable. Every American should have a gun. What could go wrong with that? Self-annihilation? Sounds good to me.

We have laws in place that prohibit certain people from owning firearms and those that are adjudicated to be mentally ill are on that list.

 

[2aguy]

So, it gives you the ability to attack a physically superior person despite you being mentally unstable. Every American should have a gun. What could go wrong with that? Self-annihilation? Sounds good to me.

And yet 27 years of more guns and more people carrying guns shows you have no idea what you are talking about…..

From 1993-2015 we increased the number of guns in this country to 600 million and more than 19.5 million Americans were carrying guns in public….

what happened?

Gun murder was down49%
Gun crime down 75%
violent crime down 72%

So….according to your nonsense, how do you explain that?

More guns, by the hundreds of millions, more people carrying guns by the millions….and less gun crime, less violent crime

The exact opposite of what you anti- gun extremists preach…

How do you explain it?

 

[BULLDOG]

We have laws in place that prohibit certain people from owning firearms and those that are adjudicated to be mentally ill are on that list.

But if an entire class of gun sales don't bother to even look at that list, what good is it?

 

[2aguy]

But if an entire class of gun sales don't bother to even look at that list, what good is it?

Yes....yes....you want universal background checks so you can demand gun registration...which you need to ban and confiscate guns.....and you are willing to lie about private gun sales in order to get universal background checks....

Criminals are not getting their guns from normal people selling their guns....they get their guns from straw buyers, people who are knowingly buying guns to supply criminals....but instead of locking up criminals who commit gun crime, the democrat party that you support keeps releasing them. These criminals are the ones who are doing all of the shooting, yet you and your party keep releasing them.

 

[Blues Man]

But if an entire class of gun sales don't bother to even look at that list, what good is it?

If we don't enforce the gun laws we have what good are they? Most gun sales are subject to BG checks because they are done through licensed dealers.


When was the last time a person caught carrying a gun illegally was charged with a federal crime ? We all know that gun charges are the first to be dropped in plea deals.

WHen the city of Richmond VA worked with the US Attorneys office and actually prosecuted criminal gun crimes and sent the offenders to federal prison for 5 or more years the murder rate dropped, crime dropped by a statistically significant amount.

In just three years, Project Exile has startled critics and supporters with a message so strong it makes criminals drop guns. Now everyone from the NRA to the Million Mom March to Congress wants a piece of the action.

Growing Exile

www.styleweekly.com

 

[Stryder50]

Really? Golly! So, all of those men, women and children who get blown to bits at kindergartens, primary schools, junior high schools, high schools, colleges, universities, post offices, churches, road rages and shopping malls are (sorry .... 'were') gang or drug cartel members? Hmmm, you learn something new every day!.

And while you are at that learning thing, consider improving your reading comprehension and English language skills.

I said "MOST", not "ALL"; hopefully the differences aren't too nuanced for you to grasp.

BTW - you Europeans seem to hold a record of sorts on this mass shooting/killing "business" and that in countries with strict gun controls and a largely unarmed public;

Norway police say 85 killed in island youth camp attack​

Norway police say 85 killed in island youth camp attack

The death toll from the shooting at a Norwegian youth camp rises to 85, as police question a 32-year-old suspect.

www.bbc.com

...
Fjotolf Hansen[5] (born 13 February 1979), better known by his birth name Anders Behring Breivik (Norwegian pronunciation: [ˈɑ̂nːəʂ ˈbêːrɪŋ ˈbræ̂ɪviːk] (listen))[6] and by his pseudonym Andrew Berwick, is a Norwegian far right domestic terrorist,[7] known for committing the 2011 Norway attacks on 22 July 2011. On that day, he killed eight people by detonating a van bomb at Regjeringskvartalet in Oslo, then killed 69 participants of a Workers' Youth League (AUF) summer camp in a mass shooting on the island of Utøya.[8][9]
...

Anders Behring Breivik - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[BULLDOG]

Yes....yes....you want universal background checks so you can demand gun registration...which you need to ban and confiscate guns.....and you are willing to lie about private gun sales in order to get universal background checks....

Criminals are not getting their guns from normal people selling their guns....they get their guns from straw buyers, people who are knowingly buying guns to supply criminals....but instead of locking up criminals who commit gun crime, the democrat party that you support keeps releasing them. These criminals are the ones who are doing all of the shooting, yet you and your party keep releasing them.

There s no lie about individual gun sales. They are perfectly legal, and they happen every day without any kind of background check. Your lie about gun confiscation has no basis in fact.

 

[2aguy]

There s no lie about individual gun sales. They are perfectly legal, and they happen every day without any kind of background check. Your lie about gun confiscation has no basis in fact.

The lie is that you pretend normal people who sell their guns are supplying gangs and criminals...that is the lie.

The truth is you have straw buyers....people who are knowingly buying guns to sell them to criminals who are one small source of guns to criminals......

You want to pretend that normal people who sell their guns are a problem, since they don't have to do a background check since they are selling private property.

You want to use this lie to fool uninformed people into giving you universal background checks.

You want universal background checks, which will not stop straw buyers since they can pass any background check, to get gun registration, which you need before you move to ban and confiscate guns.

 

[2aguy]

And while you are at that learning thing, consider improving your reading comprehension and English language skills.

I said "MOST", not "ALL"; hopefully the differences aren't too nuanced for you to grasp.

BTW - you Europeans seem to hold a record of sorts on this mass shooting/killing "business" and that in countries with strict gun controls and a largely unarmed public;

Norway police say 85 killed in island youth camp attack​

Norway police say 85 killed in island youth camp attack

The death toll from the shooting at a Norwegian youth camp rises to 85, as police question a 32-year-old suspect.

www.bbc.com

...
Fjotolf Hansen[5] (born 13 February 1979), better known by his birth name Anders Behring Breivik (Norwegian pronunciation: [ˈɑ̂nːəʂ ˈbêːrɪŋ ˈbræ̂ɪviːk] (listen))[6] and by his pseudonym Andrew Berwick, is a Norwegian far right domestic terrorist,[7] known for committing the 2011 Norway attacks on 22 July 2011. On that day, he killed eight people by detonating a van bomb at Regjeringskvartalet in Oslo, then killed 69 participants of a Workers' Youth League (AUF) summer camp in a mass shooting on the island of Utøya.[8][9]
...

Anders Behring Breivik - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

You don't even have to start there.....in the 1920s the governments of Europe began registering, banning and confiscating guns from their people...all across the continent......on the promise it would make their people safer....

By 1939. the German socialists began the process of murdering 15 million innocent men, women and children....not war dead, not collateral damage from military action.....innocent people grabbed up across Europe and murdered by the German socialists.......after they surrendered their guns on the promise their governments would protect them.....

They have nothing to teach us....

 

[BULLDOG]

The lie is that you pretend normal people who sell their guns are supplying gangs and criminals...that is the lie.

The truth is you have straw buyers....people who are knowingly buying guns to sell them to criminals who are one small source of guns to criminals......

You want to pretend that normal people who sell their guns are a problem, since they don't have to do a background check since they are selling private property.

You want to use this lie to fool uninformed people into giving you universal background checks.

You want universal background checks, which will not stop straw buyers since they can pass any background check, to get gun registration, which you need before you move to ban and confiscate guns.

Buying without a background check is the same as a straw buyer.

 

[2aguy]

Buying without a background check is the same as a straw buyer.

No, it isn't. See....you just lied.

A straw buyer is knowingly buying a gun to give to a criminal. They can pass any background check, including "universal background checks," so what you want still won't stop them.

But, you desperately want gun registration.....you need universal background checks to get it.....

 

[2aguy]

And while you are at that learning thing, consider improving your reading comprehension and English language skills.

I said "MOST", not "ALL"; hopefully the differences aren't too nuanced for you to grasp.

BTW - you Europeans seem to hold a record of sorts on this mass shooting/killing "business" and that in countries with strict gun controls and a largely unarmed public;

Norway police say 85 killed in island youth camp attack​

Norway police say 85 killed in island youth camp attack

The death toll from the shooting at a Norwegian youth camp rises to 85, as police question a 32-year-old suspect.

www.bbc.com

...
Fjotolf Hansen[5] (born 13 February 1979), better known by his birth name Anders Behring Breivik (Norwegian pronunciation: [ˈɑ̂nːəʂ ˈbêːrɪŋ ˈbræ̂ɪviːk] (listen))[6] and by his pseudonym Andrew Berwick, is a Norwegian far right domestic terrorist,[7] known for committing the 2011 Norway attacks on 22 July 2011. On that day, he killed eight people by detonating a van bomb at Regjeringskvartalet in Oslo, then killed 69 participants of a Workers' Youth League (AUF) summer camp in a mass shooting on the island of Utøya.[8][9]
...

Anders Behring Breivik - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Don't forget The paris attack...

137 killed....by muslims with fully automatic military rifles, and grenades......

 

[GLASNOST]

... Any "Wild West" state in the USA has mostly to do with gangs and drug cartels. .......

Really? Golly! So, MOST of those men, women and children who get blown to bits at kindergartens, primary schools, junior high schools, high schools, colleges, universities, post offices, churches, road rages and shopping malls are (sorry .... 'were') gang or drug cartel members? Hmmm, you learn something new every day!

 

[2aguy]

Really? Golly! So, MOST of those men, women and children who get blown to bits at kindergartens, primary schools, junior high schools, high schools, colleges, universities, post offices, churches, road rages and shopping malls are (sorry .... 'were') gang or drug cartel members? Hmmm, you learn something new every day!

Yep.....

6 mass public shootings in 2019...yes....6.......a total of 43 people were killed...

Ladders kill 300 people a year.

Deer kill 200 people a year.

Bathtubs 350 people a year.

Lawn mowers kill 90-100 people a year.....

Total number of murders in 2019?

10,258

So...you doofus......that means that the majority of gun shootings in the U.S. were not mass public shootings....

The actual victims of the regular shootings?

Criminals...murdered by other criminals....and of the rest of the victims, the majority are the friends and family of criminals, hit by mistake as their criminal family or friend was being shot at by other criminals....

Most murder victims in big cities have criminal record

A review of murder statistics across America shows that in many large cities, up to 90 percent of the victims have criminal records.
-------
The report concludes that “of the 2011 homicide victims, 77 percent (66) had a least one prior arrest and of the known 2011 homicide suspects 90 percent (74) had at least one prior arrest.”
----------
In early 2012, after pressure put on the police by murder victims’ families in New Orleans, the police department stopped revealing whether or not the murder victim had a prior record.
---------------
Though data is no longer published in Baltimore, USA Today reported in 2007 that 91 percent of the then-205 murder victims in the city between Jan. 1 and Aug. 31, 2007, had criminal records.
---------
A WND review of the Philadelphia Police Department Murder and Shooting Analysis for 2011 shows a similar pattern to that of other large cities in America – a majority of the murder victims have prior records.

--------
In Philadelphia in 2011, of 324 murders, 81 percent (263) of the victims had at least one prior arrest; 62 percent (164) had been arrested for a violent crime prior to their murder.
----------
In Newark, N.J., long considered one of America’s most dangerous cities, 85 percent of the 165 murder victims between 2009 and 2010 had serious arrest histories.
Anthony Braga, a professor with the Rutgers-Newark School of Criminal Justice, told the Newark Star-Ledger that 85 percent of 165 murder victims in Newark between 2009 and 2010 had been arrested at least once before they were killed.
Those victims, he said, had, on average, 10 prior arrests on their criminal records.
A WND review of the Chicago Police Department Murder Analysis reports from 2003 to 2011 provides a statistical breakdown of the demographics of both the victims and offenders in the 4,265 murders in Chicago over that time period.

=======

A study finds that suspects in violent crime in the District share a lot of characteristics.

The National Institute for Criminal Justice Reform looked at the numbers for homicides and nonfatal shooting in D.C. in 2019 and 2020, and found that “most gun violence is tightly concentrated on a small number of very high-risk young Black male adults that share a common set of risk factors.”

Those factors include involvements in street crews, a previous criminal justice history and connection to a recent shooting. Often, they’ve been the victims of crime themselves. While the motive for the shooting “may not be a traditional gang war,” the report says, “often shootings are precipitated by a petty conflict over a young woman, a simple argument, or the now-ubiquitous social media slight.”
---------
More than 90% of victims and suspects in 2019 and 2020 were male and about 96% were Black.

The study also found that another 86% of victims and suspects have been involved with the criminal justice system and the average age of victims is 31, while the average age of suspects is 27 years old.

They found that, in terms of prior arrests, “victims and suspects were remarkably similar.”

http://[URL='https://wtop.com/dc/20...dc-gun-crimes-involve-small-number-of-people/

[/URL]

US mass shootings, 1982–2024: Data from Mother Jones’ investigation

The full data set from our in-depth investigation into mass shootings.

www.motherjones.com

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8

ucr.fbi.gov

 

[GLASNOST]

..... you Europeans seem to hold a record of sorts on this mass shooting/killing "business" and that in countries with strict gun controls and a largely unarmed public;

Not even comparable. These figures below are for one SINGLE YEAR:

USA 2020 - 19,384 gun deaths
Mexico 2019 - 22,116 gun deaths.
Colombia 2019 – 13,169 gun deaths.
Guatemala 2019 – 5,980 gun deaths.
Venezuela 2019 - 28,515 gun deaths.
.... perpetrated by a largely armed public.

I guess you've been relying on comic books, CIA disinformation and NRA brain-washing?