We Don’t Want a Post-Pandemic “Return to Normal,” We Want the End of Capitalism

[alang1216]

Using your statement then in the working class there are employment opportunities that are overpaid and employment opportunities that are underpaid with abilities taking a back seat to real privilege.

I don't follow your logic. Please explain.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Amazon Has Record-Breaking Profits in 2020, Avoids $2.3 Billion in Federal Income Taxes

The mechanisms the company is using to drop its effective tax rate are mostly unchanged: the company saved $1.8 billion using tax breaks for stock options, and it saved $639 million using various tax credits.

What's wrong with that?

 

[pknopp]

The mechanisms the company is using to drop its effective tax rate are mostly unchanged: the company saved $1.8 billion using tax breaks for stock options, and it saved $639 million using various tax credits.

What's wrong with that?

Read the thread. The complaint was a corporation using taxpayer funded infrastructure and not paying for it themselves also.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Read the thread. The complaint was a corporation using taxpayer funded infrastructure and not paying for it themselves also.

I read the thread.

What's on the other side of those "tax breaks for stock options"?

 

[pknopp]

I read the thread.

What's on the other side of those "tax breaks for stock options"?

dont care

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

dont care

I agree, you should remain ignorant.
Don't strain your brain.

 

[pknopp]

I agree, you should remain ignorant.
Don't strain your brain.

Start a thread on that if you wish to discuss it.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Start a thread on that if you wish to discuss it.

You brought it up when you clearly don't understand it.

 

[Uncensored2008]

That is true.


So you say but in my opinion a system that is undemocratic, organized completely top-down, tells it's members where they can live, what they can do, provides all their clothing, equipment, education, and healthcare is an essentially the classic communist model.

Your opinion is irrelevant.

1. Such a system would not be "communist" but rather totalitarian. You are confused between economic systems and governance models.
2. You claimed that the USA was "Communist," none of the above elements are part of the American system yet (though democrats are working toward it.)
3. Even the old USSR used currency to let people decide what clothing and consumer goods they would buy - despite extreme scarcity.

If a company can't exist without using government owned assets, to me that says socialism.

Utter nonsense. If Boise Paper sells mostly to government and depends on revenue from those sales, that in no way makes them socialist.

The issue is that you have no understanding of basic economic principles or terms.

That is exactly how Western economies were organized until problems emerged, e.g., monopolies, adulteration, etc. The government was inserted into the market in reaction to these problems.

False.

Western Economic models first arose as feudalism - which is really indistinguishable from socialism. Markets arose during the enlightenment as tradesmen and craftsmen arose due to advances in transportation, specifically the age of sail. The monarchies resisted releasing control of the economy by the state/crown but failed to stop it due to the incredible efficiency of free markets.

What you demand is little more than a return to 15th century economic models.

Too bad you don't live in a democracy like the USA where the government is elected by the people.

The USA is a constitutional republic. There are democratic elements in some states, such as the initiative process in California, but overall, it is a representative republic.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Do they own it?

It is not the means of production.

Take an introduction to economics course are at a local night school.

 

[alang1216]

Your opinion is irrelevant.

Not to me.

1. Such a system would not be "communist" but rather totalitarian. You are confused between economic systems and governance models.
2. You claimed that the USA was "Communist," none of the above elements are part of the American system yet (though democrats are working toward it.)
3. Even the old USSR used currency to let people decide what clothing and consumer goods they would buy - despite extreme scarcity.

1. This system is both since everyone is told what jobs they will perform and are provided all the tools they will use to do their job. The real world is very complicated and very messy.
2. No I claimed that the USA and every other country had hybrid economic systems composed of communist, socialist, and capitalist sectors. The communist model accounts for over 3% the USA's GDP.

Utter nonsense. If Boise Paper sells mostly to government and depends on revenue from those sales, that in no way makes them socialist.

No but if Boise Paper uses public roads to do their business, that makes the system they are a part of a hybrid of capitalist and socialist.

Western Economic models first arose as feudalism - which is really indistinguishable from socialism. Markets arose during the enlightenment as tradesmen and craftsmen arose due to advances in transportation, specifically the age of sail. The monarchies resisted releasing control of the economy by the state/crown but failed to stop it due to the incredible efficiency of free markets.

What you demand is little more than a return to 15th century economic models.

Actually I just finished a great book on Britain in the Victorian age. Aside from loving their imperial monopolies, they were serious into laissez faire but found they were continually having to inject the government into businesses when things like famines, mass poisonings, labor unrest, etc. At every step they moved grudgingly, just as the US did. In the USA, most of the early roads were private toll roads.

The USA is a constitutional republic. There are democratic elements in some states, such as the initiative process in California, but overall, it is a representative republic.

A flavor of democracy like an SUV is a flavor of an automobile.

 

[alang1216]

It is not the means of production.

Take an introduction to economics course are at a local night school.

Can they produce without it?

 

[francoHFW]

We need a real ambition, but the ambition to return to normality within capitalism is surely no ambition at all. To be politically salient, the desire to return to “normal” has to be seen as an expression of desire for the good life — for us to escape hardship. “Normal” is used as shorthand because, whatever the miseries forced upon us by capitalist depredations, the memory of small day-to-day pleasures from pre-pandemic life contains hints of broader freedoms. Rather than yearning for normal, we should insist on the good by insisting on socialism.

We Don’t Want a Post-Pandemic “Return to Normal,” We Want the End of Capitalism

In 2022, we limped out of the pandemic frying pan into the fire of resumed capitalist crises. Popular yearning to “get back to normal” is a desire for the good life — and making such a desire a reality will require fighting for socialism.

jacobin.com

socialism is simply always democratic fair capitalism with a good safety net just like in every modern country but us. Stop scaring the people lol

 

[francoHFW]

Shame is just another thing leftists destroyed. Remember in the 90s the left claimed being ashamed to be on welfare was mean. Now people are proud to get as much welfare as possible.

No, it was Mario Cuomo who said that Reagan made blaming the poor acceptable. Actually it is still despicable and your statements are crap propaganda, hater dupe.

 

[francoHFW]

All of man's endeavors fail eventually.

It's part of the fun of being human

that's communism as in a dictatorship that owns all business and industry. That's why this article is ******** because they never say what their definition of socialism is, which in the United States and other English speaking countries that are brainwashed with savage capitalist baloney is beyond confusing... Socialism as understood in France Germany Italy Sweden Russia everywhere but English speaking dupes, is understood as fair capitalism with a good safety net. Communism is a dictatorship and fails every time not socialism. Jesus Christ!

 

[francoHFW]

In this case it is correct,'Socialism always fails

BS. that's communism as in a dictatorship that owns all business and industry. That's why this article is ******** because they never say what their definition of socialism is, which in the United States and other English speaking countries that are brainwashed with savage capitalist baloney is beyond confusing... Socialism as understood in France Germany Italy Sweden Russia everyone but English speaking dupes, is understood as fair capitalism with a good safety net. Communism is a dictatorship and fails every time not socialism. Jesus Christ!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

basquebromance wants a free pony

He is looking for something to fuck! His Lebanese goats have gone frigid to his advances.

 

[Soupnazi630]

BS. that's communism as in a dictatorship that owns all business and industry. That's why this article is ******** because they never say what their definition of socialism is, which in the United States and other English speaking countries that are brainwashed with savage capitalist baloney is beyond confusing... Socialism as understood in France Germany Italy Sweden Russia everyone but English speaking dupes, is understood as fair capitalism with a good safety net. Communism is a dictatorship and fails every time not socialism. Jesus Christ!

Bullshit

You know nothing of this issue

Run along and talk about taylor swift or something more your speed

Socialism fails every where bitch DEAL WITH IT

 

[westwall]

We need a real ambition, but the ambition to return to normality within capitalism is surely no ambition at all. To be politically salient, the desire to return to “normal” has to be seen as an expression of desire for the good life — for us to escape hardship. “Normal” is used as shorthand because, whatever the miseries forced upon us by capitalist depredations, the memory of small day-to-day pleasures from pre-pandemic life contains hints of broader freedoms. Rather than yearning for normal, we should insist on the good by insisting on socialism.

We Don’t Want a Post-Pandemic “Return to Normal,” We Want the End of Capitalism

In 2022, we limped out of the pandemic frying pan into the fire of resumed capitalist crises. Popular yearning to “get back to normal” is a desire for the good life — and making such a desire a reality will require fighting for socialism.

jacobin.com

You truly are a fucking moron. But hey, at least the socialists will kill you quick so you won't be posting anymore bullshit.

 

[pknopp]

Bullshit

You know nothing of this issue

Run along and talk about taylor swift or something more your speed

Socialism fails every where bitch DEAL WITH IT

We see that happening here. But people love it.