What does the liberals think about enhanced interrogation now?

[Mr. Shaman]

If you catch a notorious Al Qaida leader and you ask them about impending terror attacks and they respond "soon, you will know".

That is a good time to break out the towels.

Yeah....I'm sure they do that, all-the-time.....

They did in the actual case.

Show Me!!!!!

<tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick>....​

 

[g5000]

Yup. Every god-fearn' real Merkin knows the only way we wuz gonna catch that sumbitch Obama, er...Osama (yuk yuk yuk, I crack myself up sometimes) was to drown a few rats, nowwutimean?

We suck so bad at findin' bad guyz we hasta resort to some of that tortu...er, "enhanced integration" stuff to find them these days.

You libtards can't name any other way we coulda finded him, so there. There just wuz no other way.

The ends justifies the means. Enhanced integration ain't wrong if we do it.

 

[CMike]

Yeah....I'm sure they do that, all-the-time.....

They did in the actual case.

Show Me!!!!!

<tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick>....​

I did.

I posted it already.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Yup. Every god-fearn' real Merkin knows the only way we wuz gonna catch that sumbitch Obama, er...Osama (yuk yuk yuk, I crack myself up sometimes) was to drown a few rats, nowwutimean?

We suck so bad at findin' bad guyz we hasta resort to some of that tortu...er, "enhanced integration" stuff to find them these days.

You libtards can't name any other way we coulda finded him, so there.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1ivoWW1-4U]The interrogator, Pt. 1 - YouTube[/ame]
*
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0iaNMRjkno]The interrogator, Pt. 2 - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Mr. Shaman]

They did in the actual case.

Show Me!!!!!

<tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick>....​

I did.

I posted it already.

Fail!!!!!



*

Run, along, Skippy.....​

 

[nodoginnafight]

Yup. Every god-fearn' real Merkin knows the only way we wuz gonna catch that sumbitch Obama, er...Osama (yuk yuk yuk, I crack myself up sometimes) was to drown a few rats, nowwutimean?

We suck so bad at findin' bad guyz we hasta resort to some of that tortu...er, "enhanced integration" stuff to find them these days.

You libtards can't name any other way we coulda finded him, so there. There just wuz no other way.

The ends justifies the means. Enhanced integration ain't wrong if we do it.

you're on a roll today

 

[CMike]

Show Me!!!!!

<tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick>....​

I did.

I posted it already.

Fail!!!!!



*

]​

http://www.usmessageboard.com/6735256-post99.html

I guess you like big type so here you go.



CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style Attack on Los Angeles | CNS News

CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style Attack on Los Angeles


Khalid Sheik Mohammad, a top al Qaeda leader who divulged information -- after being waterboarded -- that allowed the U.S. government to stop a planned terrorist attack on Los Angeles.

(CNSNews.com) - The Central Intelligence Agency told CNSNews.com today that it stands by the assertion made in a May 30, 2005 Justice Department memo that the use of “enhanced techniques” of interrogation on al Qaeda leader Khalid Sheik Mohammed (KSM) -- including the use of waterboarding -- caused KSM to reveal information that allowed the U.S. government to thwart a planned attack on Los Angeles.

Before he was waterboarded, when KSM was asked about planned attacks on the United States, he ominously told his CIA interrogators, “Soon, you will know.”

According to the previously classified May 30, 2005 Justice Department memo that was released by President Barack Obama last week, the thwarted attack -- which KSM called the “Second Wave”-- planned “ ‘to use East Asian operatives to crash a hijacked airliner into’ a building in Los Angeles.”

KSM was the mastermind of the first “hijacked-airliner” attacks on the United States, which struck the World Trade Center in New York and the Pentagon in Northern Virginia on Sept. 11, 2001.

After KSM was captured by the United States, he was not initially cooperative with CIA interrogators. Nor was another top al Qaeda leader named Zubaydah. KSM, Zubaydah, and a third terrorist named Nashiri were the only three persons ever subjected to waterboarding by the CIA. (Additional terrorist detainees were subjected to other “enhanced techniques” that included slapping, sleep deprivation, dietary limitations, and temporary confinement to small spaces -- but not to water-boarding.)

This was because the CIA imposed very tight restrictions on the use of waterboarding. “The ‘waterboard,’ which is the most intense of the CIA interrogation techniques, is subject to additional limits,” explained the May 30, 2005 Justice Department memo. “It may be used on a High Value Detainee only if the CIA has ‘credible intelligence that a terrorist attack is imminent’; ‘substantial and credible indicators that the subject has actionable intelligence that can prevent, disrupt or deny this attack’; and ‘[o]ther interrogation methods have failed to elicit this information within the perceived time limit for preventing the attack.’”

The quotations in this part of the Justice memo were taken from an Aug. 2, 2004 letter that CIA Acting General Counsel John A. Rizzo sent to the Justice Department’s Office of Legal Counsel.

Before they were subjected to “enhanced techniques” of interrogation that included waterboarding, KSM and Zubaydah were not only uncooperative but also appeared contemptuous of the will of the American people to defend themselves.

“In particular, the CIA believes that it would have been unable to obtain critical information from numerous detainees, including KSM and Abu Zubaydah, without these enhanced techniques,” says the Justice Department memo. “Both KSM and Zubaydah had ‘expressed their belief that the general US population was ‘weak,’ lacked resilience, and would be unable to ‘do what was necessary’ to prevent the terrorists from succeeding in their goals.’ Indeed, before the CIA used enhanced techniques in its interrogation of KSM, KSM resisted giving any answers to questions about future attacks, simply noting, ‘Soon you will know.’”
After he was subjected to the “waterboard” technique, KSM became cooperative, providing intelligence that led to the capture of key al Qaeda allies and, eventually, the closing down of an East Asian terrorist cell that had been tasked with carrying out the 9/11-style attack on Los Angeles.

The May 30, 2005 Justice Department memo that details what happened in this regard was written by then-Principal Deputy Attorney General Steven G. Bradbury to John A. Rizzo, the senior deputy general counsel for the CIA.

“You have informed us that the interrogation of KSM—once enhanced techniques were employed—led to the discovery of a KSM plot, the ‘Second Wave,’ ‘to use East Asian operatives to crash a hijacked airliner into’ a building in Los Angeles,” says the memo.

“You have informed us that information obtained from KSM also led to the capture of Riduan bin Isomuddin, better known as Hambali, and the discover of the Guraba Cell, a 17-member Jemaah Islamiyah cell tasked with executing the ‘Second Wave,’” reads the memo. “More specifically, we understand that KSM admitted that he had [redaction] large sum of money to an al Qaeda associate [redaction] … Khan subsequently identified the associate (Zubair), who was then captured. Zubair, in turn, provided information that led to the arrest of Hambali. The information acquired from these captures allowed CIA interrogators to pose more specific questions to KSM, which led the CIA to Hambali’s brother, al Hadi. Using information obtained from multiple sources, al-Hadi was captured, and he subsequently identified the Garuba cell. With the aid of this additional information, interrogations of Hambali confirmed much of what was learned from KSM.”​

 

[CMike]

I don't know, what does the liberals think; my informed guess is liberals don't all think alike.

Exactly no foundation of absolutes with Liberals.

Exactly.

We prefer to think for ourselves. We're not as lazy as the average "conservative"/Teabagger.

]​

When are you guys going to start?

 

[CMike]

Being a Liberal means never having to say you're sorry.

And winning is all that matters no matter who gets hurt
there base has been lied so much they have no idea what to think until there told
seal team 6 are heros in a world of heros
the libs called them Cheneys assassination squad for years

You're gonna have a pretty difficult time, in Jr. High, if that's the best you can spell & punctuate.

You mean "going to" ?

 

[emilynghiem]

Seeing as how "conservatives" are typically "absolutes"-driven....as-opposed-to thinking for themselves, they've earned the lemming-designation. ​

OK let's look at absolutism vs. relativism

A. pro-choice abortion rights vs. gun rights

Liberals I know want absolutely NO laws restricting limiting or regulating abortion in any way.
Absolutely not.
Because if you start anything, even asking for sonograms or anesthesia, even recognizing an unborn baby killed in the womb of a murdered mother as a murdered person also, then that "opens the door" for more legislation.

But when people against gun regulations argue for similar reasons,
they are irresponsible and denying responsibility for the abuses of guns.

Do you see that it is mutual, and how both sides see the other?
As an absolutist who won't budge, because it opens the door to the other side taking over?

B. homosexuality and orientation

Liberals I know reject the idea that homosexuality is a choice. I have also never met a person who consciously chose to be gay or transgender etc.
In some cases, it is not natural and can be changed though it takes more than free will.
There are many people who report being healed of abuse where it no longer repeated in patterns of sexual abuse, whether heterosexual OR homosexual relations were abused.

However, in cases of conversion such as these, suddenly the gay community doesn't recognize their experiences as real or valid. So these people "weren't really gay to begin with" There are also still conflicts going on within gay, lesbian, and bisexual groups not treating and including each other equally, though much progress has been made.

So this idea of including all people is relative. It is only if people agree to support people who think as they do. But when a bisexual or former homosexual has a different experience and talks about choosing to act differently, then that doesn't count. So it depends.

Is this what you mean by taking a relative approach?

Not to worry, Conservatives do this also!
Look at the free exercise of religion, and how Muslims were discriminated against.
Christians complain when they are targeted by fear, and then they did it to Muslims.

Not very "absolutist" about freedom of religion, are they?

 

[rightwinger]

Torture is for pussies

 

[Rocko]

Yup. Every god-fearn' real Merkin knows the only way we wuz gonna catch that sumbitch Obama, er...Osama (yuk yuk yuk, I crack myself up sometimes) was to drown a few rats, nowwutimean?

We suck so bad at findin' bad guyz we hasta resort to some of that tortu...er, "enhanced integration" stuff to find them these days.

You libtards can't name any other way we coulda finded him, so there. There just wuz no other way.

The ends justifies the means. Enhanced integration ain't wrong if we do it.

Right, you think everyone who disagrees with you is a stupid fucking hick. Got it.

Enhanced interrogation can be a very effective tool in saving lives and preventing attacks. I'm glad we still have the option of using them.

 

[Rocko]

Torture is for pussies

So you love it then.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

I did.

I posted it already.

Fail!!!!!



*

]​

http://www.usmessageboard.com/6735256-post99.html

I guess you like big type so here you go.



CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style Attack on Los Angeles | CNS News​

Aw, jeez.....you know, as-well-as anyone else, that the potential LA "attacks" were bogus.....dreamed-up by BU$HCO, to make it look like they were on top of things.

Get back, to me, when you find something real......​

​

​

 

[rightwinger]

Torture is for pussies

So you love it then.

I grew up watching movies of Nazis, Japanese, Communists and evil villains engaging in torture

Now kids get to grow up watching movies about Americans engaged in torture

 

[Rocko]

Torture is for pussies

So you love it then.

I grew up watching movies of Nazis, Japanese, Communists and evil villains engaging in torture

Now kids get to grow up watching movies about Americans engaged in torture

I don't believe we've ever tortured anyone. You and I have a fundamental disagreement on that. Can you at least admit that enhanced integration can give us a edge on the battlefield and in combating terrorism?

 

[g5000]

Yup. Every god-fearn' real Merkin knows the only way we wuz gonna catch that sumbitch Obama, er...Osama (yuk yuk yuk, I crack myself up sometimes) was to drown a few rats, nowwutimean?

We suck so bad at findin' bad guyz we hasta resort to some of that tortu...er, "enhanced integration" stuff to find them these days.

You libtards can't name any other way we coulda finded him, so there. There just wuz no other way.

The ends justifies the means. Enhanced integration ain't wrong if we do it.

Right, you think everyone who disagrees with you is a stupid fucking hick. Got it.


Enhanced interrogation can be a very effective tool in saving lives and preventing attacks. I'm glad we still have the option of using them.

Oh, you are much worse than a hick. You are a collectivist totalitarian wannabe:

From the two central features of every collectivist system, the need for a commonly accepted system of ends of the group and the all-overriding desire to give to the group the maximum of power to achieve these ends, grows a definite system of morals, which on some points coincides and on others violently contrasts with ours&#8212;but differs from it in one point which makes it doubtful whether we can call it morals: that it does not leave the individual conscience free to apply its own rules and does not even know any general rules which the individual is required or allowed to observe in all circumstances. This makes collectivist morals so different from what we have known as morals that we find it difficult to discover any principle in them, which they nevertheless possess.

The difference of principle is very much the same as that which we have already considered in connection with the Rule of Law. Like formal law, the rules of individualist ethics, however unprecise they may be in many respects, are general and absolute; they prescribe or prohibit a general type of action irrespective of whether in the particular instance the ultimate purpose is good or bad. To cheat or steal, to torture or betray a confidence, is held to be bad, irrespective of whether or not in the particular instance any harm follows from it. Neither the fact that in a given instance nobody may be the worse for it, nor any high purpose for which such an act may have been committed, can alter the fact that it is bad. Though we may sometimes be forced to choose between different evils, they remain evils.

The principle that the end justifies the means is in individualist ethics regarded as the denial of all morals. In collectivist ethics it becomes necessarily the supreme rule; there is literally nothing which the consistent collectivist must not be prepared to do if it serves &#8220;the good of the whole,&#8221; because the &#8220;good of the whole&#8221; is to him the only criterion of what ought to be done. The raison d&#8217;état, in which collectivist ethics has found its most explicit formulation, knows no other limit than that set by expediency&#8212;the suitability of the particular act for the end in view. And what the raison d&#8217;état affirms with respect to the relations between different countries applies equally to the relations between different individuals within the collectivist state. There can be no limit to what its citizen must be prepared to do, no act which his conscience must prevent him from committing, if it is necessary for an end which the community has set itself or which his superiors order him to achieve.

The Road to Serfdom

 

[rightwinger]

So you love it then.

I grew up watching movies of Nazis, Japanese, Communists and evil villains engaging in torture

Now kids get to grow up watching movies about Americans engaged in torture

I don't believe we've ever tortured anyone. You and I have a fundamental disagreement on that. Can you at least admit that enhanced integration can give us a edge on the battlefield and in combating terrorism?

John McCain is an expert on torture
I will take his word on it

EVERYONE who engages in torture has a damn good reason for it. We should not cross that line

 

[g5000]

Apparently the scared little rabid dogs can't figure out another way we could get information. It totally stumps them.

 

[Rocko]

I grew up watching movies of Nazis, Japanese, Communists and evil villains engaging in torture

Now kids get to grow up watching movies about Americans engaged in torture

I don't believe we've ever tortured anyone. You and I have a fundamental disagreement on that. Can you at least admit that enhanced integration can give us a edge on the battlefield and in combating terrorism?

John McCain is an expert on torture
I will take his word on it

EVERYONE who engages in torture has a damn good reason for it. We should not cross that line

I respect John McCain's opinion, I just happen to disagree with it. I disagree with your premise that enhance interrogation is in fact torture. I'm sure you've been asked this in this debate, but I'll ask anyway, if someone you loved was in danger and enhanced interrogation is an option in alleviating the situation, would you want the government to use it? I'm not asking you the question to prove the end justifies the means, I'm trying to see if you will admit it can be an effective measure in coercing information, as common sense would dictate.