What Happens When You Tax Billionaires At 90%

[Markle]

As you said, they think they're going to be billionaires or at least multimillionaires too, so they support whatever is in the vested interest of the uber-rich, even if it undermines their own real interests and that of their children. They love the rich and hold the poor in contempt, including democracy, that's why the only government that is evil in their eyes, is a publicly created and run one, not the bureaucracy of the filthy rich, which they go to six days weekly eight hours daily a.k.a.:

View attachment 792176
THE NON-DEMOCRATIC WORKPLACE = THE PRIVATE GOVERNMENT DICTATORSHIP OF THE RICH.​

She probably works 60 hours weekly and despite her billionaire employer making tens of billions yearly in profits, she and her coworkers are still on food-stamps. She's never participated in an election at work, because her billionaire employer doesn't hold any. The right-wingers love privately owned totalitarian governments, a.k.a. private business enterprises. They love that, and abhor civil, democratic government, created by the people. They can't stand that, because the uber-rich hate democracy. They love PLUTOCRACY = RULE OF THE RICH.

​

Ironically, these Republican conservatives, claim to be disciples of Jesus, whose teachings on personal finance and good government were more in line with Bernie Sanders, a democratic socialist than with Adam Smith the father of capitalism. Not even Adam Smith agrees with them, because Smith identified capitalists as "masters". He used the word "master" when referring to capitalists, at a time when masters owned slaves. Smith called employees, workmen or "servants". Amazing their confusion. the irony of their anti-working class hubris. They hate the working-class (they hate themselves).

​

 

[ReinyDays]

Correction, the more you use petroleum(gasoline), or diesel, the more you pay.
So far, EV's not using as much gasoline/petrol/diesel as ICs, pay less than their "fair share" of taxes for roads. Throw in the additional tax subsidies(write-offs) on purchase of EVs and they pay even less of their "fair-share". Throw in the tax-payer subsidized charging stations and even less still.
When it comes to taxes for transportation~roads; improvements, maintain, expand, etc.; best method would be a mileage (use) based tax.

True ... but "tax-payer subsidized charging station" along the Columbia River is a vanishing small amount of money ... cheap AND carbon-neutral hydro-power ... pennies per month per rate-payer ...

Mileage and weight ... it's the big rigs that tear up the roads ...

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

GDP isn't the only metric to assess the standard of living of a country. So why the emphasis on GDP?

You won't post their GDP per capita?

 

[TruthNotBS]

You won't post their GDP per capita?

Why are you emphasizing GDP and ignoring every other metric for assessing a population's standard of living? The GDP of the EU is 16 trillion as of 2022.

 

[TruthNotBS]

Boohoo, I'm a "troll" because you don't like my point of view.

 

[Markle]

You certainly have the buzzwords down pat. Very little in the way of substantiating anything beyond insisting that it's true because you say so, but hey, who's counting?

Do you deny that the bottom line of capitalism is profits? Capitalism is a profit-driven system of production.

To assert that capitalists were supposedly compelled to close all of their factories here at home and move them to China, Mexico, and other third-world countries out of the goodness of their hearts, to provide cheap products to the American consumer (the American poor), is truly absurd. You're just making excuses for capitalists who want to make more money, at the expense of the American worker and economy.

Another ridiculous cop-out argument that you appealed to, is the one that proposes that American workers prefer to lose their good-paying, union jobs, in order to have cheap Chinese coffee mugs. That's essentially what you're saying. American manufacturers for over a century were making decent profits, even with unionized labor. Most Americans, if they had the opportunity to buy better quality, MADE IN THE USA production, they would do it, even if they have to pay more.

Of course, you're going to exaggerate and pretend that the better quality American products are going to be SO MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE, AND UNAFFORDABLE, but that's nonsense. Back in the 1980s, even into the 90s, there were plenty of American-made products, and people purchased those products, due to their better quality and simply because those products are AMERICAN. Americans like buying American, especially when they had good-paying union jobs. When you pay workers low wages, they don't have cash to buy products and may actually get into credit-card debt. That's why in the 1980s, so many working-class people fell into heavy credit card debt.


Haven't you noticed that jobs are plentiful right now? In fact, companies can't get enough GOOD workers. The ones they find don't do the job right anymore, so don't deserve high pay.

Why would anyone, especially among the youth, want to work under a totalitarian system that tries to extract as much labor-power from them as possible, while paying as little as possible, with few benefits, if any and without any representation or protection from a labor union?

These businesses are overworking their employees in order to recover as much money as possible, of what they lost during covid and don't care about the conditions their workers are working under (suck it up and get to work bucko!). They could care less. These capitalists share your cynical, indifferent elitist attitude, that always assumes that the workers are at fault for whatever occurs to them in the "labor market" or workplace. By default, it's never the employer-elites who are worthy of criticism, it's supposedly always those "lazy poor people", and "whinny workers".

However, the fact that there are a lot of jobs now is really irrelevant to the point I made in my last post. The point is that, whether there are or aren't enough jobs, the US government can ensure that every American that can work, has a job, in the public sector.

And bankrupt us all the faster. FDR didn't have 30 trillion in debt to deal with, we do.

You obviously don't know anything about economics or how our monetary system works. We have a GDP of 25 trillion dollars and a sovereign fiat currency, exclusively issued by our federal government. There's no way the US Gov, will ever go insolvent, much less bankrupt. Are you suggesting the US government is going to run out of dollars? How is that possible, when it is the exclusive issuer of the USD?

The so-called national debt is a political ploy perpetuated by capitalists and their Republican and Democrat cronies in government. They want Americans to believe that the so-called "national debt", is like a personal or household debt and that couldn't be further from the truth. The debt of currency users (we the people) and the debt of the currency issuer (the US Federal Government), are completely different. Not the same.

If the government spends money on infrastructural projects and putting people to work, that only increases production or our GDP, stimulating the economy. It has ZERO negative effect on our so-called "debt", which is more of a ledger or record of all of the money that is in the economy, in savings and treasuries. Watch this:

​

Where is that actually happening?

If we had a government that served the people (the American public) rather than the wealthy elites who bribe politicians with their army of lobbyists and their well-funded "think tanks" (stink tanks), they would fix the system, facilitating the creation of democratically-run worker-owned cooperatives, that are now practically always denied loans from the SBA (Small Business Administration) and private banks.

The US government should also provide the American people with a job guarantee in the public sector. That would put more money in worker's hands, that they can use to purchase goods and services and it would increase democracy. The wealthy elites wouldn't be so arrogant and dismissive of the needs of the American workforce. People would have more options than just working for capitalists who hate democracy.

More, as automation and artificial intelligence develop, there's eventually going to be a transition from for-profit production to a non-profit, publicly owned and run production system, hence it behooves us to begin the transition of the American workforce from working in privately owned capitalist dictatorships to democratically run and worker-owned cooperatives.

I absolutely believe the American consumer will pay the lowest price he can find to pay, even at lower quality, especially when it's a choice between cheap shoes and no shoes, cheap TV or no TV.

That's a false dichotomy. The American workforce, despite all of the difficulties and damage caused by supply-side Reaganomics (the trickle down that doesn't trickle), we're still not at a point where the choice is between a cheap Chinese pair of shoes and no shoes, or a cheap Chinese TV and no TV. That's a gross, groundless exaggeration. Most Americans would pay a bit more for a MADE IN THE USA product than continue buying lower-quality Chinese products and destroying America in the process. Gutting America of its manufacturing base and making us dependent upon China for crucial items like safety equipment for medical staff and countless consumer-goods is dangerous and irresponsible.

We should become energy independent and also as independent as possible for all of the consumer goods that we use, that way we can truly be free, no longer needing an adversary to supply us with what we need to live.


Click to expand...Wow, you actually think Americans want to spend more to have American made goods.

Maybe you won't but there are tens of millions of Americans right now, despite the negative, ignorant neo-liberal, capitalist propaganda that you spew, that wouldn't think twice, much less complain about spending a few bucks more to support the American economy and American patriot-employers, who love this country and keep Americans employed, with good wages. In a heartbeat. Maybe you've become nihilistic and don't care anymore, thinking everyone shares your condition.

No reason to read any further than that. Here's your homework assignment. Go stand outside your local Walmart and ask 100 people as they exit if they are, as you say, "itching, even desperate" to buy American, ESPECIALLY when it means they pay a lot more. Come back and tell us how it went.

You're late, I've already done that in my church and online, I've run several polls. Most Americans would opt to restore our manufacturing base, increase wages, improve work conditions, and buy MADE IN THE USA.

If you were a smart capitalist, you would open a factory here and emphasize the fact you sell GOOD QUALITY - MADE IN THE USA.

View attachment 792341


View attachment 792342
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[Nostra]

Boohoo, I'm a "troll" because you don't like my point of view.

Nah, pretty much cuz you are a pathetic troll, Newbie.

 

[TruthNotBS]

Nah, pretty much cuz you are a pathetic troll, Newbie.

 

[Nostra]

View attachment 792414

See.

 

[TruthNotBS]

Markle

You don't want capitalism to benefit everyone in society? Just the rich?

 

[TruthNotBS]

See.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Why are you emphasizing GDP and ignoring every other metric for assessing a population's standard of living? The GDP of the EU is 16 trillion as of 2022.

When you say "standard of living", GDP per capita is by far the most important part of that standard.

OK, how about square feet of living space per capita?

 

[Nostra]

View attachment 792419

See.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

You certainly have the buzzwords down pat. Very little in the way of substantiating anything beyond insisting that it's true because you say so, but hey, who's counting?

Do you deny that the bottom line of capitalism is profits? Capitalism is a profit-driven system of production.

To assert that capitalists were supposedly compelled to close all of their factories here at home and move them to China, Mexico, and other third-world countries out of the goodness of their hearts, to provide cheap products to the American consumer (the American poor), is truly absurd. You're just making excuses for capitalists who want to make more money, at the expense of the American worker and economy.

Another ridiculous cop-out argument that you appealed to, is the one that proposes that American workers prefer to lose their good-paying, union jobs, in order to have cheap Chinese coffee mugs. That's essentially what you're saying. American manufacturers for over a century were making decent profits, even with unionized labor. Most Americans, if they had the opportunity to buy better quality, MADE IN THE USA production, they would do it, even if they have to pay more.

Of course, you're going to exaggerate and pretend that the better quality American products are going to be SO MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE, AND UNAFFORDABLE, but that's nonsense. Back in the 1980s, even into the 90s, there were plenty of American-made products, and people purchased those products, due to their better quality and simply because those products are AMERICAN. Americans like buying American, especially when they had good-paying union jobs. When you pay workers low wages, they don't have cash to buy products and may actually get into credit-card debt. That's why in the 1980s, so many working-class people fell into heavy credit card debt.


Haven't you noticed that jobs are plentiful right now? In fact, companies can't get enough GOOD workers. The ones they find don't do the job right anymore, so don't deserve high pay.

Why would anyone, especially among the youth, want to work under a totalitarian system that tries to extract as much labor-power from them as possible, while paying as little as possible, with few benefits, if any and without any representation or protection from a labor union?

These businesses are overworking their employees in order to recover as much money as possible, of what they lost during covid and don't care about the conditions their workers are working under (suck it up and get to work bucko!). They could care less. These capitalists share your cynical, indifferent elitist attitude, that always assumes that the workers are at fault for whatever occurs to them in the "labor market" or workplace. By default, it's never the employer-elites who are worthy of criticism, it's supposedly always those "lazy poor people", and "whinny workers".

However, the fact that there are a lot of jobs now is really irrelevant to the point I made in my last post. The point is that, whether there are or aren't enough jobs, the US government can ensure that every American that can work, has a job, in the public sector.

And bankrupt us all the faster. FDR didn't have 30 trillion in debt to deal with, we do.

You obviously don't know anything about economics or how our monetary system works. We have a GDP of 25 trillion dollars and a sovereign fiat currency, exclusively issued by our federal government. There's no way the US Gov, will ever go insolvent, much less bankrupt. Are you suggesting the US government is going to run out of dollars? How is that possible, when it is the exclusive issuer of the USD?

The so-called national debt is a political ploy perpetuated by capitalists and their Republican and Democrat cronies in government. They want Americans to believe that the so-called "national debt", is like a personal or household debt and that couldn't be further from the truth. The debt of currency users (we the people) and the debt of the currency issuer (the US Federal Government), are completely different. Not the same.

If the government spends money on infrastructural projects and putting people to work, that only increases production or our GDP, stimulating the economy. It has ZERO negative effect on our so-called "debt", which is more of a ledger or record of all of the money that is in the economy, in savings and treasuries. Watch this:

​

Where is that actually happening?

If we had a government that served the people (the American public) rather than the wealthy elites who bribe politicians with their army of lobbyists and their well-funded "think tanks" (stink tanks), they would fix the system, facilitating the creation of democratically-run worker-owned cooperatives, that are now practically always denied loans from the SBA (Small Business Administration) and private banks.

The US government should also provide the American people with a job guarantee in the public sector. That would put more money in worker's hands, that they can use to purchase goods and services and it would increase democracy. The wealthy elites wouldn't be so arrogant and dismissive of the needs of the American workforce. People would have more options than just working for capitalists who hate democracy.

More, as automation and artificial intelligence develop, there's eventually going to be a transition from for-profit production to a non-profit, publicly owned and run production system, hence it behooves us to begin the transition of the American workforce from working in privately owned capitalist dictatorships to democratically run and worker-owned cooperatives.

I absolutely believe the American consumer will pay the lowest price he can find to pay, even at lower quality, especially when it's a choice between cheap shoes and no shoes, cheap TV or no TV.

That's a false dichotomy. The American workforce, despite all of the difficulties and damage caused by supply-side Reaganomics (the trickle down that doesn't trickle), we're still not at a point where the choice is between a cheap Chinese pair of shoes and no shoes, or a cheap Chinese TV and no TV. That's a gross, groundless exaggeration. Most Americans would pay a bit more for a MADE IN THE USA product than continue buying lower-quality Chinese products and destroying America in the process. Gutting America of its manufacturing base and making us dependent upon China for crucial items like safety equipment for medical staff and countless consumer-goods is dangerous and irresponsible.

We should become energy independent and also as independent as possible for all of the consumer goods that we use, that way we can truly be free, no longer needing an adversary to supply us with what we need to live.


Click to expand...Wow, you actually think Americans want to spend more to have American made goods.

Maybe you won't but there are tens of millions of Americans right now, despite the negative, ignorant neo-liberal, capitalist propaganda that you spew, that wouldn't think twice, much less complain about spending a few bucks more to support the American economy and American patriot-employers, who love this country and keep Americans employed, with good wages. In a heartbeat. Maybe you've become nihilistic and don't care anymore, thinking everyone shares your condition.

No reason to read any further than that. Here's your homework assignment. Go stand outside your local Walmart and ask 100 people as they exit if they are, as you say, "itching, even desperate" to buy American, ESPECIALLY when it means they pay a lot more. Come back and tell us how it went.

You're late, I've already done that in my church and online, I've run several polls. Most Americans would opt to restore our manufacturing base, increase wages, improve work conditions, and buy MADE IN THE USA.

If you were a smart capitalist, you would open a factory here and emphasize the fact you sell GOOD QUALITY - MADE IN THE USA.

View attachment 792341


View attachment 792342
​

We should crank up the printing presses to pay for stupid government spending?

 

[TruthNotBS]

When you say "standard of living", GDP per capita is by far the most important part of that standard.

OK, how about square feet of living space per capita?

No, it's not. Life expectancy, the overall health of the population, child mortality, access to healthcare and education, housing, and employment. Worker rights and how people in general feel about their lives, are they happy? Those are very important metrics that you poopoo because you know that in America, we're at the bottom of the barrel on practically all of those.

​

 

[TruthNotBS]

We should crank up the printing presses to pay for stupid government spending?

It's mostly a keyboard at the FED, not a printing press. Your stupid government Social Security and Medicare? Maybe you should go without that?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

No, it's not. Life expectancy, the overall health of the population, child mortality, access to healthcare and education, housing, and employment. Worker rights and how people in general feel about their lives, are they happy? Those are very important metrics that you poopoo because you know that in America, we're at the bottom of the barrel on practically all of those.

​

So, if you're poorer, living in a tiny apartment, with a tiny car (or no car), on a long waiting list for lower quality government run heathcare, but you tell a pollster you're happy.....that means you have a higher standard of living?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

It's mostly a keyboard at the FED, not a printing press. Your stupid government Social Security and Medicare? Maybe you should go without that grandpa?

Just fire up the old keyboard to pay for more stupid government spending?

How'd that work for Bidenflation over the last few years?

Sorry to disappoint, comrade, not on either.

 

[TruthNotBS]

So, if you're poorer, living in a tiny apartment, with a tiny car (or no car), on a long waiting list for lower quality government run heathcare, but you tell a pollster you're happy.....that means you have a higher standard of living?

Great, at least now you're getting more specific. They're not living in tiny apartments, they have regular cars, although that's not really an important factor if you have a robust public transit system (as we have in Madrid), and if people choose to drive or ride other types of vehicles (there are a lot of scooters in Madrid).

The long waits canard is an old worn-out one, that is greatly exaggerated by right-wing apologists. I had to wait two months to see a specialist on my United Healthcare plan (private insurance). I also had less access to certain doctors, due to not being part of my "network".

I live half the year in Spain, where I'm also a citizen, and I have quick access to primary care. The most I've ever waited to see a specialist is two months as well, the same as here in America with private insurance. I also have dental and other services that I don't have here.

More, most people here in the US are more than satisfied with their "socialist" Medicare plan. There's no reason why we can't have single-payer, universal Medicare here in America.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Great, at least now you're getting more specific. They're not living in tiny apartments, they have regular cars, although that's not really an important factor if you have a robust public transit system (as we have in Madrid), and if people choose to drive or ride other types of vehicles (a lot of scooters in Madrid. .

The long waits canard is an old worn-out one, that is greatly exaggerated by right-wing apologists. I had to wait two months to see a specialist on my United Healthcare plan (private insurance). I also had less access to certain doctors, due to not being part of my "network".

I live half the year in Spain, where I'm also a citizen, and I have quick access to primary care. The most I've ever waited to see a specialist is two months as well, the same as here in America with private insurance. I also have dental and other services that I don't have here.

More, most people here in the US are more than satisfied with their "socialist" Medicare plan. There's no reason why we can't have single-payer, universal Medicare here in America.

Great, at least now you're getting more specific. They're not living in tiny apartments,

Post your evidence.

they have regular cars

Ditto.

The long waits canard is an old worn-out one,

And it's true. They have less equipment, and it's older. Fewer drugs, and they're older.
And longer lines.

I had to wait two months to see a specialist on my United Healthcare plan (private insurance).

And you'd have been waiting 6 months, or longer, under socialized medicine.

At the age of 90, Isabel had a micro stroke. Eleven months later she is still waiting for a CAT scan.

'People may die': Hospital waiting times in Spain break records

At the age of 90, Isabel had a micro stroke. Eleven months later she is still waiting for a CAT scan.

www.euronews.com

There's no reason why we can't have single-payer, universal Medicare here in America.

Sure. All the benefits of the DMV and the charm of the IRS.