What if she didn't have a gun?

[mudwhistle]

My point from the very beginning has been that all gun sales do not require a background check. Thank you for confirming that.

Clearly you don't even understand the intent of background checks. I guess that's not surprising.

The fact is you were arguing from a different point than I. I was arguing from a dealers standpoint since I am a federally licensed firearm dealer. You were arguing about the sale of ALL guns which encompasses every firearm in every nation on every continent.

Intent? What intent? There are no legal requirements for private sales of firearms in regards to back grounds checks, period.

Then your not very smart. I've clearly and often been stating ALL sales. Your arguments have been a waste of time because ultimately YOU confirmed I am correct.

The intend of gun laws is to keep them from criminals. Duh

History is full of failures with good intentions.

Laws are worthless against the lawless.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

My point from the very beginning has been that all gun sales do not require a background check. Thank you for confirming that.

Clearly you don't even understand the intent of background checks. I guess that's not surprising.

The fact is you were arguing from a different point than I. I was arguing from a dealers standpoint since I am a federally licensed firearm dealer. You were arguing about the sale of ALL guns which encompasses every firearm in every nation on every continent.

Intent? What intent? There are no legal requirements for private sales of firearms in regards to back grounds checks, period.

Then your not very smart. I've clearly and often been stating ALL sales. Your arguments have been a waste of time because ultimately YOU confirmed I am correct.

The intend of gun laws is to keep them from criminals. Duh

Yes and I interpreted it as to all sales from a licensed dealer.

I applaud the way you dodged the fact that you were mistaken about background check loopholes involving private sales of firearms.

Do you really have to have a law telling you not to sell a firearm to a criminal? I guess you do since you're the kind that would sell guns without a bill of sale.

 

[Brain357]

The fact is you were arguing from a different point than I. I was arguing from a dealers standpoint since I am a federally licensed firearm dealer. You were arguing about the sale of ALL guns which encompasses every firearm in every nation on every continent.

Intent? What intent? There are no legal requirements for private sales of firearms in regards to back grounds checks, period.

Then your not very smart. I've clearly and often been stating ALL sales. Your arguments have been a waste of time because ultimately YOU confirmed I am correct.

The intend of gun laws is to keep them from criminals. Duh

Yes and I interpreted it as to all sales from a licensed dealer.

I applaud the way you dodged the fact that you were mistaken about background check loopholes involving private sales of firearms.

Do you really have to have a law telling you not to sell a firearm to a criminal? I guess you do since you're the kind that would sell guns without a bill of sale.

So constantly saying ALL sales wasn't enough for you? What about my example of me buying a gun from my neighbor who bought it from a friend. That didn't clue you in either? Let's face it, your clueless.

Without the background check you don't really know if the person is a criminal. Again your clueless.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Joe is right. We have gun crime, but not at the same rate seen in the US. And zero mass shootings since 1996.

But far more rapes and assaults.

 

[mudwhistle]

Then your not very smart. I've clearly and often been stating ALL sales. Your arguments have been a waste of time because ultimately YOU confirmed I am correct.

The intend of gun laws is to keep them from criminals. Duh

Yes and I interpreted it as to all sales from a licensed dealer.

I applaud the way you dodged the fact that you were mistaken about background check loopholes involving private sales of firearms.

Do you really have to have a law telling you not to sell a firearm to a criminal? I guess you do since you're the kind that would sell guns without a bill of sale.

So constantly saying ALL sales wasn't enough for you? What about my example of me buying a gun from my neighbor who bought it from a friend. That didn't clue you in either? Let's face it, your clueless.

Without the background check you don't really know if the person is a criminal. Again your clueless.

Try ending all drug sales.

Nope, you can't.

 

[Brain357]

Yes and I interpreted it as to all sales from a licensed dealer.

I applaud the way you dodged the fact that you were mistaken about background check loopholes involving private sales of firearms.

Do you really have to have a law telling you not to sell a firearm to a criminal? I guess you do since you're the kind that would sell guns without a bill of sale.

So constantly saying ALL sales wasn't enough for you? What about my example of me buying a gun from my neighbor who bought it from a friend. That didn't clue you in either? Let's face it, your clueless.

Without the background check you don't really know if the person is a criminal. Again your clueless.

Try ending all drug sales.

Nope, you can't.

For many reasons that's a completely different task. The number of people who do or have done illegal drugs would absolutely dwarf the number of people who have committed a crime with a firearm. Plus people can make or grow drugs. Plus the only victim is the person doing the drug... Sorry it's not comparable.

 

[mudwhistle]

Like I said, you want to create another class of criminals. But you figure going after people different from you doesn't effect you, so why the Hell not. Screw over millions of Americans just so you can feel warm and fuzzy.

I think abortion is murder. 50 million babies killed out of pure convenience, so folks can bone any time they want. These innocent victims are just invisible to the left.

This is my chance to stand on the bodies of dead babies. Gun legislation is your opportunity.

 

[mudwhistle]

So constantly saying ALL sales wasn't enough for you? What about my example of me buying a gun from my neighbor who bought it from a friend. That didn't clue you in either? Let's face it, your clueless.

Without the background check you don't really know if the person is a criminal. Again your clueless.

Try ending all drug sales.

Nope, you can't.

For many reasons that's a completely different task. The number of people who do or have done illegal drugs would absolutely dwarf the number of people who have committed a crime with a firearm. Plus people can make or grow drugs. Plus the only victim is the person doing the drug... Sorry it's not comparable.

Now you're winning my argument for me.

Oh, crime is usually related to drug use.

 

[Brain357]

Try ending all drug sales.

Nope, you can't.

For many reasons that's a completely different task. The number of people who do or have done illegal drugs would absolutely dwarf the number of people who have committed a crime with a firearm. Plus people can make or grow drugs. Plus the only victim is the person doing the drug... Sorry it's not comparable.

Now you're winning my argument for me.

Oh, crime is usually related to drug use.

No I haven't actually.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Then your not very smart. I've clearly and often been stating ALL sales. Your arguments have been a waste of time because ultimately YOU confirmed I am correct.

The intend of gun laws is to keep them from criminals. Duh

Yes and I interpreted it as to all sales from a licensed dealer.

I applaud the way you dodged the fact that you were mistaken about background check loopholes involving private sales of firearms.

Do you really have to have a law telling you not to sell a firearm to a criminal? I guess you do since you're the kind that would sell guns without a bill of sale.

So constantly saying ALL sales wasn't enough for you? What about my example of me buying a gun from my neighbor who bought it from a friend. That didn't clue you in either? Let's face it, your clueless.

Without the background check you don't really know if the person is a criminal. Again your clueless.

No because I believed it was in the context of guns being purchased from a dealer. I've already explained this to you once, Are you that dumb that you need it explained again? If you need a more simple explanation, I'll have my grandson explain it to you.

When you mentioned your neighbor selling you a gun etc.. I didn't argue that a background check was required or not. I stated a bill of sale would be the ideal thing to have. That's two totally separate issues with two different legal requirements. No comparison.

If I were to privately sell a firearm you can bet your ass I would know the person I'm selling it to and whether or not he/she is a criminal or if they can legally possess a firearm or I would not sell to them if these things weren't known by me.

Do you honestly think background checks for ALL gun sales will stop criminals from getting access to guns and or using them in a crime?

I'm not understanding why you are pursuing this line of thought when it's flawed from the start.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

So constantly saying ALL sales wasn't enough for you? What about my example of me buying a gun from my neighbor who bought it from a friend. That didn't clue you in either? Let's face it, your clueless.

Without the background check you don't really know if the person is a criminal. Again your clueless.

Try ending all drug sales.

Nope, you can't.

For many reasons that's a completely different task. The number of people who do or have done illegal drugs would absolutely dwarf the number of people who have committed a crime with a firearm. Plus people can make or grow drugs. Plus the only victim is the person doing the drug... Sorry it's not comparable.

People can also make guns.

 

[mudwhistle]

For many reasons that's a completely different task. The number of people who do or have done illegal drugs would absolutely dwarf the number of people who have committed a crime with a firearm. Plus people can make or grow drugs. Plus the only victim is the person doing the drug... Sorry it's not comparable.

Now you're winning my argument for me.

Oh, crime is usually related to drug use.

No I haven't actually.

Most violent crime involves drugs in some shape or form. You could give a flying-f about all of the kids dying in Chicago because of gang activity which usually involves drugs or alcohol. You want to focus on Sandyhook and maybe suicides. That is the tip of the iceberg.

Remove the negativity in black communities and most of the gun violence goes away.

Nope, you want to take away guns from everyone else while ignoring the real causes of the problem.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Now you're winning my argument for me.

Oh, crime is usually related to drug use.

Actually, crime is usually related to drug prohibition.

 

[Uncensored2008]

No I haven't actually.

What you have done is demonstrate the complete lack of reasoning skills that is so common among gun grabbers.

This is why you lose, because you cannot present a reasoned argument to support your position. Emotion only takes you so far, and that is ALL you have, an appeal to emotion.

 

[Brain357]

Yes and I interpreted it as to all sales from a licensed dealer.

I applaud the way you dodged the fact that you were mistaken about background check loopholes involving private sales of firearms.

Do you really have to have a law telling you not to sell a firearm to a criminal? I guess you do since you're the kind that would sell guns without a bill of sale.

So constantly saying ALL sales wasn't enough for you? What about my example of me buying a gun from my neighbor who bought it from a friend. That didn't clue you in either? Let's face it, your clueless.

Without the background check you don't really know if the person is a criminal. Again your clueless.

No because I believed it was in the context of guns being purchased from a dealer. I've already explained this to you once, Are you that dumb that you need it explained again? If you need a more simple explanation, I'll have my grandson explain it to you.

When you mentioned your neighbor selling you a gun etc.. I didn't argue that a background check was required or not. I stated a bill of sale would be the ideal thing to have. That's two totally separate issues with two different legal requirements. No comparison.

If I were to privately sell a firearm you can bet your ass I would know the person I'm selling it to and whether or not he/she is a criminal or if they can legally possess a firearm or I would not sell to them if these things weren't known by me.

Do you honestly think background checks for ALL gun sales will stop criminals from getting access to guns and or using them in a crime?

I'm not understanding why you are pursuing this line of thought when it's flawed from the start.

Sorry ding dong, we talked about specific situations where there wouldn't be a background check. You agreed so you knew we weren't talking about dealers. Now your using a lie to cover your other lie. You have a big problem with honesty, just like the NRA. Now stop embarrassing yourself.

 

[Brain357]

Now you're winning my argument for me.

Oh, crime is usually related to drug use.

No I haven't actually.

Most violent crime involves drugs in some shape or form. You could give a flying-f about all of the kids dying in Chicago because of gang activity which usually involves drugs or alcohol. You want to focus on Sandyhook and maybe suicides. That is the tip of the iceberg.

Remove the negativity in black communities and most of the gun violence goes away.

Nope, you want to take away guns from everyone else while ignoring the real causes of the problem.

I would make it much harder for all criminals to get guns.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

So constantly saying ALL sales wasn't enough for you? What about my example of me buying a gun from my neighbor who bought it from a friend. That didn't clue you in either? Let's face it, your clueless.

Without the background check you don't really know if the person is a criminal. Again your clueless.

No because I believed it was in the context of guns being purchased from a dealer. I've already explained this to you once, Are you that dumb that you need it explained again? If you need a more simple explanation, I'll have my grandson explain it to you.

When you mentioned your neighbor selling you a gun etc.. I didn't argue that a background check was required or not. I stated a bill of sale would be the ideal thing to have. That's two totally separate issues with two different legal requirements. No comparison.

If I were to privately sell a firearm you can bet your ass I would know the person I'm selling it to and whether or not he/she is a criminal or if they can legally possess a firearm or I would not sell to them if these things weren't known by me.

Do you honestly think background checks for ALL gun sales will stop criminals from getting access to guns and or using them in a crime?

I'm not understanding why you are pursuing this line of thought when it's flawed from the start.

Sorry ding dong, we talked about specific situations where there wouldn't be a background check. You agreed so you knew we weren't talking about dealers. Now your using a lie to cover your other lie. You have a big problem with honesty, just like the NRA. Now stop embarrassing yourself.

Do you honestly think background checks for ALL gun sales will stop criminals from getting access to guns and or using them in a crime?

 

[Brain357]

No because I believed it was in the context of guns being purchased from a dealer. I've already explained this to you once, Are you that dumb that you need it explained again? If you need a more simple explanation, I'll have my grandson explain it to you.

When you mentioned your neighbor selling you a gun etc.. I didn't argue that a background check was required or not. I stated a bill of sale would be the ideal thing to have. That's two totally separate issues with two different legal requirements. No comparison.

If I were to privately sell a firearm you can bet your ass I would know the person I'm selling it to and whether or not he/she is a criminal or if they can legally possess a firearm or I would not sell to them if these things weren't known by me.

Do you honestly think background checks for ALL gun sales will stop criminals from getting access to guns and or using them in a crime?

I'm not understanding why you are pursuing this line of thought when it's flawed from the start.

Sorry ding dong, we talked about specific situations where there wouldn't be a background check. You agreed so you knew we weren't talking about dealers. Now your using a lie to cover your other lie. You have a big problem with honesty, just like the NRA. Now stop embarrassing yourself.

Do you honestly think background checks for ALL gun sales will stop criminals from getting access to guns and or using them in a crime?

It would make it much harder for criminals to get guns if combined with registering all guns.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Sorry ding dong, we talked about specific situations where there wouldn't be a background check. You agreed so you knew we weren't talking about dealers. Now your using a lie to cover your other lie. You have a big problem with honesty, just like the NRA. Now stop embarrassing yourself.

Do you honestly think background checks for ALL gun sales will stop criminals from getting access to guns and or using them in a crime?

It would make it much harder for criminals to get guns if combined with registering all guns.

You have evidence to that effect?

 

[Brain357]

No loophole, That's the way it has always been and only a total idiot would sell a firearm registered in their name to someone that would use it to commit a crime.

I've been shot at on one occasion and I've held burglars that broke into my shop at gun point on another. Luckily I have yet had to shoot anyone.

Guns are registered?

So you have not been in a shootout, then you don't know.

When you buy a gun from an FFL dealer, you are required by law to complete a BATF form 4473. The dealer is then required to keep that form forever - and also record the purchase in a BATF "bound book" that shows all inflows and outflows of firearms.

If a gun is ever "traced" by BATF, they will first call the manufacturer and ask where the gun was shipped (manufacturers also have to have a special FFL AND maintain their own bound book records. BATF will then contact the wholesaler that received the gun and again track that through their bound book to the retailer. Finally the retailer is called and asked who the gun was sold to.

So, there is basically a paper trail on all new gun sales since 1968.

Also, if an FFL dealer goes out of business, they are required by law to forward their bound book and all form 4473 paperwork to the BATF for safekeeping.

So yes it is basically registered.

Trust me, I know.

You already made a good argument why all guns should be registered. Then we can find out how the criminal got the gun and prosecute.