What If You Atheists Are Wrong? Hmmmm...

[JBeukema]

Indeed...please explain just where YOUR sense of morality came from....since NATURE teaches none.

You're a fucking moron

http://www.usmessageboard.com/religion-and-ethics/79578-the-moral-instinct.html

If it were not for RELIGION...there would be no civilization nor laws.

you're a fucking moron

social contract law - Google Search

Mankind would be living in small isolated groups or tribes living under only one rule....survival of the fittest.

you're a fucking moron

Humanist Network News Ezine Archives

There would be no ill or sick....they would consumed for the good of the whole or simply allowed to die to keep from hindering the herd mentality.

Please kill yourself; such advanced stupidity must not be allowed to spread

 

[N4mddissent]

Indeed...please explain just where YOUR sense of morality came from....since NATURE teaches none. If it were not for RELIGION...there would be no civilization nor laws. Mankind would be living in small isolated groups or tribes living under only one rule....survival of the fittest. There would be no ill or sick....they would consumed for the good of the whole or simply allowed to die to keep from hindering the herd mentality

First of all, if you want to make this argument, then I suppose any religion will do. After all, there were civilizations that had never heard of christianity. They had some form of religion. So I guess it doesn't really matter what you believe. The aztecs had laws, the babylonians had laws, and tribes all over the world had rules and standards of conduct.

As for nature, while it is indeed "red in tooth and claw" I suggest you do a little more research on altruism among animals. Some animals will sacrifice themselves for their young. Chimps and bonobos have elaborate systems of reciprocity. Are you suggesting all of these have civilizations?

 

[HUGGY]

See what most people, non-believers, especially the rabid strain, don't understand is that if genuine Christianity is totally bogus, once we die, we literally have had nothing to lose and, in any case, have lived a beautiful life.

If Christianity did not exist, civilization at this point would probably have died out. Seriously!

Anne Marie

The humans have survived in spite of christianity ...not because of it...seriously!

It's amazing how much credit you annoint yourself with. I would rather poke knitting needles in my eyes than be a christian.

If there is no god you have spent your life living a lie. You have spent your life spreading that lie and wasting time and energy that could accomplish something tangible and truly worthwhile for society.

Indeed...please explain just where YOUR sense of morality came from....since NATURE teaches none. If it were not for RELIGION...there would be no civilization nor laws. Mankind would be living in small isolated groups or tribes living under only one rule....survival of the fittest. There would be no ill or sick....they would consumed for the good of the whole or simply allowed to die to keep from hindering the herd mentality.

Well since you asked nicely....

Contrary to your obsevations I see nature displaying nurture constantly. Not caring for the young is the exception.

Elephants..whales.. many species defend the weak and dying..most protect the very young disregarding thier own safety.

All morality extrapolates from those examples. My own is an extension of the lessons nature has offered.

 

[Dr Grump]

so we are suppose to "hedge our bets" no thanks....i believe in goddess....i have my own belief system...i dont have to hedge my bet with your god.

Trouble is....YOUR BELIEF, holds no authority, nor can it be confirmed....its ONLY MYTHICAL, and not historically documented and confirmed by actual history and physical science, as is the revelation of the one and only TRUE GOD of Creation.

Er, I hate to break it to ya Malph, but your belief holds no authority, nor can it be confirmed, and it is only mythical. Go figure....

 

[sidneyworld]

Indeed...please explain just where YOUR sense of morality came from....since NATURE teaches none.

You're a fucking moron

http://www.usmessageboard.com/religion-and-ethics/79578-the-moral-instinct.html

If it were not for RELIGION...there would be no civilization nor laws.

you're a fucking moron

social contract law - Google Search

Mankind would be living in small isolated groups or tribes living under only one rule....survival of the fittest.

you're a fucking moron

Humanist Network News Ezine Archives

There would be no ill or sick....they would consumed for the good of the whole or simply allowed to die to keep from hindering the herd mentality.

Please kill yourself; such advanced stupidity must not be allowed to spread

Well said, JB. You're on top of your game I see.

am

 

[sidneyworld]

Well move over mother Teresa..

All that do gooder shit is real impresive. I volunteer at a local food bank. Big whoop! We feed the homeless at the restarant free of charge.

You do not come here advocating for the homeless or those in need in 99% of your posts. You come here to push Christianity.

After you get your foot out of your mouth and the egg off your face, you can apologize.



Anne Marie

You forgot the crow I'm eating with the foot and the egg. The three basic food groups. Yum!

Appologise? For what? Where pray tell did I err? Having a full dance card as a wet nurse for everyone you know that can't figure out how to cope with life doesn't make you any wiser than me or anyone else. You don't get extra credit to push Jezuss.

I have a wonderful life. I am quite wealthy in just about every way imaginable. My heaven is here for now. I hope to make it through to eternity. If you don't understand these things that's not my problem.

Try chicken instead. I like crows. They have personality..

God speed, my friend.

Anne Marie

 

[Coloradomtnman]

Once, while climbing a big wall in Yosemite I heard something above me that sounded like a rock falling through the air. Instinctively I hunched and leaned into the rock hoping that it would miss me. The sound of the rock whizzing through the air, however, was growing louder but too slowly growing nearer. Then suddenly a raven fell into view from above. I was probably around 800 feet up and watched as the raven, wings partially folded into slow its fall, fell further and further below me.

I wondered what the hell it was doing. Why wasn't it flying or gliding? They aren't birds of prey so I didn't think it was attacking another bird. It kept falling nearing the trees. Just as it got close to the treetops it suddenly and rapidly spread its wings and shot out over the valley floor and glided off out of sight. There was no practical reason I could see for the raven to do this. And then it occurred to me...

It was B.A.S.E. jumping! The raven had leapt from the cliff high above me, fell for close to a thousand feet, and then deployed its chute (its wings) at the very last second all just for fun. The bird was having a good time doin' the Dew, dude! Totally extreme, er, whatever! Ever since then I've had a new found respect for ravens.

 

[sidneyworld]

Once, while climbing a big wall in Yosemite I heard something above me that sounded like a rock falling through the air. Instinctively I hunched and leaned into the rock hoping that it would miss me. The sound of the rock whizzing through the air, however, was growing louder but too slowly growing nearer. Then suddenly a raven fell into view from above. I was probably around 800 feet up and watched as the raven, wings partially folded into slow its fall, fell further and further below me.

I wondered what the hell it was doing. Why wasn't it flying or gliding? They aren't birds of prey so I didn't think it was attacking another bird. It kept falling nearing the trees. Just as it got close to the treetops it suddenly and rapidly spread its wings and shot out over the valley floor and glided off out of sight. There was no practical reason I could see for the raven to do this. And then it occurred to me...

It was B.A.S.E. jumping! The raven had leapt from the cliff high above me, fell for close to a thousand feet, and then deployed its chute (its wings) at the very last second all just for fun. The bird was having a good time doin' the Dew, dude! Totally extreme, er, whatever! Ever since then I've had a new found respect for ravens.

Hi Colorado! Great story. I've seen some pretty incredible stuff in my time as well.

Anne Marie

 

[Anguille]

Once, while climbing a big wall in Yosemite I heard something above me that sounded like a rock falling through the air. Instinctively I hunched and leaned into the rock hoping that it would miss me. The sound of the rock whizzing through the air, however, was growing louder but too slowly growing nearer. Then suddenly a raven fell into view from above. I was probably around 800 feet up and watched as the raven, wings partially folded into slow its fall, fell further and further below me.

I wondered what the hell it was doing. Why wasn't it flying or gliding? They aren't birds of prey so I didn't think it was attacking another bird. It kept falling nearing the trees. Just as it got close to the treetops it suddenly and rapidly spread its wings and shot out over the valley floor and glided off out of sight. There was no practical reason I could see for the raven to do this. And then it occurred to me...

It was B.A.S.E. jumping! The raven had leapt from the cliff high above me, fell for close to a thousand feet, and then deployed its chute (its wings) at the very last second all just for fun. The bird was having a good time doin' the Dew, dude! Totally extreme, er, whatever! Ever since then I've had a new found respect for ravens.

Crows and ravens often engage in play like this especially in mating season. Tumbling in the air and somersaults. There is a name for this type of behavior but it slips my mind at the moment.

 

[sidneyworld]

Once, while climbing a big wall in Yosemite I heard something above me that sounded like a rock falling through the air. Instinctively I hunched and leaned into the rock hoping that it would miss me. The sound of the rock whizzing through the air, however, was growing louder but too slowly growing nearer. Then suddenly a raven fell into view from above. I was probably around 800 feet up and watched as the raven, wings partially folded into slow its fall, fell further and further below me.

I wondered what the hell it was doing. Why wasn't it flying or gliding? They aren't birds of prey so I didn't think it was attacking another bird. It kept falling nearing the trees. Just as it got close to the treetops it suddenly and rapidly spread its wings and shot out over the valley floor and glided off out of sight. There was no practical reason I could see for the raven to do this. And then it occurred to me...

It was B.A.S.E. jumping! The raven had leapt from the cliff high above me, fell for close to a thousand feet, and then deployed its chute (its wings) at the very last second all just for fun. The bird was having a good time doin' the Dew, dude! Totally extreme, er, whatever! Ever since then I've had a new found respect for ravens.

Crows and ravens often engage in play like this especially in mating season. Tumbling in the air and somersaults. There is a name for this type of behavior but it slips my mind at the moment.

"...As for the bald eagles’ aerial displays during courtship, most of them are very impressive. One is called the cartwheel display, where the eagles will fly high, lock talons, and then cartwheel to earth, only breaking apart at the last moment before they hit the ground or water. Another is the chase display, where after chasing each other they will lock talons and roll together. And finally there is the roller-coaster display, where an individual eagle will fly high, fold its wings, then plummet down, only to swoop up at the last minute to avoid hitting the earth. While these aerial activities are certainly captivating to watch, eagle biologists report that the ritual of building the nest together is probably more powerful in securing a tight bond between the pair..."

http://www.usmessageboard.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=1378044

This is a great site by the way if you like eagles. There's a live webcam when they are nesting.

Anne Marie

 

[N4mddissent]

Once, while climbing a big wall in Yosemite I heard something above me that sounded like a rock falling through the air. Instinctively I hunched and leaned into the rock hoping that it would miss me. The sound of the rock whizzing through the air, however, was growing louder but too slowly growing nearer. Then suddenly a raven fell into view from above. I was probably around 800 feet up and watched as the raven, wings partially folded into slow its fall, fell further and further below me.

I wondered what the hell it was doing. Why wasn't it flying or gliding? They aren't birds of prey so I didn't think it was attacking another bird. It kept falling nearing the trees. Just as it got close to the treetops it suddenly and rapidly spread its wings and shot out over the valley floor and glided off out of sight. There was no practical reason I could see for the raven to do this. And then it occurred to me...

It was B.A.S.E. jumping! The raven had leapt from the cliff high above me, fell for close to a thousand feet, and then deployed its chute (its wings) at the very last second all just for fun. The bird was having a good time doin' the Dew, dude! Totally extreme, er, whatever! Ever since then I've had a new found respect for ravens.

We're still discovering how interesting birds really are. Crows are similar to ravens. Check out this story about their problem solving ability. Further research is being done along these lines with other birds as well.

 

[Ceasaro]

I'm an agnostic, so I don't think that it's out of the question that there's a god, but so far I've seen no real, tangible proof. None.
So, do I get in heaven or not? Surely, I won't get thrown in hell for that. Or is there another place?

 

[N4mddissent]

I'm an agnostic, so I don't think that it's out of the question that there's a god, but so far I've seen no real, tangible proof. None.
So, do I get in heaven or not? Surely, I won't get thrown in hell for that. Or is there another place?

By many interpretations, doubting is not believing. It is active faith you need, not a "it might be true".

 

[SWGAFire]

The very idea of the question is interesting to me ('what IF you atheists are wrong?' Not stating that we/they are). In my experiences living in the 'bible belt', where there's 2.4 churches per square mile...and knowing MANY Christians...there really isn't much True faith. The majority of what I find is a fear of it actually being right. That there Is a god who wants you to follow his doctrines. It is better to go to church and profess belief than the alternative in the afterlife.

That isn't faith or belief! That's simply fear of the the unknown, fear of death. It's better to believe and be safe. Now, wouldn't you imagine that an Omniscient being wouldn't be dupped by such a childish tomfoolery?

 

[N4mddissent]

The very idea of the question is interesting to me ('what IF you atheists are wrong?' Not stating that we/they are). In my experiences living in the 'bible belt', where there's 2.4 churches per square mile...and knowing MANY Christians...there really isn't much True faith. The majority of what I find is a fear of it actually being right. That there Is a god who wants you to follow his doctrines. It is better to go to church and profess belief than the alternative in the afterlife.

That isn't faith or belief! That's simply fear of the the unknown, fear of death. It's better to believe and be safe. Now, wouldn't you imagine that an Omniscient being wouldn't be dupped by such a childish tomfoolery?

Or what if they are right and it's the god I described in this post?

 

[sidneyworld]

The very idea of the question is interesting to me ('what IF you atheists are wrong?' Not stating that we/they are). In my experiences living in the 'bible belt', where there's 2.4 churches per square mile...and knowing MANY Christians...there really isn't much True faith. The majority of what I find is a fear of it actually being right. That there Is a god who wants you to follow his doctrines. It is better to go to church and profess belief than the alternative in the afterlife.

That isn't faith or belief! That's simply fear of the the unknown, fear of death. It's better to believe and be safe. Now, wouldn't you imagine that an Omniscient being wouldn't be dupped by such a childish tomfoolery?

I absolutely agree with you here. My faith does not deal with fear. It simply has heightened my awareness of life. I'm still an artist, still a legal adminstrator, still a pain in the butt at times, still stubborn and unyielding to advise, though I do listen, and I still have a stronger faith by the day as my life continues. And all this without attending mass.

Imagine that! Faith is real. Religion for some is more like a star chamber. Especially in the Bible Belt! Phew!

Anne Marie

 

[SWGAFire]

Yea, I read it, N4mddissent. Wonderfully written, a bedtime story I'd tell my children. If I had children. But still...it's filled with all these "what ifs" and that's what gets to me (and I know to you as well). 'If' you were right, Hellz! That would be sweet!

Over the centuries with every advancement in every science 'God' has been pushed further and further aside. Microbiology and Meteorology have dispelled 90% of God (thanks Sagan). And still people cling to a crippled, starving horse praying it carry them off after their sun sets.

It's sad to think of all the world has lost and had torn from it's collect brains because of self-perceived threat to doctrine. Think of the stores of ancient knowledges lost! Christianity, I would say, set humankind back centuries in development because of the unimaginable amount of books, scrolls, tablets, murals, verbal teachings etc that they burned, hammered and suppressed from our forefathers!!!! Not to mention the advancements that were never made just because of the FEAR of the church! And still it effects Scientists today. I wonder in the future, how will people look back at us and gawk in disbelief at how dark our age is?

Damn...it's late, I've got to wind down...

 

[Diuretic]

It's perfectly natural for us humans to do anything to avoid the end of consciousness. We'll believe just about any claim, indulge in just about any ritual, deny ourselves harmless pleasures, in order to cling to the notion that when we die somehow we will continue to have a consciousness, preferably in a nice place. When we eventually accept that, like everything else we can see, we're temporary, then we will have no need for religion.

 

[N4mddissent]

It's perfectly natural for us humans to do anything to avoid the end of consciousness. We'll believe just about any claim, indulge in just about any ritual, deny ourselves harmless pleasures, in order to cling to the notion that when we die somehow we will continue to have a consciousness, preferably in a nice place. When we eventually accept that, like everything else we can see, we're temporary, then we will have no need for religion.

Why should I fear death? If I am, death is not. If death is, I am not.

-Epicurus

 

[renoite]

I'm an agnostic, so I don't think that it's out of the question that there's a god, but so far I've seen no real, tangible proof. None.
So, do I get in heaven or not? Surely, I won't get thrown in hell for that. Or is there another place?

the rule of thumb well the rule is that you have know jesus crist and know GOD sent him do die for your and mine sins. or your dont go to heaven that is what the bible says. But if you dont think GOD is real it shouldn't matter to you anyways.