Why it is so vital for the DOJ to investigate Police Departments.

[SavannahMann]

Attorney General Sessions has announced that the DOJ will no longer pursue compliance actions against the various police departments. This essentially ends a practice that has been vigorously pursued since Bill Clinton was President. George W. Bush also pursued police departments that were violating civil rights as a matter of practice.

Now, we have two cities where without that compliance, without those investigations, the corruption, systemic corruption would be continuing.

Federal Court Issues Order in Lawsuit Against the Twin Cities of Colorado City, Arizona and Hildale, Utah, Finding Widespread Police Misconduct and Religious Discrimination

So what was going on? The Police Departments turned blind eyes towards the Fundimentalist Latter Day Saints branch of the Morman church.

They helped a fugitive. They ignored underage marriages. They protected criminals. Senator Sessions called these kinds of investigations part of the war on cops. This isn't the war on cops. This isn't part of it. This is a corrupt police agency that would be committing those same criminal acts today if not for the investigations that Sessions has shut down.

I voted for Trump. And I am going to continue to take the administration to task for these kinds of actions. Because I believe in doing the right thing, no matter who is in charge. My beliefs do not change with the wind. I don't believe the issue will be solved with a single election, but with determined and continuous effort.

Civil Rights are worth it. I don't live there, and I wasn't ever in contact with them. Yet we all are diminished when one of us has his or her civil rights denied them.

 

[Pete7469]

How about the government end drug prohibition and stop law enforcement all together in certain communities?

What if police officers had to live inside their patrol district?

If an area is so depressed and no taxes can be expected from it, let it go wild for a while. Nature will take it's course.

The feds give LEO's MRAPs and now all of a sudden libs want to regulate the fuck out of local police? They had that in the USSR.... NOT INTERESTED.....

 

[SavannahMann]

How about the government end drug prohibition and stop law enforcement all together in certain communities?

What if police officers had to live inside their patrol district?

If an area is so depressed and no taxes can be expected from it, let it go wild for a while. Nature will take it's course.

The feds give LEO's MRAPs and now all of a sudden libs want to regulate the fuck out of local police? They had that in the USSR.... NOT INTERESTED.....

So you prefer police departments that assist drug lords? Police departments that are complicit in Statutory Rape? Police Departments that assist fugitives?

I don't think I like your world much.

 

[Pete7469]

So you prefer police departments that assist drug lords? Police departments that are complicit in Statutory Rape? Police Departments that assist fugitives?

I don't think I like your world much.

There are levels of oversight, I get that.

I want oversight not management.

I also want accountability at the federal level. Until we get THAT, the feds have ZERO credibility to oversee anyone.

Do you understand why that is?

 

[SavannahMann]

So you prefer police departments that assist drug lords? Police departments that are complicit in Statutory Rape? Police Departments that assist fugitives?

I don't think I like your world much.

There are levels of oversight, I get that.

I want oversight not management.

I also want accountability at the federal level. Until we get THAT, the feds have ZERO credibility to oversee anyone.

Do you understand why that is?

The Compliance Actions aren't even really Oversight. First, many times, but certainly not all the time, the investigations into the Police are conducted at the request of the City Political Leaders. These investigations are best considered reviews of the policies, and practices.

One of the most famous recent examples is Ferguson Missouri. Yes, the same state that just recently made it a felony for grade school kids to get into a fight. The Feds cleared Wilson in the shooting of Mike Brown. But they also investigated the Police at the request of the City Fathers. That investigation found widespread violations of Civil Rights. The Feds wrote up a list of changes that the Police needed to make to be in compliance with the Constitution. Changes needed to bring the police in compliance with Civil Rights.

The "oversight" consisted of a period in which the Feds would get copies of the Police Reports to insure that the changes outlined in the agreement were made, and became the standard practices.

In Ferguson none of the cops went to jail for violating the civil rights. That's the other thing. The compliance actions don't normally result in people going to jail. In California, the LASD was routinely violating civil rights, and people including the Sheriff went to jail themselves. The reason is three fold. First, the Sheriff ordered that the Deputies not comply with the investigation, he ordered them to lie. The deputies found a person who was informing on the practices inside the LA jail, and started to bounce him around the other facilities to keep him from being found by the Feds, and informing on them. This is interfering with an investigation. That isn't the 5th Amendment right not to testify against yourself, or the refusal to answer questions. It was outright lies. Lying to the Feds, on orders, from the Sheriff.

If the Sheriff had just shrugged and ignored the investigation, he wouldn't have gone to jail, but like most problems of this sort, it wasn't the things they were doing wrong that was the big issue, it was the cover up.

Oh the Feds would have gotten their compliance action, and the Deputies would have been told to stop planting drugs on visitors to the jail among other crimes, but chances are nobody would have gone to jail themselves.

What I want is the ability that we had under George W. Bush as well as Clinton and Obama. I want the ability to investigate the entire police department, and examine all their policies, and practices, to insure they are in compliance with the law. The Feds never can, and never will have the manpower to investigate every police department. But departments with a history of questionable actions need to have those actions examined. If nothing else then as an example to the others to take a long hard look at themselves and try and make the changes on their own, and thus obey the Constitution.

 

[foggedinn]

I'm aware that police corruption is endemic. Putting the fox in charge of guarding the henhouse is pointless and futile. Putting professional liars in charge of finding truth has given us our current drug problem. Men praise and lift up our Constitution when it suits their purpose and use it as a piece of toilet paper when it doesn't.
Go to church and pray. It will do as much good as anything else I have heard as a possible solution.

 

[SavannahMann]

I'm aware that police corruption is endemic. Putting the fox in charge of guarding the henhouse is pointless and futile. Putting professional liars in charge of finding truth has given us our current drug problem. Men praise and lift up our Constitution when it suits their purpose and use it as a piece of toilet paper when it doesn't.
Go to church and pray. It will do as much good as anything else I have heard as a possible solution.

First we have to admit, as a society that we have a problem. That admission is a long way from here. Many will fight that admission kicking and screaming. Some won't admit it even in the face of overwhelming evidence.

But once we have the problem identified we can start to work on it. There are tools we can use.

One example. Polygraph testing. People with access to top secret material are subjected to polygraph tests randomly. If they fail the test they don't go to jail, but they don't go back inside where the top secret material is either.

Similar standards for police would be possible. A half dozen questions after name and other background stuff. Have you lied under oath. Have you planted evidence. Have you seen anyone else plant evidence? Have you used unnecessary force. Have you seen anyone use unnecessary force? Would you report any of these violations to superiors.

If the cop fails the test he isn't under arrest. But he doesn't get to wear the badge and gun out of the building either.

Yes. The tester could be corrupt. Yes there are problems with this approach. But the point is before we can come up with a remedy we have to admit there is a problem. Then we can decide what remedy we feel is appropriate. One idea I had was to put the head of the ACLU in charge of the Civil Rights Division of the DOJ. Have his Deputy be the head of the CATO Police Misconduct group. Switch them around if you like. Because there you have both ends of the spectrum. Liberal civil rights and Libertarian police corruption groups. Between them they have probably seen it all and would be in a position to turn rhetoric into action.