Why we want stimulus now and worry about deficits later

[Uncensored2008]

It did not fail, it stopped the economy from sliding deeper into recession.

And kept unemployment under 8%.....

 

[Uncensored2008]

Now is the WRONG time to be worrying about deficits.

Yeah, there is an election to buy and Obama really needs to pay off cronies if he is to have ANY chance at this thing..

When you're having a heart attack, costs are secondary.

Good point.

Obama DOES have about the same effect on the country as a heart attack does on a person.

 

[ilia25]

Because growing X percent a year is the definition of an exponential growth.


What about the exponential growth of the debt?

It does not matter if nominal GDP is growing faster than debt over the long run (e.g. if NGDP grows at 4% a year and the debt grows only 3% a year, then GDP to debt ratio will be improving).

How's that going to happen with trillion dollar deficits as far as the eye can see?

If you have problems with eyesight, you should talk a doctor. And while you're at it, ask him about your head too.

 

[Uncensored2008]

If you have problems with eyesight, you should talk a doctor. And while you're at it, ask him about your head too.

I take it you're part of an "Official Obama Truthiness Squad?"

You've got the armband and custom "King Shabazz" billy club to "correct" infidels saying unapproved things about your Messiah®, doncha?

 

[saveliberty]

On the contrary, its the hands off approach by the government that would lead to a disaster. It is very simple concept, really:
1) Something bad happens, consumers got scared and are trying to save
2) Companies see the sales and prices falling, start the layoffs
3) Consumers get even more scared, cut on spending even more
4) Companies respond with more layoffs, and so the vicious spiral continues.

In the end nobody works, nobody can sell nothing, nobody consumes anything and everyone starves to death. OK, it won't go that far, but we can end up in the stone age.

You are describing Austrian Economics, congratulations. Now if you'd just stop prescribing Keynesian solutions....

Well, the hands off approach Austrians suggest is madness, we can agree on that.

Why would you solve a Austrian situation with Keynesian failed techniques? Oh, I remember, so you can enslave an entire nation with socialist reforms.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

It does not matter if nominal GDP is growing faster than debt over the long run (e.g. if NGDP grows at 4% a year and the debt grows only 3% a year, then GDP to debt ratio will be improving).

How's that going to happen with trillion dollar deficits as far as the eye can see?

If you have problems with eyesight, you should talk a doctor. And while you're at it, ask him about your head too.

I can see that the debt has grown faster than GDP under Obama.

What do the voices in your head tell you?

 

[ilia25]

If you have problems with eyesight, you should talk a doctor. And while you're at it, ask him about your head too.

I take it you're part of an "Official Obama Truthiness Squad?"

You've got the armband and custom "King Shabazz" billy club to "correct" infidels saying unapproved things about your Messiah®, doncha?

And you are a typical republican dumbass. The first thing you do is putting a label on your opponent, so that you can continue arguing with whatever you imagine that label stands for.

For the record, Obama made way more than his fair share of stupid mistakes.

 

[ilia25]

How's that going to happen with trillion dollar deficits as far as the eye can see?

If you have problems with eyesight, you should talk a doctor. And while you're at it, ask him about your head too.

I can see that the debt has grown faster than GDP under Obama.

Have you ever heard of a deep economic depression started in 2008?

 

[saveliberty]

How's that going to happen with trillion dollar deficits as far as the eye can see?

If you have problems with eyesight, you should talk a doctor. And while you're at it, ask him about your head too.

I can see that the debt has grown faster than GDP under Obama.

What do the voices in your head tell you?

"ilia, take two aspirin and call them back in thirty years".

 

[ilia25]

You are describing Austrian Economics, congratulations. Now if you'd just stop prescribing Keynesian solutions....

Well, the hands off approach Austrians suggest is madness, we can agree on that.

Why would you solve a Austrian situation with Keynesian failed techniques? Oh, I remember, so you can enslave an entire nation with socialist reforms.

This is not "an Austrian situation". In fact, Austrians deny that the above scenario is possible. If they weren't, then their hads-off approach would look even crazier.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

If you have problems with eyesight, you should talk a doctor. And while you're at it, ask him about your head too.

I can see that the debt has grown faster than GDP under Obama.

Have you ever heard of a deep economic depression started in 2008?

I have.

Have you heard about the long term shortfalls in Social Security and Medicare?

 

[Uncensored2008]

And you are a typical republican dumbass. The first thing you do is putting a label on your opponent, so that you can continue arguing with whatever you imagine that label stands for.

I have no need to put a label on you; you have "Obamabot" tattooed on your forehead.

For the record, Obama made way more than his fair share of stupid mistakes.

The biggest one being porkulus.

Now it dawns on you that the UAW and the public employee unions may not be enough to keep your Messiah® in power, so you want to loot even more tax payer funds to bribe the well connected in hopes of swaying the election in his favor.

 

[ilia25]

I can see that the debt has grown faster than GDP under Obama.

Have you ever heard of a deep economic depression started in 2008?

I have.

Have you heard about the long term shortfalls in Social Security and Medicare?

That is why we need more taxes on the rich. In any case, the current 16 trillion debt would not matter if we will solve those long term shortfalls. And if we won't, then the current debt would not matter either.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Have you ever heard of a deep economic depression started in 2008?

I have.

Have you heard about the long term shortfalls in Social Security and Medicare?

That is why we need more taxes on the rich. In any case, the current 16 trillion debt would not matter if we will solve those long term shortfalls. And if we won't, then the current debt would not matter either.

That's why we need less spending.
And why we need to reform those programs.

 

[saveliberty]

Have you ever heard of a deep economic depression started in 2008?

I have.

Have you heard about the long term shortfalls in Social Security and Medicare?

That is why we need more taxes on the rich. In any case, the current 16 trillion debt would not matter if we will solve those long term shortfalls. And if we won't, then the current debt would not matter either.

By your own reasoning, a twenty plus year time horizon should right the problem without taxes. Why the aboutface?

 

[ilia25]

BTW, look who is talking!

At a campaign stop in Michigan on Tuesday, Mitt Romney made news by telling the truth about the economy. He said: “If you just cut, if all you’re thinking about doing is cutting spending, as you cut spending you’ll slow down the economy. So you have to, at the same time, create pro-growth tax policies.”
Mitt Romney Said Cutting Spending Slows the Economy - NYTimes.com

Now can anyone suggest a model in which cutting the spending depresses the economy, but rising them will not have the opposite effect?

Romney just admitted that we need more stimulus -- and we need it now, then we sure needed more of it since 2008.

 

[saveliberty]

BTW, look who is talking!

At a campaign stop in Michigan on Tuesday, Mitt Romney made news by telling the truth about the economy. He said: “If you just cut, if all you’re thinking about doing is cutting spending, as you cut spending you’ll slow down the economy. So you have to, at the same time, create pro-growth tax policies.”
Mitt Romney Said Cutting Spending Slows the Economy - NYTimes.com

Now can anyone suggest a model in which cutting the spending depresses the economy, but rising them will not have an opposite effect?

Romney just admitted that we need more stimulus -- and we need it now, then we sure needed more of it since 2008.

Romney is a liberal, I expect that kind of talk out of him. A simpleton like you probably can only think in left is bad, so right is good.

 

[ilia25]

I have.

Have you heard about the long term shortfalls in Social Security and Medicare?

That is why we need more taxes on the rich. In any case, the current 16 trillion debt would not matter if we will solve those long term shortfalls. And if we won't, then the current debt would not matter either.

By your own reasoning, a twenty plus year time horizon should right the problem without taxes. Why the aboutface?

Man, seriously? My point was that the current debt does not matter, not that we don't have to reduce the future deficits.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Man, seriously? My point was that the current debt does not matter, not that we don't have to reduce the future deficits.

Public debt is the means of stripping wealth from those who live by means of currency on behalf of those who live by means of property. Currency will bear 100% of the burden of debt, and thus ensure that the lower caste shoulders all of it.

 

[ilia25]

Man, seriously? My point was that the current debt does not matter, not that we don't have to reduce the future deficits.

Public debt is the means of stripping wealth from those who live by means of currency on behalf of those who live by means of property. Currency will bear 100% of the burden of debt, and thus ensure that the lower caste shoulders all of it.

If you wanted your writing style resembling that of Marx, then you have succeeded -- and you are making even less sense than him.