Wyoming has highest gun per capita rate...and below average murder rate, guns don't cause murder.

[Divine Wind]

crime is an act done by people, the choices of people are the cause of crime

Blacks cause the US murder rate to be inflated, they caused crime

Your logic failed in the second paragraph. Saying or implying all blacks cause the murder rate to be inflated is not only wrong, but racist. Same goes for "they caused crime".

Again, this is cultural, not racial.

 

[NCC1701]

crime is an act done by people, the choices of people are the cause of crime

Blacks cause the US murder rate to be inflated, they caused crime

Your logic failed in the second paragraph. Saying or implying all blacks cause the murder rate to be inflated is not only wrong, but racist. Same goes for "they caused crime".

Again, this is cultural, not racial.

I did not say all blacks murder, I am saying their demographic (blacks, like we normally say) causes the murder rate to be abnormally high. You may want to nitpick semantics, I don't care, but the reality is that if you show me a large black population I will show you a larger than average violent crime rate. They caused it, not every single one of them committed crime, but in the collective sense that the left loves to use. Just like when they say 'we' went to the moon when only a small minority of people actually contributed.

If you ask the left, race is a social construct, so by saying race vs. culture you are creating a tautology. I just don't dance around, it is race, and I think part of it is genetic.

 

[eflatminor]

WYoning [sic] has highest gun per capita rate...and below average murder rate, guns don't cause murder.

No shit, Sherlock. Wyoming also has the thinnest population density in the conterminous 48. That's far more relevant.

Sure, cuz when firearms get near to each other, they start going off!

True story.

 

[jon_berzerk]

WYoning [sic] has highest gun per capita rate...and below average murder rate, guns don't cause murder.

No shit, Sherlock. Wyoming also has the thinnest population density in the conterminous 48. That's far more relevant.

Sure, cuz when firearms get near to each other, they start going off!

True story.

So what he saying

Is that people not guns are the problem

With its thinnest population density and all

 

[Divine Wind]

I did not say all blacks murder, I am saying their demographic (blacks, like we normally say) causes the murder rate to be abnormally high. You may want to nitpick semantics, I don't care, but the reality is that if you show me a large black population I will show you a larger than average violent crime rate. They caused it, not every single one of them committed crime, but in the collective sense that the left loves to use. Just like when they say 'we' went to the moon when only a small minority of people actually contributed.

If you ask the left, race is a social construct, so by saying race vs. culture you are creating a tautology. I just don't dance around, it is race, and I think part of it is genetic.

The way you phrased it implied all blacks cause crime.

If you really mean "a disproportionate number of blacks are involved with crime" or "the black demographic shows a higher incidence of crime", then say so. Write what you mean instead of with innuendo and unclear phrasing.

 

[Pogo]

WYoning [sic] has highest gun per capita rate...and below average murder rate, guns don't cause murder.

No shit, Sherlock. Wyoming also has the thinnest population density in the conterminous 48. That's far more relevant.

Sure, cuz when firearms get near to each other, they start going off!

True story.

So what he saying

Is that people not guns are the problem

With its thinnest population density and all

That's kind of what I'm saying, though poorly expressed.

What E♭m is saying is anybody's guess. Looks like yet another strawman.

 

[NCC1701]

I did not say all blacks murder, I am saying their demographic (blacks, like we normally say) causes the murder rate to be abnormally high. You may want to nitpick semantics, I don't care, but the reality is that if you show me a large black population I will show you a larger than average violent crime rate. They caused it, not every single one of them committed crime, but in the collective sense that the left loves to use. Just like when they say 'we' went to the moon when only a small minority of people actually contributed.

If you ask the left, race is a social construct, so by saying race vs. culture you are creating a tautology. I just don't dance around, it is race, and I think part of it is genetic.

The way you phrased it implied all blacks cause crime.

If you really mean "a disproportionate number of blacks are involved with crime" or "the black demographic shows a higher incidence of crime", then say so. Write what you mean instead of with innuendo and unclear phrasing.

At some point the connection must be made, if the correlation is always strong then causation is probably there.

Point taken, but I am tired of trying to be polite with the left when they are some of the most impolite offensive people out there. Here is how the left talks

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

 

[2aguy]

The entire premise of the anti gun movement is that more guns cause more crime...and this has been shown to be wrong....completely wrong........

LMAO. Hey IF no one had a gun, if there were no guns, would there still be gun crime?

Seeing as how y o u believe more guns equals less crime. What would happen if there were no guns? Would the gun murder rate decline with no guns available?

This is another tough question. Think carefully.

There would be more violent crime.....Britain banned and confiscated guns and their country is 2x as violent as the United States.......and their gun crime rate did not change....in fact, their violent crime rate went up 27% last year and their gun crime rate went up 4% nation wide ....in a country with every single gun control law you want plus gun confiscation and banning.......

Explain that.....

 

[eflatminor]

WYoning [sic] has highest gun per capita rate...and below average murder rate, guns don't cause murder.

No shit, Sherlock. Wyoming also has the thinnest population density in the conterminous 48. That's far more relevant.

Sure, cuz when firearms get near to each other, they start going off!

True story.

So what he saying

Is that people not guns are the problem

With its thinnest population density and all

That's kind of what I'm saying, though poorly expressed.

What E♭m is saying is anybody's guess. Looks like yet another strawman.

Low murder rates among those with high firearm ownership rates hasn't a thing to due with population density. THAT is a strawman argument.

You can back peddle all you like now, it was a really dumb thing to state. Sorry if you're unable to comprehend that.

 

[eflatminor]

The entire premise of the anti gun movement is that more guns cause more crime...and this has been shown to be wrong....completely wrong........

LMAO. Hey IF no one had a gun, if there were no guns, would there still be gun crime?

Seeing as how y o u believe more guns equals less crime. What would happen if there were no guns? Would the gun murder rate decline with no guns available?

This is another tough question. Think carefully.

There would be more violent crime.....Britain banned and confiscated guns and their country is 2x as violent as the United States.......and their gun crime rate did not change....in fact, their violent crime rate went up 27% last year and their gun crime rate went up 4% nation wide ....in a country with every single gun control law you want plus gun confiscation and banning.......

Explain that.....

You're asking a logical question based on a valid example. Reason cannot be used against those that base their position on intentions and not results.

Makes their little brains explode.

 

[Divine Wind]

At some point the connection must be made, if the correlation is always strong then causation is probably there.

Point taken, but I am tired of trying to be polite with the left when they are some of the most impolite offensive people out there. Here is how the left talks

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

The connection is cultural, not genetic nor "racial".

Yes, the Left are a bunch of fucking racists who continually use race to divide our nation.

 

[2aguy]

At some point the connection must be made, if the correlation is always strong then causation is probably there.

Point taken, but I am tired of trying to be polite with the left when they are some of the most impolite offensive people out there. Here is how the left talks

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

The connection is cultural, not genetic nor "racial".

Yes, the Left are a bunch of fucking racists who continually use race to divide our nation.

The reason we have gun crime.......single, teenage mothers over a period of decades have created males with little to no impulse control...because they have never had adult male role models to teach them how not to murder on a whim........

The criminals in Europe, outside of muslim terrorists, are not murdering each other over facebook insults.....they are not luring 9 year old boys into alleys where they shoot them to death in revenge against the boys gang banger father.........you don't see that in Europe, you don't see that in Australia, you don't see that in Japan......different criminal cultures have different views of the use of violence and the use of murder..........

Read up on the Yakuza of Japan....very different take on their interactions with the non criminal population......hospitals and funerals are off limits for any kind of violence....and they take public opinion into account with their violent activities.......Chicago gangs just shoot people.....

 

[NCC1701]

At some point the connection must be made, if the correlation is always strong then causation is probably there.

Point taken, but I am tired of trying to be polite with the left when they are some of the most impolite offensive people out there. Here is how the left talks

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

The connection is cultural, not genetic nor "racial".

Yes, the Left are a bunch of fucking racists who continually use race to divide our nation.

again, race is sometimes defined as culture, so false dichotomy if you really believe there is no genetic component. I could argue that, not today though.

 

[Pogo]

WYoning [sic] has highest gun per capita rate...and below average murder rate, guns don't cause murder.

No shit, Sherlock. Wyoming also has the thinnest population density in the conterminous 48. That's far more relevant.

Sure, cuz when firearms get near to each other, they start going off!

True story.

So what he saying

Is that people not guns are the problem

With its thinnest population density and all

That's kind of what I'm saying, though poorly expressed.

What E♭m is saying is anybody's guess. Looks like yet another strawman.

Low murder rates among those with high firearm ownership rates hasn't a thing to due with population density. THAT is a strawman argument.

You can back peddle all you like now, it was a really dumb thing to state. Sorry if you're unable to comprehend that.

Apparently there still walk among us those with no clue what a strawman is.

A strawman refers to setting up a premise that nobody made. Read that again --- a PREMISE ---- not a conclusion. That's exactly what this thread does, starting with its title. I noted that immediately and challenged the OP (or anyone) to document where anyone made such an argument. Nobody did, since it does not exist. Strawman.

That's why this thread never got off the ground. It never established its premise, as it started with a fallacy from the very title. I stated the obvious.

Apparently I stated it to the oblivious.

All I did was point out the OP's plane has no wings. Now y'all wanna come whining that I pointed out the obvious.

Wanna make a point -- put wings on it. Not rocket surgery.

 

[Pogo]

At some point the connection must be made, if the correlation is always strong then causation is probably there.

Point taken, but I am tired of trying to be polite with the left when they are some of the most impolite offensive people out there. Here is how the left talks

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

America Has A Problem And It’s Called Straight White Men

The connection is cultural, not genetic nor "racial".

Yes, the Left are a bunch of fucking racists who continually use race to divide our nation.

again, race is sometimes defined as culture, so false dichotomy if you really believe there is no genetic component. I could argue that, not today though.

Race is never defined as "culture", nor is the vice the versa. Except by those with no idea what they're talking about.

 

[Divine Wind]

Race is never defined as "culture", nor is the vice the versa. Except by those with no idea what they're talking about.

No shit, Pogo. Thanks for admitting you don't know what the fuck you are talking about. Who here is claiming race = culture?.....well except for your straw man bullshit.

 

[Divine Wind]

again, race is sometimes defined as culture, so false dichotomy if you really believe there is no genetic component. I could argue that, not today though.

You and Pogo are either equally stupid or equally illiterate. Which is it?

The problem with the high rate of crime in black neighborhoods is not race, it's not genetic. It's a culture of violence. If you want to reword your posts to say "inner city black culture is predisposed to criminal activities and violence", then you'd have a better understanding of what I'm addressing.

 

[Divine Wind]

Some links regarding the Sociology of gang culture.


http://www.d.umn.edu/~jarthur/courses/SociologyGangs.pdf

...Sixth, no community is immune from this problem. The gang problem cuts across all social and community groups. It is not a white or black problem. It is a problem that transcends race, gender, class, and ethnicity. It affects small towns like Duluth, Cloquet, Suprior and Esko. It also affect mega cities like Minneapolis-St. Paul, Chicago, Miami, and LA. Poor people join gangs, so do middle and upper class people. But a cautionary note is in order here. Sometimes media portrayal is that this is a black or Hispanic or Asian problem. No, no, no. neither is it only a male problem as some have suggested. Women gangs are sometimes more lethal than their male counterparts. The problem with gang behaviour is not the gangs in existence that we all know from LA, Minneapolis, the sharks, vice-lord, crips, the tongs, skin-heads and so forth. The problem is the ones that are covert or hidden from law enforcement agents and the community in which they operate. These unknown gangs that operate tend to be very insidious and lethal and in some cases may even infiltrate legitimate business and also work underground committing all sorts of heinous crimes for which the law enforcement agents are not able to form a clue as to who committed the crimes. It affects us all sociologically, culturally, and psychologically. The economic impact is daunting.....

Social Theories: Explaining Gang Violence ~ Criminology & Justice

.....Social control theorists believe that everyone in the world has the ability to break the law and choosing to do so is based on the many opportunities that are available in society. They see behavior as being either administered or constrained by an individual’s affiliation with peers and institutions (Walsh & Hemmens, 2008). Participation in gangs would be explained by social theorists as a phenomenon that takes place as a result of people not being tied to or associated with the right peers or organizations. The way a person is raised and the opportunities afforded to them are negative influences in their lives and participating in gangs is all that they know.
A branch theory of the social control sub-theory is the social bond theory. Social bond theory suggests that people become criminals when they do not have proper connections to institutions and the individual processes of conventional civilization. The elements of social bond theory include attachment to family, friend, or the community, commitment to an individual’s future, career, success, or personal goals, involvement with activities, organizations, religious groups and social clubs, and personal beliefs such as honesty, morality, and patriotism (Siegel, 2010). This can explain a person’s tendency for violence within a gang because they have nothing to lose by their antisocial behavior.
The last sub-theory of social process theory is the social reaction theory, commonly referred to as labeling theory. According to the social reaction theory, some people are given classified in a negative way by people of authority. They begin to feel that the label they have been given is correct and further themselves into deviant behaviors. A person initially gets labeled and then strives to live up to the label in a continuing cycle. First the person commits a single criminal act, then they are caught, someone (the courts, a parent, etc.) gives them a deviant label, and they now have a new identity that society knows them by. They begin to believe that society is correct, and at last they try to live up to the label that they know identifies them. This can explain gang involvement because an otherwise ordinary person has been stigmatized by a destructive label. All social “interaction and encounters” (Siegel, 2010) are now negative and in order to feel that a person has a place in society they join a gang and live up to the label they have been given......

https://publicsociology.berkeley.edu/publications/producing/sanchez.pdf

CONCLUSION page 12

http://freakonomics.com/2007/08/06/...bout-street-gangs-but-didnt-know-whom-to-ask/

....Q: How do you define a gang?

A: Great question. There are a few important legal cases where prosecutors tried to prosecute college fraternities as “gangs.” They suggested that the fraternity was an organization that existed to promote criminal behavior, such as the abuse of women and underage drinking. Most judges threw these cases out because they thought that fraternities were not, by definition, “gangs.” But judges rarely gave a logical reason for excluding (typically white) fraternities from the “gang category.”

Indeed, by any valid social scientific definition of a gang – “an established organization whose members come together for solidarity reasons and who engage in delinquent and/or criminal activities” – a fraternity most certainly qualifies. But race, as we know, can be a factor in shaping judicial outcomes....

 

[Pogo]

again, race is sometimes defined as culture, so false dichotomy if you really believe there is no genetic component. I could argue that, not today though.

You and Pogo are either equally stupid or equally illiterate. Which is it?

The problem with the high rate of crime in black neighborhoods is not race, it's not genetic. It's a culture of violence. If you want to reword your posts to say "inner city black culture is predisposed to criminal activities and violence", then you'd have a better understanding of what I'm addressing.

Why do you lump me in with him? I've been talking incessantly about the culture of violence since literally the day I came to this site. And before.

 

[Pogo]

Race is never defined as "culture", nor is the vice the versa. Except by those with no idea what they're talking about.

No shit, Pogo. Thanks for admitting you don't know what the fuck you are talking about. Who here is claiming race = culture?.....well except for your straw man bullshit.

THE POST I JUST QUOTED, Stupid. Which you would have read if you hadn't CUT IT OUT.

Dishonest fucking hack.

Wanna see it?

again, race is sometimes defined as culture

--- on which I called bullshit. Learn how to read.

SMFH