12 Dead in Mass Shooting at So.Cal Bar

[gipper]

I addressed your false perception about the uselessness of the 2nd Amendment.

Perhaps you need to revisit it? It was by the authority on world history, by that guy, Carroll Quigley, that is telling you the truth behind the corporate media conditioning you to the reason why you really want to get rid of it?

Did you watch that video? Breaking News - 12 Dead in Mass Shooting at So.Cal Bar

Minute 8:00, remember? You never addressed it. Why not? That is the authority on world history, he told us, remember, crucial to a nation's liberty?

Who are you to dispute that? Some professor at Harvard now?

I tried watching it, Mr. Beale, but I listened to quite a bit of it and did not see that it was addressing the second amendment. I don't agree with how you view the world's affairs. Sorry.

Why do you want to give up your right to self defense? Have you bothered to study the history of this issue? If you had, you would know what a terrible idea this is.

Well, I appreciate your approach, gipper. I made the choice early in my life not to protect myself with a firearm and I have never changed my mind. I was not aware that a lot of other countries had ever had an automatic right to own guns emblazoned in their Constitution. In retrospect, I think THAT may be been a terrible idea. Certainly, the resistance to restricting ownership to responsible and stable people has been a terrible idea and if people don't start compromising on this, I think the threat of the 2nd going away is going to become more real.
My position on guns has always been radical and I have no hope whatsoever of ever seeing my country agree with me.

Well if history can be used as our guide, I too would expect the 2A to disappear. After all, the ruling class demands it and they usually get what they want. The consequences of this, again if history is our guide, will be rather harmful to the American people. Once criminals and the government (one and the same) are the only one's armed, well we know what happens....if history is our guide.

What happens? Switzerland?

Lol. The Swiss are armed.

 

[2aguy]

If the pillhead didn't have a gun, how many people would he have shot?

He could have used a truck and killed even more people.....the muslim terrorist in Nice, France used a rental Truck and murdered 86 people, not 12, and injured 450, not 18, in 5 minutes of driving.......

It isn't the tool...it is the target.

Yet another deflection. What a surprise. How many would he have "shot"?

You obviously don't care about how they die, since all you care about are getting rid of guns....do you understand that if there had been civilians there with their own legal guns, fewer people would have been killed....how do we know this..? Because from past mass public shootings with armed civilians on site have lower death numbers...

Also...do you realize there were 6 off duty police officers in that bar at the time of the Attack? All they could do was help people escape since they were not allowed to carry their guns with them into the bar when they were off duty.....that is another reason so many died...

The gun free zone status allowed more people to be killed...

 

[OldLady]

I'm sure my husband would join in that watering, but what about me. Problem with CW 2.0 is the government is lost so it's a moot point :/

Yeah. I talk a lot of shit about fighting back against they tyrants just on principle alone, but you're right, we're too far gone. Our government has been lost for a long time. We're 22 trillion in debt, our dollar is worth 4 cents, the market is gonna collapse by default any year now, and given the dependence on the massive welfare state we run, when the government runs out of money to steal and when they've totally devalued the dollar to the point that they cant print any more, when the people have nothing else to lose, they'll lose it in the streets. Notwithstanding the fact that we've drifted into a true police state. I wanna be as far away from that as possible. Personally, I plan on being out of the country before they finally tank it. I'm prepared to make the move, and I will. Though, I was hoping they'd get their wall up sooner to keep the zombies and the jackboots contained.

There's too many other nice countries in the world to want to hang around this powder keg. And it's all manufactured from the top down. The more I think on it, the more I believe they want to use the media to create unrest and to go after the guns because they know they can't keep patching that bubble. It's literally the biggest bubbe in the history if mankind. There will be civil unrrest, the likes this country has never known.

I plan to be on the outside and watching the smoke rise from afar. Maybe sipping on those blue fruity things with the little pink umbrellas in em.

Well, I don't know about everything you say, but welfare is definitely about keeping the poor comfortable enough not to revolt. We all know that. Or we should.

 

[OldLady]

I tried watching it, Mr. Beale, but I listened to quite a bit of it and did not see that it was addressing the second amendment. I don't agree with how you view the world's affairs. Sorry.

Why do you want to give up your right to self defense? Have you bothered to study the history of this issue? If you had, you would know what a terrible idea this is.

Well, I appreciate your approach, gipper. I made the choice early in my life not to protect myself with a firearm and I have never changed my mind. I was not aware that a lot of other countries had ever had an automatic right to own guns emblazoned in their Constitution. In retrospect, I think THAT may be been a terrible idea. Certainly, the resistance to restricting ownership to responsible and stable people has been a terrible idea and if people don't start compromising on this, I think the threat of the 2nd going away is going to become more real.
My position on guns has always been radical and I have no hope whatsoever of ever seeing my country agree with me.

Well if history can be used as our guide, I too would expect the 2A to disappear. After all, the ruling class demands it and they usually get what they want. The consequences of this, again if history is our guide, will be rather harmful to the American people. Once criminals and the government (one and the same) are the only one's armed, well we know what happens....if history is our guide.

What happens? Switzerland?

Lol. The Swiss are armed.

You're right.

 

[hunarcy]

deciding on what IS and IS NOT irational raving is an OPINION . Until a LAW is broke =
NO, if someone is a danger to themself or others, that person should be forced to receive mental health care until the danger is passed. It's people like you that have created the situation where mass shootings have become common. MOST of the people (who are not terrorists) who do these things have already come to the attention of law enforcement and action could have been taken to help them if not for people like you...I'm not talking about putting people in jail. I'm talking about getting them into a mental health facility where they can be cared for.

Sieg Heil.

If your neighbor had an active case of Ebola Fever, would you want them removed from society? Keep your ridiculous Nazi comparisons to yourself.

---------------------------- ebola can be proven , mental illness can not be proven . Some people on this board could be accused of mental illness because of their political point of view i suppose Hunarcy .

And mental illness can be proven by the irrational ravings of the mentally ill. And, of course, by the dead bodies left in their wake. Honestly, I would rather err on the side of caution than mop up the aftermath of a shooting like happened in California.

--------------------------------------- i think that rational or irrational are simply OPINIONS until laws are broken Hunarcy

Sorry that you think that way. You, and people who think like you, are the problem. Your ilk EMPTIED the asylums back in the 70's, turning thousands out and creating the homeless problem we have today, where the mentally ill are reduced to screaming at lamp posts instead of getting the help they needed. And, you insist on having the mentally ill live amongst us and shoot us because you seem unwilling to allow them to get the help they need.

 

[hunarcy]

and i think the 'soviets' did that to millions as millions were involuntarily sent to 'gulags' or death camps some because they were SUPPOSEDLY Mentally ill Hunarcy .

And we all know that was wrong of them to do, pismoe. Are you saying that in our free society, we can't trust mental health professionals to truly focus on the mentally ill and completely refuse to engage in misdeeds as were done in the Soviet Union?

------------------------------------------ i have no use for people like you describe that 'dabble' in pseudo or PRETEND and unproven and unrepeatable science. They don't have my respect or confidence . And of course i don't trust them in any case in anything Hunarcy .

And I have no respect for those who pretend expertise in determining what is pseudo ANYTHING.

 

[hunarcy]

and i think the 'soviets' did that to millions as millions were involuntarily sent to 'gulags' or death camps some because they were SUPPOSEDLY Mentally ill Hunarcy .

And we all know that was wrong of them to do, pismoe. Are you saying that in our free society, we can't trust mental health professionals to truly focus on the mentally ill and completely refuse to engage in misdeeds as were done in the Soviet Union?

------------------------------------------------- heck , they work for MONEY and praise and recognition and of course they can't be trusted the same way that the 'doktors' in the 'ussr' couldn't be trusted or the ' doctor gosnel ' and other abortion 'doktors' can't be trusted to do NO HARM Hunarcy .

I pity your cynicism

 

[EverCurious]

I'm sure my husband would join in that watering, but what about me. Problem with CW 2.0 is the government is lost so it's a moot point :/

Yeah. I talk a lot of shit about fighting back against they tyrants just on principle alone, but you're right, we're too far gone. Our government has been lost for a long time. We're 22 trillion in debt, our dollar is worth 4 cents, the market is gonna collapse by default any year now, and given the dependence on the massive welfare state we run, when the government runs out of money to steal and when they've totally devalued the dollar to the point that they cant print any more, when the people have nothing else to lose, they'll lose it in the streets. Notwithstanding the fact that we've drifted into a true police state. I wanna be as far away from that as possible. Personally, I plan on being out of the country before they finally tank it. I'm prepared to make the move, and I will. Though, I was hoping they'd get their wall up sooner to keep the zombies and the jackboots contained.

There's too many other nice countries in the world to want to hang around this powder keg. And it's all manufactured from the top down. The more I think on it, the more I believe they want to use the media to create unrest and to go after the guns because they know they can't keep patching that bubble. It's literally the biggest bubbe in the history if mankind. There will be civil unrrest, the likes this country has never known.

I plan to be on the outside and watching the smoke rise from afar. Maybe sipping on those blue fruity things with the little pink umbrellas in em.

Well, I don't know about everything you say, but welfare is definitely about keeping the poor comfortable enough not to revolt. We all know that. Or we should.

Fuck em, my dear. Let em die like the worthless dregs they are if they don't want to find means to support themselves.

Would you like to place bets on how many of them suddenly figured out how to get jobs and feed and clothe themselves?

 

[PoliticalChic]

If the pillhead didn't have a gun, how many people would he have shot?

He could have used a truck and killed even more people.....the muslim terrorist in Nice, France used a rental Truck and murdered 86 people, not 12, and injured 450, not 18, in 5 minutes of driving.......

It isn't the tool...it is the target.

Yet another deflection. What a surprise. How many would he have "shot"?

You obviously don't care about how they die, since all you care about are getting rid of guns....do you understand that if there had been civilians there with their own legal guns, fewer people would have been killed....how do we know this..? Because from past mass public shootings with armed civilians on site have lower death numbers...

Also...do you realize there were 6 off duty police officers in that bar at the time of the Attack? All they could do was help people escape since they were not allowed to carry their guns with them into the bar when they were off duty.....that is another reason so many died...

The gun free zone status allowed more people to be killed...

And Obama's "Arrest Free Zones," schools like Parkview Florida, allow killers like Nikolas Cruz to legally obtain guns.

 

[joaquinmiller]

If the pillhead didn't have a gun, how many people would he have shot?

He could have used a truck and killed even more people.....the muslim terrorist in Nice, France used a rental Truck and murdered 86 people, not 12, and injured 450, not 18, in 5 minutes of driving.......

It isn't the tool...it is the target.

Yet another deflection. What a surprise. How many would he have "shot"?

You obviously don't care about how they die, since all you care about are getting rid of guns....do you understand that if there had been civilians there with their own legal guns, fewer people would have been killed....how do we know this..? Because from past mass public shootings with armed civilians on site have lower death numbers...

Also...do you realize there were 6 off duty police officers in that bar at the time of the Attack? All they could do was help people escape since they were not allowed to carry their guns with them into the bar when they were off duty.....that is another reason so many died...

The gun free zone status allowed more people to be killed...

Deflecting still. Yes, there are lots of ways to meet your maker.

You make erroneous assumptions. I have three long guns, including a tube-fed .22 semi-automatic. I favor banning concealed weapons, handguns, and high-powered rifles with high-capacity magazines. That covers most of the mass murders, and leaves me with what I need.

 

[PoliticalChic]

If the pillhead didn't have a gun, how many people would he have shot?

He could have used a truck and killed even more people.....the muslim terrorist in Nice, France used a rental Truck and murdered 86 people, not 12, and injured 450, not 18, in 5 minutes of driving.......

It isn't the tool...it is the target.

Yet another deflection. What a surprise. How many would he have "shot"?

You obviously don't care about how they die, since all you care about are getting rid of guns....do you understand that if there had been civilians there with their own legal guns, fewer people would have been killed....how do we know this..? Because from past mass public shootings with armed civilians on site have lower death numbers...

Also...do you realize there were 6 off duty police officers in that bar at the time of the Attack? All they could do was help people escape since they were not allowed to carry their guns with them into the bar when they were off duty.....that is another reason so many died...

The gun free zone status allowed more people to be killed...

Deflecting still. Yes, there are lots of ways to meet your maker.

You make erroneous assumptions. I have three long guns, including a tube-fed .22 semi-automatic. I favor banning concealed weapons, handguns, and high-powered rifles with high-capacity magazines. That covers most of the mass murders, and leaves me with what I need.

Have you read this scholarly thesis?

Have you ever read any books?

 

[hunarcy]

A person that can defend themselves is the greatest threat to tyranny.

Old Lady made the damn mistake claiming she can defeat tyranny with education and her intellect but when I pointed out Trotsky stupidity by thinking he was smarter than Stalin, well noticed she went silent quickly.

Also notice when it is pointed out the guy disobeyed the laws the progressive left want us to be silent and not discuss the possible failures because if any failure then it ruins their argument that more laws will help.

As I pointed out the progressive left want to do away with our rights from owning firearms to what we say and in this thread there are great examples!

I went silent yesterday because as usual you are spouting your right wing bullshit tapes instead of listening to what I said. I don't expect anyone to agree, but if you want to talk, at least address what I said. I told you why the second amendment is a useless and counterproductive measure.

I also tried to suggest other options for getting our violence problem under control, but you have been conveniently dismissing all that because the NRA has apparently not given you sound bytes for those.

You just go on calling me stupid in as many ways as you can and then you start pulling in Stalin and Trotsky? WTF? C'mon Bruce. Put your feet on the ground and focus if you want to have a discussion.

I addressed your false perception about the uselessness of the 2nd Amendment.

Perhaps you need to revisit it? It was by the authority on world history, by that guy, Carroll Quigley, that is telling you the truth behind the corporate media conditioning you to the reason why you really want to get rid of it?

Did you watch that video? Breaking News - 12 Dead in Mass Shooting at So.Cal Bar

Minute 8:00, remember? You never addressed it. Why not? That is the authority on world history, he told us, remember, crucial to a nation's liberty?

Who are you to dispute that? Some professor at Harvard now?

I tried watching it, Mr. Beale, but I listened to quite a bit of it and did not see that it was addressing the second amendment. I don't agree with how you view the world's affairs. Sorry.

Why do you want to give up your right to self defense? Have you bothered to study the history of this issue? If you had, you would know what a terrible idea this is.

Well, I appreciate your approach, gipper. I made the choice early in my life not to protect myself with a firearm and I have never changed my mind. I was not aware that a lot of other countries had ever had an automatic right to own guns emblazoned in their Constitution. In retrospect, I think THAT may have been a terrible idea. Certainly, the resistance to restricting ownership to responsible and stable people has been a terrible idea and if people don't start compromising on this, I think the threat of the 2nd going away is going to become more real.
My position on guns has always been radical and I have no hope whatsoever of ever seeing my country agree with me.

As long as it is YOUR choice, that's fine. But, when you begin to impose your choice on everyone else because you don't like their choice, you create a problem.

As for "resistance to restricting ownership to responsible and stable people", I do not know anyone who feels that way. However, for the past 50 years, we have been promised that if we just "give up this one right", the world will become safer, which hasn't happened...in fact, things are worse. As a result, those who do see a need to own a firearm feel imposed on and don't want to give up any more of their rights.

 

[joaquinmiller]

Sieg Heil.

If your neighbor had an active case of Ebola Fever, would you want them removed from society? Keep your ridiculous Nazi comparisons to yourself.

---------------------------- ebola can be proven , mental illness can not be proven . Some people on this board could be accused of mental illness because of their political point of view i suppose Hunarcy .

And mental illness can be proven by the irrational ravings of the mentally ill. And, of course, by the dead bodies left in their wake. Honestly, I would rather err on the side of caution than mop up the aftermath of a shooting like happened in California.

--------------------------------------- i think that rational or irrational are simply OPINIONS until laws are broken Hunarcy

Sorry that you think that way. You, and people who think like you, are the problem. Your ilk EMPTIED the asylums back in the 70's, turning thousands out and creating the homeless problem we have today, where the mentally ill are reduced to screaming at lamp posts instead of getting the help they needed. And, you insist on having the mentally ill live amongst us and shoot us because you seem unwilling to allow them to get the help they need.

One reason the mental hospitals were emptied was due to a reliance on management-pharmaceuticals. You know, the pharmaceuticals gun nuts blame for gun murders.

Law of Unintended Consequences, innit?

 

[HenryBHough]

California needs tough gun laws to prevent this shit!

Oh, wait!

They have had one that would have prevented this incident IF IT HAD BEEN ENFORCED. No point in passing new laws when you're not willing to enforce the ones you already have.

 

[pismoe]

and i think the 'soviets' did that to millions as millions were involuntarily sent to 'gulags' or death camps some because they were SUPPOSEDLY Mentally ill Hunarcy .

And we all know that was wrong of them to do, pismoe. Are you saying that in our free society, we can't trust mental health professionals to truly focus on the mentally ill and completely refuse to engage in misdeeds as were done in the Soviet Union?

------------------------------------------------- heck , they work for MONEY and praise and recognition and of course they can't be trusted the same way that the 'doktors' in the 'ussr' couldn't be trusted or the ' doctor gosnel ' and other abortion 'doktors' can't be trusted to do NO HARM Hunarcy .

I pity your cynicism

--------------------------------- i pity your NAIVETE Hunarcy !!

 

[hunarcy]

and i think the 'soviets' did that to millions as millions were involuntarily sent to 'gulags' or death camps some because they were SUPPOSEDLY Mentally ill Hunarcy .

And we all know that was wrong of them to do, pismoe. Are you saying that in our free society, we can't trust mental health professionals to truly focus on the mentally ill and completely refuse to engage in misdeeds as were done in the Soviet Union?

------------------------------------------------- heck , they work for MONEY and praise and recognition and of course they can't be trusted the same way that the 'doktors' in the 'ussr' couldn't be trusted or the ' doctor gosnel ' and other abortion 'doktors' can't be trusted to do NO HARM Hunarcy .

I pity your cynicism

--------------------------------- i pity your NAIVETE Hunarcy !!

Enjoy your day.

 

[buttercup]

That would actually be an important thing to look into....but it won't lead to banning and confiscating guns so the left wing isn't interested in it...since understanding that aspect of the issue would actually lower the body count...which the left really needs to push gun control.

You’re absolutely right that they need an increasing body count in order to push their gun grabbing agenda. And I know that the majority here will disagree, but it’s why a lot of these “events” are psyops. As I said earlier on the thread, it’s the Hegelian Dialectic. Problem - Reaction - Solution. The predetermined “solution” is the agenda in the first place.

And it’s why a lot of gun-grabbing Dems here probably secretly love when these “shootings” happen, because each one gets them gradually closer to their ultimate goal.

As someone said earlier on the thread, when you disarm all the law-abiding people, you’re left with criminals and the (corrupt) government being the only ones armed. History has shown numerous times what happens in that case. Sadly, people never learn from history.

 

[pismoe]

Sieg Heil.

If your neighbor had an active case of Ebola Fever, would you want them removed from society? Keep your ridiculous Nazi comparisons to yourself.

---------------------------- ebola can be proven , mental illness can not be proven . Some people on this board could be accused of mental illness because of their political point of view i suppose Hunarcy .

And mental illness can be proven by the irrational ravings of the mentally ill. And, of course, by the dead bodies left in their wake. Honestly, I would rather err on the side of caution than mop up the aftermath of a shooting like happened in California.

--------------------------------------- i think that rational or irrational are simply OPINIONS until laws are broken Hunarcy

Sorry that you think that way. You, and people who think like you, are the problem. Your ilk EMPTIED the asylums back in the 70's, turning thousands out and creating the homeless problem we have today, where the mentally ill are reduced to screaming at lamp posts instead of getting the help they needed. And, you insist on having the mentally ill live amongst us and shoot us because you seem unwilling to allow them to get the help they need.

---------------------------------------------- you poor victim , have YOU been shot yet [chuckle] . Very FEW people are ever shot in this country that has a population of 310 million Hunarcy . And letting them out , that sure wasn't me , i never let anyone out with my actions or my votes or wishes . And living among you . i never had anything to do with that . Though if the fecked up in the head haven't broken laws they don't deserve to be locked up like was done in 'soviet' russia Hunarcy .

 

[PoliticalChic]

California needs tough gun laws to prevent this shit!

Oh, wait!

They have had one that would have prevented this incident IF IT HAD BEEN ENFORCED. No point in passing new laws when you're not willing to enforce the ones you already have.

. The Democrats are the party that looks at the mayhem their gun laws have produced in Chicago, California, etc. ……and this is their model for the nation.

 

[Manonthestreet]

Anyone see anything on some of the Vegas shooting survivors being in this one too