5'2", 110lbs. Can you handle him?

[del]

Del, I posted this earlier in the thread. My son is autistic, is 16, is 5'2" and weighs 110. I'm 5'2", 48 and have zero training of any kind in apprenhending someone. I can and have brought my son down and have held him there, if necessary, by myself. Bull that two trained cops were unable to do this. The taser was not necessary.

ETA: Unless there is information not mentioned in the article. If the kid had a weapon for instance. But the article stated he had no criminal record, was learning disabled and was petrified.

You also know what your son is and how he behaves. Police have their lives on the line 24/7, even when not in uniform. Your life isn't in danger either. So, to put it in clearer terms: The police are stopping someone they don't know, have no idea what they have on them, and have no clue if the person may be on drugs or drunk. They have to subdue them, period, no choice, that's their job and they have to do it. So ... again, be a cop for a year, then come back and say they did something wrong.

Yes I do know my son. He's strong and he bites and he kicks. Soon I won't be able to restrain him if I need too. But I can now and he's the same size as that kid.

And you insist on ignoring the fact that TWO TRAINED COPS could have taken ONE 110 LB. kid down and cuffed him without the use of the taser. Had they done this, that boy would be alive today. (Yes, you will respond with 'but he could have hit his head and died').

no, i'll respond with "you have no idea what you're talking about."

 

[Zoom-boing]

To those that think tasing this kid was the better or only choice, I simply disagree. Having restrained a kid that age and size by myself, I'm telling you -- two trained cops could have gotten cuffs on him (yes, yes bruising him and all) and that boy would be alive today. Again, unless there is more information that was not in the article, like if he had a weapon.

It's nearly midnight here, I"m doing to bed. Night.

 

[del]

To those that think tasing this kid was the better or only choice, I simply disagree. Having restrained a kid that age and size by myself, I'm telling you -- two trained cops could have gotten cuffs on him (yes, yes bruising him and all) and that boy would be alive today. Again, unless there is more information that was not in the article, like if he had a weapon.

It's nearly midnight here, I"m doing to bed. Night.

good night

 

[Zoom-boing]

Gotta disagree with ya on that one, del. She's stated over and over in the thread that she has an autistic teenage son about the same size that she has to restrain regularly.

No, not 'regularly'. Used to be 'regularly'; now it's an exception. So, I'm even out of practice. And I had to restrain him about two weeks ago. And I did, by myself.

My bad. I misread your posts.

lol, that's ok. It's a rarity now. Yeah!!!

 

[Zoom-boing]

To those that think tasing this kid was the better or only choice, I simply disagree. Having restrained a kid that age and size by myself, I'm telling you -- two trained cops could have gotten cuffs on him (yes, yes bruising him and all) and that boy would be alive today. Again, unless there is more information that was not in the article, like if he had a weapon.

It's nearly midnight here, I"m doing to bed. Night.

good night

Night!!

 

[Zoom-boing]

You also know what your son is and how he behaves. Police have their lives on the line 24/7, even when not in uniform. Your life isn't in danger either. So, to put it in clearer terms: The police are stopping someone they don't know, have no idea what they have on them, and have no clue if the person may be on drugs or drunk. They have to subdue them, period, no choice, that's their job and they have to do it. So ... again, be a cop for a year, then come back and say they did something wrong.

Yes I do know my son. He's strong and he bites and he kicks. Soon I won't be able to restrain him if I need too. But I can now and he's the same size as that kid.

And you insist on ignoring the fact that TWO TRAINED COPS could have taken ONE 110 LB. kid down and cuffed him without the use of the taser. Had they done this, that boy would be alive today. (Yes, you will respond with 'but he could have hit his head and died').

no, i'll respond with "you have no idea what you're talking about."

Sorry Del, but I do. (oh, the 'he could have hit his head and died' remark was for KK, not you. My bad.)

 

[KittenKoder]

Yes I do know my son. He's strong and he bites and he kicks. Soon I won't be able to restrain him if I need too. But I can now and he's the same size as that kid.

And you insist on ignoring the fact that TWO TRAINED COPS could have taken ONE 110 LB. kid down and cuffed him without the use of the taser. Had they done this, that boy would be alive today. (Yes, you will respond with 'but he could have hit his head and died').

no, i'll respond with "you have no idea what you're talking about."

Sorry Del, but I do. (oh, the 'he could have hit his head and died' remark was for KK, not you. My bad.)

You really do have a one track mind ...

 

[del]

Kitten, we have yet to hear your opinion on the cops who have sued for taser injuries. Are they bad cops?

not necessarily.
they're certainly not relevant to the discussion.

 

[Care4all]

The thing is, the cop is feeling terrible right now...i can sense it....(or...empathize, uh oh ),he didn't mean to kill this kid, he was issued the taser and the rules to follow, of which he did not create, the Police department did. And for all we know, he did follow the "rules" to the T and this circumstance would have allowed him to use the taser on this 5;2'' 110 pound kid...?

Why can't they create a taser that has a switch, where you can have a stronger voltage for burley men or a smaller voltage for women or children?

Why should they say this taser is nonlethal WHEN IT IS OBVIOUSLY LETHAL...some of the time? 334 deaths from tasers since 2001, through december of 2008...in the USA.

I don't think one cop has been found guilty in any manner in any of those cases either.... from what I have read on it, so it always goes in the favor of the policeman, and probably because of what i stated above, the rules tell them they can do this and they never intentionally meant to kill these people.

We should be discussing the rules...when they first came out, they could ONLY be used if the person was trying to escape from committing a felony, if they were threatened or others around them were being threatend with their lives type of things....then the slippery slope....using it on obviously pregnant women and using it on a 12 year old, unruley child on a bus and so on and so forth....all perfectly legal, ruled by the florida supreme court and the USSC refused to hear one of the case involving police tasering that tried to make it there in appeal....

In las vegas, i think someone might have mentioned that the legislature was trying to legislate stricter guidelines on using their tasers and they are going to have cameras on the end of them or something of the sort, I was reading....and issuing to the public the video of every time they tasered someone, so to keep the tasering abuse in line...

I think the Taser policies of our governing powers, need to be rethought....since tasering can kill some people, UNLIKE what they TOLD us when they wanted to add them to their amory....which to me is the person who made the Taser's fault, to claim one thing then deliver another....each district that uses them, just needs to rethink their policies on using them now that we know, 334 people have died uselessly, from them...imo.


Care

 

[Joe_Penalty]

Look back, why did you run from the cops?

Because I was scared shitless of getting in trouble. It had nothing to do with what my mommy and daddy told me to do in a situation involving the police.

Thus your parents raised you right, you knew they put people who did something wrong in jail.

An innocent person doesn't run from them unless they are wrongly informed as to what the job of the police is.

I disagree.

 

[Joe_Penalty]

The facts are often ignored to demonize the police. Hell, I've been electrocuted several times from wall sockets and I still live, and my weight proportions are about the same. The cops had no idea it would kill the kid, the kid simply should not have resisted, period.

KK, he was learning disabled. He very well may not have realized what the cops wanted and/or was scared shitless.

On that subject, why is Ms. "They're supposed to protect us" raising her kid to be that terrified of cops? I can promise you that none of MY children feel the slightest urge to take off running at the sight of a police officer.

Only if you knew.

 

[brewerboy]

The thing is, the cop is feeling terrible right now...i can sense it....(or...empathize, uh oh ),he didn't mean to kill this kid, he was issued the taser and the rules to follow, of which he did not create, the Police department did. And for all we know, he did follow the "rules" to the T and this circumstance would have allowed him to use the taser on this 5;2'' 110 pound kid...?

Why can't they create a taser that has a switch, where you can have a stronger voltage for burley men or a smaller voltage for women or children?

Why should they say this taser is nonlethal WHEN IT IS OBVIOUSLY LETHAL...some of the time? 334 deaths from tasers since 2001, through december of 2008...in the USA.

I don't think one cop has been found guilty in any manner in any of those cases either.... from what I have read on it, so it always goes in the favor of the policeman, and probably because of what i stated above, the rules tell them they can do this and they never intentionally meant to kill these people.

We should be discussing the rules...when they first came out, they could ONLY be used if the person was trying to escape from committing a felony, if they were threatened or others around them were being threatend with their lives type of things....then the slippery slope....using it on obviously pregnant women and using it on a 12 year old, unruley child on a bus and so on and so forth....all perfectly legal, ruled by the florida supreme court and the USSC refused to hear one of the case involving police tasering that tried to make it there in appeal....

In las vegas, i think someone might have mentioned that the legislature was trying to legislate stricter guidelines on using their tasers and they are going to have cameras on the end of them or something of the sort, I was reading....and issuing to the public the video of every time they tasered someone, so to keep the tasering abuse in line...

I think the Taser policies of our governing powers, need to be rethought....since tasering can kill some people, UNLIKE what they TOLD us when they wanted to add them to their amory....which to me is the person who made the Taser's fault, to claim one thing then deliver another....each district that uses them, just needs to rethink their policies on using them now that we know, 334 people have died uselessly, from them...imo.


Care

 

[Sweet Willy]

Kitten, we have yet to hear your opinion on the cops who have sued for taser injuries. Are they bad cops?

not necessarily.
they're certainly not relevant to the discussion.

Sure they are. It's a discussion about cops using tasers. Since Kitten decided to somehow figure that I just don't like cops and that cops are all just doing the best they can, I can't help but wonder how the feline feels about cops who have been injured by tasers. Do they deserve to be compensated for taser injuries? Should cops be tasered? It has been installed a requirement of training for using a taser in many places, that you be tased. Quite a few got injured. Seems relevant enough to me.

 

[KittenKoder]

Okat, let me get this straight, over a thousand people die from being beaten every year, while 334 deaths in 8 years is somehow worse .... um yea ... that's only an average of 47 per year ... yeah, that's really deadly.

 

[brewerboy]

And they knew he was learning disabled, not on drugs, and not armed how, precisely? They tasered him because they had no way of knowing any of the above.

No, they may not have known any of that at the time. Even more reason that they should have taken him down and cuffed him rather than tasering him. Even if the kid hadn't been killed, tasering him in this instance wasn't necessary. Two cops, one 110 lb. kid. Do the math.

Um ... they did the math, tasering has a much lower chance of severe injury to the target than tackling.

I about spit out my ravioli upon reading this. Seriously???

So are you saying, that if I was standing in front of you at the instant you read this, and gave you the choice between me tackling you, or me tasering you...you'd pick the taser?

Puh-Leeeze.

And for the sake of argument, lets up my stauture to more of the average Cop.

I'm small statured by ANYONES perspective (5'8 140 lbs.) so lets say I was 6 even, 170 lbs. just to make it realistic. Have you ever seen a cop my size?

You'd still choose taser?

 

[KittenKoder]

No, they may not have known any of that at the time. Even more reason that they should have taken him down and cuffed him rather than tasering him. Even if the kid hadn't been killed, tasering him in this instance wasn't necessary. Two cops, one 110 lb. kid. Do the math.

Um ... they did the math, tasering has a much lower chance of severe injury to the target than tackling.

I about spit out my ravioli upon reading this. Seriously???

So are you saying, that if I was standing in front of you at the instant you read this, and gave you the choice between me tackling you, or me tasering you...you'd pick the taser?

Puh-Leeeze.

And for the sake of argument, lets up my stauture to more of the average Cop.

I'm small statured by ANYONES perspective (5'8 140 lbs.) so lets say I was 6 even, 170 lbs. just to make it realistic. Have you ever seen a cop my size?

You'd still choose taser?

Chances of pain is higher with the taser, it hurts, while tackling, no matter how big you are, there is no way you'd take me down, even if there were a half dozen, trust me. I would prefer the tackling simply because I know I have a higher chance of defeating you, not because there is a lower risk of damage to me.

 

[brewerboy]

Um ... they did the math, tasering has a much lower chance of severe injury to the target than tackling.

I about spit out my ravioli upon reading this. Seriously???

So are you saying, that if I was standing in front of you at the instant you read this, and gave you the choice between me tackling you, or me tasering you...you'd pick the taser?

Puh-Leeeze.

And for the sake of argument, lets up my stauture to more of the average Cop.

I'm small statured by ANYONES perspective (5'8 140 lbs.) so lets say I was 6 even, 170 lbs. just to make it realistic. Have you ever seen a cop my size?

You'd still choose taser?

Chances of pain is higher with the taser, it hurts, while tackling, no matter how big you are, there is no way you'd take me down, even if there were a half dozen, trust me. I would prefer the tackling simply because I know I have a higher chance of defeating you, not because there is a lower risk of damage to me.

On a personal note sweetie, even at my real life stature, theres no way you would "defeat" me.

Ask the guy in Peoria, IL who stole from me then beat me with a club when I went to get the object back. Ten staples in my head, got the object back along with the money in his wallet, and him passed out in Hooters parking lot.

I have the scar on my noggin and the drum-stick hanging in my room to this day.



Thanks for the laugh though.

In the words of Jim Carrey in "Ace Ventura": "Whooo hoo hoo, fiction CAN be fun!"

 

[KittenKoder]

I about spit out my ravioli upon reading this. Seriously???

So are you saying, that if I was standing in front of you at the instant you read this, and gave you the choice between me tackling you, or me tasering you...you'd pick the taser?

Puh-Leeeze.

And for the sake of argument, lets up my stauture to more of the average Cop.

I'm small statured by ANYONES perspective (5'8 140 lbs.) so lets say I was 6 even, 170 lbs. just to make it realistic. Have you ever seen a cop my size?

You'd still choose taser?

Chances of pain is higher with the taser, it hurts, while tackling, no matter how big you are, there is no way you'd take me down, even if there were a half dozen, trust me. I would prefer the tackling simply because I know I have a higher chance of defeating you, not because there is a lower risk of damage to me.

On a personal note sweetie, even at my real life stature, theres no way you would "defeat" me.

Ask the guy in Peoria, IL who stole from me then beat me with a club when I went to get the object back. Ten staples in my head, got the object back along with the money in his wallet, and him passed out in Hooters parking lot.

I have the scar on my noggin and the drum-stick hanging in my room to this day.



Thanks for the laugh though.

In the words of Jim Carrey in "Ace Ventura": "Whooo hoo hoo, fiction CAN be fun!"

Nice way to dodge the point ... point is, you don't know, neither do I really, and neither do the cops.

 

[brewerboy]

Chances of pain is higher with the taser, it hurts, while tackling, no matter how big you are, there is no way you'd take me down, even if there were a half dozen, trust me. I would prefer the tackling simply because I know I have a higher chance of defeating you, not because there is a lower risk of damage to me.

On a personal note sweetie, even at my real life stature, theres no way you would "defeat" me.

Ask the guy in Peoria, IL who stole from me then beat me with a club when I went to get the object back. Ten staples in my head, got the object back along with the money in his wallet, and him passed out in Hooters parking lot.

I have the scar on my noggin and the drum-stick hanging in my room to this day.



Thanks for the laugh though.

In the words of Jim Carrey in "Ace Ventura": "Whooo hoo hoo, fiction CAN be fun!"

Nice way to dodge the point ... point is, you don't know, neither do I really, and neither do the cops.

I wasnt trying to dodge the point, I promise.

I guess that last reply was a "I doubt you could take me at my real life stature, much less TWO cops at the same time"....

Granted, I sometimes have a round-about way of expressing things from a personal point of view.

But perhaps you're correct. I should start my own thread if I really wanna measure our piss trails


Its bed-time, I'll pick up measuring my "you-know-what" in the morning

Night KK, and everyone else.

 

[Ravi]

Does anyone have any credible stats on taser death rates?

Very small, but growing so probably in your acceptable range. Regardless, cops are trained to avoid harming innocent people. If they used a potato cannon to kill him that would be even a smaller statistic.

Once again Ravi betrays her abject ignorance of statistics.

Actually, if they killed him with potato cannon, I'd wager all I own the death RATE would be much much higher. Probably something like 1 out of 1... What a fuck'n dolt.

Sorry to disappoint you, but you are the dolt here. The method of death isn't the problem, the use of unneccessary force is the problem. The valid statistic is how many die when cops use too much force to restrain an unarmed 110 pound child?