74 school shootings in 77 weeks...Worth it's own thread.

[Meister]

The thing is, you gun nuts are more of a danger to us than the criminals are.

Stand around with a wad of cash in your hand at an NRA meeting, then do the same thing in the hood. See how long you last at each location.

So if the NRA isn't actually doing the crimes, why do they make it so easy for others to commit the crimes?

It all boils down to money for the NRA and gun sales.

How are they making it "easy for others to commit the crimes"?

Sarah, we have laws in place for gun purchases, if they're not being followed, it's not the NRA, but the firearm dealers. More laws won't make a difference.

 

[Meister]

The thing is, you gun nuts are more of a danger to us than the criminals are.

You're an outlier, Joe.

The more you post the more ridiculous you sound.

When a criminal breaks into your house and has his way with your family, get back to me just how bad guns are, OK?

Again, far more likely that someone in the house will be injured by that gun than a bad guy.

The "Cure" is worse than the disease.

But here's the thing. Those Commie Socialist Europeans. They don't let average citizens have guns and theyhave LESS crime than we do.

And they aren't locking up millions of people like we do. Their prison populations are usually less than 100,000.

Hmmmm.

So if guns and prisons make us safer, why are we less safe?

There we have it.......like I said, I love it when the nuts post. We get to see what is really driving you, Joeseph. Again, thank you.

 

[Meister]

The thing is, you gun nuts are more of a danger to us than the criminals are.

You're an outlier, Joe.

The more you post the more ridiculous you sound.

When a criminal breaks into your house and has his way with your family, get back to me just how bad guns are, OK?

Again, far more likely that someone in the house will be injured by that gun than a bad guy.

The "Cure" is worse than the disease.

But here's the thing. Those Commie Socialist Europeans. They don't let average citizens have guns and theyhave LESS crime than we do.

And they aren't locking up millions of people like we do. Their prison populations are usually less than 100,000.

Hmmmm.

So if guns and prisons make us safer, why are we less safe?

I'm more safe, Joe. With all your undocumented research that you've posted, why don't you research how guns have thwarted crimes?

 

[Spoonman]

[

I am against the abridgment of the Second Amendment, Joe, and I don't even own a gun because I'm too sensitive to noise. Even so, that Second Amendment was put there to prevent any kind of bad government from getting worse. Although sometimes I don't see how government could get any worse than it is at this moment with letting bad guys go free and killing off American vets through inferior health care for which the top cats running the VA all got big fat bonus checks last Christmas.

Even so, those messing with Amendment 2 should just let it be.

So let me get this straight, because Wingnut logic is kind of hard to follow.

The VA is overwealmed, and maybe 47 vets die because they couldn't get in to see a doctor. OH MY GOD THIS IS THE WORST CRISIS EVER!!!!!

32,000 Americans die EVERY YEAR because someone sold a gun to someone who had no business having one. Ah, this isn't a problem at all.

While I think the person who wants to shoot a bad guy is a little sily, the Wingnut who wants guns because they lost an election is even sillier.

The government is not an amorphous mob of zombies. The government is a cop who stopped by for a slice of pizza and leaves behind six kids when the crazy person shoots him.

Funny, you never hear Left Wingers talking about needing guns when Bush STEALS an election, gets us into a war based on lies, tortures prisoners, and spies on Americans without a warrant. Nope. They actually talk about how to fix that at the next election and using the process.

But wingnuts. You all lose an election, and you start waving your guns around talking smack about tyranny.

Okay, memo. IF the government ever got "so bad", the problem is, they have tanks, they have bombers. they have drones.

You've got your squirrel gun.

The Founding Slave Rapists didn't think a mob was going to overthrow the government. They called for MILITIAS that would act under the color of law.

suicide has nothing to do with a gun. people don't chose to kill themselves because they have a gun. its time you liberal idiots start focusing on the problem. My friends 32 year old cousin hung herself this weekend. she didn't own a gun. but its still didn't stop her.

 

[Spoonman]

Theres also a really good chance, given how paranoid you come off, that you will totally misjudge a situation and pull a "Zimmerman"

dude, you are the one who is so paranoid you feel you need to know the name and address of everyone who owns a gun

 

[JoeB131]

Theres also a really good chance, given how paranoid you come off, that you will totally misjudge a situation and pull a "Zimmerman"

Wrong again Nut-Job. Armed Police Misjudge Situations. Armed citizens shoot 250% more criminals than police. Police kill 550% more innocent people than Armed Citizens.

Facts are not paranoia. I may or may-not be held at gunpoint again, but facts & my experience prove I am safer with legalized CCW.

BTW: Zimmerman was a Police Wannabe.

Where the fuck are you even getting these whacky numbers.

Okay - Number of homicides in the US. That would be innocent people being shot by gun owners- 11,000 a year.

Number of people killed by Police- most of them found to be justified - 607.

Number of criminals killed by armed citizens ruled to be justifiable- 201 according to the FBI.

 

[JoeB131]

Theres also a really good chance, given how paranoid you come off, that you will totally misjudge a situation and pull a "Zimmerman"

dude, you are the one who is so paranoid you feel you need to know the name and address of everyone who owns a gun

That's already a matter of public record.

All the paper did was make the record known.

 

[JoeB131]

As for concealed carry making us "Safer"....

Martha Rosenberg: Think Concealed Carry Makes You Safe? Think Again!

It is obvious conceal and carry does not protect the carriers or stop bad guys, unless you consider Trayvon Martin a bad guy. But there is a more deadly side to conceal carry. Since 2007, conceal carriers have been responsible for 494 U.S. civilian deaths, 23 mass shootings and the death of 14 law enforcement officers, according to data compiled by the
Violence Policy Institute.

States began loosening conceal carry laws, says the Institute, in 1996 when Tanya Metaksa, executive director of the National Rifle Association's Institute for Legislative Action, told lawmakers, "these citizens don't commit violent crimes."

There was just one problem with her assurance. She was wrong.

A staggering 1,400 people licensed for conceal carry in Florida have pleaded guilty or no contest to felonies, the Gainsville Sun reported upon reviewing records. Two hundred and sixteen had outstanding warrants, 128 had active domestic violence injunctions and six were registered sex offenders. Are these the "good guys"?

 

[martybegan]

As for concealed carry making us "Safer"....

Martha Rosenberg: Think Concealed Carry Makes You Safe? Think Again!

It is obvious conceal and carry does not protect the carriers or stop bad guys, unless you consider Trayvon Martin a bad guy. But there is a more deadly side to conceal carry. Since 2007, conceal carriers have been responsible for 494 U.S. civilian deaths, 23 mass shootings and the death of 14 law enforcement officers, according to data compiled by the
Violence Policy Institute.

States began loosening conceal carry laws, says the Institute, in 1996 when Tanya Metaksa, executive director of the National Rifle Association's Institute for Legislative Action, told lawmakers, "these citizens don't commit violent crimes."

There was just one problem with her assurance. She was wrong.

A staggering 1,400 people licensed for conceal carry in Florida have pleaded guilty or no contest to felonies, the Gainsville Sun reported upon reviewing records. Two hundred and sixteen had outstanding warrants, 128 had active domestic violence injunctions and six were registered sex offenders. Are these the "good guys"?

VPI, lol.

 

[martybegan]

Theres also a really good chance, given how paranoid you come off, that you will totally misjudge a situation and pull a "Zimmerman"

Wrong again Nut-Job. Armed Police Misjudge Situations. Armed citizens shoot 250% more criminals than police. Police kill 550% more innocent people than Armed Citizens.

Facts are not paranoia. I may or may-not be held at gunpoint again, but facts & my experience prove I am safer with legalized CCW.

BTW: Zimmerman was a Police Wannabe.

Where the fuck are you even getting these whacky numbers.

Okay - Number of homicides in the US. That would be innocent people being shot by gun owners- 11,000 a year.

Number of people killed by Police- most of them found to be justified - 607.

Number of criminals killed by armed citizens ruled to be justifiable- 201 according to the FBI.

11,000 assumes all gun murders are by a criminal on a non criminal, where if you actually pulled your head out of your ass you would see a lot of shootings are CRIMINAL ON CRIMINAL.

have you ever watched the First 48?

 

[JoeB131]

None of those "Criminals" who were shot did something that required them to be shot.

Kind of a classist argument. "Well, it's those people", as though their lives don't count as much as clean cut suburban moms.

So here's an idea. Put such heavy taxes on guns and ammo that only the rich can afford to have them.

Problem solved.

 

[hunarcy]

As for concealed carry making us "Safer"....

Martha Rosenberg: Think Concealed Carry Makes You Safe? Think Again!

It is obvious conceal and carry does not protect the carriers or stop bad guys, unless you consider Trayvon Martin a bad guy. But there is a more deadly side to conceal carry. Since 2007, conceal carriers have been responsible for 494 U.S. civilian deaths, 23 mass shootings and the death of 14 law enforcement officers, according to data compiled by the
Violence Policy Institute.

States began loosening conceal carry laws, says the Institute, in 1996 when Tanya Metaksa, executive director of the National Rifle Association's Institute for Legislative Action, told lawmakers, "these citizens don't commit violent crimes."

There was just one problem with her assurance. She was wrong.

A staggering 1,400 people licensed for conceal carry in Florida have pleaded guilty or no contest to felonies, the Gainsville Sun reported upon reviewing records. Two hundred and sixteen had outstanding warrants, 128 had active domestic violence injunctions and six were registered sex offenders. Are these the "good guys"?

VPI, lol.

I'd be interested in a list of the 23 mass shootings that were carried out by concealed carry permit holders. We'll never get it from JoeTroll, but if this Martha Rosenberg, who wrote the article, was honest, that list would have been included. The fact that it's not is a sign that it's not true.

 

[Spoonman]

As for concealed carry making us "Safer"....

Martha Rosenberg: Think Concealed Carry Makes You Safe? Think Again!

It is obvious conceal and carry does not protect the carriers or stop bad guys, unless you consider Trayvon Martin a bad guy. But there is a more deadly side to conceal carry. Since 2007, conceal carriers have been responsible for 494 U.S. civilian deaths, 23 mass shootings and the death of 14 law enforcement officers, according to data compiled by the
Violence Policy Institute.

States began loosening conceal carry laws, says the Institute, in 1996 when Tanya Metaksa, executive director of the National Rifle Association's Institute for Legislative Action, told lawmakers, "these citizens don't commit violent crimes."

There was just one problem with her assurance. She was wrong.

A staggering 1,400 people licensed for conceal carry in Florida have pleaded guilty or no contest to felonies, the Gainsville Sun reported upon reviewing records. Two hundred and sixteen had outstanding warrants, 128 had active domestic violence injunctions and six were registered sex offenders. Are these the "good guys"?

of course no mention of how many times they stopped a crime. Once again Joe be with only one side of the story. his.

 

[JoeB131]

[

of course no mention of how many times they stopped a crime. Once again Joe be with only one side of the story. his.

Because it almost never happens.

People are being killed here. But as long as you gun nuts feel a little better about your tiny peckers, you are just fine with that.

 

[JoeB131]

[

I'd be interested in a list of the 23 mass shootings that were carried out by concealed carry permit holders. We'll never get it from JoeTroll, but if this Martha Rosenberg, who wrote the article, was honest, that list would have been included. The fact that it's not is a sign that it's not true.

Here's a link to VPC's website, which Rosenberg also linked to.

It's up to 27 now, BTW.

http://www.vpc.org/fact_sht/ccwmassshootings.pdf

I'll just give you the first two.

Concealed Handgun Permit Holder: Michael McLendon

On March 10, 2009, Michael McLendon, a self-proclaimed survivalist,
killed his mother at their family home, beginning a shooting rampage that stretched
across 24 miles. By the time McLendon took his own life in the midst of a police
shootout at a factory where he had previously worked, he had shot four more relatives,
including his 74-year-old grandmother, and five strangers, including the wife and 18-
month-old daughter of a local sheriff’s deputy. McLendon had a concealed handgun
permit for two handguns. Police later found at the home he shared with his mother
numerous how-to DVDs on committing acts of violence.


Concealed Handgun Permit Holder: Carey H. Dyess
On June 2, 2011, Carey H. Dyess, 73, went on an hours-long shooting
rampage in two communities, killing five before taking his own life. In Arizona legal gun
owners can carry concealed handguns without a permit. From approximately five in the
morning till approximately five and three quarters of an hour later when he was found
dead from a self-inflicted gunshot wound, Dyess gunned down his fifth ex-wife, Theresa
Lorraine Sigurdson, 61, her lawyer, and three of her friends. One additional victim was
shot seven times and survived. In court filings Dyess had claimed that Sigurdson—from
whom he was divorced in 2007 after arguments over money and their 10-acre property—
and her friends had harassed him.

 

[martybegan]

None of those "Criminals" who were shot did something that required them to be shot.

Kind of a classist argument. "Well, it's those people", as though their lives don't count as much as clean cut suburban moms.

So here's an idea. Put such heavy taxes on guns and ammo that only the rich can afford to have them.

Problem solved.

Law abiding poor people are the ones who need RKBA the most.

And they weren't doing something that required them to be shot, they were doing something that put them at a risk of being shot. A running theme in the first 48 is drug dealers being ambushed for their $$ and their drugs.

 

[martybegan]

[

I'd be interested in a list of the 23 mass shootings that were carried out by concealed carry permit holders. We'll never get it from JoeTroll, but if this Martha Rosenberg, who wrote the article, was honest, that list would have been included. The fact that it's not is a sign that it's not true.

Here's a link to VPC's website, which Rosenberg also linked to.

It's up to 27 now, BTW.

http://www.vpc.org/fact_sht/ccwmassshootings.pdf

I'll just give you the first two.

Concealed Handgun Permit Holder: Michael McLendon

On March 10, 2009, Michael McLendon, a self-proclaimed survivalist,
killed his mother at their family home, beginning a shooting rampage that stretched
across 24 miles. By the time McLendon took his own life in the midst of a police
shootout at a factory where he had previously worked, he had shot four more relatives,
including his 74-year-old grandmother, and five strangers, including the wife and 18-
month-old daughter of a local sheriff’s deputy. McLendon had a concealed handgun
permit for two handguns. Police later found at the home he shared with his mother
numerous how-to DVDs on committing acts of violence.


Concealed Handgun Permit Holder: Carey H. Dyess
On June 2, 2011, Carey H. Dyess, 73, went on an hours-long shooting
rampage in two communities, killing five before taking his own life. In Arizona legal gun
owners can carry concealed handguns without a permit. From approximately five in the
morning till approximately five and three quarters of an hour later when he was found
dead from a self-inflicted gunshot wound, Dyess gunned down his fifth ex-wife, Theresa
Lorraine Sigurdson, 61, her lawyer, and three of her friends. One additional victim was
shot seven times and survived. In court filings Dyess had claimed that Sigurdson—from
whom he was divorced in 2007 after arguments over money and their 10-acre property—
and her friends had harassed him.

The fact that they call the 2nd one a permit holder WHEN NO PERMIT WAS REQUIRED just shows the lengths that gun control freaks will go to when it comes to lying outright about certain shootings, as long as it follows the message.

 

[hunarcy]

None of those "Criminals" who were shot did something that required them to be shot.

Kind of a classist argument. "Well, it's those people", as though their lives don't count as much as clean cut suburban moms.

So here's an idea. Put such heavy taxes on guns and ammo that only the rich can afford to have them.

Problem solved.

Law abiding poor people are the ones who need RKBA the most.

And they weren't doing something that required them to be shot, they were doing something that put them at a risk of being shot. A running theme in the first 48 is drug dealers being ambushed for their $$ and their drugs.

Law abiding poor people and minorities are the ones that JoeTroll fears the most. He is willing to let those who can afford it be armed, but those poor blacks, well they'd better be controlled. When you strip away the rantings and name calling and truly analyze his postings, that becomes obvious.

 

[JoeB131]

[

The fact that they call the 2nd one a permit holder WHEN NO PERMIT WAS REQUIRED just shows the lengths that gun control freaks will go to when it comes to lying outright about certain shootings, as long as it follows the message.

Guy, the point is, the man could LEGALLY walk about with concealed guns. This is what you gun nuts always claim is the good, that the more guns we have out there, the more bad guys you can stop.

Well, no, it just makes it easier for the bad guys.

 

[KissMy]

Theres also a really good chance, given how paranoid you come off, that you will totally misjudge a situation and pull a "Zimmerman"

Wrong again Nut-Job. Armed Police Misjudge Situations. Armed citizens shoot 250% more criminals than police. Police kill 550% more innocent people than Armed Citizens.

Facts are not paranoia. I may or may-not be held at gunpoint again, but facts & my experience prove I am safer with legalized CCW.

BTW: Zimmerman was a Police Wannabe.

Where the fuck are you even getting these whacky numbers.

Okay - Number of homicides in the US. That would be innocent people being shot by gun owners- 11,000 a year.

Number of people killed by Police- most of them found to be justified - 607.

Number of criminals killed by armed citizens ruled to be justifiable- 201 according to the FBI.

Witnin minutes 9 innocent victims were SHOT by NYPD officers

Daily Kos: SHOOT THE INNOCENT "SUSPECT" is Growing Police Trend: Chicago Tribune Expose, Examples, Stats

In 2003 Police Shot Innocent People 550% more often than Armed Civilians Did!

"Newsweek has reported that law-abiding American citizens using guns in self-defense during 2003 shot and killed two and one-half times as many criminals as police did, and with fewer than one-fifth as many incidents as police where an innocent person mistakenly identified as a criminal (2% versus 11%)."

This is probably why British Bobbies (police) aren't allowed to carry guns