About this wall

[Lesh]

"Found it on facebook"

Think about what you just posted

 

[WillowTree]

"Found it on facebook"

Think about what you just posted

Yes! I found it on Facebook. Not mother jones or move on. Think about that.

 

[Lesh]

Facebook was Putin's friend in 2016...an still is

 

[WillowTree]

Facebook was Putin's friend in 2016...an still is

Oh shit! Not that Russian bullshit again. Jeezus seek help!

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

"Nobody has the intention of building a wall." - GDR head of state Walter Ulbricht, East Berlin, June 15th 1961


A few month later, in August 1961 he thanked the labour force for erecting this wall.


It’s purpose; protecting eastern Germany from western spies, insurgents and intrusion of undesirable elements.


A wall is always going to have two sides. Perhaps the actual, acute need for a wall, in reality, isn’t that desperate? More like a political trophy of some kind?

The actual intent was to keep residents of East Berlin in East Berlin – something the Berlin Wall failed miserably to do.

Just as Trump’s ‘wall’ of fear, bigotry, and hate will fail.

Indeed, both walls were about politics, not keeping people out (or in).

And both walls were about fear and contempt for freedom and liberty.

For the Soviet Union the fear was that liberal, democratic West Berlin would have the effect of ‘contaminating’ the East German police state with ‘dangerous’ ideas of freedom and liberty.

For Trump and his supporters, the ‘border wall’ represents their unwarranted fear of change and diversity, and their bigotry and fear of more ‘brown people’ who speak Spanish coming into the United States.

The actual intent was to keep residents of East Berlin in East Berlin – something the Berlin Wall failed miserably to do.

Really?
How many fled in the month before the wall was built?
How many fled in the decades after?

 

[OKTexas]

So you're admitting the wall will work and force the illegals to use alternative methods to try to get here. BTW even the 70 billion is less than illegals are costing us every year.

.

No idea about those numbers - but let’s say it does. Then perhaps the wall should be constructed. But it seems right now to be very exaggerated (the stress, like n o w before Christmas). Right now it seems to be more of a symbol than that of practical value.

All expenditures, federal, State and local total almost 140 billion a year. Illegals are almost twice as likely to us the social safety net as citizens or legal immigrants. You can't have open borders and huge social programs at the same time. Europe is learning that lesson the hard way and we're starting to. Of course the commies never include the cost to the country when calculating the cost of the wall. That doesn't take into account the human costs.

.

Europe has no plan for immigration, I... well subject for another thread maybe.

But the focus on the concept of a wall? Prone to fail, the longer the worse. Why not enforce strong points where needed? Keep flexible? This wall is gaining too much attention duento it’s symbolic value.

The commies won't fund the manpower to do that either. Their border security talk is all bullshit, they have no interest in securing the border. Personally I don't think you have a clue what it takes to secure a 2000 mile border. I'm assuming you have no military experience.

.

By commies you mean Trumps opposition? Perhaps it’s easier to get them along with funding those sort of actions?

And it will leave you with some depth in the fight too, in this case depth isn’t actual depth on the battlefield but rather more complex.

Let’s say you can cut down most immigration from the border, focusing on the worst elements and also start shutting down other means of intrusion with the same funding?

More flexibility and more bang for the buck. The wall keeps getting such high attention. Just because it’s that, a wall, an object you can measure and understand.

No I mean opposition to America. You can't allow poverty to to push into a country unencumbered and expect to maintain the strength and prosperity of a nation. It's a drain on every resource a country has.

.

 

[OKTexas]

Trump promised us a wall, and he knows how important it is to keep voters motivated. DHS wants the wall. In video clips we see how it does stop all but the most athletic climbers. If you saw the 6,000 member caravans going to Tijuana to get into the US any way they can, you'd know that the new wall is really needed. We can't afford open borders.

He promised that Mexico would pay for it... People voted on getting free wall... Why does the tax payer need to pay for it...

Trump promised people a free Model T Ford, the wall was meant to be free and it is out of date...

BTW: More Canadians overstay their visa passes than Mexicans...

Congressman Tim Ryan on Twitter

Let’s consider the lunacy coming from the right:

Conservatives want to waste billions of dollars on a ‘wall’ they’ve been told won’t work, a ‘wall’ that will have little effect keeping anyone out.

Conservatives have forever abandoned any claim to being ‘fiscally responsible.’

You're a fucking liar, we want to stop spending more than 100 billion a year on people who shouldn't be here in the first place. People like you should be deported right along with the criminals you support.

.

 

[Lesh]

Trump promised us a wall, and he knows how important it is to keep voters motivated. DHS wants the wall. In video clips we see how it does stop all but the most athletic climbers. If you saw the 6,000 member caravans going to Tijuana to get into the US any way they can, you'd know that the new wall is really needed. We can't afford open borders.

He promised that Mexico would pay for it... People voted on getting free wall... Why does the tax payer need to pay for it...

Trump promised people a free Model T Ford, the wall was meant to be free and it is out of date...

BTW: More Canadians overstay their visa passes than Mexicans...

Congressman Tim Ryan on Twitter

Let’s consider the lunacy coming from the right:

Conservatives want to waste billions of dollars on a ‘wall’ they’ve been told won’t work, a ‘wall’ that will have little effect keeping anyone out.

Conservatives have forever abandoned any claim to being ‘fiscally responsible.’

You're a fucking liar, we want to stop spending more than 100 billion a year on people who shouldn't be here in the first place. People like you should be deported right along with the criminals you support.

.

According to Cato...it's somewhere between 3 and 16 billion.

 

[ErikViking]

No idea about those numbers - but let’s say it does. Then perhaps the wall should be constructed. But it seems right now to be very exaggerated (the stress, like n o w before Christmas). Right now it seems to be more of a symbol than that of practical value.

All expenditures, federal, State and local total almost 140 billion a year. Illegals are almost twice as likely to us the social safety net as citizens or legal immigrants. You can't have open borders and huge social programs at the same time. Europe is learning that lesson the hard way and we're starting to. Of course the commies never include the cost to the country when calculating the cost of the wall. That doesn't take into account the human costs.

.

Europe has no plan for immigration, I... well subject for another thread maybe.

But the focus on the concept of a wall? Prone to fail, the longer the worse. Why not enforce strong points where needed? Keep flexible? This wall is gaining too much attention duento it’s symbolic value.

The commies won't fund the manpower to do that either. Their border security talk is all bullshit, they have no interest in securing the border. Personally I don't think you have a clue what it takes to secure a 2000 mile border. I'm assuming you have no military experience.

.

By commies you mean Trumps opposition? Perhaps it’s easier to get them along with funding those sort of actions?

And it will leave you with some depth in the fight too, in this case depth isn’t actual depth on the battlefield but rather more complex.

Let’s say you can cut down most immigration from the border, focusing on the worst elements and also start shutting down other means of intrusion with the same funding?

More flexibility and more bang for the buck. The wall keeps getting such high attention. Just because it’s that, a wall, an object you can measure and understand.

No I mean opposition to America. You can't allow poverty to to push into a country unencumbered and expect to maintain the strength and prosperity of a nation. It's a drain on every resource a country has.

.

Now this is an issue!
And quite a dilemma. How to cope with a neighboring country - not hostile in any sense - but with a significant lesser standard of living.

Having the control over the situation isn’t a bad move at all.

 

[OKTexas]

Trump promised us a wall, and he knows how important it is to keep voters motivated. DHS wants the wall. In video clips we see how it does stop all but the most athletic climbers. If you saw the 6,000 member caravans going to Tijuana to get into the US any way they can, you'd know that the new wall is really needed. We can't afford open borders.

He promised that Mexico would pay for it... People voted on getting free wall... Why does the tax payer need to pay for it...

Trump promised people a free Model T Ford, the wall was meant to be free and it is out of date...

BTW: More Canadians overstay their visa passes than Mexicans...

Congressman Tim Ryan on Twitter

Let’s consider the lunacy coming from the right:

Conservatives want to waste billions of dollars on a ‘wall’ they’ve been told won’t work, a ‘wall’ that will have little effect keeping anyone out.

Conservatives have forever abandoned any claim to being ‘fiscally responsible.’

You're a fucking liar, we want to stop spending more than 100 billion a year on people who shouldn't be here in the first place. People like you should be deported right along with the criminals you support.

.

According to Cato...it's somewhere between 3 and 16 billion.

We know for a fact that is bullshit. Border patrol alone is 3.8 billion, then add federal prisoners , ICE, health care, education, social services, state and local prisoners, state and locals services and 16 billion isn't even in the solar system.

Illegal Immigration Costs U.S. $113 Billion a Year, Study Finds

.

 

[easyt65]

"Nobody has the intention of building a wall." - GDR head of state Walter Ulbricht, East Berlin, June 15th 1961


A few month later, in August 1961 he thanked the labour force for erecting this wall.


It’s purpose; protecting eastern Germany from western spies, insurgents and intrusion of undesirable elements.


A wall is always going to have two sides. Perhaps the actual, acute need for a wall, in reality, isn’t that desperate? More like a political trophy of some kind?

Eeverywhere a barrier is erected along the southern border, as proven by Arizona, illegal immigration / illegal border crossings go down 95%.

Why do snowflakes and illegals advocate, aid, and abet illegal immigration / non-enforcement of existing US immigration law?

 

[OKTexas]

All expenditures, federal, State and local total almost 140 billion a year. Illegals are almost twice as likely to us the social safety net as citizens or legal immigrants. You can't have open borders and huge social programs at the same time. Europe is learning that lesson the hard way and we're starting to. Of course the commies never include the cost to the country when calculating the cost of the wall. That doesn't take into account the human costs.

.

Europe has no plan for immigration, I... well subject for another thread maybe.

But the focus on the concept of a wall? Prone to fail, the longer the worse. Why not enforce strong points where needed? Keep flexible? This wall is gaining too much attention duento it’s symbolic value.

The commies won't fund the manpower to do that either. Their border security talk is all bullshit, they have no interest in securing the border. Personally I don't think you have a clue what it takes to secure a 2000 mile border. I'm assuming you have no military experience.

.

By commies you mean Trumps opposition? Perhaps it’s easier to get them along with funding those sort of actions?

And it will leave you with some depth in the fight too, in this case depth isn’t actual depth on the battlefield but rather more complex.

Let’s say you can cut down most immigration from the border, focusing on the worst elements and also start shutting down other means of intrusion with the same funding?

More flexibility and more bang for the buck. The wall keeps getting such high attention. Just because it’s that, a wall, an object you can measure and understand.

No I mean opposition to America. You can't allow poverty to to push into a country unencumbered and expect to maintain the strength and prosperity of a nation. It's a drain on every resource a country has.

.

Now this is an issue!
And quite a dilemma. How to cope with a neighboring country - not hostile in any sense - but with a significant lesser standard of living.

Having the control over the situation isn’t a bad move at all.

Ya think? LMAO

.

 

[ErikViking]

"Nobody has the intention of building a wall." - GDR head of state Walter Ulbricht, East Berlin, June 15th 1961


A few month later, in August 1961 he thanked the labour force for erecting this wall.


It’s purpose; protecting eastern Germany from western spies, insurgents and intrusion of undesirable elements.


A wall is always going to have two sides. Perhaps the actual, acute need for a wall, in reality, isn’t that desperate? More like a political trophy of some kind?

Eeverywhere a barrier is erected along the southern border, as proven by Arizona, illegal immigration / illegal border crossings go down 95%.

Why do snowflakes and illegals advocate, aid, and abet illegal immigration / non-enforcement of existing US immigration law?

I have no idea. Perhaps things aren’t black/white. My interest here is why the concept of building a wall is so important. First I thought this was only about people with the desire to raise the wall. But it seems equally important for those against it. It’s not a lot of money we are talking about. In any other circumstances you would get funding if a large enough group demanded it. In this case no, this wall represents something else.

I guess it’s way to attached to the election. It’s way out of proportion. Fortify where needed, agile and cost effective where doable. This is not even on the table - just wall - or no wall. No one gets in or everyone does. Very exreme.

 

[ErikViking]

Europe has no plan for immigration, I... well subject for another thread maybe.

But the focus on the concept of a wall? Prone to fail, the longer the worse. Why not enforce strong points where needed? Keep flexible? This wall is gaining too much attention duento it’s symbolic value.

The commies won't fund the manpower to do that either. Their border security talk is all bullshit, they have no interest in securing the border. Personally I don't think you have a clue what it takes to secure a 2000 mile border. I'm assuming you have no military experience.

.

By commies you mean Trumps opposition? Perhaps it’s easier to get them along with funding those sort of actions?

And it will leave you with some depth in the fight too, in this case depth isn’t actual depth on the battlefield but rather more complex.

Let’s say you can cut down most immigration from the border, focusing on the worst elements and also start shutting down other means of intrusion with the same funding?

More flexibility and more bang for the buck. The wall keeps getting such high attention. Just because it’s that, a wall, an object you can measure and understand.

No I mean opposition to America. You can't allow poverty to to push into a country unencumbered and expect to maintain the strength and prosperity of a nation. It's a drain on every resource a country has.

.

Now this is an issue!
And quite a dilemma. How to cope with a neighboring country - not hostile in any sense - but with a significant lesser standard of living.

Having the control over the situation isn’t a bad move at all.

Ya think? LMAO

.

I also think that takes a multi dimensional effort. Well beyond “all wall” or “no wall”.

 

[ErikViking]

Europe has no plan for immigration, I... well subject for another thread maybe.

But the focus on the concept of a wall? Prone to fail, the longer the worse. Why not enforce strong points where needed? Keep flexible? This wall is gaining too much attention duento it’s symbolic value.

The commies won't fund the manpower to do that either. Their border security talk is all bullshit, they have no interest in securing the border. Personally I don't think you have a clue what it takes to secure a 2000 mile border. I'm assuming you have no military experience.

.

By commies you mean Trumps opposition? Perhaps it’s easier to get them along with funding those sort of actions?

And it will leave you with some depth in the fight too, in this case depth isn’t actual depth on the battlefield but rather more complex.

Let’s say you can cut down most immigration from the border, focusing on the worst elements and also start shutting down other means of intrusion with the same funding?

More flexibility and more bang for the buck. The wall keeps getting such high attention. Just because it’s that, a wall, an object you can measure and understand.

No I mean opposition to America. You can't allow poverty to to push into a country unencumbered and expect to maintain the strength and prosperity of a nation. It's a drain on every resource a country has.

.

Now this is an issue!
And quite a dilemma. How to cope with a neighboring country - not hostile in any sense - but with a significant lesser standard of living.

Having the control over the situation isn’t a bad move at all.

Ya think? LMAO

.

Also, a wall isn’t a sustainable solution. Will is eventually going to beat class. So you need a much deeper and comprehensive plan in the long run anyway.

 

[sartre play]

Still waiting for that list of people who want open borders & unlimited immigration.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

"Nobody has the intention of building a wall." - GDR head of state Walter Ulbricht, East Berlin, June 15th 1961


A few month later, in August 1961 he thanked the labour force for erecting this wall.


It’s purpose; protecting eastern Germany from western spies, insurgents and intrusion of undesirable elements.


A wall is always going to have two sides. Perhaps the actual, acute need for a wall, in reality, isn’t that desperate? More like a political trophy of some kind?

Eeverywhere a barrier is erected along the southern border, as proven by Arizona, illegal immigration / illegal border crossings go down 95%.

Why do snowflakes and illegals advocate, aid, and abet illegal immigration / non-enforcement of existing US immigration law?

I have no idea. Perhaps things aren’t black/white. My interest here is why the concept of building a wall is so important. First I thought this was only about people with the desire to raise the wall. But it seems equally important for those against it. It’s not a lot of money we are talking about. In any other circumstances you would get funding if a large enough group demanded it. In this case no, this wall represents something else.

I guess it’s way to attached to the election. It’s way out of proportion. Fortify where needed, agile and cost effective where doable. This is not even on the table - just wall - or no wall. No one gets in or everyone does. Very exreme.

My interest here is why the concept of building a wall is so important.

Because in areas where there is no wall, illegal aliens can freely stream across the border.

 

[ErikViking]

Alright.
I don’t know if this is worth it.

The wall served a purpose. Pretty obvious too. But it wasn’t presented as that, get it? They didn’t tell East Germans that they would be kept inside. They said this wall was - protection.

We know history. It’s not that. The wall went to pure symbolic action- it was all it did. The number of people, the drama, suffering is utterly marginal. That wall had no effect at all on a grand scale, order than that of symbol. An iron curtain.

It was more than symbolic - if the Berlin Wall had not been built, East Germans would have left in droves. They risked getting shot to get out of there and many of them died trying, and it sure as hell wasn't to keep anybody out. Our proposed wall is the reverse, it is only one part of an overall solution to reduce illegal immigration and the flow of illegal drugs and anything else into the US. What makes this whole thing so vexing is that the democrats voted for that wall 12 years ago, but now that Trump wants it they're voting against it.

I don’t have the energy to over-repeat myself. Please, the Berlin Wall had only local impact. It surrounded West Berlin. We can agree of its purpose, however that was not the open and official stand point of those who built it.

So, with that said - the real practical use of any such installation might be more about sending signals than creating a long term change.

You have to marvel at the utter irony of a poster from Stockholm Sweden named Erik the Viking who is all but CRYING about a foreign nation wanting to defend its own borders with a wall. From foreign invaders.

Has anyone but me let this sink in? Because here we are at the close of 2018: Erik THE VIKING is crying about a foreign nation defending its borders from foreign invaders with a wall.

Just....I need all the GIFs for this one, Erik the Viking.

Not crying, only asking the question if this wall is more of a political slogan. A question you could ask yourself too.
The rethoric and emotions are sky high. You shut down government to speed things up. No patience or thought through arguments.

Here's something to think through:

Your username is ERIK VIKING from SWEDEN and you are worked up about a foreign nation building a wall to keep out INVADERS

All together now....

hahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

Yeah. Maybe I should address this. I’ve spent years in the US. Almost any swede adopt instantly. Also the other way around.

I’m almost 50 years old. I’ve actually been in the Soviet Union. And Russia. And Berlin. And the Middle East. And Africa. And South America. I have a very close personal connection to the US.

So I really want US to prosper. It’s beneficial to me.

And your cranked up rethoric about invaders - give it a break. We’re talking about knocked out civilians. If you were facing a real invasion - the blood would be flowing in the other end of the court.

 

[easyt65]

Barriers erected eliminates 95% of illegal crossing.

If erected over a decade ago there would not be 20+ million illegals in the US, millions of unidentified illegals in the US.

If borders were used to force migrants into using known legal ports of entry where proper thorough processing could have been completed, the massive problem with allowing criminal illegals like MS-13 Gang members, criminals escaping prosecution in their own country, and more could have been prevented or at least greatly reduced.

The TRUTH is Dr.ocrats only believe in 1 form of 'alternate' immigration and that is to give AMNESTY to all of the millions of illegals they have allowed, aided, and abetted illegally entering the US.

Once that is accomplished they will STILL not support securing our borders and controlling who comes into the country. Just like The last time Amnesty was granted, nothing was done to stop illegal immigration. The process just began all over again.

 

[OKTexas]

The commies won't fund the manpower to do that either. Their border security talk is all bullshit, they have no interest in securing the border. Personally I don't think you have a clue what it takes to secure a 2000 mile border. I'm assuming you have no military experience.

.

By commies you mean Trumps opposition? Perhaps it’s easier to get them along with funding those sort of actions?

And it will leave you with some depth in the fight too, in this case depth isn’t actual depth on the battlefield but rather more complex.

Let’s say you can cut down most immigration from the border, focusing on the worst elements and also start shutting down other means of intrusion with the same funding?

More flexibility and more bang for the buck. The wall keeps getting such high attention. Just because it’s that, a wall, an object you can measure and understand.

No I mean opposition to America. You can't allow poverty to to push into a country unencumbered and expect to maintain the strength and prosperity of a nation. It's a drain on every resource a country has.

.

Now this is an issue!
And quite a dilemma. How to cope with a neighboring country - not hostile in any sense - but with a significant lesser standard of living.

Having the control over the situation isn’t a bad move at all.

Ya think? LMAO

.

I also think that takes a multi dimensional effort. Well beyond “all wall” or “no wall”.

Ya think?

.