Are globalized corporations unamerican?

[Mr.Nick]

Either you are deliberately lying or you are truly ignorant of our history.

The Founders created a nationalist, centralized government to correct the fundamental errors of the Articles of Confederation Congress.

BHO's policies have returned control to the auto industries and the banks.

That is the truth, and that is why the TPE is starting to founder, even in states like Texas or Utah.

Which is why we have the Bill of Rights...

I love how leftists conveniently disregard the Bill of Rights until they have a boggle.

 

[Douger]

I mean where do their loyalties lie?
Do they care if America goes down the tubes as long as their profits increase?
Same with those who play the global market.

Does America owe them any breaks or support?

Get one thing.The concept of satAn is real.The concept controls everything on this planet. EVERY Govt and every large corporation.The script they follow explains it.It´s the most sold book ever.Interpret it correctly and , like all scripts,as you watch the movie you´ll see the next chapter, ahead of time.
Relax. It´s just business.

 

[editec]

Globalization benefits only those with the capital to take advantage of global markets.

That means the vast majority of the world's workers are about in the same position as the Russian serfs were. they are tied to the fate of the nations where they are basically STUCK.

Meanwhile capital is mobile enough to see whatever advantage one nation can provide over the other.

Likewise capital can migrate to avoid paying the cost of civil society.

How many times is our American military going to go to war to protect the interests of corporations that consider themselves corporations of the world?

These corporation game the system making us protect them, while they feel no responsibility to the very nation that makes it POSSIBLE for them to exist in the first place?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Either you are deliberately lying or you are truly ignorant of our history.

The Founders created a nationalist, centralized government to correct the fundamental errors of the Articles of Confederation Congress.

BHO's policies have returned control to the auto industries and the banks.

That is the truth, and that is why the TPE is starting to founder, even in states like Texas or Utah.

Which is why we have the Bill of Rights...

I love how leftists conveniently disregard the Bill of Rights until they have a boggle.

Non sequitur. The Bill of Rights protects all Americans from you Righty Extremist Fascists, MrNick.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I love how the Righty Extremist Fascists, such as Tea Party folks or corporatists or KKK or whatever, try to pretend they are mainstream when they are nothing more than the failing, last gasps of a culture that will die out within ten years.

 

[thereisnospoon]

He considers the company stateless and will put jobs whereever is in the best interest of the stockholders.

imagine if liberals passed a law that American companies could not be primarily concerned with profits for stockholders?? Exactly 100% of American capital would go abroad and America would die 1000 deaths.

A liberal will simply lack the IQ to understand basic economics. That is the definition of liberalism. When they talk they talk pure uneducated nonsense.

True but conservatives are equally wrong in assuming if we just lower taxes and get out of the way jobs will come. They certainly won't via major corporations and if you lower capital gains taxes you will make it worse not better.

Neither party has cracked the code on what needs to be done as witnessed by the decline in middle class jobs over the past decade. Voters know this and that is why they have been shifting from on party to the other. They are looking for somebody with a solution and both sides can only offer tired worn out orthodxy that doesn't work in today's world.

That's your opinion. What is your agenda here?
How does the lowering of tax rates translate to harmful?
In what way has the middle class been harmed by the private sector?
The harm of the middle class as you say, comes from government. It is government interference, high taxes, overbearing regulations that harm the middle class. How? Ask yourself, why would any business want to expand or build new under the current economic/government conditions?
You make the assumption that government knows and does best. Really? And the track record of federal government is?
Now, do not assume there should be no regulations or taxes. There is a need for labor laws to protect workers and consumer laws to protect us from negligence.
Current law is way over the top with one size fits all rules.
Here's an example....I sued to work for an alarm company. We had a contract with a large production builder of residential homes to install the wiring for the alarms during the construction phase. One day I am working and one of the builder's superintendents walks in and tells me I have to leave......He says OSHA showed up and because there were guys not wearing hard hats( Nobody knew this was required) OSHA shut down the entire project. At that time there were 40 or 50 homes under way...
The shut down lasted a couple of days.
The point is to illustrate how government can take something insignificant , blow it out of proportion and issue a draconian order. All they had to do was issue a warning and that was that. No. This OSHA "person" had to go balls to the wall. Dumb.

 

[thereisnospoon]

ahh yes why indeed would a business expand right now. considering we are in a consumer driven economy and consumers are out of work, deep in debt, etc right now?

Jobs will come very slowly no matter what we do for at least a decade.
We are too far in debt, too many jobs offshored, etc.

So we need to encourage more globalization, offshoring, etc that helped in a major way to create this situation?

It is the policies of the current administration which are responsible for your complaints.
"Jobs will come very slowly no matter what we do for at least a decade."
Does that mean notwithstanding government interference that the economy will eventually fix itself? Sure looks like that it what you're stating to me.

"We are too far in debt"
Again, Obama admin policies...

Offshoring accounts for about 1% of the total US labor force.
Here is a link to a US Bureau of Labor Statistics table which lists the type of jobs susceptible to "offshoring".
Many site links try to put a number on off shoring. Because by law ,employers are not required to report where employees are located, it is difficult to accurately account for off shored jobs and even more difficult to define what off shored jobs actually are.
Generally, most off shored jobs are low to mid level customer service and data entry type jobs.
IN reading some commentary on sites that watchdog IT jobs, it appears they consider data entry positions to be part of IT.
IT is probably the hardest hit of all skill type jobs regarding off shoring.
One thing is clear. There is much confusion deliberate or inadvertent between off shoring and out sourcing.

http://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2008/12/art4full.pdf

let me ask you to go to the a dept store and look for things made in America.

then come back and tell me your bullcrap figures again.

At best we will slowly decline in our standard of living for the next decade or so.

Yes we will continue to have some jobs gneerated and they will pay less and less as time goes by and our wages become more inline with world labor costs.

Are companies and govt people who encourage this being pro American?

What the hell are you yammering about? I post a reliable source(our federal government) and because the figures don't fit your agenda, you call bullshit on them. How much sense does that make?
Obviously someone has convinced you that nobody in the USA does anything.
What difference does it make where stuff is made? At the end of the day one constant is clear. Low skill/ low pay manufacturing jobs, call center jobs and the like are subject to being shipped overseas. That's according to the BLS. IT is now a 24/7/365 business. The clock can no longer stop the work.
Again, the best estimate is that about 1% of possible jobs here have been sent off shore. Big deal. Look, we're not making clothing here or other textile based products because the labor costs are simply too high and the plants here are not as modern as those in other countries. There's a lot of reasons for that.
Look, wages are based on the employees value to the employer.
For a moment, let's look at this from the protectionist point of view. Suppose we place high tariffs on goods made in places such as China, Taiwan, Indonesia.....Our government demands that these and other countries increase wages to American levels. OK....Now I want you to take it from there. What happens next? Go.

 

[Sactowndog]

That's your opinion. What is your agenda here?
How does the lowering of tax rates translate to harmful?

That the US has a vibrant growing economy that creates well paying jobs for it's population. In today's international world, lowering some tax rates can help create local jobs (corporate income tax) while lowering others might actually result in less US jobs (Capital Gains tax)

In what way has the middle class been harmed by the private sector?
The harm of the middle class as you say, comes from government. It is government interference, high taxes, overbearing regulations that harm the middle class. How? Ask yourself, why would any business want to expand or build new under the current economic/government conditions?

The massive outsourcing of jobs has been going on unabated for the past decade. Its affects were masked by the interest rate games and housing bubble previously but that doesn't mean it hasn't been happening. Many major corporations have specific plans for moving jobs to low cost geographies, and targets their managers must hit. Some corporations have specific acquisition strategies predicated on labor arbitrage to make them profitable.

You make the assumption that government knows and does best. Really? And the track record of federal government is?

No I know that countries such as Singapore and China has specific policies to attract jobs into their markets (such as subsidizing engineering jobs) and other policies to retain the jobs that exist. Neither US party has any such strategy that has been well thought out. Both are relying on decades old models that no longer apply in the new international reality.

Our existing unemployment rate is a failure of both parties to break out the Keynesian / Supply Side debate and invent something new that will both meet American ideals while also not sacraficing American jobs.

 

[JakeStarkey]

thereisnospoon's mistake is making the evidence fit a predetermined philosophy rather than devise a philosophy from the evidence. Typic Far Right Extremist deficiency.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

I don't like to demonize Business but having a Corporate CEO whose company doesn't pay any Taxes,as your "Jobs Czar",is where i have to draw the line. GE CEO Jeffrey Immelt this President's "Jobs Czar?" Yikes!

 

[Brutus]

True but conservatives are equally wrong in assuming if we just lower taxes and get out of the way jobs will come.

actually business is the only source of jobs. Did you think if you help the Girl Scouts they will provide jobs too???

They certainly won't via major corporations

actually million and millions work for corporations!!!! Very few for the girl scouts

and if you lower capital gains taxes you will make it worse not better.

Even BO and Hillary disagree with you. If you lower the capital gains tax on venture capital, for example, there is more money for new ventures like INtel Google MicroSoft. It is a good thing to have more companies like those. THey provide jobs? Is that really over a liberals head?? Economics is simply over a liberals head.

Neither party has cracked the code on what needs to be done as witnessed by the decline in middle class jobs over the past decade.

way over your head but 1) make unions illegal as Republicans want and you'd have 20 million new jobs 2) send 20 million illegal back home and you'd have another 10 million jobs. Democrats are the focus of evil in America

Voters know this and that is why they have been shifting from on party to the other.

actually voters know very little 70% can't name the president and vice president and Speaker

They are looking for somebody with a solution and both sides can only offer tired worn out orthodxy that doesn't work in today's world.

actually the Republican plan would work perfectly if enacted. IF you disagree, liberal, please say exactly why.

 

[thereisnospoon]

That's your opinion. What is your agenda here?
How does the lowering of tax rates translate to harmful?

That the US has a vibrant growing economy that creates well paying jobs for it's population. In today's international world, lowering some tax rates can help create local jobs (corporate income tax) while lowering others might actually result in less US jobs (Capital Gains tax)

In what way has the middle class been harmed by the private sector?
The harm of the middle class as you say, comes from government. It is government interference, high taxes, overbearing regulations that harm the middle class. How? Ask yourself, why would any business want to expand or build new under the current economic/government conditions?

The massive outsourcing of jobs has been going on unabated for the past decade. Its affects were masked by the interest rate games and housing bubble previously but that doesn't mean it hasn't been happening. Many major corporations have specific plans for moving jobs to low cost geographies, and targets their managers must hit. Some corporations have specific acquisition strategies predicated on labor arbitrage to make them profitable.

You make the assumption that government knows and does best. Really? And the track record of federal government is?

No I know that countries such as Singapore and China has specific policies to attract jobs into their markets (such as subsidizing engineering jobs) and other policies to retain the jobs that exist. Neither US party has any such strategy that has been well thought out. Both are relying on decades old models that no longer apply in the new international reality.

Our existing unemployment rate is a failure of both parties to break out the Keynesian / Supply Side debate and invent something new that will both meet American ideals while also not sacraficing American jobs.

In what way would lower cap gains taxes(BTW individuals with small investments are also subject) result in fewer jobs?

Can you make the distinction between "outsourcing" and "off shoring"? Two are in no way the same.
Yes. Singapore and China..As a matter of fact, there are many countries where government subsidizes business. Subsidies come right out of the taxpayers. I would imagine that you would support US government subsidies that match other countries.
This would be expensive in financial cost and expensive in the amount of bureaucracy that would accompany such subsidies. Additionally, to those on the political Left, this would be politically unpalatable. That, given the protestations surrounding "corporate welfare".

Keynesian vs supply side....There is no alternative right now.
Supply side works best when government stands in the background.

 

[thereisnospoon]

thereisnospoon's mistake is making the evidence fit a predetermined philosophy rather than devise a philosophy from the evidence. Typic Far Right Extremist deficiency.

Your mistake was buying a computer.
I am discussing this issue in a civil manner with another poster. You are interjecting nonsense. It is rejected. Your views are far left.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Either you are deliberately lying or you are truly ignorant of our history.

The Founders created a nationalist, centralized government to correct the fundamental errors of the Articles of Confederation Congress.

BHO's policies have returned control to the auto industries and the banks.

That is the truth, and that is why the TPE is starting to founder, even in states like Texas or Utah.

Which is why we have the Bill of Rights...

I love how leftists conveniently disregard the Bill of Rights until they have a boggle.

Non sequitur. The Bill of Rights protects all Americans from you Righty Extremist Fascists, MrNick.

WHAT?!!!!!
Would you please repeat that? Because I cannot believe my fucking eyes.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

GE Outsources many Jobs yet GE CEO Jeffrey Immelt is this President's "Jobs Czar." And GE doesn't pay Taxes either. I'm always amused at how the Hopey Changey sheeple can conveniently ignore this stuff. In their minds,it's just not happening. But it is. And if a Republican was in there right now,these same people would be screeching for Impeachment. Like i said,i don't like to demonize Business but GE CEO Jeffrey Immelt a "Jobs Czar",really is pretty bad.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Well, I support an effective corporate tax rate of zero. But I see your point, that if they receive tax monies, they should effectively be controlled by the taxpayers through their representatives. But my problem is not with say a company "moving overseas", or a company cutting back, that's their prerogative if they feel their finances are threatened. I disagree with the subsidies. Companies should sink or swim on their own merit and not crowd up the market at the expense of taxpayers. I just disagree with the notion of Government at any level making decisions at the base level for firms.

No, I am not saying screw the majority of Americans.

What if their true finances didn't dictate that at all and it's just a profiteering motive? The way I, and a lot of other people see it, these corporations are enjoying record profits on the backs of American Citizens. Furthermore, they are taking money made off of these profits(which we ourselves contribute greatly to because of our consumer based economy) and investing them overseas, where that money is lost forever.

Take China alone... here we are cutting and scrimping, people looking for meaningful jobs and they are enjoying the luxury of expanding their infrastructure at a breakneck pace and gaining more and more global power.

That doesn't even account for the Trade Deficit, which is some $500B/year. We charge them a 2.5% tariff on goods brought into the US. They Charge us 25% for our stuff going in to their country. That's more money leaving our country and never coming back.

It's like the whole system is squarely stacked against us and has been for some time...and now we are just STARTING to feel the effects of it.

I will stipulate the percentages are correct...
Now, if you really were interested in fair trade with China, you'd be right along side those of us who support our government's long term effort to compel China to allow the Yuan to float on the open market.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I love how the Righty Extremist Fascists, such as Tea Party folks or corporatists or KKK or whatever, try to pretend they are mainstream when they are nothing more than the failing, last gasps of a culture that will die out within ten years.

Oh I get it....According to you, the American culture will die in 10 years?
You are indeed a freak of nature.
As a matter of fact, I think you are one bored, bitter individual who has accomplished nothing in his life and your last gasp on Earth to to lash out at anything that moves.
Your entire existence here has been defined by this last post and the one where you stated the Bill of Rights was written to protect the political Left( you) from the political right.
You are shit. No check that....You are shit that has dried up and been carried away by scavengers.

 

[Shogun]

As to the OP, Yes.

tax them as foreign companies and tariff the shit out of their product if their new country of origin doesn't trade on par with what we buy.

 

[Brutus]

Keynesian vs supply side....There is no alternative right now.
Supply side works best when government stands in the background.

yes business has supplied us with the goods services and jobs that got us from the stone age to here

government bureaucrats can't supply a thing, all they can do is throw a monkey wrench in the way of business.

Red China is the 100% perfect example. Once the liberal bureaucrats got out of the way, 10's of millions instantly stopped dying of starvation.

Its so simple but the liberal will lack the IQ to understand anything about economics. Thats just the way it is.

 

[Brutus]

As to the OP, Yes.

tax them as foreign companies and tariff the shit out of their product if their new country of origin doesn't trade on par with what we buy.

that is typical of the liberal IQ. He doesn't know that tarriffs(Hawley Smoot) helped cause the Great Depression and so almost all economists are against them.