Assholes making trouble in Oregon

[Camp]

Nobody's been locked out of the refuge lol, save perhaps lunatics who show up to cause trouble. The only people who lock people off our public lands are the corrupt government officials.

You just acknowledged that the refuge is public land. Now explain who and why these people staying there rent free are deciding who gets to visit and how the public property gets used.

 

[Old Rocks]

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/1471941/full_content

The case was handed back down to the District Court by the Appeals Court. Citing the strong and well known bias of the lower court judge which had decided the case, the judge has been precluded from hearing any future case.
Yesterday evening , Ammon Bundy, leader of the BundyBunch which has now held a vacant federal wildlife refuge sanctuary “hostage” for 19 days, held a meeting to urge local ranchers to tear up their BLM permits and sign a statement refusing to pay the already heavily subsidized grazing fees on BLM lands. Not one rancher of the ten or so that attended agreed, some citing it might actually harm them.

"I personally don't think this can happen this fast," said rancher Buck Taylor of Diamond. "If I just stood up and signed a piece of paper Saturday that would put my family, my ranch in jeopardy."
"You're asking us to give up everything for this rebel cause," said another rancher, Scott Franklin, who lives north of Burns. source​

The BundyBunch’s repeated failures in Harney County seem to add an edge of frustration and annoyance to the militant insurrectionists’ verbiage as Harney County residents, Piute Tribe representatives, protesters at the site and around the state and county repeatedly insist they leave.

The signing ceremony … s "a once in a lifetime opportunity," Ammon Bundy said. The next time such an opportunity arises, he said: "It'll be war."
"The opportunity is now. The place is Harney County. And you are the people," he said. source​

Bundy claims two ranchers, one in New Mexico and another elsewhere in Oregon, have already taken the pledge. The BundyBunch will be holding a signing “ceremony” on Saturday at the refuge.
Last night’s meeting was held at Crystal Crane Hot Springs, a private tourism business near the small town of Crane, northeast of Burns. Prior to the meeting, the business posted on their website an explanation that they were just trying to let the two sides get together. The explanation was taken down later.
No one from any other “side” was there to speak. The meeting, from all accounts, appeared to be nothing more than a propaganda meeting to support the group’s peculiar constitutional interpretations (led by Montanan Ryan Payne) leading up to the request of local ranchers to tear up their grazing permits. There were about 30 in attendance, including what appears to be a half dozen from the BundyBunch, a purported eight to ten ranchers, press, a few observers, and, I would assume, some FBI undercover agents.
Many people have voiced their very strong opposition to the business allowing the BundyBunch to promote their nonsense and insurrection using their facility and the business’ Facebook page, once the bastion of healthy springs and cute little cabins, is now covered with, well, just about everything.

Well, there you have Kosher's big meeting. 10 ranchers, and they wouldn't go along with Bundy at all. What a resounding endorsement of his loonyness.

 

[koshergrl]

Nobody cares what you say, Old Fag. You've been exposed as a commie partisan hack. The Daily Kos...lol.

Besides which, that wasn't the meeting I referenced. The meeting I am referencing was the one that KrisAnne Hall attended, held just outside the community building that Grasty refused to the community. When he discovered there was going to be a meeting anyway, he elected to go ahead and have a "community" meeting at the county fairgrounds AFTER all, at the exact same time, so there would be no chance of the community showing up and asking embarrassing questions..because he know that all but the government shills, his family, and refugee dingbats would be at that other, truly community meeting.

He tried to do it again with a so-called "public" community meeting scheduled for last night or today. Only for that meeting, he chose a tiny venue that would not be able to hold all those who object to his person, his presence, and federal oppression (in other words, ranchers and landowners from Harney county who do not, for the most part, live in Burns..Burns is where the gov't officials and their families live) He also determined that this community meeting would be limited to 150 souls, and he and his friends would disperse 120 of the tickets to people of their choosing. 30 would supposedly be up for grabs...just enough to make sure that those opposed to the fed presence in Harney county would be outjeered by his hysterical mob and misrepresented by PBS and the Oregonian as fringe lunatics with no support.

The outcry was so substantial, that Grasty scrapped the meeting, probably at the behest of the FBI, who don't really want to have to be asked by the worthless sheriff to step in and mow down hundreds of angry local ranchers.

 

[Old Rocks]

[FONT=Lato, arial]Armed occupiers hold community meeting[/FONT]
The armed occupiers who have taken over the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge near Burns finally held the community meeting Monday night they'd been planning since last week.
They'd hope to use a building at the fairgrounds, but Harney County denied their rushed and incomplete application. So the meeting was pushed ahead to Monday and moved 30 miles southeast of Burns to Crystal Crane Hot Springs in the small town of Crane.
Crystal Crane Hot Springs is a nice place, used by many visitors that come to the Refuge. Unfortunately, they have pretty much lost that business. Certainly, for their support of the Bundy's, I will never use the facilities until it changes ownership.
About 30 people, mostly ranchers, turned out for the meeting.

 

[Old Rocks]

That is the meeting for which there are no videos? Perhaps all who attended were ashamed of themselves? There were plenty of videos taken at the Grasty meeting.

Nobody is going to 'mow down hundreds of local ranchers'. But eventually, a dozen or so featherless loons at the Refuge may get their martyrdom wish.

 

[koshergrl]

That is the meeting for which there are no videos? Perhaps all who attended were ashamed of themselves? There were plenty of videos taken at the Grasty meeting.

Nobody is going to 'mow down hundreds of local ranchers'. But eventually, a dozen or so featherless loons at the Refuge may get their martyrdom wish.

That's just your wish, old fag. But you're a recognized nutbag commie, so it doesn't matter.

Bundy schooling the fbi negotiator (who will not meet with him in a public place in front of the press) on what the fbi is authorized to do....that is, investigate government bodies and committees. Not set up standing armies to *protect* land that they have no interest in and which does not belong to the feds.

Bundy states that when investigators start to investigate the BLM, fish & game, the Forest Service, and talk to the ranchers, and the conviction of the Hammonds, and when those people start to interview the people about the situation, he will come back to the table.

 

[Skylar]

That is the meeting for which there are no videos? Perhaps all who attended were ashamed of themselves? There were plenty of videos taken at the Grasty meeting.

Nobody is going to 'mow down hundreds of local ranchers'. But eventually, a dozen or so featherless loons at the Refuge may get their martyrdom wish.

That's just your wish, old fag. But you're a recognized nutbag commie, so it doesn't matter.

Bundy schooling the fbi negotiator (who will not meet with him in a public place in front of the press) on what the fbi is authorized to do....that is, investigate government bodies and committees. Not set up standing armies to *protect* land that they have no interest in and which does not belong to the feds.

Save of course that the Federal Government's jurisdiction over federal lands isn't based on your pseudo-legal gibberish. But on the Constitution and Federal Law.

Remember...you have no idea what you're talking about. Making your declarations of what jurisdiction the Federal government has meaningless nonsense.

It boils down to this simple question: What's the use of a 'legal argument' that isn't recognized as valid by the law or the courts?

As far as I can tell, its only use is feelings of moral justification when sitting in jail.

 

[koshergrl]

Well, let's review what has been said on this thread. Kosher starts out claiming that almost everyone in Harney County supported the scuzzy bastards at the Refuge. But the meeting last Tuesday night laid that to rest. A resounding repudiation of the fruitloops. With the fruitloops sitting right there, looking like they were sucking on a lemon.

So now Kosher is stating that the good people of Burns are all a bunch of freeloaders and commies. So she isn't for local control of the Refuge, because the locals have stated that they like it as it is. The Paiute are not going to dignify the claims of the locos at the Refuge. They also like the present arrangement. The people of Oregon want Bundy and his bunch out. Out by whatever means necessary now.

Seems Kosher not only doesn't know the mind of the people in Eastern Oregon, she doesn't know the mind of the people of Oregon, period.

The good people of Burns aren't the majority of Harney County residents. And they are disproportionately employees and supporters of the feds and the refuge.

Try, try again, you retard.

And please, never say "Paiutes" and "dignify" in the same sentence again. Those fisheaters lost all credibility when they hitched their wagons to the Oregonian for a small fee, to trot around the state and pretend to give a shit what happens out on the refuge.

 

[9thIDdoc]

That is the meeting for which there are no videos? Perhaps all who attended were ashamed of themselves? There were plenty of videos taken at the Grasty meeting.

Nobody is going to 'mow down hundreds of local ranchers'. But eventually, a dozen or so featherless loons at the Refuge may get their martyrdom wish.

That's just your wish, old fag. But you're a recognized nutbag commie, so it doesn't matter.

Bundy schooling the fbi negotiator (who will not meet with him in a public place in front of the press) on what the fbi is authorized to do....that is, investigate government bodies and committees. Not set up standing armies to *protect* land that they have no interest in and which does not belong to the feds.

Save of course that the Federal Government's jurisdiction over federal lands isn't based on your pseudo-legal gibberish. But on the Constitution and Federal Law.

Remember...you have no idea what you're talking about. Making your declarations of what jurisdiction the Federal government has meaningless nonsense.

It boils down to this simple question: What's the use of a 'legal argument' that isn't recognized as valid by the law or the courts?

As far as I can tell, its only use is feelings of moral justification when sitting in jail.

The Federal government must abide by the Constitution. In fact spelling out the powers it does and does not have is the primary purpose of the Constitution. The congress cannot legally pass laws at odds with the Constitution (such as giving itself powers not authorized by the Constitution). The courts (a branch of government) cannot legally make judgments counter to what is stated in the Constitution. It is The People who are charged with making the final judgement of what is or is not Constitutional. If enough of The People are convinced the government has exceeded it's lawful authority the FF were in favor of armed conflict if necessary to bring it back into compliance or change it as necessary.

 

[Skylar]

That is the meeting for which there are no videos? Perhaps all who attended were ashamed of themselves? There were plenty of videos taken at the Grasty meeting.

Nobody is going to 'mow down hundreds of local ranchers'. But eventually, a dozen or so featherless loons at the Refuge may get their martyrdom wish.

That's just your wish, old fag. But you're a recognized nutbag commie, so it doesn't matter.

Bundy schooling the fbi negotiator (who will not meet with him in a public place in front of the press) on what the fbi is authorized to do....that is, investigate government bodies and committees. Not set up standing armies to *protect* land that they have no interest in and which does not belong to the feds.

Save of course that the Federal Government's jurisdiction over federal lands isn't based on your pseudo-legal gibberish. But on the Constitution and Federal Law.

Remember...you have no idea what you're talking about. Making your declarations of what jurisdiction the Federal government has meaningless nonsense.

It boils down to this simple question: What's the use of a 'legal argument' that isn't recognized as valid by the law or the courts?

As far as I can tell, its only use is feelings of moral justification when sitting in jail.

The Federal government must abide by the Constitution.

The Constitution according to who? The federal judiciary has been delegated with the authority of interpreting the constitution. Says who? Says Federalist Paper 78.

Per the Bundy Thugs, ANY interpretation of the Constitution by ANY one is legally authoritative. That's not our system of laws, nor ever has been.

The Sovereign Citizen horseshit that Bundy is making up has no basis in our law. So I ask again, what's the use of a legal argument that isn't recognized as valid by the law or the constitution.

Apparently, so you can tell yourself that *your* interpretation of the constitution is the only valid one....while you sit in jail.

 

[jc456]

And on that note, all of you .gov lovers and progressives win. I resign. All the odds are on the house. I see that clearly now. I hope that the FBI just goes in and wipes those at the refuge off the face of the map, guns a blazing; that is what you all want, right? Because that is all most of seem to want. Blood. You could care less about the deeper questions that should have been raised in this thread. There has, IMHO been a bit of information posted that could have been sifted through for a thinking person to try and truthfully debate this situation, but truthful debate is not part of this section of USMB. Personal attacks and lapping up what the .gov MSM as truth is.

No, logic is not allowed here. Truth or any attempt at finding it in between the two different sides of the story are not allowed. Only personal attacks and bullshit is all. Tyrone has called me and asshole. I say "F" you. Bet that even gets me an infraction.

All I have to do now is wait for it, wait for it, and see how many tag my post as 'funny' starting with Mr Black and White (aka Tyrone) and on down, and then I know I am right, if only in my mind.

So, I sign off of this thread and here is me . . . . .



















ignoring the rest of the personal attacks on me and those others who have tried and failed to make you folks try to think for yourselves.

libturd volume 101, when you have no logic an no facts utilize tool number one, insults. Pull out every insult in the world, post up pretty clever little pictures, but by gawd don't you post up a discussion point eva!!!

 

[jc456]

"What gives these people more right to the land than a teacher, who wants to take his/her students to the refuge?" - Kim Jones of Hailey, Idaho

the fact that they are there and the teachers are not? hmmm seems clear to me.

 

[koshergrl]

These photos were taken by a community member. She reached out to us because she was followed by the darker suv out past the reservation where she regularly runs her dogs with her children each weekend. She became nervous and worried for her safety and that of her children especially when she stopped and two other vehicles were nearby. She states she asked the men why they were following her, one man in a Dodge truck stated he was lost and needed to turn around. The men i...n the dark suv stated they works for an agency but couldn't tell her who. Her husband arrived after being calling by his frantic wife and grilled the men. They admitted they were fbi agents and that her vehicle matched the description of one of interest. They also stated her son, who was driving, was a larger man and looked suspicious. Now she takes her kids out to this area weekly and was going in the complete opposite direction of the refuge and was doing nothing wrong. These men are purposely scaring residents and harassing them. Any other stories like this please post them.
See More


371 others like this.
661 shares

This is the reality in Harney County.

 

[koshergrl]

"Anne PostI pay taxes, I work long hours. My husband too. What's happening in Burns needs to happen everywhere... you don't kill people for supporting the Constitution. These protesters are not walking around with guns. These lands are being stolen and sold to foreign gvmts. Our national wealth, our kids futures."

Harney County Mall Cops

This is how the Sheriff's Dept says they are not escalating the situation. This is what you will be met with if you want to visit the court house.

199 others like this.
271 shares

 

[Skylar]

These photos were taken by a community member. She reached out to us because she was followed by the darker suv out past the reservation where she regularly runs her dogs with her children each weekend. She became nervous and worried for her safety and that of her children especially when she stopped and two other vehicles were nearby. She states she asked the men why they were following her, one man in a Dodge truck stated he was lost and needed to turn around. The men i...n the dark suv stated they works for an agency but couldn't tell her who. Her husband arrived after being calling by his frantic wife and grilled the men. They admitted they were fbi agents and that her vehicle matched the description of one of interest. They also stated her son, who was driving, was a larger man and looked suspicious. Now she takes her kids out to this area weekly and was going in the complete opposite direction of the refuge and was doing nothing wrong. These men are purposely scaring residents and harassing them. Any other stories like this please post them.
See More


371 others like this.
661 shares

This is the reality in Harney County.

Prove it. You're the same person who has lied to us repeatedly and quoted Russian Government propaganda, while making up pseudo-legal gibberish about how the Federal government lacks jurisdiction on Federal land.

We're gonna need *way* more than you insisting your latest tale 'must be so.

 

[koshergrl]

The feds and local cops blocking the roads....yet all we hear about is how the protesters are blocking roads and preventing access. Interesting, no?

 

[Skylar]

"Anne PostI pay taxes, I work long hours. My husband too. What's happening in Burns needs to happen everywhere... you don't kill people for supporting the Constitution. These protesters are not walking around with guns. These lands are being stolen and sold to foreign gvmts. Our national wealth, our kids futures."

Harney County Mall Cops

This is how the Sheriff's Dept says they are not escalating the situation. This is what you will be met with if you want to visit the court house.

199 others like this.
271 shares

There's an armed militia who very much has sported their guns that have invaded the county from out of State. Of course the Sheriff is going to protect his people.

But once again you demonstrate the lie of the Militia Thugs. They claim they want 'local' and 'state' control. Yet they ignore the State, ignore the local authorities, ignore the local people, ignore the local Sheriff, ignore the governor, even ignore the local Tribes.

The only authority that the Militia Thugs believe in is 'themselves'. They insist that any group of folks are 'The People', and can make up any laws they wish.

Sorry, my little Sovereign Citizen. But that's not our system of laws, nor ever has been.

 

[Camp]

These photos were taken by a community member. She reached out to us because she was followed by the darker suv out past the reservation where she regularly runs her dogs with her children each weekend. She became nervous and worried for her safety and that of her children especially when she stopped and two other vehicles were nearby. She states she asked the men why they were following her, one man in a Dodge truck stated he was lost and needed to turn around. The men i...n the dark suv stated they works for an agency but couldn't tell her who. Her husband arrived after being calling by his frantic wife and grilled the men. They admitted they were fbi agents and that her vehicle matched the description of one of interest. They also stated her son, who was driving, was a larger man and looked suspicious. Now she takes her kids out to this area weekly and was going in the complete opposite direction of the refuge and was doing nothing wrong. These men are purposely scaring residents and harassing them. Any other stories like this please post them.
See More


371 others like this.
661 shares

This is the reality in Harney County.

Very suspicious and scary. Vehicles with government tags roaming around and checking out people on or around federal properties. How dare they do that.

 

[Skylar]

These photos were taken by a community member. She reached out to us because she was followed by the darker suv out past the reservation where she regularly runs her dogs with her children each weekend. She became nervous and worried for her safety and that of her children especially when she stopped and two other vehicles were nearby. She states she asked the men why they were following her, one man in a Dodge truck stated he was lost and needed to turn around. The men i...n the dark suv stated they works for an agency but couldn't tell her who. Her husband arrived after being calling by his frantic wife and grilled the men. They admitted they were fbi agents and that her vehicle matched the description of one of interest. They also stated her son, who was driving, was a larger man and looked suspicious. Now she takes her kids out to this area weekly and was going in the complete opposite direction of the refuge and was doing nothing wrong. These men are purposely scaring residents and harassing them. Any other stories like this please post them.
See More


371 others like this.
661 shares

This is the reality in Harney County.

Very suspicious and scary. Vehicles with government tags roaming around and checking out people on or around federal properties. How dare they do that.

"We're only engaged in an armed insurrection and raid on government property. Why are they following us?"

 

[jc456]

These photos were taken by a community member. She reached out to us because she was followed by the darker suv out past the reservation where she regularly runs her dogs with her children each weekend. She became nervous and worried for her safety and that of her children especially when she stopped and two other vehicles were nearby. She states she asked the men why they were following her, one man in a Dodge truck stated he was lost and needed to turn around. The men i...n the dark suv stated they works for an agency but couldn't tell her who. Her husband arrived after being calling by his frantic wife and grilled the men. They admitted they were fbi agents and that her vehicle matched the description of one of interest. They also stated her son, who was driving, was a larger man and looked suspicious. Now she takes her kids out to this area weekly and was going in the complete opposite direction of the refuge and was doing nothing wrong. These men are purposely scaring residents and harassing them. Any other stories like this please post them.
See More


371 others like this.
661 shares

This is the reality in Harney County.

Very suspicious and scary. Vehicles with government tags roaming around and checking out people on or around federal properties. How dare they do that.

"We're only engaged in an armed insurrection and raid on government property. Why are they following us?"

Well, if the fbi knows where the militia dudes are at, why do they need to block roads and follow the locals around?