Boy........Did we ever get Schlonged

[Dr Grump]

I agree. It doesn't matter. Socialism never works, no matter what the size of the country.

Neither does capitalism on its own..

Yes it does.

Proof, my little fat bald friend...

 

[Dr Grump]

I'm not living month to month but the majority of Americans are living month to month. Saying it is because of insurance is a vast oversimplification. There's quite a bit more that goes into that equation. I don't know what the average family pays for health insurance, I only know what I pay. If I told you it would only make you envious. That or angry.

You tell me how much you're paying and I'll tell you how much I am. I'm guessing I'm paying a lot less than you are...

 

[Dr Grump]

That's like saying nature doesn't work on its own because there are natural disasters. Free enterprise is as close to a natural system as it gets.

Sure if you didn't have Wall St manipulating the markets. If you didn't have the 'have' giving it up the arse tot the 'have nots'. I'll give you a great example of capitalism in its purist form. Central and South America circa 1960 through to 2010....yeah, great examples. Note the countries with a good middle class, reasonable economies etc are northern europe, aussie, nz. canada....all a mixture of both socialism and capitalism. All have much better health systems than the US.

 

[ding]

I'm not living month to month but the majority of Americans are living month to month. Saying it is because of insurance is a vast oversimplification. There's quite a bit more that goes into that equation. I don't know what the average family pays for health insurance, I only know what I pay. If I told you it would only make you envious. That or angry.

You tell me how much you're paying and I'll tell you how much I am. I'm guessing I'm paying a lot less than you are...

It's around 200 per month with $3000 family deductible but we get $2000 paid into our HCA by our employer. After the deductible it is identical to the low deductible plan. The reason the plan is the way it is is because the ACA forced companies to scrap the so-called Cadillac plans and move to high deductible plans.

I am guessing that you are going to tell me that you live in one of the socialist countries and pay no costs for health care. Save your self the effort because we both know the costs of your health care are hidden in your taxes. There are no free lunches.

 

[ding]

That's like saying nature doesn't work on its own because there are natural disasters. Free enterprise is as close to a natural system as it gets.

Sure if you didn't have Wall St manipulating the markets. If you didn't have the 'have' giving it up the arse tot the 'have nots'. I'll give you a great example of capitalism in its purist form. Central and South America circa 1960 through to 2010....yeah, great examples. Note the countries with a good middle class, reasonable economies etc are northern europe, aussie, nz. canada....all a mixture of both socialism and capitalism. All have much better health systems than the US.

You make it sound like Wall St is a single entity, a person. There is no unified collusion going on here to screw over the have nots. At any point of each of our lives we are the sum of our choices.

Your views of socialism are through rose colored glasses. When capitalism fails people lose money. When socialism fails people starve. Venezuela.

 

[Dr Grump]

[
It's around 200 per month with $3000 family deductible but we get $2000 paid into our HCA by our employer. After the deductible it is identical to the low deductible plan.

Sounds very good. Ours is AU$600 a month for a family of four. Includes dental. Plus we have Medicare.....which means visits to doctors don't cost much or not at all..

 

[Dr Grump]

[
You make it sound like Wall St is a single entity, a person. There is no unified collusion going on here to screw over the have nots. At any point of each of our lives we are the sum of our choices.

Your views of socialism are through rose colored glasses. When capitalism fails people lose money. When socialism fails people starve. Venezuela.

When capitalism fails you have Germany 1930s. And people starve. I like a mixture of both. Unified collusion? So the GFC wasn't a result of wall st folk selling sub-prime mortgages? and how many of them went to jail? It wasn't mum and dad working at Walmart. Or the local butcher . or the local mechanic. No. It was greedy wall st capitalistic bastards. End of story.

 

[ding]

When capitalism fails you have Germany 1930s.

No, lol. That was reparations.

I like a mixture of both.

Good for you. World socialism as a whole, and all the figures associated with it, are shrouded in legend; its contradictions are forgotten or concealed; it does not respond to arguments but continually ignores them. Socialism dismisses its defeats and ignores its incongruities. Socialism denies examination because no one would accept its true goals were shown. The doctrines of socialism seethe with contradictions, its theories are at constant odds with its practice, yet due to a powerful instinct these contradictions do not in the least hinder the unending propaganda of socialism. Indeed, no precise, distinct socialism even exists; instead there is only a vague, rosy notion of something noble and good, of equality, communal ownership, and justice: the advent of these things will bring instant euphoria and a social order beyond reproach.

Unified collusion? So the GFC wasn't a result of wall st folk selling sub-prime mortgages?

No. It was a systemic failure of every level. It started with banks making loans that they knew could not be paid back and spreading that risk all over the world. They did so for two reasons; the low cost of money and government pressure to make the loans.

and how many of them went to jail?

Don't blame me. If I were in charge I would have filled up the jails with them.

It wasn't mum and dad working at Walmart. Or the local butcher . or the local mechanic. No. It was greedy wall st capitalistic bastards. End of story.

ummmm.... no. That is a vast over simplification that doesn't even come close to understanding the root cause of the failure. Like I already wrote, It was a systemic failure of every level. It started with banks making loans that they knew could not be paid back and spreading that risk all over the world. They did so for two reasons; the low cost of money and government pressure to make the loans. At the end of the day, no one starved. If you want to see what that looks like, just look at Venezuela, who 10 years ago was a thriving nation.

 

[Dot Com]

Did it leave a mark when you people got Shlonged?

 

[Dr Grump]

[
It started with banks making loans that they knew could not be paid back and spreading that risk all over the world. They did so for two reasons; the low cost of money and government pressure to make the loans.

ummmm.... no. It started with banks making loans that they knew could not be paid back and spreading that risk all over the world. They did so for two reasons; the low cost of money and government pressure to make the loans..

As I said. Greedy bastards.

And the Wall St elite hid the bad debts in with the good debts and sold them all over the world.

 

[Dr Grump]

Good for you. World socialism as a whole, and all the figures associated with it, are shrouded in legend; its contradictions are forgotten or concealed; it does not respond to arguments but continually ignores them. Socialism dismisses its defeats and ignores its incongruities. Socialism denies examination because no one would accept its true goals were shown. The doctrines of socialism seethe with contradictions, its theories are at constant odds with its practice, yet due to a powerful instinct these contradictions do not in the least hinder the unending propaganda of socialism. Indeed, no precise, distinct socialism even exists; instead there is only a vague, rosy notion of something noble and good, of equality, communal ownership, and justice: the advent of these things will bring instant euphoria and a social order beyond reproach..

Yep. That is socialism. It also provides a safety net (NOT a hammock) at the bottom of a cliff. I would much rather have our (NZ) form of govt and Australian (where I live) form and any of the Scandinavian countries - throw in Germany, France and Switzerland too - (but NOT the UK) any day of the week of the US. There is a reason most of those countries end up on the Best places to live in the world categories all the time. The US is too wound up in the 'self'. It's all about "me,,me me". You can't have both you know. We realise this.

BTW, just so you know, there has never EVER been a communist of socialist country in the world. China and USSR were totalitarian dictatorships. Read Marx and Engels and tell me how much that marries with the USSR and China (hint : it doesn't). Don't get me wrong, Lenin kinda wanted it. But it never came to fruition. As I said, a mixture of capitalism and socialism works. Those countries I mentioned above are proof of that.

 

[ding]

Good for you. World socialism as a whole, and all the figures associated with it, are shrouded in legend; its contradictions are forgotten or concealed; it does not respond to arguments but continually ignores them. Socialism dismisses its defeats and ignores its incongruities. Socialism denies examination because no one would accept its true goals were shown. The doctrines of socialism seethe with contradictions, its theories are at constant odds with its practice, yet due to a powerful instinct these contradictions do not in the least hinder the unending propaganda of socialism. Indeed, no precise, distinct socialism even exists; instead there is only a vague, rosy notion of something noble and good, of equality, communal ownership, and justice: the advent of these things will bring instant euphoria and a social order beyond reproach..

Yep. That is socialism. It also provides a safety net (NOT a hammock) at the bottom of a cliff. I would much rather have our (NZ) form of govt and Australian (where I live) form and any of the Scandinavian countries - throw in Germany, France and Switzerland too - (but NOT the UK) any day of the week of the US. There is a reason most of those countries end up on the Best places to live in the world categories all the time. The US is too wound up in the 'self'. It's all about "me,,me me". You can't have both you know. We realise this.

BTW, just so you know, there has never EVER been a communist of socialist country in the world. China and USSR were totalitarian dictatorships. Read Marx and Engels and tell me how much that marries with the USSR and China (hint : it doesn't). Don't get me wrong, Lenin kinda wanted it. But it never came to fruition. As I said, a mixture of capitalism and socialism works. Those countries I mentioned above are proof of that.

Gee.. it almost sounds like you are defending socialism and communism.

 

[ding]

[
It started with banks making loans that they knew could not be paid back and spreading that risk all over the world. They did so for two reasons; the low cost of money and government pressure to make the loans.

ummmm.... no. It started with banks making loans that they knew could not be paid back and spreading that risk all over the world. They did so for two reasons; the low cost of money and government pressure to make the loans..

As I said. Greedy bastards.

And the Wall St elite hid the bad debts in with the good debts and sold them all over the world.

They don't have banks where you are from?

 

[Dr Grump]

[
It started with banks making loans that they knew could not be paid back and spreading that risk all over the world. They did so for two reasons; the low cost of money and government pressure to make the loans.

ummmm.... no. It started with banks making loans that they knew could not be paid back and spreading that risk all over the world. They did so for two reasons; the low cost of money and government pressure to make the loans..

As I said. Greedy bastards.

And the Wall St elite hid the bad debts in with the good debts and sold them all over the world.

They don't have banks where you are from?

Not ones that created sub prime mortgages. No.

 

[Dr Grump]

[
Gee.. it almost sounds like you are defending socialism and communism.

Don't mind aspects of socialism at all. We have it in part down here. I don't have much time for communism. The ideal is okay but no country that I know have has ever practised it.

 

[Dot Com]

Hope you people learned a lesson

 

[Spoonman]

Major butt kicking by Republicans as Trump wins probably the most impressive victory in history. Never thought he could take a majority of swing states let alone shatter the blue wall

The SENATE. Republicans had to defend 26 states and defended 24. Unbelievable ground game by Republicans and Trumps coat tails were longer than could be expected

So now the Supreme Court will go 5-4 conservative and probably 6-3

The American people have spoken and I wish President Elect Trump the best





.

The 2nd amendment people spoke in the swing states.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Good for you. World socialism as a whole, and all the figures associated with it, are shrouded in legend; its contradictions are forgotten or concealed; it does not respond to arguments but continually ignores them. Socialism dismisses its defeats and ignores its incongruities. Socialism denies examination because no one would accept its true goals were shown. The doctrines of socialism seethe with contradictions, its theories are at constant odds with its practice, yet due to a powerful instinct these contradictions do not in the least hinder the unending propaganda of socialism. Indeed, no precise, distinct socialism even exists; instead there is only a vague, rosy notion of something noble and good, of equality, communal ownership, and justice: the advent of these things will bring instant euphoria and a social order beyond reproach..

Yep. That is socialism. It also provides a safety net (NOT a hammock) at the bottom of a cliff. I would much rather have our (NZ) form of govt and Australian (where I live) form and any of the Scandinavian countries - throw in Germany, France and Switzerland too - (but NOT the UK) any day of the week of the US. There is a reason most of those countries end up on the Best places to live in the world categories all the time. The US is too wound up in the 'self'. It's all about "me,,me me". You can't have both you know. We realise this.

BTW, just so you know, there has never EVER been a communist of socialist country in the world. China and USSR were totalitarian dictatorships. Read Marx and Engels and tell me how much that marries with the USSR and China (hint : it doesn't). Don't get me wrong, Lenin kinda wanted it. But it never came to fruition. As I said, a mixture of capitalism and socialism works. Those countries I mentioned above are proof of that.

NZ is to expensive and you know it, even with your high minimum wage you still have a million or so of working poor..

I have a few kiwi friends for a few years.. I know all about the real NZ..

.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Hope you people learned a lesson

I don't think they did Dottie, they want to get rid of the EC so the working men are never heard from again.

 

[Dr Grump]

NZ is to expensive and you know it, even with your high minimum wage you still have a million or so of working poor..

I have a few kiwi friends for a few years.. I know all about the real NZ..

.

I disagree with your friend. There are parts of NZ that are expensive. The US is a lot more - a tonne more - expensive than NZ to live. Easily. Insurances alone gobble up your wage. There are poor in NZ absolutely. But nowhere near the number (even per head of population) as the US. And your poor are really, really poor.