California's Brown Signs Bill Permitting Non-Physician Abortions

[Spoonman]

i wonder if obamcare will pay for an abortion performed by someone who isn't a doctor

 

[Katzndogz]

Saving the costs in all directions

It is amazing how lowly the left (mostly the white men) values the women ( mostly minority ones). Not that they did not give any reason for that - with gladly parroting the mantra of "that's my body and my choice"
Only stupid women coul let the men off the hook of responsibility that easy.

That is the reason the left considers women stupid cattle - the big chunk of women populace actually proves exactly that.

The reality is women ARE devalued. Men get doctors. Women get the janitor. There is no difference between these abortions and the back alley abortions of two generations ago, except today the procedures are done legally. They are still done by the same incompetents who killed women 50 years ago. These are the kind of women who get abortions. Some women will pay, or have their families pay, for a doctor to perform a medical procedure. The rest will go to incompetents and take their chances. This isn't exactly the worst thing to ever happen.

Except if the backalley abortionists were caught, they went to jail.

Not any more! Gosnell was the last. His clinic would be perfectly FINE in Cali!

In a few years, we'll be talking about the way drug dealers used to go to jail. Get rid of the crime by legalizing it. There you go.

 

[Plasmaball]

Another proud liberal who is clearly deeply concerned about "women's health."

when a woman has an abortion i put on a party hat!

Negged! and I hope you get plenty more.

Lol hypocrite.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

It is absolutely asinine to allow someone other than a trained, licensed physician to perform a procedure that can have life threatening complications...I really hope that some women are not that stupid...they may as well head to their local butcher shop.
Unreal.

The hyperbole and demagoguery notwithstanding, do you have any objective, documented evidence in support of this? Do you have any evidence that those performing abortions in California have had no more training that the local butcher?

Perhaps you should research the facts first before posting.

Otherwise, it’s much more likely that your concern is partisan, where the success of the program will serve to undermine the legitimacy of laws in other states requiring burdensome, and needless, regulatory measures, designed only to interfere with a woman’s right to privacy.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Hey, where are the Liberals chanting their screeds about Republicans not caring about women's health? Oh yeah, they're all quiet. This is disgusting and they f'ing know it.

Clearly the hypocrisy of the right knows no bounds.

Where are our conservative opponents of government regulation and advocates of personal responsibility?

If Brown were signing into law a measure allowing employers to regulate themselves concerning workplace safety, conservatives would be in full support.

 

[Vox]

Hey, where are the Liberals chanting their screeds about Republicans not caring about women's health? Oh yeah, they're all quiet. This is disgusting and they f'ing know it.

Clearly the hypocrisy of the right knows no bounds.

Where are our conservative opponents of government regulation and advocates of personal responsibility?

If Brown were signing into law a measure allowing employers to regulate themselves concerning workplace safety, conservatives would be in full support.

It is not the hypocrisy.

we are laughing at you - because you so clearly do not care AT ALL about the abdominal cavity operation being SAFE and just shovel the hanger up women's vagina in the name of population control

this is hilarious to watch - how you, leftard white men denigrate women. neither of you EVER would consider going to a butcher to perform much less dangerous procedure of vasectomy - only to a doctor. But a surgery with a possibility of death can be performed by a "trained" janitor - because it can be performed only on a woman.

Personally, for me, this decision is GREAT - it means that it is taking away the necessity to provide care for the procedure which I object to on absolute basis - to the back alleys which I have nothing to do with and never will be threatened to be forced to perform.

 

[Vox]

I see the female hating death cultists have arrived.

Aren't they cute....

No we don't hate women, we just don't think women are capable of making decisions when the subject is upon their own VAG ........... in a nut shell .......... we are striving for the rights to use & FUCK you when ever it tickles our fancy.

we know.

too bad the stupid leftard women don't.
they think that you gave them a "choice" when you just washed off your hands

 

[WelfareQueen]

least you were not all sensational about it.

Yep. Ole Kermit would be proud of you. Perhaps you'll find a woman needing your untrained hands to perform an abortion in California someday. You'll feel all giddy inside as you end a life not yet begun and perhaps maybe the poor woman's as well.

Gosnell was a licensed medical doctor. He still did horrible harm to his adult patients (The only issue that matters.) That kind of defeats your argument.

Here's the thing. Most abortions are performed between 8-12 weeks. You guys go on and on about the late term abortions that almost kind of look like a baby, but that's less than 1% of abortions performed, and usually for good medical reasons.

Fact is, trained nurse practioner is as qualified to perform an early abortion as she is to perform thousands of other medical procedures that they do every day.

I mean, shit, you guys don't get upset when midwives deliver babies, even though they aren't doctors.

This post is wrong and ignorant in every respect. This person is completely talking out of their ass. Period. I am a master level health care profession. I work in a big city ER. Nurse Practitioners are not trained to do abortions and are not trained to perform "thousands of medical procedures." A NP or PA is a mid-level adjunct to a Physician that in most medical contexts works directly under the supervision of an MD. In ER's the only "procedures" a NP or PA does is put in stitches. That's it.

They diagnosis and treat minor to moderate healthcare aliments. That is all. Anything real serious, the MD steps in, and MD's do all procedures because they have much more extensive training. Any women who would allow a non board certified OB/GYN to abort their fetus is taking their life in their hands.

In my ER (we see over 100,000 people a year) NP's and PA are not allowed to work in Trauma and Critical Care areas, or in Chest Pain. They would kill you if they did. Now if you have a fever, or a mild ankle sprain, or a bad cough....no problem.

As for Gosnell, the Government supervises dog kennels and nail salons better than abortion clinics. Democrats don't give a shit about "women's health." If they did, they would provide better supervision of abortion clinics and weed out the quacks like Gosnell.

 

[WelfareQueen]

Telling the hypocrisy and inconsistency of the right, how ‘states’ rights’ go out the window when it concerns something they oppose.

And this law is an example of how state measures can both reflect the will of the majority of the people and conform to Constitutional case law, unlike Proposition 8, for example.

By meeting those two fundamental requirements, the new law is perfectly appropriate and legitimate, as there is no evidence that the new measure will in any way jeopardize the health of women seeking abortions.

Conservatives fear the measure because they know no woman’s health will be endangered, thus undermining the legitimacy of efforts in other states such as requiring doctors to have ‘admitting privileges,’ a popular backdoor tactic by those opposed to privacy rights.

Another person talking completely out of their ass, and clearly is not a medical provider, and has no knowledge of provider training or credentials. Any women who would allow a non board certified OB/GYN to abort her fetus is taking her life in her hands. I cannot be more clear.

Any women who reads this and is considering an abortion, please make sure clinic is reputable, and a board certified physician performs the procedure. Unlike liberals, I actually give a damn about women's health.

 

[Vox]

Yep. Ole Kermit would be proud of you. Perhaps you'll find a woman needing your untrained hands to perform an abortion in California someday. You'll feel all giddy inside as you end a life not yet begun and perhaps maybe the poor woman's as well.

Gosnell was a licensed medical doctor. He still did horrible harm to his adult patients (The only issue that matters.) That kind of defeats your argument.

Here's the thing. Most abortions are performed between 8-12 weeks. You guys go on and on about the late term abortions that almost kind of look like a baby, but that's less than 1% of abortions performed, and usually for good medical reasons.

Fact is, trained nurse practioner is as qualified to perform an early abortion as she is to perform thousands of other medical procedures that they do every day.

I mean, shit, you guys don't get upset when midwives deliver babies, even though they aren't doctors.

This post is wrong and ignorant in every respect. This person is completely talking out of their ass. Period. I am a master level health care profession. I work in a big city ER. Nurse Practitioners are not trained to do abortions and are not trained to perform "thousands of medical procedures." A NP or PA is a mid-level adjunct to a Physician that in most medical contexts works directly under the supervision of an MD. In ER's the only "procedures" a NP or PA does is put in stitches. That's it.

They diagnosis and treat minor to moderate healthcare aliments. That is all. Anything real serious, the MD steps in, and MD's do all procedures because they have much more extensive training. Any women who would allow a non board certified OB/GYN to abort their fetus is taking their life in their hands.

In my ER (we see over 100,000 people a year) NP's and PA are not allowed to work in Trauma and Critical Care areas, or in Chest Pain. They would kill you if they did. Now if you have a fever, or a mild ankle sprain, or a bad cough....no problem.

As for Gosnell, the Government supervises dog kennels and nail salons better than abortion clinics. Democrats don't give a shit about "women's health." If they did, they would provide better supervision of abortion clinics and weed out the quacks like Gosnell.

same is in the OR. they can close the skin and put dressings by themselves - that's it.
NP and PA are the most used to do the paperwork. that is their level of responsibility.

 

[WelfareQueen]

Gosnell was a licensed medical doctor. He still did horrible harm to his adult patients (The only issue that matters.) That kind of defeats your argument.

Here's the thing. Most abortions are performed between 8-12 weeks. You guys go on and on about the late term abortions that almost kind of look like a baby, but that's less than 1% of abortions performed, and usually for good medical reasons.

Fact is, trained nurse practioner is as qualified to perform an early abortion as she is to perform thousands of other medical procedures that they do every day.

I mean, shit, you guys don't get upset when midwives deliver babies, even though they aren't doctors.

This post is wrong and ignorant in every respect. This person is completely talking out of their ass. Period. I am a master level health care profession. I work in a big city ER. Nurse Practitioners are not trained to do abortions and are not trained to perform "thousands of medical procedures." A NP or PA is a mid-level adjunct to a Physician that in most medical contexts works directly under the supervision of an MD. In ER's the only "procedures" a NP or PA does is put in stitches. That's it.

They diagnosis and treat minor to moderate healthcare aliments. That is all. Anything real serious, the MD steps in, and MD's do all procedures because they have much more extensive training. Any women who would allow a non board certified OB/GYN to abort their fetus is taking their life in their hands.

In my ER (we see over 100,000 people a year) NP's and PA are not allowed to work in Trauma and Critical Care areas, or in Chest Pain. They would kill you if they did. Now if you have a fever, or a mild ankle sprain, or a bad cough....no problem.

As for Gosnell, the Government supervises dog kennels and nail salons better than abortion clinics. Democrats don't give a shit about "women's health." If they did, they would provide better supervision of abortion clinics and weed out the quacks like Gosnell.

same is in the OR. they can close the skin and put dressings by themselves - that's it.
NP and PA are the most used to do the paperwork. that is their level of responsibility.

Yep,

It is identical in Virginia. Mid-level providers serve an important role, but they are not trained to do complex procedures. Any woman who would allow a non OB/GYN to perform an abortion is foolish.

Btw....I have four years undergrad, two years of graduate school, a one year internship, and a three year residency to get licensed. I worked hard for those credentials, but I know what I am capable of doing and not doing, and what I am able to do under the scope of my license. This California Law endangers women's health, and shows a contempt for women in general.

 

[Vox]

Btw....I have four years undergrad, two years of graduate school, a one year internship, and a three year residency to get licensed. I worked hard for those credentials, but I know what I am capable of doing and not doing, and what I am able to do under the scope of my license. This California Law endangers women's health, and shows a contempt for women in general.

It certainly does. I am actually amazed that women don't protest this. Look on this board - all our militant feministas are zipped, because instinctively thet FEEL it is wrong and devastating to THEM, but the party line is to parrot and cheer

 

[WelfareQueen]

Btw....I have four years undergrad, two years of graduate school, a one year internship, and a three year residency to get licensed. I worked hard for those credentials, but I know what I am capable of doing and not doing, and what I am able to do under the scope of my license. This California Law endangers women's health, and shows a contempt for women in general.

It certainly does. I am actually amazed that women don't protest this. Look on this board - all our militant feministas are zipped, because instinctively thet FEEL it is wrong and devastating to THEM, but the party line is to parrot and cheer

Again, I have to agree with you. No way any true feminist or person who supports women's health issues would like this bill. I guess that's why all are democrat ladies on this message board have gone in hiding. Very sad.

And ladies, no guy on planet earth would have a non-MD do a vasectomy. Why would you be stupid enough to have a non-MD do a surgical procedure in your uterus. I mean, no offense, but are you fucking stupid?

 

[martybegan]

It's a real stretch to call early abortion "surgery".

in fact, women have been getting abortions since the time of Jesus, usually not performed by "doctors".

It's not like you wingnuts care about the fetuses, you just want to make life as difficult for the women as possible.

Your seriously referencing back to a time where barbers/"doctors" bled people to balance thier "four humors" as an example of a non-physician doing abortions?

If something has to go in to take something out, its surgery, even if its minor surgery and should be done by a doctor. Why does the sacred lefitst sacrament of abortion require all sorts of special rules if its just another procedure to get rid of "unwanted tissue"? How many other procedures to get rid of "unwanted tissue" can be done by someone without an MD?

Not really. There's really no reason why an abortion has to be performed by a doctor in the first trimester. It's simply not that complicated of a procedure.

And as you point out, abortions can be performed chemically now without "surgery".

Does the bill only allow NP's and PA's to administer chemical abortions? Or is this another political bill that is short on details and actual contnent, and just something a special interest group rammed through?

 

[g5000]

Who needs a doctor when youi're killing babies?..Women's rights?

Gov. Jerry Brown of California signed AB 154 on Wednesday, legalizing non-physician abortions in the state.

The legislation, which had been pushed vigorously by Planned Parenthood, had been strongly opposed by pro-life groups and some physicians, arguing that it amounted to legalizing back-alley abortions for profit.

California's Brown Signs Bill Permitting Non-Physician Abortions

Governor Brown has de-regulated abortions.

Interesting.

 

[g5000]

Does the bill only allow NP's and PA's to administer chemical abortions? Or is this another political bill that is short on details and actual contnent, and just something a special interest group rammed through?

Read it and find out for yourself: Bill Text - AB-154 Abortion.

 

[g5000]

I am a master's level health care provider. I work in a major inner city ER that sees over 100,000 patients a year. I have been in practice for over 25 years. In no way is a Nurse Practitioner or PA qualified to do unsupervised abortions. It is beyond their scope of practice and license, and is a major potential health risk to women.

This law demonstrates an utter contempt for women and their health. Period. The only person who should be performing abortions are board certified OB/GYN specialists.

The only entity who should be performing abortions is God.

 

[koshergrl]

Telling the hypocrisy and inconsistency of the right, how ‘states’ rights’ go out the window when it concerns something they oppose.

And this law is an example of how state measures can both reflect the will of the majority of the people and conform to Constitutional case law, unlike Proposition 8, for example.

By meeting those two fundamental requirements, the new law is perfectly appropriate and legitimate, as there is no evidence that the new measure will in any way jeopardize the health of women seeking abortions.

Conservatives fear the measure because they know no woman’s health will be endangered, thus undermining the legitimacy of efforts in other states such as requiring doctors to have ‘admitting privileges,’ a popular backdoor tactic by those opposed to privacy rights.

Another person talking completely out of their ass, and clearly is not a medical provider, and has no knowledge of provider training or credentials. Any women who would allow a non board certified OB/GYN to abort her fetus is taking her life in her hands. I cannot be more clear.

Any women who reads this and is considering an abortion, please make sure clinic is reputable, and a board certified physician performs the procedure. Unlike liberals, I actually give a damn about women's health.

You forget how thoroughly the progressive bloc has trained generations of women, and men, to believe that abortion is a clean, easy, clinical procedure that poses no more risk than blowing your nose....and that it is the obligation of every confused, abused, bullied woman to climb up and spread her legs for the good of the country if she gets pregnant.

It's all based on lies. From Kinsey, to R v. W, to now. Everything they think and believe is lies. Abortion is risky, women do still die, they are killing babies, it doesn't protect anyone from anything but makes EVERYTHING worse. They lie about the numbers that are performed, about how it's done, and about the circumstances and the age of the babies killed. They refuse to answer to ANYONE...and people are SURPRISED when there are butcher shops like Gosnell's that run for years and years and years with the blessings of PP and the whole progressive establishment?

Gosnell is a progressive HERO. That is why they're lowering the standards in Cali. So they can enable more people just like him to butcher women and children...only legally.

 

[mamooth]

NP's can be certified midwives, and childbirth is way more dangerous than abortion.

Hence, it's illogical and insane to claim NP's are unqualified to do the much safer abortion procedures.

Vox, WelfareQueen, why do you hate women so much that you'd allow NP's to be midwives? Is it that you want women to die?

The kooks, even the "health care professionals", don't seem to know even the most basic facts about medical abortions and childbirth. Such as how easy and safe a vacuum aspiration abortion is. But then, if they weren't dogshit ignorant of the facts, they wouldn't be pro-lifers.

Of course, pro-lifers are the crowd that created Dr. Gosnell. He's the pro-life poster boy, and the goal of pro-lifers is to create more Dr. Gosnells. Once you make it impossible for good clinics to exist, hacks step in to fill the void. Pro-lifers adore that, since they fully approve of abortion as long as it's humiliating and dangerous. Vox proved that with this line.

Personally, for me, this decision is GREAT - it means that it is taking away the necessity to provide care for the procedure which I object to on absolute basis - to the back alleys which I have nothing to do with and never will be threatened to be forced to perform.

Most pro-life liars don't give a shit about life. Never have. They're mainly just a bunch of sicko pervs who get off on punishing women.

 

[koshergrl]

Oh look, more lies right on cue.