CDZ Can Hurricane deaths 5 months after Hurricane be blamed on Trump?

[WillowTree]

The Puerto Rican government is completely corrupt, and the deaths attributed to the Hurricane? Are now being counted 5 months out in an obvious attempt to attack Trump....is this fair?

Completely. Trump is in Charge of FEMA, the organization that is supposed to respond to disasters and get a region like this back on their feet after a disaster.

Then he needs to declare martial law! Put a division of army in there, put the dumb officials in jail and just take over PR. Otherwise he is not responsible.

Exactly !!!!

The storm was catastrophic, and in the modern age those numbers are actually low in regards to the deaths involved. If a Storm like that would have hit them decades ago, the numbers would have been catastrophic in regards to the numbers of deaths. It will probably amaze people as to how many resources have been poured into that area since then. The infrastructure was very fragile due to a number of past reasons, and that also played a huge role in the deaths I'm thinking. Emergency preparedness was probably another factor. We're shelters adequate, high ground routes adequate, transportation adequate, escape routes adequate etc ?

This cheap shot at Trump is pure political bullcrap, just as it was in the blaming of Bush during Katrina. What did that idiot Ralm Emmanuel get caught saying ? "Never let a ??? go to waste"

It amazes me that some people, especially the left never ever question what they are being told. They hate Trump so much that they will take any lie at face value and run with it. Help was sent, troops were sent. The gov. Is corrupt! The aid sits rotting away but instead of getting it to the people the PR officials are busy paying a university to drum up inflated numbers a year later, manufacturing tee shirts and screaming into the cameras!

 

[eagle1462010]

This is the group that was there during and right after the storm

 

[eagle1462010]

 

[beagle9]

If the islands government is corrupt, then Marshall law should be implemented immediately, and the corruption destroyed.

After that, then rebuild the island into a modern day paradise with security measures that would withstand another hit from a major storm like that. End of story.

 

[JoeB131]

Giving money to American rather than to those who have repeatedly voted not be part of America but still demand America pay all their bills?

Puerto Rico is a 116-year-old child who refuses to leave Mom's basement.

We need to call Dr Phil ... it's time for 'tough love'.

I think you are a little confused.

Puerto Rico has voted for statehood a number of times.

the reason why it can't become a state is Congress hasn't approved it as called for in the constitution.

That won't happen because the last thing Republicans want is 2 more democratic senators and 8 more democratic congressmen, which is what they would get if PR became a state.

 

[eagle1462010]

Damage to Puerto Rico from Hurricane Irma.........900,000 without power ........before Maria ever hit...........They were already damaged and hadn't recovered from Irma when Maria hit.

 

[JoeB131]

If the islands government is corrupt, then Marshall law should be implemented immediately, and the corruption destroyed.

After that, then rebuild the island into a modern day paradise with security measures that would withstand another hit from a major storm like that. End of story.

first, it's "Martial" law, not "Marshall" law.

Second, the Federal Government already has more authority in PR than it would have in IL, because it's a territory, not a state. So Trump could have sent in FEMA and the military to help out without really asking permission. Not that he would have needed it, they'd have been happy for the help.

Instead, he forgot about it as soon as it was out of the headlines.

 

[Camp]

"Can Hurricane deaths 5 months after Hurricane be blamed on Trump?

Yes, absolutely. If rhe cause of death is attributable to an illness or injury originating during the hurricane and caused by a poor emergency services response it can be blamed on the poor response. Trump, as CiC is hence culpable for the poor response. In this case, a lack of LPH's directly stalled and hindered the delivery of life-saving supplies such as medicines and clean drinking water that and troops to administer and safeguard those supplies could have and should have been delivered via helicopters dispatched from an appropriate number of LPH's. Helicopter Carriers (LPH's) were in short supply only because they were not dispatched to rhe area in time.

The Gator Navy pulled in right behind the storm...........Kearsarge and the Wasp my old ship............and immediately went into rescue operations...........FEMA workers road out the storm on those 2 ships..............nearly 10000 FEMA workers and military were there during the storm because of Irma...............were already rendering aid to the region..........

You can only deliver so much via helo's...........the main push had to be by port then land transport........took them days to clear the water ways..............funny thing about storms...........they litter the harbors with debris.........that had to be cleared to open the water ways...........

Supplies were at the shipping centers already...........but then the truck drivers went on freaking strike in the middle of the storm demanding more money in the middle of a recovery effort.............go on strike when people needed them right then and there...............

Not only that...........the dam was about to break and partially broke that held the Islands water supply........not an easy fix.........the main River changed direction and was now flowing directly through a city .........The Corp of Engineers had to build a levee to redirect an entire River to stop it from flowing into the city.........

Roads were cut..........all roads were blocked by debris........yet the clean up started right after the storm..........

Temp power went out almost immediately to every hospital and key medical centers the next day........getting fuel to them being the next major problem............

Your side is lying about the effort there.......

How many helicopters did the Kearsarge and Wasp provide? How many LPH's are in rhe fleet?

 

[eagle1462010]

"Can Hurricane deaths 5 months after Hurricane be blamed on Trump?

Yes, absolutely. If rhe cause of death is attributable to an illness or injury originating during the hurricane and caused by a poor emergency services response it can be blamed on the poor response. Trump, as CiC is hence culpable for the poor response. In this case, a lack of LPH's directly stalled and hindered the delivery of life-saving supplies such as medicines and clean drinking water that and troops to administer and safeguard those supplies could have and should have been delivered via helicopters dispatched from an appropriate number of LPH's. Helicopter Carriers (LPH's) were in short supply only because they were not dispatched to rhe area in time.

The Gator Navy pulled in right behind the storm...........Kearsarge and the Wasp my old ship............and immediately went into rescue operations...........FEMA workers road out the storm on those 2 ships..............nearly 10000 FEMA workers and military were there during the storm because of Irma...............were already rendering aid to the region..........

You can only deliver so much via helo's...........the main push had to be by port then land transport........took them days to clear the water ways..............funny thing about storms...........they litter the harbors with debris.........that had to be cleared to open the water ways...........

Supplies were at the shipping centers already...........but then the truck drivers went on freaking strike in the middle of the storm demanding more money in the middle of a recovery effort.............go on strike when people needed them right then and there...............

Not only that...........the dam was about to break and partially broke that held the Islands water supply........not an easy fix.........the main River changed direction and was now flowing directly through a city .........The Corp of Engineers had to build a levee to redirect an entire River to stop it from flowing into the city.........

Roads were cut..........all roads were blocked by debris........yet the clean up started right after the storm..........

Temp power went out almost immediately to every hospital and key medical centers the next day........getting fuel to them being the next major problem............

Your side is lying about the effort there.......

How many helicopters did the Kearsarge and Wasp provide? How many LPH's are in rhe fleet?

That would be job specific...........would have to get that data.......but they are provided by the Marines.....aka......Gator Navy...............

We are fighting a endless War.......our assets are scattered around the globe......Irma had just hit the U.S. Virgin Islands........and Key West........Assets were tied up all over the place...........

To your question on the LHD's.........We have 8 of them built in Pasgagoula Miss............4 of them are East Coast and 4 of them are West coast............2 tied up for deployment overseas for the War out of the East Coast.........so every LHD available would be 2............That doesn't count the LHA's.....or the Carriers.........which were also in rescue mode in other areas...............

These 2 storms destroyed the entire area.......Puerto Rico was not the ONLY MISSION......Irma went through as a Cat 5 and the Navy and our assets were helping other Islands as well............

Your wishful thinking on how it should have been done with the areas hit at the same time is quite frankly........BS.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

"Can Hurricane deaths 5 months after Hurricane be blamed on Trump?"

Of course they can.

The deaths of American citizens during the storm and subsequently are the consequence of Trump’s incompetence and failure to address the crisis.

And the lie that the Puerto Rican government is ‘corrupt’ fails as a red herring fallacy, just another example of how dishonest and reprehensible Trump supporters are.

 

[eagle1462010]

"Can Hurricane deaths 5 months after Hurricane be blamed on Trump?

Yes, absolutely. If rhe cause of death is attributable to an illness or injury originating during the hurricane and caused by a poor emergency services response it can be blamed on the poor response. Trump, as CiC is hence culpable for the poor response. In this case, a lack of LPH's directly stalled and hindered the delivery of life-saving supplies such as medicines and clean drinking water that and troops to administer and safeguard those supplies could have and should have been delivered via helicopters dispatched from an appropriate number of LPH's. Helicopter Carriers (LPH's) were in short supply only because they were not dispatched to rhe area in time.

The Gator Navy pulled in right behind the storm...........Kearsarge and the Wasp my old ship............and immediately went into rescue operations...........FEMA workers road out the storm on those 2 ships..............nearly 10000 FEMA workers and military were there during the storm because of Irma...............were already rendering aid to the region..........

You can only deliver so much via helo's...........the main push had to be by port then land transport........took them days to clear the water ways..............funny thing about storms...........they litter the harbors with debris.........that had to be cleared to open the water ways...........

Supplies were at the shipping centers already...........but then the truck drivers went on freaking strike in the middle of the storm demanding more money in the middle of a recovery effort.............go on strike when people needed them right then and there...............

Not only that...........the dam was about to break and partially broke that held the Islands water supply........not an easy fix.........the main River changed direction and was now flowing directly through a city .........The Corp of Engineers had to build a levee to redirect an entire River to stop it from flowing into the city.........

Roads were cut..........all roads were blocked by debris........yet the clean up started right after the storm..........

Temp power went out almost immediately to every hospital and key medical centers the next day........getting fuel to them being the next major problem............

Your side is lying about the effort there.......

How many helicopters did the Kearsarge and Wasp provide? How many LPH's are in rhe fleet?

google it...........

I was responding to your post that they were not deployed on time..........They were already there.......They were there before and after the storm........IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE STORM..........How is that not deployed on time..........considering every LHD on the East Coast available for rescue was already there......................hmmmm

 

[Erinwltr]

The Puerto Rican government is completely corrupt, and the deaths attributed to the Hurricane? Are now being counted 5 months out in an obvious attempt to attack Trump....is this fair?

The politics of calculating hurricane deaths

Here’s where we run into trouble. Look at the description of the methodology they used. It’s based on “a careful examination of all of the deaths officially reported to the government of Puerto Rico between September 2017 and February 2018… using state-of-the-art mathematical modeling to compare the total number of deaths during that time to the expected number of deaths, based on historical patterns as well as age, sex, socioeconomic status and migration from the island.”

They’re counting deaths which took place five months after the storm had passed.

Pardon my incredulousness over such a serious matter, but when did we start defining hurricane deaths in this fashion? When we think of people dying in a hurricane, we picture those who are washed out to sea, struck by flying debris, trapped under collapsed buildings, drowned in rising storm surge waters or even expiring from exposure while trapped on their roofs awaiting rescue. But at some point the storm is over and the immediate rescue and recovery operations are complete. People no doubt suffer ill effects from a deadly storm for some time to come, but that’s largely a matter of how good the medical and social support services available to them happen to be.

------

This new study of Maria, as indicated above, was looking at the number of people who probably would have died on average in each month following the storm going out to February fo the following year. Then they looked at the number of actual death certificates they could find (no matter what they died of) and any in excess of the projection were attributed to the storm. Five. Months. Later.

I’m not saying that there was or wasn’t any political bias involved in the compilation of the Milken Institute study, but that’s really not the point. The question is whether or not this is actual science. If you’re suggesting that every person who gets sick and dies months after a storm comes through because the infrastructure is inadequate, or medical supplies aren’t available, or because they were bitten by a dog who might have been too hungry because he lost his owners in the storm, are directly attributable to the hurricane, then… please.

Yuck it up. You should be so Proud.

 

[fncceo]

"Can Hurricane deaths 5 months after Hurricane be blamed on Trump?"

Of course they can.

The deaths of American citizens during the storm and subsequently are the consequence of Trump’s incompetence and failure to address the crisis.

And the lie that the Puerto Rican government is ‘corrupt’ fails as a red herring fallacy, just another example of how dishonest and reprehensible Trump supporters are.

Called it ...

 

[Taz]

PR has seen what America can do for it, which is not help at all. So I'd suggest that they declare independence and tell Americans where they can stick their territory.

 

[eagle1462010]

"Can Hurricane deaths 5 months after Hurricane be blamed on Trump?"

Of course they can.

The deaths of American citizens during the storm and subsequently are the consequence of Trump’s incompetence and failure to address the crisis.

And the lie that the Puerto Rican government is ‘corrupt’ fails as a red herring fallacy, just another example of how dishonest and reprehensible Trump supporters are.

I've been dispelling your outright LIES...............like the other poster who said the Navy ships weren't sent on time.....They were already there...........10,000 FEMA and army were ALREADY THERE.

You bunch of dumb asses know what kind of damage 2 Cat 5 Hurricanes can do.......

Then I want you to look at a map and show that they have to travel 1200 miles to get there.

Shall we go into the U.S. Navy assets to Key West.........guess what, they were there also.............

Incompetent........our Military was all over these places at the same time.......providing assistance.....

Where the hell you gonna get the other assets for these storms at the same time while fighting Wars overseas.........Did you expect them to pull them out of their asses..........

Good Grief you people are beyond stupid.

 

[eagle1462010]

 

[eagle1462010]

 

[eagle1462010]

 

[eagle1462010]

 

[gipper]

The Puerto Rican government is completely corrupt, and the deaths attributed to the Hurricane? Are now being counted 5 months out in an obvious attempt to attack Trump....is this fair?

The politics of calculating hurricane deaths

Here’s where we run into trouble. Look at the description of the methodology they used. It’s based on “a careful examination of all of the deaths officially reported to the government of Puerto Rico between September 2017 and February 2018… using state-of-the-art mathematical modeling to compare the total number of deaths during that time to the expected number of deaths, based on historical patterns as well as age, sex, socioeconomic status and migration from the island.”

They’re counting deaths which took place five months after the storm had passed.

Pardon my incredulousness over such a serious matter, but when did we start defining hurricane deaths in this fashion? When we think of people dying in a hurricane, we picture those who are washed out to sea, struck by flying debris, trapped under collapsed buildings, drowned in rising storm surge waters or even expiring from exposure while trapped on their roofs awaiting rescue. But at some point the storm is over and the immediate rescue and recovery operations are complete. People no doubt suffer ill effects from a deadly storm for some time to come, but that’s largely a matter of how good the medical and social support services available to them happen to be.

------

This new study of Maria, as indicated above, was looking at the number of people who probably would have died on average in each month following the storm going out to February fo the following year. Then they looked at the number of actual death certificates they could find (no matter what they died of) and any in excess of the projection were attributed to the storm. Five. Months. Later.

I’m not saying that there was or wasn’t any political bias involved in the compilation of the Milken Institute study, but that’s really not the point. The question is whether or not this is actual science. If you’re suggesting that every person who gets sick and dies months after a storm comes through because the infrastructure is inadequate, or medical supplies aren’t available, or because they were bitten by a dog who might have been too hungry because he lost his owners in the storm, are directly attributable to the hurricane, then… please.

Is Trump president or not?

Fuck, he's taking credit for the economy doing well when he did nothing, now he doesn't want to take the blame for problems that are happening. What a fucking surprise.

Illogical and you contradict yourself in this little post.

Trump is responsible for hurricane deaths during his presidency, but not responsible for the economy during his presidency. LOL.