Conservatives sold themselves two lies

[dblack]

Please, spare me the conservative bullshit.

Don't think anyone would accuse me of being a conservative, but okay.

Well, a lot of people think of authoritarians and conservatives as one in the same. You're living proof of their error.

 

[JoeB131]

I could say "oranges are orange", and my little stalker friend would find a way to complain and attack. I've never been up in someone's head like this before.

You get used to it. No harm, no foul.

Well, you'd say it in a pompous, nonsensical way, like 'Oranges are oranges and THE MUSLIMS ARE OUT TO KILL US ALL AND GIVE OUR WOMEN CLITECTOMIES!"

 

[JoeB131]

Well, a lot of people think of authoritarians and conservatives as one in the same. You're living proof of their error.

No, I'm just not a libertarian child who thinks that civilization is free.

Civilization has a cost. That cost is taxes and obeying the rules.

Totally worth the price of admission.

 

[dblack]

Looking at the threads, it's pretty clear that many of Trump's supporters are throwing up their hands right now. Understandable. Some are blaming Trump, others are blaming the GOP "swamp". Whichever.

Conservatives allowed themselves to believe two lies:

First, that overnight, they could just yank this entire country over to their way of looking at things. Mention "incrementalism" and they'd laugh. They figured things would just go so swimmingly, so quickly, that we'd all just mindlessly fall in line behind them. That's not how it works, guys. You have to prove yourselves. Bit by bit. Over time. You haven't.

Second, that their national priorities are shared by everyone else. Wrong again. You point to the stock market and unemployment as the reasons we should all fall in line. That shows you don't understand that a growing number of people have different priorities. I wonder if you know what they are. You never bring them up. Would any of you like to guess?

We'll know more in eight months. But at some level, you have to know this hasn't been a rousing success so far, and the current trajectory ain't favorable. Outside of blaming someone else, you may want to examine why.
.

So, the same sort of hubris that bit the Dems in the ass?

No. You republicans ...

I'm not a Republican. But my question still stands. And, of course, I'm not waiting for any Democrats to come clean and admit their fuck-ups. But fuck-up they did. They fell for the exact same two lies: "that overnight, they could just yank this entire country over to their way of looking at things", and "that their national priorities are shared by everyone else."

 

[JoeB131]

I'm not a Republican. But my question still stands. And, of course, I'm not waiting for any Democrats to come clean and admit their fuck-ups. But fuck-up they did. They fell for the exact same two lies: "that overnight, they could just yank this entire country over to their way of looking at things", and "that their national priorities are shared by everyone else."

Meh, the thing is, - and I'll explain this again - is that even Conservatives don't want to live in the Social Darwinist Society that Libertarians and Republicans advocate.

They all want that nice liberal social safety net for me, but not for thee.

So you'll have the working class Republican who got laid off again collecting his seasonal Unemployment Check, bitching about them welfare people who get food stamps.

They want their government subsidized health insurance through their employers, but man, if Obama expands medicaid to "Those People", they'll scream about socialism!!!!

 

[Crixus]

Looking at the threads, it's pretty clear that many of Trump's supporters are throwing up their hands right now. Understandable. Some are blaming Trump, others are blaming the GOP "swamp". Whichever.

Conservatives allowed themselves to believe two lies:

First, that overnight, they could just yank this entire country over to their way of looking at things. Mention "incrementalism" and they'd laugh. They figured things would just go so swimmingly, so quickly, that we'd all just mindlessly fall in line behind them. That's not how it works, guys. You have to prove yourselves. Bit by bit. Over time. You haven't.

Second, that their national priorities are shared by everyone else. Wrong again. You point to the stock market and unemployment as the reasons we should all fall in line. That shows you don't understand that a growing number of people have different priorities. I wonder if you know what they are. You never bring them up. Would any of you like to guess?

We'll know more in eight months. But at some level, you have to know this hasn't been a rousing success so far, and the current trajectory ain't favorable. Outside of blaming someone else, you may want to examine why.
.

He had them at “deport Mexicans” and “big beautiful wall”. Gotta remember, not everyone who voted for Trump wanted Trump. But even today, a trump supporter (most) will tell you that Trump is okay granting amnesty to 1.3 million illegals and their families BEFORE negotiations even begin. They are okay with Obamacare not being repealed, and my favorite, that the signing of this omnibus is a clever ploy for Trump to get wall money and put the Democrats in a corner in October. In the end, Trump is just a politition.

 

[jillian]

Looking at the threads, it's pretty clear that many of Trump's supporters are throwing up their hands right now. Understandable. Some are blaming Trump, others are blaming the GOP "swamp". Whichever.

Conservatives allowed themselves to believe two lies:

First, that overnight, they could just yank this entire country over to their way of looking at things. Mention "incrementalism" and they'd laugh. They figured things would just go so swimmingly, so quickly, that we'd all just mindlessly fall in line behind them. That's not how it works, guys. You have to prove yourselves. Bit by bit. Over time. You haven't.

Second, that their national priorities are shared by everyone else. Wrong again. You point to the stock market and unemployment as the reasons we should all fall in line. That shows you don't understand that a growing number of people have different priorities. I wonder if you know what they are. You never bring them up. Would any of you like to guess?

We'll know more in eight months. But at some level, you have to know this hasn't been a rousing success so far, and the current trajectory ain't favorable. Outside of blaming someone else, you may want to examine why.
.

trump people aren't conservatives. and many of them, as you've seen, have only one priority and that is, how do they keep saying it to me?? oh yeah., "making 'libtards' cry".

THAT is why things are a mess for them.

and left of center people might have gone along with a lot of what they want. but they don't want to work with anyone to the left of atilla the hun. if something is offensive to anyone who is not extreme rightwing, they intentionally push it harder.

when you elect an internet troll for president simply BECAUSE he is an internet troll who says nasty things about the opposition, and don't care that he is wholly and completely ill-equipped for the job, this is what you get.

 

[Oldstyle]

If I were a black person living in the United States...

...but you're not. And you're assuming that you're making those judgements on the same sets of facts and upbringing and life experiences, but you're not.

And on top of everything else, you have a guy in the White House who is supported by white "supremacists" and white nationalists from coast to coast, a guy who pretended not to know who David Duke is. And you expect them to bring down their defenses and open their minds? Really?

Again, this is an example of my point #2 in the OP: You don't understand their priorities. They think you don't want them here. That overrides any claims, or opinions, or unemployment rate, or stock market level. That cuts to the very core of their existence here. I can't make it more clear than that.
.

You really think Donald Trump is a racist? That he supports white supremacists? That's a load of crap and I think you know it! So why even bring it up?

If blacks think that I don't "want them here"...then they're idiots. I'm no more of a racist than Donald Trump is! Not only do I want them here...I want them to prosper. So tell me who is the REAL racists are...me...or the people who have kept large segments of an entire race of people dependent on government handouts?

You keep talking about how blacks don't like the GOP because they "feel" unwanted by them! Do you think it might be time for them to start asking themselves if those "feelings" are based on facts or based on a narrative pushed by liberals that have used the black vote to stay in power since the days of LBJ without really helping the black community at all? Trump is telling blacks he doesn't care about skin color. He wants them to succeed. Liberals have been telling blacks that conservatives hate them for sixty years now but that they love them and the proof of that is that they're going to give them free stuff. So who's REALLY helped the black community and who's hurt it? Be honest about it for once...

 

[Oldstyle]

I'm not quite sure what it is you think the GOP should be doing that they're not? Promise minorities more freebies and then not deliver? Become another variation of the same theme Democrats are using? How does that "work" to make the Party better?

I don't know. But if you don't need them, and that's definitely what they think, then you don't have to worry.
.

It's not that we need THEM, Mac...it's that the other guys haven't done right by them which means it might be time to look elsewhere! If I were a black person living in the United States...I'd be taking a long hard look at who's promised me a lot in exchange for my vote and what they've delivered on those promises. Especially once the Hispanic voting block becomes so large that the black voting block becomes an afterthought for Democrats!

Well I am black and we've been promised no more by the democrats than whites have been promised by republicans. And we would be stupid to join the republican party knowing they don't give a damn but only wants black votes. So if we are going to change a party, we sure don't run from the one who nominated and worked to get the first black president elected twice to the party where the president is endorsed by the KKK. We've taken the long hard look. And it is comments such as yours that are the prevailing sentiment of the republican party, that tells us to stay away.

You find a comment that I've made something to make blacks run from the GOP? Really? What comment would that be? That government dependency has hurt the black community more than it's helped it? That Democrats have used your votes for decades to win seats in government which they used to enrich themselves while your income levels lagged far behind the rest of the country? That the Hispanic voting block is going to become more and more a focus of Democrats and that they will care less and less about your needs going forward? What is it that I've pointed out that isn't true or should in any way be offensive to a black person? I get the feeling you don't want to deal with reality...you want to deal with "feelings" like Mac!

 

[Mac1958]

If I were a black person living in the United States...

...but you're not. And you're assuming that you're making those judgements on the same sets of facts and upbringing and life experiences, but you're not.

And on top of everything else, you have a guy in the White House who is supported by white "supremacists" and white nationalists from coast to coast, a guy who pretended not to know who David Duke is. And you expect them to bring down their defenses and open their minds? Really?

Again, this is an example of my point #2 in the OP: You don't understand their priorities. They think you don't want them here. That overrides any claims, or opinions, or unemployment rate, or stock market level. That cuts to the very core of their existence here. I can't make it more clear than that.
.

You really think Donald Trump is a racist? That he supports white supremacists? That's a load of crap and I think you know it! So why even bring it up?

If blacks think that I don't "want them here"...then they're idiots. I'm no more of a racist than Donald Trump is! Not only do I want them here...I want them to prosper. So tell me who is the REAL racists are...me...or the people who have kept large segments of an entire race of people dependent on government handouts?

You keep talking about how blacks don't like the GOP because they "feel" unwanted by them! Do you think it might be time for them to start asking themselves if those "feelings" are based on facts or based on a narrative pushed by liberals that have used the black vote to stay in power since the days of LBJ without really helping the black community at all? Trump is telling blacks he doesn't care about skin color. He wants them to succeed. Liberals have been telling blacks that conservatives hate them for sixty years now but that they love them and the proof of that is that they're going to give them free stuff. So who's REALLY helped the black community and who's hurt it? Be honest about it for once...

That's the perception. I've said this many times now, and I don't know how else to say it.

You can argue about their perceptions, which won't work, or you can do something to change them.

I don't know what else to tell you.
.

 

[Oldstyle]

If I were a black person living in the United States...

...but you're not. And you're assuming that you're making those judgements on the same sets of facts and upbringing and life experiences, but you're not.

And on top of everything else, you have a guy in the White House who is supported by white "supremacists" and white nationalists from coast to coast, a guy who pretended not to know who David Duke is. And you expect them to bring down their defenses and open their minds? Really?

Again, this is an example of my point #2 in the OP: You don't understand their priorities. They think you don't want them here. That overrides any claims, or opinions, or unemployment rate, or stock market level. That cuts to the very core of their existence here. I can't make it more clear than that.
.

You really think Donald Trump is a racist? That he supports white supremacists? That's a load of crap and I think you know it! So why even bring it up?

If blacks think that I don't "want them here"...then they're idiots. I'm no more of a racist than Donald Trump is! Not only do I want them here...I want them to prosper. So tell me who is the REAL racists are...me...or the people who have kept large segments of an entire race of people dependent on government handouts?

You keep talking about how blacks don't like the GOP because they "feel" unwanted by them! Do you think it might be time for them to start asking themselves if those "feelings" are based on facts or based on a narrative pushed by liberals that have used the black vote to stay in power since the days of LBJ without really helping the black community at all? Trump is telling blacks he doesn't care about skin color. He wants them to succeed. Liberals have been telling blacks that conservatives hate them for sixty years now but that they love them and the proof of that is that they're going to give them free stuff. So who's REALLY helped the black community and who's hurt it? Be honest about it for once...

That's the perception. I've said this many times now, and I don't know how else to say it.

You can argue about their perceptions, which won't work, or you can do something to change them.

I don't know what else to tell you.
.

What they choose to do is totally up to them. At some point I think that they are going to come to same conclusions as I've already come to...that liberals haven't helped them and that liberal policies have actually hurt the black community. So then they can go one of two ways...either change the Democratic Party or take their vote elsewhere.

 

[Correll]

We don't have that kind of time. The Left's use of Third World immigration to turn the US into a defacto, One Party, Third World shit hole is barreling at US like a freight train on crack. We have to radically change people's perceptions with results, NOW, or we will be shut out of every having a chance to try again.

I know that's the philosophy - "this can ONLY be done NOW, right NOW" - but the Left could have said the same thing back in the 80's. Instead, they remained consistent and patient and ingrained their message into our very CULTURE.

If there's one thing the GOP can do - and frankly, I think it's too late at this point - it is to stop ignoring (and even mocking) the massive upcoming demographic shift and embrace it.

I know, the GOP doesn't want to play the Identity Politics game, and I sure as hell can't blame you. But if you don't come up with a way to attract minorities, then just punt. And as I mentioned in the OP, this ain't about the unemployment rate or the stock market. This is much DEEPER than that. This is PERSONAL. The GOP has to figure THAT out, TOO.
.

But the GOP has been playing the identity politics game. Since at least 1964.

The GOP voted for that civil rights bill. YOu knew that right?

 

[Mac1958]

If I were a black person living in the United States...

...but you're not. And you're assuming that you're making those judgements on the same sets of facts and upbringing and life experiences, but you're not.

And on top of everything else, you have a guy in the White House who is supported by white "supremacists" and white nationalists from coast to coast, a guy who pretended not to know who David Duke is. And you expect them to bring down their defenses and open their minds? Really?

Again, this is an example of my point #2 in the OP: You don't understand their priorities. They think you don't want them here. That overrides any claims, or opinions, or unemployment rate, or stock market level. That cuts to the very core of their existence here. I can't make it more clear than that.
.

You really think Donald Trump is a racist? That he supports white supremacists? That's a load of crap and I think you know it! So why even bring it up?

If blacks think that I don't "want them here"...then they're idiots. I'm no more of a racist than Donald Trump is! Not only do I want them here...I want them to prosper. So tell me who is the REAL racists are...me...or the people who have kept large segments of an entire race of people dependent on government handouts?

You keep talking about how blacks don't like the GOP because they "feel" unwanted by them! Do you think it might be time for them to start asking themselves if those "feelings" are based on facts or based on a narrative pushed by liberals that have used the black vote to stay in power since the days of LBJ without really helping the black community at all? Trump is telling blacks he doesn't care about skin color. He wants them to succeed. Liberals have been telling blacks that conservatives hate them for sixty years now but that they love them and the proof of that is that they're going to give them free stuff. So who's REALLY helped the black community and who's hurt it? Be honest about it for once...

That's the perception. I've said this many times now, and I don't know how else to say it.

You can argue about their perceptions, which won't work, or you can do something to change them.

I don't know what else to tell you.
.

What they choose to do is totally up to them. At some point I think that they are going to come to same conclusions as I've already come to...that liberals haven't helped them and that liberal policies have actually hurt the black community. So then they can go one of two ways...either change the Democratic Party or take their vote elsewhere.

Yes, that appears to be the GOP approach, so we agree.
.

 

[edward37]

maybe ,just maybe black folk don't care much for republican support for cops killing unarmed blacks?

 

[Correll]

If I were a black person living in the United States...

...but you're not. And you're assuming that you're making those judgements on the same sets of facts and upbringing and life experiences, but you're not.

And on top of everything else, you have a guy in the White House who is supported by white "supremacists" and white nationalists from coast to coast, a guy who pretended not to know who David Duke is. And you expect them to bring down their defenses and open their minds? Really?

Again, this is an example of my point #2 in the OP: You don't understand their priorities. They think you don't want them here. That overrides any claims, or opinions, or unemployment rate, or stock market level. That cuts to the very core of their existence here. I can't make it more clear than that.
.

You really think Donald Trump is a racist? That he supports white supremacists? That's a load of crap and I think you know it! So why even bring it up?

If blacks think that I don't "want them here"...then they're idiots. I'm no more of a racist than Donald Trump is! Not only do I want them here...I want them to prosper. So tell me who is the REAL racists are...me...or the people who have kept large segments of an entire race of people dependent on government handouts?

You keep talking about how blacks don't like the GOP because they "feel" unwanted by them! Do you think it might be time for them to start asking themselves if those "feelings" are based on facts or based on a narrative pushed by liberals that have used the black vote to stay in power since the days of LBJ without really helping the black community at all? Trump is telling blacks he doesn't care about skin color. He wants them to succeed. Liberals have been telling blacks that conservatives hate them for sixty years now but that they love them and the proof of that is that they're going to give them free stuff. So who's REALLY helped the black community and who's hurt it? Be honest about it for once...

That's the perception. I've said this many times now, and I don't know how else to say it.

You can argue about their perceptions, which won't work, or you can do something to change them.

I don't know what else to tell you.
.

If someone chooses to believe all the lies about you, you can't do stop them.

 

[Correll]

maybe ,just maybe black folk don't care much for republican support for cops killing unarmed blacks?

IF by that, you mean we don't believe ever bullshit accusation that gets made, then possibly.


Remember "Hand's up don't shoot"?


Total lie. Didn't happen.

 

[Oldstyle]

If I were a black person living in the United States...

...but you're not. And you're assuming that you're making those judgements on the same sets of facts and upbringing and life experiences, but you're not.

And on top of everything else, you have a guy in the White House who is supported by white "supremacists" and white nationalists from coast to coast, a guy who pretended not to know who David Duke is. And you expect them to bring down their defenses and open their minds? Really?

Again, this is an example of my point #2 in the OP: You don't understand their priorities. They think you don't want them here. That overrides any claims, or opinions, or unemployment rate, or stock market level. That cuts to the very core of their existence here. I can't make it more clear than that.
.

You really think Donald Trump is a racist? That he supports white supremacists? That's a load of crap and I think you know it! So why even bring it up?

If blacks think that I don't "want them here"...then they're idiots. I'm no more of a racist than Donald Trump is! Not only do I want them here...I want them to prosper. So tell me who is the REAL racists are...me...or the people who have kept large segments of an entire race of people dependent on government handouts?

You keep talking about how blacks don't like the GOP because they "feel" unwanted by them! Do you think it might be time for them to start asking themselves if those "feelings" are based on facts or based on a narrative pushed by liberals that have used the black vote to stay in power since the days of LBJ without really helping the black community at all? Trump is telling blacks he doesn't care about skin color. He wants them to succeed. Liberals have been telling blacks that conservatives hate them for sixty years now but that they love them and the proof of that is that they're going to give them free stuff. So who's REALLY helped the black community and who's hurt it? Be honest about it for once...

That's the perception. I've said this many times now, and I don't know how else to say it.

You can argue about their perceptions, which won't work, or you can do something to change them.

I don't know what else to tell you.
.

What they choose to do is totally up to them. At some point I think that they are going to come to same conclusions as I've already come to...that liberals haven't helped them and that liberal policies have actually hurt the black community. So then they can go one of two ways...either change the Democratic Party or take their vote elsewhere.

Yes, that appears to be the GOP approach, so we agree.
.

So the question then becomes...when is the Main Stream Media going to admit that liberal policies have NOT helped the black community but in many ways have harmed them and that it might be time for a complete "rethink" on what we're trying to do?

 

[edward37]

If I were a black person living in the United States...

...but you're not. And you're assuming that you're making those judgements on the same sets of facts and upbringing and life experiences, but you're not.

And on top of everything else, you have a guy in the White House who is supported by white "supremacists" and white nationalists from coast to coast, a guy who pretended not to know who David Duke is. And you expect them to bring down their defenses and open their minds? Really?

Again, this is an example of my point #2 in the OP: You don't understand their priorities. They think you don't want them here. That overrides any claims, or opinions, or unemployment rate, or stock market level. That cuts to the very core of their existence here. I can't make it more clear than that.
.

You really think Donald Trump is a racist? That he supports white supremacists? That's a load of crap and I think you know it! So why even bring it up?

If blacks think that I don't "want them here"...then they're idiots. I'm no more of a racist than Donald Trump is! Not only do I want them here...I want them to prosper. So tell me who is the REAL racists are...me...or the people who have kept large segments of an entire race of people dependent on government handouts?

You keep talking about how blacks don't like the GOP because they "feel" unwanted by them! Do you think it might be time for them to start asking themselves if those "feelings" are based on facts or based on a narrative pushed by liberals that have used the black vote to stay in power since the days of LBJ without really helping the black community at all? Trump is telling blacks he doesn't care about skin color. He wants them to succeed. Liberals have been telling blacks that conservatives hate them for sixty years now but that they love them and the proof of that is that they're going to give them free stuff. So who's REALLY helped the black community and who's hurt it? Be honest about it for once...

That's the perception. I've said this many times now, and I don't know how else to say it.

You can argue about their perceptions, which won't work, or you can do something to change them.

I don't know what else to tell you.
.

If someone chooses to believe all the lies about you, you can't do stop them.

isn't that how Trump won the presidency?? Lied about Hillary and all his republican opponents?

 

[Mac1958]

...but you're not. And you're assuming that you're making those judgements on the same sets of facts and upbringing and life experiences, but you're not.

And on top of everything else, you have a guy in the White House who is supported by white "supremacists" and white nationalists from coast to coast, a guy who pretended not to know who David Duke is. And you expect them to bring down their defenses and open their minds? Really?

Again, this is an example of my point #2 in the OP: You don't understand their priorities. They think you don't want them here. That overrides any claims, or opinions, or unemployment rate, or stock market level. That cuts to the very core of their existence here. I can't make it more clear than that.
.

You really think Donald Trump is a racist? That he supports white supremacists? That's a load of crap and I think you know it! So why even bring it up?

If blacks think that I don't "want them here"...then they're idiots. I'm no more of a racist than Donald Trump is! Not only do I want them here...I want them to prosper. So tell me who is the REAL racists are...me...or the people who have kept large segments of an entire race of people dependent on government handouts?

You keep talking about how blacks don't like the GOP because they "feel" unwanted by them! Do you think it might be time for them to start asking themselves if those "feelings" are based on facts or based on a narrative pushed by liberals that have used the black vote to stay in power since the days of LBJ without really helping the black community at all? Trump is telling blacks he doesn't care about skin color. He wants them to succeed. Liberals have been telling blacks that conservatives hate them for sixty years now but that they love them and the proof of that is that they're going to give them free stuff. So who's REALLY helped the black community and who's hurt it? Be honest about it for once...

That's the perception. I've said this many times now, and I don't know how else to say it.

You can argue about their perceptions, which won't work, or you can do something to change them.

I don't know what else to tell you.
.

What they choose to do is totally up to them. At some point I think that they are going to come to same conclusions as I've already come to...that liberals haven't helped them and that liberal policies have actually hurt the black community. So then they can go one of two ways...either change the Democratic Party or take their vote elsewhere.

Yes, that appears to be the GOP approach, so we agree.
.

So the question then becomes...when is the Main Stream Media going to admit that liberal policies have NOT helped the black community but in many ways have harmed them and that it might be time for a complete "rethink" on what we're trying to do?

I can't imagine them ever doing that. They're biased to the Left and won't shoot themselves in the foot like that.
.

 

[Mac1958]

If I were a black person living in the United States...

...but you're not. And you're assuming that you're making those judgements on the same sets of facts and upbringing and life experiences, but you're not.

And on top of everything else, you have a guy in the White House who is supported by white "supremacists" and white nationalists from coast to coast, a guy who pretended not to know who David Duke is. And you expect them to bring down their defenses and open their minds? Really?

Again, this is an example of my point #2 in the OP: You don't understand their priorities. They think you don't want them here. That overrides any claims, or opinions, or unemployment rate, or stock market level. That cuts to the very core of their existence here. I can't make it more clear than that.
.

You really think Donald Trump is a racist? That he supports white supremacists? That's a load of crap and I think you know it! So why even bring it up?

If blacks think that I don't "want them here"...then they're idiots. I'm no more of a racist than Donald Trump is! Not only do I want them here...I want them to prosper. So tell me who is the REAL racists are...me...or the people who have kept large segments of an entire race of people dependent on government handouts?

You keep talking about how blacks don't like the GOP because they "feel" unwanted by them! Do you think it might be time for them to start asking themselves if those "feelings" are based on facts or based on a narrative pushed by liberals that have used the black vote to stay in power since the days of LBJ without really helping the black community at all? Trump is telling blacks he doesn't care about skin color. He wants them to succeed. Liberals have been telling blacks that conservatives hate them for sixty years now but that they love them and the proof of that is that they're going to give them free stuff. So who's REALLY helped the black community and who's hurt it? Be honest about it for once...

That's the perception. I've said this many times now, and I don't know how else to say it.

You can argue about their perceptions, which won't work, or you can do something to change them.

I don't know what else to tell you.
.

If someone chooses to believe all the lies about you, you can't do stop them.

True, but it doesn't help when they see a GOP nominee pretending not to know who David Duke is, or when they see white nationalists supporting him.

Those are facts. And for people who are already sensitized to this, those are LOUD facts.
.