Creationists

[ima]

So why can't evolution be part of god's plan?

It is true we have seen variations within a family that is it and there is simple asnwer for this to which I have answered. Many creatures have gone extinct does not mean they were organisms that evolved it just shows they once existed. By your own theory these so call tranitional fossils why did they go extinct if by your theory they were better adapted ?

This question has gone with no explanation from your side.

Because the theory goes against what the bible teaches. If this process of evolution was used by God I think he would provided some type of explanation of the process in the bible. Why do you guys throw this question out there when you're totally against the thought of design ? That has been what has been demonstrated throughout this thread.

So basically, because the bible doesn't say so. But the earth is round, and the bible doesn't say it is?
A lot of creatures went extinct because of nature changing or something like an asteroid... The most well adapted are still alive. Look, a baby starts out small and unable to talk and it evolves into a talking, thinking adult. Or, I used to eat meat, but my thinking evolved to a healthier lifestyle and I'll probably live longer than my siblings.

Btw, the bible isn't the word of god, it's the words of men.

 

[Youwerecreated]

So why can't evolution be part of god's plan?

It is true we have seen variations within a family that is it and there is simple asnwer for this to which I have answered. Many creatures have gone extinct does not mean they were organisms that evolved it just shows they once existed. By your own theory these so call tranitional fossils why did they go extinct if by your theory they were better adapted ?

This question has gone with no explanation from your side.

Because the theory goes against what the bible teaches. If this process of evolution was used by God I think he would provided some type of explanation of the process in the bible. Why do you guys throw this question out there when you're totally against the thought of design ? That has been what has been demonstrated throughout this thread.

Your comments depict a typical lack of knowledge regarding the science of evolution or more likely, a willful misrepresentation of what you choose to misrepresent.

Your comments are in concert with what is barfed out of creationist ministries. Such allegiance to lies and falsehoods calls into question your personal credibility.

I asked you for an example of your accusation.

 

[Hollie]

My scientific arguments are not faith based they are fact based.

Lordy man, but you are confused. Metaphysics, magic and superstition are not science. Have you noticed that these terms are even spelled differently? That's because they're different... which is why they're spelled differently. Do you been additional tutoring on this?

You're spending too much time at Harun Yahya.

I am no Lord. You're completely ignorant on the subject of science please stop pretending you're not. You keep throwing this term around Metaphysics,please show where I am doing this ?

Are you not a lord of Harun Yahya? Maybe just a "minister of misinformation". With practice, you may soon be promoted to "Cardinal of Crackpots".

I can appreciate that you recoil when your sacred cows of creationist dogma are refuted by science fact but supermagicalism is hardly something that will cause you to be taken seriously.

 

[Hollie]

It is true we have seen variations within a family that is it and there is simple asnwer for this to which I have answered. Many creatures have gone extinct does not mean they were organisms that evolved it just shows they once existed. By your own theory these so call tranitional fossils why did they go extinct if by your theory they were better adapted ?

This question has gone with no explanation from your side.

Because the theory goes against what the bible teaches. If this process of evolution was used by God I think he would provided some type of explanation of the process in the bible. Why do you guys throw this question out there when you're totally against the thought of design ? That has been what has been demonstrated throughout this thread.

Your comments depict a typical lack of knowledge regarding the science of evolution or more likely, a willful misrepresentation of what you choose to misrepresent.

Your comments are in concert with what is barfed out of creationist ministries. Such allegiance to lies and falsehoods calls into question your personal credibility.

I asked you for an example of your accusation.

Previously supplied.

 

[Youwerecreated]

So why can't evolution be part of god's plan?

It is true we have seen variations within a family that is it and there is simple asnwer for this to which I have answered. Many creatures have gone extinct does not mean they were organisms that evolved it just shows they once existed. By your own theory these so call tranitional fossils why did they go extinct if by your theory they were better adapted ?

This question has gone with no explanation from your side.

Because the theory goes against what the bible teaches. If this process of evolution was used by God I think he would provided some type of explanation of the process in the bible. Why do you guys throw this question out there when you're totally against the thought of design ? That has been what has been demonstrated throughout this thread.

So basically, because the bible doesn't say so. But the earth is round, and the bible doesn't say it is?
A lot of creatures went extinct because of nature changing or something like an asteroid... The most well adapted are still alive. Look, a baby starts out small and unable to talk and it evolves into a talking, thinking adult. Or, I used to eat meat, but my thinking evolved to a healthier lifestyle and I'll probably live longer than my siblings.

Btw, the bible isn't the word of god, it's the words of men.

You are wrong the earth was described as a circle in the bible. That is only theory that dinosaurs went extinct from a giant meteor. That is not evolution a child forming in the womb and becoming an intelligent thinking adult. That is a natural process that was put into motion and that person runs it's course. If anything it would be devolution because the person reaches a certain point then they eventually wear out and die.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Lordy man, but you are confused. Metaphysics, magic and superstition are not science. Have you noticed that these terms are even spelled differently? That's because they're different... which is why they're spelled differently. Do you been additional tutoring on this?

You're spending too much time at Harun Yahya.

I am no Lord. You're completely ignorant on the subject of science please stop pretending you're not. You keep throwing this term around Metaphysics,please show where I am doing this ?

Are you not a lord of Harun Yahya? Maybe just a "minister of misinformation". With practice, you may soon be promoted to "Cardinal of Crackpots".

I can appreciate that you recoil when your sacred cows of creationist dogma are refuted by science fact but supermagicalism is hardly something that will cause you to be taken seriously.

Until you're adult enough to have an adult discussion I will ignore your rhetorical posts.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Your comments depict a typical lack of knowledge regarding the science of evolution or more likely, a willful misrepresentation of what you choose to misrepresent.

Your comments are in concert with what is barfed out of creationist ministries. Such allegiance to lies and falsehoods calls into question your personal credibility.

I asked you for an example of your accusation.

Previously supplied.

You making a claim is not giving an example to back your claim.

 

[Hollie]

It is true we have seen variations within a family that is it and there is simple asnwer for this to which I have answered. Many creatures have gone extinct does not mean they were organisms that evolved it just shows they once existed. By your own theory these so call tranitional fossils why did they go extinct if by your theory they were better adapted ?

This question has gone with no explanation from your side.

Because the theory goes against what the bible teaches. If this process of evolution was used by God I think he would provided some type of explanation of the process in the bible. Why do you guys throw this question out there when you're totally against the thought of design ? That has been what has been demonstrated throughout this thread.

So basically, because the bible doesn't say so. But the earth is round, and the bible doesn't say it is?
A lot of creatures went extinct because of nature changing or something like an asteroid... The most well adapted are still alive. Look, a baby starts out small and unable to talk and it evolves into a talking, thinking adult. Or, I used to eat meat, but my thinking evolved to a healthier lifestyle and I'll probably live longer than my siblings.

Btw, the bible isn't the word of god, it's the words of men.

You are wrong the earth was described as a circle in the bible. That is only theory that dinosaurs went extinct from a giant meteor. That is not evolution a child forming in the womb and becoming an intelligent thinking adult. That is a natural process that was put into motion and that person runs it's course. If anything it would be devolution because the person reaches a certain point then they eventually wear out and die.

Dinosaurs could not have faced extinction in the distant past. Ken Ham's creation museum depicts children in buckskin outfits frollicking with those dinosaurs. It really calls into question all of science. Thank the gawds for Ken Ham.

And what about all those dinosaurs on the Ark?

 

[Youwerecreated]

So basically, because the bible doesn't say so. But the earth is round, and the bible doesn't say it is?
A lot of creatures went extinct because of nature changing or something like an asteroid... The most well adapted are still alive. Look, a baby starts out small and unable to talk and it evolves into a talking, thinking adult. Or, I used to eat meat, but my thinking evolved to a healthier lifestyle and I'll probably live longer than my siblings.

Btw, the bible isn't the word of god, it's the words of men.

You are wrong the earth was described as a circle in the bible. That is only theory that dinosaurs went extinct from a giant meteor. That is not evolution a child forming in the womb and becoming an intelligent thinking adult. That is a natural process that was put into motion and that person runs it's course. If anything it would be devolution because the person reaches a certain point then they eventually wear out and die.

Dinosaurs could not have faced extinction in the distant past. Ken Ham's creation museum depicts children in buckskin outfits frollicking with those dinosaurs. It really calls into question all of science. Thank the gawds for Ken Ham.

And what about all those dinosaurs on the Ark?

Does ken ham represent and speak for all who believe in a creator ?

 

[Hollie]

I asked you for an example of your accusation.

Previously supplied.

You making a claim is not giving an example to back your claim.

That would apply to the entirety of the Christian creationist agenda.

 

[Hollie]

You are wrong the earth was described as a circle in the bible. That is only theory that dinosaurs went extinct from a giant meteor. That is not evolution a child forming in the womb and becoming an intelligent thinking adult. That is a natural process that was put into motion and that person runs it's course. If anything it would be devolution because the person reaches a certain point then they eventually wear out and die.

Dinosaurs could not have faced extinction in the distant past. Ken Ham's creation museum depicts children in buckskin outfits frollicking with those dinosaurs. It really calls into question all of science. Thank the gawds for Ken Ham.

And what about all those dinosaurs on the Ark?

Does ken ham represent and speak for all who believe in a creator ?

Of course not. Similarly, your cutting and pasting from Harun Yahya would not suggest you represent all who believe in the Allah gawd.

There are many differing and competing versions of creators / gawds/ supreme beings, etc.. Most of them being reconstructions and refinements of earlier creators. Consider the Romans, for example. They actually assumed that the gawds of other cultures were true. Certainly, they found the earlier Egyptian gods to be a bit… um… strange, but they still considered them powerful and extant. In a truly spectacular acknowledgement of their own lack of knowledge regarding the gawds, the Romans also worshiped "the unknown god." Think of this as essentially praying to, "to whom it may concern" with the explicit understanding that nobody had exclusive or full knowledge of the real nature of THE gawd or gawds... sort of the "gawds to be announced at a later date", or… "gawds to suit any occasion", so to speak. This idea was borrowed from the earlier Greeks. The Greeks even built a temple in Athens to this: Agnostos Theos.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Dinosaurs could not have faced extinction in the distant past. Ken Ham's creation museum depicts children in buckskin outfits frollicking with those dinosaurs. It really calls into question all of science. Thank the gawds for Ken Ham.

And what about all those dinosaurs on the Ark?

Does ken ham represent and speak for all who believe in a creator ?

Of course not. Similarly, your cutting and pasting from Harun Yahya would not suggest you represent all who believe in the Allah gawd.

There are many differing and competing versions of creators / gawds/ supreme beings, etc.. Most of them being reconstructions and refinements of earlier creators. Consider the Romans, for example. They actually assumed that the gawds of other cultures were true. Certainly, they found the earlier Egyptian gods to be a bit… um… strange, but they still considered them powerful and extant. In a truly spectacular acknowledgement of their own lack of knowledge regarding the gawds, the Romans also worshiped "the unknown god." Think of this as essentially praying to, "to whom it may concern" with the explicit understanding that nobody had exclusive or full knowledge of the real nature of THE gawd or gawds... sort of the "gawds to be announced at a later date", or… "gawds to suit any occasion", so to speak. This idea was borrowed from the earlier Greeks. The Greeks even built a temple in Athens to this: Agnostos Theos.

Your problem is that creationist and ID'ers raise legitimate questions to the explanations and assumptions of evolutionist where you dismiss them because they are believers and ignore the legitimate questions they raise. You believe it is just agenda by them and not real science is why the questions are raised.

The two questions that truly separate both sides are,where did the universe come from ? how did life begin ?

Your side claims there is no evidence of God but I say the evidence can be seen in nature but you ignore the fact that your side have no evidence supporting your beliefs.

 

[Hollie]

I am no Lord. You're completely ignorant on the subject of science please stop pretending you're not. You keep throwing this term around Metaphysics,please show where I am doing this ?

Are you not a lord of Harun Yahya? Maybe just a "minister of misinformation". With practice, you may soon be promoted to "Cardinal of Crackpots".

I can appreciate that you recoil when your sacred cows of creationist dogma are refuted by science fact but supermagicalism is hardly something that will cause you to be taken seriously.

Until you're adult enough to have an adult discussion I will ignore your rhetorical posts.

Yep. Hit'em with the truth and fundies run for the exits.

 

[ima]

It is true we have seen variations within a family that is it and there is simple asnwer for this to which I have answered. Many creatures have gone extinct does not mean they were organisms that evolved it just shows they once existed. By your own theory these so call tranitional fossils why did they go extinct if by your theory they were better adapted ?

This question has gone with no explanation from your side.

Because the theory goes against what the bible teaches. If this process of evolution was used by God I think he would provided some type of explanation of the process in the bible. Why do you guys throw this question out there when you're totally against the thought of design ? That has been what has been demonstrated throughout this thread.

So basically, because the bible doesn't say so. But the earth is round, and the bible doesn't say it is?
A lot of creatures went extinct because of nature changing or something like an asteroid... The most well adapted are still alive. Look, a baby starts out small and unable to talk and it evolves into a talking, thinking adult. Or, I used to eat meat, but my thinking evolved to a healthier lifestyle and I'll probably live longer than my siblings.

Btw, the bible isn't the word of god, it's the words of men.

You are wrong the earth was described as a circle in the bible. That is only theory that dinosaurs went extinct from a giant meteor. That is not evolution a child forming in the womb and becoming an intelligent thinking adult. That is a natural process that was put into motion and that person runs it's course. If anything it would be devolution because the person reaches a certain point then they eventually wear out and die.

Then why did the church torture people who claimed it was round and not the center of the universe?
So my thinking evolved to a healthier lifestyle by learning about and becoming a vegetarian?
C'mon, then how did the dinosaurs all die off around the same time? God? Anyways, lots of animals die from changing weather over time.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Do any of you evolutionist idiots believe that humans have a soul?

Do all crceatures have souls?

Where did the soul originate?

What happenes to it when you die?


Four easy simple questions. But I bet I don't get any intelligent responses. I wonder how many cut and paste jobs will respond. Hmmmm......

Gee whiz. Another angry fundie rattling on about metaphysics absent any understanding of what he's rattling in about.

Your explanation of the concept of a "soul" is insufficient. It's only sufficient for those who have already decided there must be a "soul". You believe it's okay to assume as decided, the issue of some sort of continuation of the consciousness after death.

I have no explanation for "spirits" or the "soul" because the soul remains undemonstrated. I have no properties and characteristics for that which does not exist. I do have a comment about personality, and where that comes from. The sense of self is a higher brain function and it's seen in comparably lesser degrees in lesser animals (i.e., humans are not the only creatures with a sense of "self"). This in and of itself is enough to prove that "selfhood" is a natural phenomenon of higher brain functions. Either that, or your gawds have made monkeys and men with a soul each, and that means humans are the 'e'special creation of the gawds. Language, nurturing, survival, industry, and even environmental control all can be attributed to animals lesser on the sentience strat than man, which is a great case for man being of and a part of the natural world-- no gawds needed.

Personality is a phenomenon of the brain. Remove sections of the brain and the "self" changes as well. Apparently your eternal soul is at the mercy of a few pounds of grey jelly, because the soul cannot override the impact to the brain and the change in personality that attends that impact. The soul must be fairly weak.

This is a perfectly valid explanation for emotions, and it doesn't require the mumbo-jumbo of gods to explain it.

Non-material concepts are not fully non-material. You need a brain to substantiate them. Damage or impact to the brain directly affects the development and delivery of the concepts. You are simply assuming a spiritual nature for these things, and not submitting any case to support it. I am submitting they are the effects of the brain along with neurons and chemicals within the brain, and I can demonstrate how they can be manipulated by physical impact.

By way of example, I can

1. End all thought by killing that brain

2. create an emotion by chemical inducement of that brain

3. limit the thought and emotion of the brain by removing sections of it.

All the poetry about feelings and spirit and so on -- reside only in the brain. Remove it, and away it all goes. All of it. Even belief in gods.

Now you demonstrate the spiritual source, which you assert is the actual reason emotions exist and disassemble my case, please.

The only angry person I see is you . I asked some simple questions.

I didn't offer any explanations.

So in short. You don't think humans have souls.

No one ask you about personalities.

But since you brought it up.

You should get one.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Do any of you evolutionist idiots believe that humans have a soul?

Do all crceatures have souls?

Where did the soul originate?

What happenes to it when you die?


Four easy simple questions. But I bet I don't get any intelligent responses. I wonder how many cut and paste jobs will respond. Hmmmm......

1.first you must describe what a soul is .

2. no one knows where or if a "soul" originated anywhere.
your belife that a god made and gave them to "Us" is no proof .
3. no one knows that either .
if by soul you mean sentience, then most all life has one.

I didn't ask for proof of a soul. I asked what you believed.

Damn you people sure have a hard time comprehending simple questions.

Here's Webster's definitions.

1 : the immaterial essence, animating principle, or actuating cause of an individual life
2 a: the spiritual principle embodied in human beings, all rational and spiritual beings, or the universe
b capitalized Christian Science : god 1b
3: a person's total self
4a : an active or essential part b : a moving spirit : leader
5a : the moral and emotional nature of human beings b : the quality that arouses emotion and sentiment c : spiritual or moral force : fervor

Bold Scientists Say: PROOF Soul Exists

The Lancet is one of the world's most respected medical journals. So when it published an article in its current edition in which scientists claim to have PROOF that humans have a life after death that exists independently of the body that it inhabits, folks are sitting up and taking notice.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Do any of you evolutionist idiots believe that humans have a soul?

Do all crceatures have souls?

Where did the soul originate?

What happenes to it when you die?


Four easy simple questions. But I bet I don't get any intelligent responses. I wonder how many cut and paste jobs will respond. Hmmmm......

Do you have any evidence of a soul? No. Therefore, it is most likely, does not exist.

Yes

 

[Hollie]

Do any of you evolutionist idiots believe that humans have a soul?

Do all crceatures have souls?

Where did the soul originate?

What happenes to it when you die?


Four easy simple questions. But I bet I don't get any intelligent responses. I wonder how many cut and paste jobs will respond. Hmmmm......

Gee whiz. Another angry fundie rattling on about metaphysics absent any understanding of what he's rattling in about.

Your explanation of the concept of a "soul" is insufficient. It's only sufficient for those who have already decided there must be a "soul". You believe it's okay to assume as decided, the issue of some sort of continuation of the consciousness after death.

I have no explanation for "spirits" or the "soul" because the soul remains undemonstrated. I have no properties and characteristics for that which does not exist. I do have a comment about personality, and where that comes from. The sense of self is a higher brain function and it's seen in comparably lesser degrees in lesser animals (i.e., humans are not the only creatures with a sense of "self"). This in and of itself is enough to prove that "selfhood" is a natural phenomenon of higher brain functions. Either that, or your gawds have made monkeys and men with a soul each, and that means humans are the 'e'special creation of the gawds. Language, nurturing, survival, industry, and even environmental control all can be attributed to animals lesser on the sentience strat than man, which is a great case for man being of and a part of the natural world-- no gawds needed.

Personality is a phenomenon of the brain. Remove sections of the brain and the "self" changes as well. Apparently your eternal soul is at the mercy of a few pounds of grey jelly, because the soul cannot override the impact to the brain and the change in personality that attends that impact. The soul must be fairly weak.

This is a perfectly valid explanation for emotions, and it doesn't require the mumbo-jumbo of gods to explain it.

Non-material concepts are not fully non-material. You need a brain to substantiate them. Damage or impact to the brain directly affects the development and delivery of the concepts. You are simply assuming a spiritual nature for these things, and not submitting any case to support it. I am submitting they are the effects of the brain along with neurons and chemicals within the brain, and I can demonstrate how they can be manipulated by physical impact.

By way of example, I can

1. End all thought by killing that brain

2. create an emotion by chemical inducement of that brain

3. limit the thought and emotion of the brain by removing sections of it.

All the poetry about feelings and spirit and so on -- reside only in the brain. Remove it, and away it all goes. All of it. Even belief in gods.

Now you demonstrate the spiritual source, which you assert is the actual reason emotions exist and disassemble my case, please.

The only angry person I see is you . I asked some simple questions.

I didn't offer any explanations.

So in short. You don't think humans have souls.

No one ask you about personalities.

But since you brought it up.

You should get one.

There's no reason to flame with the "angry fundie", persona. I gave you a reasonable explanation ( personality derived from chemical processes in the brain) to what you want to attach metaphysics, mysticism and the mumbo- jumbo of gawds and spirit worlds.

It seems fundies instantly get angry when their sacred cows are yanked by the nose ring.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Gee whiz. Another angry fundie rattling on about metaphysics absent any understanding of what he's rattling in about.

Your explanation of the concept of a "soul" is insufficient. It's only sufficient for those who have already decided there must be a "soul". You believe it's okay to assume as decided, the issue of some sort of continuation of the consciousness after death.

I have no explanation for "spirits" or the "soul" because the soul remains undemonstrated. I have no properties and characteristics for that which does not exist. I do have a comment about personality, and where that comes from. The sense of self is a higher brain function and it's seen in comparably lesser degrees in lesser animals (i.e., humans are not the only creatures with a sense of "self"). This in and of itself is enough to prove that "selfhood" is a natural phenomenon of higher brain functions. Either that, or your gawds have made monkeys and men with a soul each, and that means humans are the 'e'special creation of the gawds. Language, nurturing, survival, industry, and even environmental control all can be attributed to animals lesser on the sentience strat than man, which is a great case for man being of and a part of the natural world-- no gawds needed.

Personality is a phenomenon of the brain. Remove sections of the brain and the "self" changes as well. Apparently your eternal soul is at the mercy of a few pounds of grey jelly, because the soul cannot override the impact to the brain and the change in personality that attends that impact. The soul must be fairly weak.

This is a perfectly valid explanation for emotions, and it doesn't require the mumbo-jumbo of gods to explain it.

Non-material concepts are not fully non-material. You need a brain to substantiate them. Damage or impact to the brain directly affects the development and delivery of the concepts. You are simply assuming a spiritual nature for these things, and not submitting any case to support it. I am submitting they are the effects of the brain along with neurons and chemicals within the brain, and I can demonstrate how they can be manipulated by physical impact.

By way of example, I can

1. End all thought by killing that brain

2. create an emotion by chemical inducement of that brain

3. limit the thought and emotion of the brain by removing sections of it.

All the poetry about feelings and spirit and so on -- reside only in the brain. Remove it, and away it all goes. All of it. Even belief in gods.

Now you demonstrate the spiritual source, which you assert is the actual reason emotions exist and disassemble my case, please.

The only angry person I see is you . I asked some simple questions.

I didn't offer any explanations.

So in short. You don't think humans have souls.

No one ask you about personalities.

But since you brought it up.

You should get one.

There's no reason to flame with the "angry fundie", persona. I gave you a reasonable explanation ( personality derived from chemical processes in the brain) to what you want to attach metaphysics, mysticism and the mumbo- jumbo of gawds and spirit worlds.

It seems fundies instantly get angry when their sacred cows are yanked by the nose ring.

The only person flaming is you. With every post you write.

Without your snide remarks and asinine insults, you wouldn't have much to say.

I understood your ramblings perfectly. You do not believe that humans have a soul.

Again, I'm not nor have I been angry. Fact is I find your childish ways quite entertaining. I just hope you don't miss milk and cookie time or nap time.

 

[Hollie]

The only angry person I see is you . I asked some simple questions.

I didn't offer any explanations.

So in short. You don't think humans have souls.

No one ask you about personalities.

But since you brought it up.

You should get one.

There's no reason to flame with the "angry fundie", persona. I gave you a reasonable explanation ( personality derived from chemical processes in the brain) to what you want to attach metaphysics, mysticism and the mumbo- jumbo of gawds and spirit worlds.

It seems fundies instantly get angry when their sacred cows are yanked by the nose ring.

The only person flaming is you. With every post you write.

Without your snide remarks and asinine insults, you wouldn't have much to say.

I understood your ramblings perfectly. You do not believe that humans have a soul.

Again, I'm not nor have I been angry. Fact is I find your childish ways quite entertaining. I just hope you don't miss milk and cookie time or nap time.

I just find it curious that fundies get so angry when challenged. Sacred cows are fine for supporting religious belief but under the glaring light of education, those cows tend to shrink.

You might be interested to find that cows milk is not all its cracked up to be. This "soul" thing you allege is not what you "believe" it to be. Did you realize that NDE's can be reproduced by the introduction of chemicals in the brain? How curious.

near-death experience (NDE) - The Skeptic's Dictionary - Skepdic.com