Definitive Proof that GOD Exists?

[edthecynic]

What's spiritual evidence?

Read the thread, there is 37 pages of it. But you'll dismiss and reject it, because you don't accept spiritual evidence. You can't accept it, I understand this, it's why I began my argument establishing this first.

cmon man, sum it up for me, I don't have time for 37 pages.

To sum it up, spiritual evidence is what Bossy says it is, period. Bossy is the Boss of spirituality. If you question him in any way, then you do not believe in spiritual evidence.

He uses 70k years of physical beings being spiritual as evidence that God exists, not that physical beings existed first and their belief in the spiritual followed their physical existence. He has nothing that proves the spiritual existed before the physical beings, he just pontificates it is so, and he has given himself the final say, and if you don't submit to his absolute authority you don't accept spiritual evidence.

You can point out that you believe in spiritual evidence and give as an example that as a musician you experience the spirit of the composer in his music. But if you point out that the composer had to exist first before his spirit lives in his music, you are told you do not believe in spiritual evidence.

You only believe in spiritual evidence if you agree with Bossy.
Get it?

 

[Youwerecreated]

Of course, our solar system is such an infinitesimal speck in the vastness of the universe as we understand it....the idea that life should be found elsewhere in the solar system is pretty silly.

REALLY? WHY? Because, according to you, life on Earth came about as a result of primordial soup, all the elements of life from the universe, and over billions of years, evolved with nothing more than natural selection guiding the way. If this is such an easy read, why is the story not the same elsewhere? Life, if it were as easy to explain the origin of as you've made it out to be, should be all around us... on the moon, on Mars... the moons of Jupiter... etc. All the same natural elements that propagated life on Earth, are available everywhere else in the universe, so why is it silly to expect to see the same results?

It's only "silly" because we don't find it. Before we were capable of looking, there were quite a few scientists who speculated life existed on other planets in our solar system. We're still convinced that we'll find microbial life on Mars!



Yet the universe contains all of the essential elements to form life, and on our particular planet in the universe, this life formed in great abundance, and evolved into a completely self-sustaining ecosystem, working in harmony with natural forces, generating new species and varieties of living things, by the billions, all interdependent on each other for survival and existence, and at the technological pinnacle, is a species who happens to curiously possess profound spiritual connection to something greater than self. Weird man!

While I agree that stating there definitely is life on other worlds is wrong, I don't think that is how Mom was saying it. By prefacing her statement with 'I agree with Ed' she was echoing the sentiment. Ambiguously worded, perhaps, but what I took from it was that it is her belief, not some statement of irrefutable fact.

The irrefutable fact is, we've not discovered life elsewhere in our vast huge universe. Despite the fact that our vast huge universe is chock-full of life-enabling elements, and the supposed origin process is such a piece of cake. Meanwhile, back on Earth, we have a distinct wobble in our rotation, caused by the moon careening into the planet early on, and we have tides created by the presence of that same moon, which isn't too big or too small, and provides a gravitational pull on the oceans. The seasons and ocean tides are what enable almost every variety of life to exist, it is the key to most life cycles, reproduction, function, purpose. We have a layered atmosphere, one that blocks out radiation and ultraviolet rays, and one that maintains the perfect atmospheric pressure to enable life to exist. Because of the seasons and tides, and the atmosphere, we have a climate system which operates in a fairly stable manner, yes we have disasters, but we don't have hurricanes that consume large areas of our planet for thousands of years, like Jupiter.

The further down the road of knowledge we go, the more we see that life is special, and it takes a lot of very special things to make it possible. You can only say "it just so happens" so many times, then it gets to be ridiculous. And when we couple all of this, with the indisputable fact that life's most advanced species is intrinsically tied to spirituality, it becomes almost impossible to believe ALL these things are coincidental.

First of all, you don't know what has been discovered and kept secret by the government. There are plenty of stories of UFOs and aliens just like your "spiritual" evidence. Secondly, why does all life have to be the same as our carbon based life? There could be other forms of life all around us that we just can't recognize. And finally, most of what you said is specially needed for life, like tides, the atmosphere, etc, are not so important. There are living organisms at the ocean floor so deep that no light or tide can reach them who live off the sulphur spewed from volcanic vents on the ocean floor. Life is quite tenacious and adaptive. Hell, there are bacteria that live in the tiniest of gaps in deep granitic and basaltic formations that metabolize hydrogen.

Planet earth is full of diverse life and life that has the ability to adapt. What does life having the ability to adapt prove ? Why is this planet so unique from other planets like it was designed for life ?

 

[edthecynic]

REALLY? WHY? Because, according to you, life on Earth came about as a result of primordial soup, all the elements of life from the universe, and over billions of years, evolved with nothing more than natural selection guiding the way. If this is such an easy read, why is the story not the same elsewhere? Life, if it were as easy to explain the origin of as you've made it out to be, should be all around us... on the moon, on Mars... the moons of Jupiter... etc. All the same natural elements that propagated life on Earth, are available everywhere else in the universe, so why is it silly to expect to see the same results?

It's only "silly" because we don't find it. Before we were capable of looking, there were quite a few scientists who speculated life existed on other planets in our solar system. We're still convinced that we'll find microbial life on Mars!



Yet the universe contains all of the essential elements to form life, and on our particular planet in the universe, this life formed in great abundance, and evolved into a completely self-sustaining ecosystem, working in harmony with natural forces, generating new species and varieties of living things, by the billions, all interdependent on each other for survival and existence, and at the technological pinnacle, is a species who happens to curiously possess profound spiritual connection to something greater than self. Weird man!



The irrefutable fact is, we've not discovered life elsewhere in our vast huge universe. Despite the fact that our vast huge universe is chock-full of life-enabling elements, and the supposed origin process is such a piece of cake. Meanwhile, back on Earth, we have a distinct wobble in our rotation, caused by the moon careening into the planet early on, and we have tides created by the presence of that same moon, which isn't too big or too small, and provides a gravitational pull on the oceans. The seasons and ocean tides are what enable almost every variety of life to exist, it is the key to most life cycles, reproduction, function, purpose. We have a layered atmosphere, one that blocks out radiation and ultraviolet rays, and one that maintains the perfect atmospheric pressure to enable life to exist. Because of the seasons and tides, and the atmosphere, we have a climate system which operates in a fairly stable manner, yes we have disasters, but we don't have hurricanes that consume large areas of our planet for thousands of years, like Jupiter.

The further down the road of knowledge we go, the more we see that life is special, and it takes a lot of very special things to make it possible. You can only say "it just so happens" so many times, then it gets to be ridiculous. And when we couple all of this, with the indisputable fact that life's most advanced species is intrinsically tied to spirituality, it becomes almost impossible to believe ALL these things are coincidental.

First of all, you don't know what has been discovered and kept secret by the government. There are plenty of stories of UFOs and aliens just like your "spiritual" evidence. Secondly, why does all life have to be the same as our carbon based life? There could be other forms of life all around us that we just can't recognize. And finally, most of what you said is specially needed for life, like tides, the atmosphere, etc, are not so important. There are living organisms at the ocean floor so deep that no light or tide can reach them who live off the sulphur spewed from volcanic vents on the ocean floor. Life is quite tenacious and adaptive. Hell, there are bacteria that live in the tiniest of gaps in deep granitic and basaltic formations that metabolize hydrogen.

Planet earth is full of diverse life and life that has the ability to adapt. What does life having the ability to adapt prove ? Why is this planet so unique from other planets like it was designed for life ?

Prove that this planet is unique in the universe.

The fact that life can adapt to the most extreme conditions proves that you don't need specially designed conditions for life to exist and thrive.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Wow, you have completely misunderstood what I've said.

It is expecting life to exist elsewhere in the solar system that I have questioned. My reasons for this are that it takes some specific conditions for life as we know it to survive and other planets don't (so far as we can tell) have all of the correct conditions, and that just based on probability, unless you think life should arise on nearly every planet or moon in the universe, there are few enough of those in the solar system that more than one would possibly be an anomaly.

In other words, while I think it's likely that life exists or existed elsewhere in the universe, I don't think there is a good reason to assume that it should also exist elsewhere in the solar system, however it may have begun.

I don't know how to explain what I am saying to you, if you can't comprehend what I am writing. Yes, it takes some very special and unique conditions for life to exist, in fact, we only know of one place in the universe it does exist. But you would think, being that all the ingredients for the cake are present, and the recipe is so easy, we'd see at least some inkling of life, somewhere nearby. You're right, the planets are not hospitable... but why aren't they? All the same ingredients, a few of them should have at least been able to spurt out simple organisms of some kind, develop a stable atmosphere, something, anything!

We are expected to believe that life originated naturally, out of primordial soup or whatever, and all of this miraculous life just amazingly sprang forth... naturally... nothing else needed. Yet, there is absolutely no evidence this happened anywhere else. You say, "well it just so happens" that we had all the right conditions to support life... okay, but then, most life cycles depend on seasons and tides, which wouldn't exist if not for the moon colliding with Earth, putting it in a distinctly wobbly orbit, which creates seasons. If the moon didn't create tides, much of the ocean life couldn't exist. Seasons and tides... two more "it just so happens" to consider. Then... "it just so happens" that life we observe around us is in harmonious order, interdependent, following a form and function... more "it just so happens" to think about. Now, we get to the question of how there came to be billions of life forms, and they "just so happened" to evolve into place from other living things and then seemingly "just so happened" to stop, because we no longer see new genera emerging from other genera. But most amazing of all, it "just so happens" the only critters on the planet capable of pulling itself out of the jungles to achieve extraordinary things in comparison to other forms of life.... "just so happens," they are also profoundly attached to a spiritual belief in something greater than self.

At some point, don't we have to stop believing in coincidence?

The fact that humanity has felt the need to believe in the spiritual is in no way proof of the existence of the spiritual.

Oh, no one said it is proof, we've been over this. "Proof" is dependent on your perception of what proves something, and since you don't believe in spiritual existence, there is no proof for you. Darwin would suggest that it's evidence, that a species has exhibited a particular inherent behavior for all of it's existence, of something fundamental to the species. So whether spiritual is "real" or not, humans most certainly can't exist without believing it is real, and paying homage to it. We've done it all our existence, it can't be stomped out, ridiculed out, mocked out, educated out... Human spirituality still remains.

You say it's not proof, I say your mind is closed to spiritual proof.



No, this is where you are fundamentally wrong. Humans perceive both the physical and spiritual. We exist in the physical universe, but we have an intrinsic and unfettered connection with the spiritual universe. There is no way to prove the spiritual with only physical evidence, NONE! There never will be, because it is a logic dichotomy! Once you have proven God with physical evidence, God ceases to be a "spiritual" entity! From that moment forward, God will forever be a PHYSICAL entity, defined by physical evidence of existence. So you can see why this is not ever going to happen, right?



Your HEART! Your SOUL! Your MIND! There is nothing 'subjective' about those, we all have them. The "repeatable effect" is humanity. It is what enabled mankind to emerge from the jungles, form civilized societies, establish morals, become humanitarian creatures. As I said, the spiritual evidence is strong and overwhelming, which is why you must reject it...even in the face of being totally illogical in the process.

The only person you can prove anything to with totally subjective evidence is yourself.

And the only person who can open your mind to spiritual understanding is you.

The reason I have 'closed my mind' to the spiritual is because I require evidence, or at least what I consider a trustworthy source, in order to believe something exists. You have provided neither.

I know the reason, I stated it within the first two paragraphs of the OP, back on page 1 of the thread, it was deliberately the FIRST point I made. You require some kind of PHYSICAL evidence or proof, of the PHYSICAL existence (because you can't imagine any other kind of existence), regarding a SPIRITUAL entity. As we've established, this is never going to happen. But unless you see a physical proof of God, it can never be proven to you.

In order to have an objective evaluation of the existence (or presence) of a spiritual entity, we must be able to evaluate spiritual evidence, which you've completely closed your mind to. Go read the OP, I made this observation to begin the argument.

The big bang would have surely put all the ingredients for the cake on nearby planets you're correct. Yes at some point we have to rule out coincidence someone that is using logic that is.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Wow, you have completely misunderstood what I've said.

It is expecting life to exist elsewhere in the solar system that I have questioned. My reasons for this are that it takes some specific conditions for life as we know it to survive and other planets don't (so far as we can tell) have all of the correct conditions, and that just based on probability, unless you think life should arise on nearly every planet or moon in the universe, there are few enough of those in the solar system that more than one would possibly be an anomaly.

In other words, while I think it's likely that life exists or existed elsewhere in the universe, I don't think there is a good reason to assume that it should also exist elsewhere in the solar system, however it may have begun.

I don't know how to explain what I am saying to you, if you can't comprehend what I am writing. Yes, it takes some very special and unique conditions for life to exist, in fact, we only know of one place in the universe it does exist. But you would think, being that all the ingredients for the cake are present, and the recipe is so easy, we'd see at least some inkling of life, somewhere nearby. You're right, the planets are not hospitable... but why aren't they? All the same ingredients, a few of them should have at least been able to spurt out simple organisms of some kind, develop a stable atmosphere, something, anything!

We are expected to believe that life originated naturally, out of primordial soup or whatever, and all of this miraculous life just amazingly sprang forth... naturally... nothing else needed. Yet, there is absolutely no evidence this happened anywhere else. You say, "well it just so happens" that we had all the right conditions to support life... okay, but then, most life cycles depend on seasons and tides, which wouldn't exist if not for the moon colliding with Earth, putting it in a distinctly wobbly orbit, which creates seasons. If the moon didn't create tides, much of the ocean life couldn't exist. Seasons and tides... two more "it just so happens" to consider. Then... "it just so happens" that life we observe around us is in harmonious order, interdependent, following a form and function... more "it just so happens" to think about. Now, we get to the question of how there came to be billions of life forms, and they "just so happened" to evolve into place from other living things and then seemingly "just so happened" to stop, because we no longer see new genera emerging from other genera. But most amazing of all, it "just so happens" the only critters on the planet capable of pulling itself out of the jungles to achieve extraordinary things in comparison to other forms of life.... "just so happens," they are also profoundly attached to a spiritual belief in something greater than self.

At some point, don't we have to stop believing in coincidence?




Oh, no one said it is proof, we've been over this. "Proof" is dependent on your perception of what proves something, and since you don't believe in spiritual existence, there is no proof for you. Darwin would suggest that it's evidence, that a species has exhibited a particular inherent behavior for all of it's existence, of something fundamental to the species. So whether spiritual is "real" or not, humans most certainly can't exist without believing it is real, and paying homage to it. We've done it all our existence, it can't be stomped out, ridiculed out, mocked out, educated out... Human spirituality still remains.

You say it's not proof, I say your mind is closed to spiritual proof.



No, this is where you are fundamentally wrong. Humans perceive both the physical and spiritual. We exist in the physical universe, but we have an intrinsic and unfettered connection with the spiritual universe. There is no way to prove the spiritual with only physical evidence, NONE! There never will be, because it is a logic dichotomy! Once you have proven God with physical evidence, God ceases to be a "spiritual" entity! From that moment forward, God will forever be a PHYSICAL entity, defined by physical evidence of existence. So you can see why this is not ever going to happen, right?



Your HEART! Your SOUL! Your MIND! There is nothing 'subjective' about those, we all have them. The "repeatable effect" is humanity. It is what enabled mankind to emerge from the jungles, form civilized societies, establish morals, become humanitarian creatures. As I said, the spiritual evidence is strong and overwhelming, which is why you must reject it...even in the face of being totally illogical in the process.



And the only person who can open your mind to spiritual understanding is you.

The reason I have 'closed my mind' to the spiritual is because I require evidence, or at least what I consider a trustworthy source, in order to believe something exists. You have provided neither.

I know the reason, I stated it within the first two paragraphs of the OP, back on page 1 of the thread, it was deliberately the FIRST point I made. You require some kind of PHYSICAL evidence or proof, of the PHYSICAL existence (because you can't imagine any other kind of existence), regarding a SPIRITUAL entity. As we've established, this is never going to happen. But unless you see a physical proof of God, it can never be proven to you.

In order to have an objective evaluation of the existence (or presence) of a spiritual entity, we must be able to evaluate spiritual evidence, which you've completely closed your mind to. Go read the OP, I made this observation to begin the argument.

Your circular reasoning is hilarious. In order to believe in the spiritual, you must first.....believe in the spiritual!

You say I have closed my mind to the spiritual, after saying the spiritual is made up of something which cannot be objectively observed. You may as well say I have closed my mind to Santa Clause, or Vishnu, or the Force.

I wonder, how is it that the spiritual can see and affect the physical, but the reverse doesn't seem to be true?

I notice you keep attempting to insert Darwin into your posts, as though assuming you have any idea what he would think of your arguments might lend them weight with those who don't already believe as you do. First, I think that that kind of speculation is pretty worthless; the long-dead cannot confirm or deny the accuracy of such claims. Second, it's a bit funny because Darwin, while he may have been the father of evolutionary theory, got a number of things wrong.

You say the heart, soul and mind can all perceive things other than the physical. The heart perceives nothing; it is but a muscle which pumps blood. The word really means emotions in the sense you appear to be using it, which are a product of the mind. And I have seen no evidence of a soul, so I cannot agree that it is something we all have. As to the mind, your claim that the human brain can perceive things not in the realm of the physical is, again, nothing but a completely subjective belief. There is no objective evidence of it. We can certainly imagine things, but that doesn't mean they exist independent of our imaginings. Unless you are trying to say the spiritual is created by the imaginings of intelligent life, I continue to disagree and await any actual evidence other than your unsubstantiated word.

In order to have an objective evaluation of the existence of a spiritual entity, it (or the reactions caused by it) must be objectively observable. As your definition of the spiritual doesn't allow for this, no, there can be no objective evaluation.

To get back to the whole life on other planets theme, you are oversimplifying enormously. All the ingredients are present and the recipe is easy? Who said the creation of life is 'easy'? The same elements may be present on other planets and moons in the solar system, but the conditions are not likely the same as they were on Earth when life first appeared.

I don't expect you or anyone else to believe that life occurred naturally. I have no idea if life may have been created or not. Aliens could have seeded the planet, a god or gods may have created life, or it may have arisen through spontaneous reaction.

Was it coincidence that the proper materials and conditions were here for life? It certainly could be. Again, when you take into account the vastness of the universe and the huge number of planets and moons within it, and the time it has possibly existed for, it becomes less and less difficult to imagine life arising spontaneously SOMEWHERE. And of course, it would take an intelligent form of life to eventually wonder how it could have happened where it did, why that particular planet, etc. etc. That you can look back and consider it overly coincidental might be an inevitable consequence of the arising of intelligent life.

That much of humanity has believed in the supernatural can be used as evidence that the supernatural exists. On the other hand, it can be used as evidence simply that humans are beings of imagination. We see something we don't understand, we want an explanation, we create one. Add in our often flawed perceptions and it is not difficult to see why people have always believed in the spiritual or supernatural.

Again, your evidence and arguments are based almost entirely on your subjective views.

Everyone uses circular reasoning we are human and that is our thought pattern.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Your circular reasoning is hilarious. In order to believe in the spiritual, you must first.....believe in the spiritual!

Again, "circular reasoning" does not mean something is wrong! In this case, it is absolutely accurate and correct, in order to acknowledge spiritual evidence, you must believe in spiritual evidence. The same applies to physical science. If this is funny to you, I am sorry. It's a relatively simplistic concept of logic and common sense, it shouldn't have to be pointed out to you.



I did not say spiritual is made up of something that can't be objectively observed. You aren't reading my words. I can't communicate with you if you won't read my words. Spiritual is non-physical, but it most certainly can be objectively observed by people who believe in spiritual nature. It can not be objectively observed by those who reject spiritual evidence. There is no basis in logic for spiritual entities to have physical evidence, and you can never physically prove something spiritual.



Again, we have over 70k years of evidence that billions of people most certainly have spiritually connected to something. You see, this is where you are becoming confused. You assume, since you refuse to see spiritual evidence, no one else is able to. The spiritual evidence is overwhelming, it's right there in front of you, but you continue to refuse to accept spiritual evidence.



Oh I know Darwin got things wrong, namely, his explanation of how a complex human eye evolved. He admits that if the eye can't be explained through natural selection, it can't be the product of evolution. Well, what he explained, and what many scientist believed until recently, is that a photoreceptor cell was a predecessor to the human eye, but the systems are completely different and work in a different way. The eye could not evolve the way Darwin explained.

I am not speculating anything with regard to Darwin, I've read his book. I understand the principles of natural selection and evolution, and I know that it simply can't have the predictive power to "know" what parts are needed before they are needed. IF natural selection IS this powerful, it is more of a miracle than God or an intelligent designer.



All you are doing is confirming the point I made in the first two paragraphs of the OP. You don't accept or acknowledge spiritual evidence. This has been established, it was the very FIRST point I made in my argument, I don't understand why you continue to reaffirm it. There IS objective evidence for people who believe in spiritual nature. Billions and billions have attested to this, some went to their graves fighting to protect their spiritual beliefs. You believe there is no objective evidence because you reject spiritual evidence. I am not saying that to be insulting or rude, just stating a fact of life... you don't accept or acknowledge spiritual evidence, you mind is closed to it, so you obviously can not see spiritual evidence, and dismiss it as imagination.



The only way to objectively observe spiritual evidence, is to believe and accept spiritual nature. Billions and billions have done this, and because you can't do this, doesn't mean others can't. My definition of spiritual is "non-physical." I never claimed it couldn't be objectively observed and evaluated. It simply can't meet your criteria of providing physical evidence, because it isn't physical in nature.



Well, the people who don't believe in intelligent design or creationism, claim that the miracle of life sprang forth from primordial soup when the planet was cooling. Then they posit a theory for abiogenesis, where all life sprang forth miraculously from a single cell organism. Were WE the only place around who got the primordial soup? Just so happened? We went down that road, there are a LOT of "just so happened" events to ponder. If any of them had "not so happened" we wouldn't have life on Earth.

You missed my question to you... WHY are the conditions not appropriate on other planets? Same universe, same materials available, same relative environment in the vacuum of space, why didn't other planets form atmospheres with layers to protect life from radiation and ultraviolet rays? 'Just so happens' we were the lucky planet? Now, we haven't looked at much of the universe, but we have looked at many planets and moons, and the only place in the universe we have found life is here. If life were some natural phenomenon, it would be happening elsewhere, all around us on other planets, which had the same elements to work with as Earth had, as we are all part of the same universe. But that is not what we see.



At least your mind is open to possibility. That's a start. The thread title is posed as a question. I did this to illustrate, it is a question that can only be answered if we are willing to accept and evaluate spiritual evidence. This is needed because we must first establish terminology, so that we are talking about the same things. You see, if someone does not believe in a spiritual nature, they can't process terms like "exist" in their minds. To "exist" can only mean, to physically exist, if you don't recognize spiritual existence. It's an illogical dichotomy for a spiritual god to physically exist. It can never meet that criteria, or it is no longer spiritual in nature.



At some point, continued coincidence starts becoming suspect, wouldn't you agree? If you went with a friend to Vegas, and they started gambling and winning, and this went on all night, you'd say... hey, it's a coincidence, the got lucky... but then, a second and third night, same thing, weeks roll by, they can't lose. A month later, they are making headline news as the luckiest person ever, they haven't lost yet... they keep winning every time... at what point to do you admit that it's not just luck and coincidence? I can accept that one or maybe two things, happened by coincidence. But when I see literally millions of things that had to happen to a certain degree and order, in harmony with other things happening, over and over for millions of years, the astounding nature of our climate system and weather, the wondrous beauty we see in nature, the intricacy of mechanical engineering of the simplest organisms. Life is amazing and miraculous, it simply did not happen by accident.

That much of humanity has believed in the supernatural can be used as evidence that the supernatural exists. On the other hand, it can be used as evidence simply that humans are beings of imagination. We see something we don't understand, we want an explanation, we create one. Add in our often flawed perceptions and it is not difficult to see why people have always believed in the spiritual or supernatural.

Again, your evidence and arguments are based almost entirely on your subjective views.

You dismiss spirituality as "imagination." As I said, you have closed your mind to spiritual evidence, you think it's over-fertile imaginations run wild. Ironically, I do believe this explains Religion. I think all organized religions are simply man's imagination, trying to grapple with this spiritual thing they are intrinsically connected to. There can be no denying, humans are spiritually connected to something, it's not imagination.

To believe spirituality is merely man's imagination, you relegate man to one of the stupidest forms of life to ever exist, because nothing else we know of, does this. Animals do not behave inherently for all of their existence because of something they imagine, which simply isn't there. It doesn't happen with any living organism we know of, but you claim it's happened with humans, for all of our existence. I reject that argument.

What's spiritual evidence?

You don't need to read all 37 pages.

 

[Youwerecreated]

First of all, you don't know what has been discovered and kept secret by the government. There are plenty of stories of UFOs and aliens just like your "spiritual" evidence. Secondly, why does all life have to be the same as our carbon based life? There could be other forms of life all around us that we just can't recognize. And finally, most of what you said is specially needed for life, like tides, the atmosphere, etc, are not so important. There are living organisms at the ocean floor so deep that no light or tide can reach them who live off the sulphur spewed from volcanic vents on the ocean floor. Life is quite tenacious and adaptive. Hell, there are bacteria that live in the tiniest of gaps in deep granitic and basaltic formations that metabolize hydrogen.

Planet earth is full of diverse life and life that has the ability to adapt. What does life having the ability to adapt prove ? Why is this planet so unique from other planets like it was designed for life ?

Prove that this planet is unique in the universe.

The fact that life can adapt to the most extreme conditions proves that you don't need specially designed conditions for life to exist and thrive.

Where did the ability to adapt originate from ?

What Makes Earth Special Compared to Other Planets | Space.com


What is there to debate there is no planet like earth.

 

[edthecynic]

Planet earth is full of diverse life and life that has the ability to adapt. What does life having the ability to adapt prove ? Why is this planet so unique from other planets like it was designed for life ?

Prove that this planet is unique in the universe.

The fact that life can adapt to the most extreme conditions proves that you don't need specially designed conditions for life to exist and thrive.

Where did the ability to adapt originate from ?

What Makes Earth Special Compared to Other Planets | Space.com


What is there to debate there is no planet like earth.

The ability to adapt is innate to life.

From your link:

Not-so-special Earth

As our planet-hunting technology improves, many planet hunters expect to find Earth's twin. The search has led scientists to debate whether Earth is really as special as we think it is.

"In the past 10 years, everything has been pointing in the direction of, 'Hey, the solar system, which we thought was unique, is not unique at all,'" said Alan Boss.

Boss and many other scientists think it's likely that some form of life exists on some of those countless other planets out there.

"Certainly there will be other planets that support life," he said. "I think life is actually quite common. I think we're going to find there are literally billions of them in the galaxy."

 

[Youwerecreated]

Prove that this planet is unique in the universe.

The fact that life can adapt to the most extreme conditions proves that you don't need specially designed conditions for life to exist and thrive.

Where did the ability to adapt originate from ?

What Makes Earth Special Compared to Other Planets | Space.com


What is there to debate there is no planet like earth.

The ability to adapt is innate to life.

From your link:

Not-so-special Earth

As our planet-hunting technology improves, many planet hunters expect to find Earth's twin. The search has led scientists to debate whether Earth is really as special as we think it is.

"In the past 10 years, everything has been pointing in the direction of, 'Hey, the solar system, which we thought was unique, is not unique at all,'" said Alan Boss.

Boss and many other scientists think it's likely that some form of life exists on some of those countless other planets out there.

"Certainly there will be other planets that support life," he said. "I think life is actually quite common. I think we're going to find there are literally billions of them in the galaxy."

I knew you would lock in on the conjecture part of the web page. You do realize they are debating it that they do not have any proof ? For right now this planet is unique correct ? Kinda like a theory that this planet is unique is the best answer we have at this point correct ?

 

[Youwerecreated]

Prove that this planet is unique in the universe.

The fact that life can adapt to the most extreme conditions proves that you don't need specially designed conditions for life to exist and thrive.

Where did the ability to adapt originate from ?

What Makes Earth Special Compared to Other Planets | Space.com


What is there to debate there is no planet like earth.

The ability to adapt is innate to life.

From your link:

Not-so-special Earth

As our planet-hunting technology improves, many planet hunters expect to find Earth's twin. The search has led scientists to debate whether Earth is really as special as we think it is.

"In the past 10 years, everything has been pointing in the direction of, 'Hey, the solar system, which we thought was unique, is not unique at all,'" said Alan Boss.

Boss and many other scientists think it's likely that some form of life exists on some of those countless other planets out there.

"Certainly there will be other planets that support life," he said. "I think life is actually quite common. I think we're going to find there are literally billions of them in the galaxy."

INNATE is not a good answer for the ability of organisms to adapt. This sounds like purposeful design to me.

 

[daws101]

Your last attempt at being intelligent lol. post 1299 I am sure i can find more if i check every post you attempt to sound intelligent

Liar.

https://www.google.com/search?sourc...philosophers+such+as+Henri+Bergson,+Nietzsche

I notice you haven't credited them to the real authors..

again a mistake unlike, your ongoing fraud.

btw I could write a book on you failed attempts to feign first hand knowledge and expertize on these threads.
the difference is I can make mistakes as I don't claim to be something I'm not.
on the other hand, you.....

Nope you are a dishonest turd and I am everything I claimed to be.

if that were true, then why did you not credit those quotes?
you are hardly all you claim to be.
as you left out plagiarist, distorter of fact, braggart, willful ignorance and pseudoscientist. Just a name a few.

 

[daws101]

Your last attempt at being intelligent lol. post 1299 I am sure i can find more if i check every post you attempt to sound intelligent

Liar.

https://www.google.com/search?sourc...philosophers+such+as+Henri+Bergson,+Nietzsche

I notice you haven't credited them to the real authors..

again a mistake unlike, your ongoing fraud.

btw I could write a book on you failed attempts to feign first hand knowledge and expertize on these threads.
the difference is I can make mistakes as I don't claim to be something I'm not.
on the other hand, you.....

Take your pick several sources on that google search said what you said word for word lol.

I never claimed they were my words....
you on the other hand are so fucking arrogant you actually believed that no one would call you on it .
show some dignity and man up !

 

[daws101]

Sorry what I stated was a fact and has been noted as such. Your side keeps ducking the hard questions because they know they had a hole shot in their theory.

dodge! it's not your theory and it's wrong.

Astrology was not my major but explain how what I stated was wrong ?

ok ! here we go. Astrology



Astrology consists of belief systems which hold that there is a relationship between astronomical phenomena and events in the human world. In the West, astrology most often consists of a system of horoscopes that claim to explain aspects of a person's personality and predict future events in their life based on the positions of the sun, moon, and other planetary objects at the time of their birth. Many cultures have attached importance to astronomical events, and the Indians, Chinese, and Mayans developed elaborate systems for predicting terrestrial events from celestial observations.

Among Indo-European peoples, astrology has been dated to the 3rd millennium BCE, with roots in calendrical systems used to predict seasonal shifts and to interpret celestial cycles as signs of divine communications.[1] Through most of its history, astrology was considered a scholarly tradition. It was accepted in political and academic contexts, and was connected with other studies, such as astronomy, alchemy, meteorology, and medicine.[2] At the end of the 17th century, new scientific concepts in astronomy and physics (such as heliocentrism and Newtonian mechanics) called astrology into question, and subsequent controlled studies failed to confirm its predictive value. Astrology thus lost its academic and theoretical standing, and common belief in astrology has largely declined.[3]

Astrology has been rejected by the scientific community as having no explanatory power for describing the universe (see pseudoscience). Scientific testing of astrology has been conducted, and no evidence has been found to support any of the premises or purported effects outlined in astrological traditions. Where astrology has made falsifiable predictions, it has been falsified.[4]:424 There is no proposed mechanism of action by which the positions and motions of stars and planets could affect people and events on Earth that does not contradict well understood, basic aspects of biology and physics.[5]:249[6]


Astrology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Not to be confused with Astronomy.



This article is about the scientific study of celestial objects. For other uses, see Astronomy (disambiguation).

Not to be confused with Astrology, the belief system claiming that celestial phenomena influence the lives and behavior of humans.

A giant Hubble mosaic of the Crab Nebula, a supernova remnant
Astronomy is a natural science that deals with the study of celestial objects (such as moons, planets, stars, nebulae, and galaxies); the physics, chemistry, mathematics, and evolution of such objects; and phenomena that originate outside the atmosphere of Earth (such as supernovae explosions, gamma ray bursts, and cosmic background radiation). A related but distinct subject, cosmology, is concerned with studying the universe as a whole.[1]

Astronomy is one of the oldest sciences. Prehistoric cultures left behind astronomical artifacts such as the Egyptian monuments and Nubian monuments, and early civilizations such as the Babylonians, Greeks, Chinese, Indians, Iranians and Maya performed methodical observations of the night sky. However, the invention of the telescope was required before astronomy was able to develop into a modern science. Historically, astronomy has included disciplines as diverse as astrometry, celestial navigation, observational astronomy, and the making of calendars, but professional astronomy is nowadays often considered to be synonymous with astrophysics.[2]

During the 20th century, the field of professional astronomy split into observational and theoretical branches. Observational astronomy is focused on acquiring data from observations of astronomical objects, which is then analyzed using basic principles of physics. Theoretical astronomy is oriented towards the development of computer or analytical models to describe astronomical objects and phenomena. The two fields complement each other, with theoretical astronomy seeking to explain the observational results, and observations being used to confirm theoretical results.

Amateur astronomers have contributed to many important astronomical discoveries, and astronomy is one of the few sciences where amateurs can still play an active role, especially in the discovery and observation of transient phenomena.

Astronomy is not to be confused with astrology, the belief system which claims that human affairs are correlated with the positions of celestial objects. Although the two fields share a common origin they are now entirely distinct.[3]
Astronomy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
anything else I can help you with bahahahahahahahahahaha!

 

[daws101]

REALLY? WHY? Because, according to you, life on Earth came about as a result of primordial soup, all the elements of life from the universe, and over billions of years, evolved with nothing more than natural selection guiding the way. If this is such an easy read, why is the story not the same elsewhere? Life, if it were as easy to explain the origin of as you've made it out to be, should be all around us... on the moon, on Mars... the moons of Jupiter... etc. All the same natural elements that propagated life on Earth, are available everywhere else in the universe, so why is it silly to expect to see the same results?

It's only "silly" because we don't find it. Before we were capable of looking, there were quite a few scientists who speculated life existed on other planets in our solar system. We're still convinced that we'll find microbial life on Mars!



Yet the universe contains all of the essential elements to form life, and on our particular planet in the universe, this life formed in great abundance, and evolved into a completely self-sustaining ecosystem, working in harmony with natural forces, generating new species and varieties of living things, by the billions, all interdependent on each other for survival and existence, and at the technological pinnacle, is a species who happens to curiously possess profound spiritual connection to something greater than self. Weird man!



The irrefutable fact is, we've not discovered life elsewhere in our vast huge universe. Despite the fact that our vast huge universe is chock-full of life-enabling elements, and the supposed origin process is such a piece of cake. Meanwhile, back on Earth, we have a distinct wobble in our rotation, caused by the moon careening into the planet early on, and we have tides created by the presence of that same moon, which isn't too big or too small, and provides a gravitational pull on the oceans. The seasons and ocean tides are what enable almost every variety of life to exist, it is the key to most life cycles, reproduction, function, purpose. We have a layered atmosphere, one that blocks out radiation and ultraviolet rays, and one that maintains the perfect atmospheric pressure to enable life to exist. Because of the seasons and tides, and the atmosphere, we have a climate system which operates in a fairly stable manner, yes we have disasters, but we don't have hurricanes that consume large areas of our planet for thousands of years, like Jupiter.

The further down the road of knowledge we go, the more we see that life is special, and it takes a lot of very special things to make it possible. You can only say "it just so happens" so many times, then it gets to be ridiculous. And when we couple all of this, with the indisputable fact that life's most advanced species is intrinsically tied to spirituality, it becomes almost impossible to believe ALL these things are coincidental.

First of all, you don't know what has been discovered and kept secret by the government. There are plenty of stories of UFOs and aliens just like your "spiritual" evidence. Secondly, why does all life have to be the same as our carbon based life? There could be other forms of life all around us that we just can't recognize. And finally, most of what you said is specially needed for life, like tides, the atmosphere, etc, are not so important. There are living organisms at the ocean floor so deep that no light or tide can reach them who live off the sulphur spewed from volcanic vents on the ocean floor. Life is quite tenacious and adaptive. Hell, there are bacteria that live in the tiniest of gaps in deep granitic and basaltic formations that metabolize hydrogen.

Planet earth is full of diverse life and life that has the ability to adapt. What does life having the ability to adapt prove ? Why is this planet so unique from other planets like it was designed for life ?

speaking of lying, declaring that life was designed with zero proof is extremely dishonest..
the truth would be is you believe it was designed...

 

[daws101]

Planet earth is full of diverse life and life that has the ability to adapt. What does life having the ability to adapt prove ? Why is this planet so unique from other planets like it was designed for life ?

Prove that this planet is unique in the universe.

The fact that life can adapt to the most extreme conditions proves that you don't need specially designed conditions for life to exist and thrive.

Where did the ability to adapt originate from ?

What Makes Earth Special Compared to Other Planets | Space.com


What is there to debate there is no planet like earth.

another false declarative!

 

[edthecynic]

Where did the ability to adapt originate from ?

What Makes Earth Special Compared to Other Planets | Space.com


What is there to debate there is no planet like earth.

The ability to adapt is innate to life.

From your link:

Not-so-special Earth

As our planet-hunting technology improves, many planet hunters expect to find Earth's twin. The search has led scientists to debate whether Earth is really as special as we think it is.

"In the past 10 years, everything has been pointing in the direction of, 'Hey, the solar system, which we thought was unique, is not unique at all,'" said Alan Boss.

Boss and many other scientists think it's likely that some form of life exists on some of those countless other planets out there.

"Certainly there will be other planets that support life," he said. "I think life is actually quite common. I think we're going to find there are literally billions of them in the galaxy."

INNATE is not a good answer for the ability of organisms to adapt. This sounds like purposeful design to me.

Random chance sounds like purposeful design to you. Everything sounds like purposefully designed to you.

 

[daws101]

It is not easy to estimate how far away from the Earth the Moon was when it formed, but simulations suggest is was about 3-5 times the radius of the Earth, or about 19-30 thousand km. The Moon is currently about 384,000 km away from Earth or 3-4 thousand times further away than this.
The exact rate of the Moon's movement away from Earth has varied a lot over time. It depends both on the distance between the Earth and the Moon, and the exact shape of the Earth. The details of continents and oceans moving around on Earth actually change the rate, which make it a very hard thing to estimate. The rate is currently slowing down slightly, and it is estimated that in about 15 billion years the Moon's orbit will stop increasing in size.
Thereafter, the Moon will remain at a fixed distance from Earth; the Moon will then appear fixed over one side of the Earth, never to be seen on the other side.
This extrapolation into the future is moot, however, because the Sun will have stopped shinning long before this and, in all likelihood, will have swallowed the Earth and Moon in the process.
In conclusion, it is not a easy question because there are a lot of unknown details about the formation of the Moon, probably a violent impact between the Earth and an object roughly the size of Mars.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080212223000AAAOCHk

 

[daws101]

The ability to adapt is innate to life.

From your link:

Not-so-special Earth

As our planet-hunting technology improves, many planet hunters expect to find Earth's twin. The search has led scientists to debate whether Earth is really as special as we think it is.

"In the past 10 years, everything has been pointing in the direction of, 'Hey, the solar system, which we thought was unique, is not unique at all,'" said Alan Boss.

Boss and many other scientists think it's likely that some form of life exists on some of those countless other planets out there.

"Certainly there will be other planets that support life," he said. "I think life is actually quite common. I think we're going to find there are literally billions of them in the galaxy."

INNATE is not a good answer for the ability of organisms to adapt. This sounds like purposeful design to me.

Random chance sounds like purposeful design to you. Everything sounds like purposefully designed to you.

bump

 

[Montrovant]

Planet earth is full of diverse life and life that has the ability to adapt. What does life having the ability to adapt prove ? Why is this planet so unique from other planets like it was designed for life ?

Prove that this planet is unique in the universe.

The fact that life can adapt to the most extreme conditions proves that you don't need specially designed conditions for life to exist and thrive.

Where did the ability to adapt originate from ?

What Makes Earth Special Compared to Other Planets | Space.com


What is there to debate there is no planet like earth.

How many planets have we been able to study closely?

How many planets have we observed?

Do you really think we know that Earth is unique based on our incredibly limited experience?

We've been through this before YWC. You are basically saying that, having picked up a handful of sand from the beach, and having seen one of the grains of sand being a different color than the others, that the differently colored grain of sand is unique on the entire beach. No need to bother looking at the other trillion grains of sand, this tiny portion is all that's needed!

 

[daws101]

Prove that this planet is unique in the universe.

The fact that life can adapt to the most extreme conditions proves that you don't need specially designed conditions for life to exist and thrive.

Where did the ability to adapt originate from ?

What Makes Earth Special Compared to Other Planets | Space.com


What is there to debate there is no planet like earth.

How many planets have we been able to study closely?

How many planets have we observed?

Do you really think we know that Earth is unique based on our incredibly limited experience?

We've been through this before YWC. You are basically saying that, having picked up a handful of sand from the beach, and having seen one of the grains of sand being a different color than the others, that the differently colored grain of sand is unique on the entire beach. No need to bother looking at the other trillion grains of sand, this tiny portion is all that's needed!

to add, our best technology can only take us to our closest neighbors and they're not home.